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    Default 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Alfek's Empowered Curse
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 4, Druid 4
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: 1 round

    After you cast this spell, the next spell you cast in this round that deals damage to a creature's ability score deals an increased amount of damage as if the damage being dealt was a natural attack and you increased the size of it. (1d6 Str damage would become 1d8, 1d8 would become 2d6, etc)

    Additionally, the next spell you cast this round that deal's damage to a creature's ability score also grants you a +5 bonus to your caster level check to penetrate any and all targets for that spell's spell resistance.


    Alfek's Greater Empowered Curse
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 7, Druid 7
    Casting Time: 1 round
    Duration: 1 round/level

    This spell functions like Alfek's empowered curse, except as noted above, and also, its bonuses apply to all spells you cast that deal damage to a creature's ability scores until the spell expires.


    Alfek's Superior Curse
    Transmutation
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 3, Druid 3
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: 1 round

    The next spell you cast this round that deals damage to a creature's ability scores has the DC for its saving throw (if it allows a saving throw) increased by +2, and also deals 2 additional points of ability score damage.


    Alfek's Sacrificing Curse
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 4, Druid 4
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Medium
    Target: One creature
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Save: None
    SR: Yes

    As part of casting this spell, you take 1d4 points of damage to one of your ability scores, chosen at the time of this casting. If some or all of this damage is prevented, or if you are immune to this damage, the spell fails. You then make a ranged touch attack, and if you hit, the target creature takes 3d4 points of damage to the same ability score that you took damage to.


    Alfek's Supernatural Punishing Curse
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 2, Druid 2
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Close
    Target: One creature
    Save: Fortitude Negates
    SR: Yes

    You must succeed on a ranged touch attack. If you hit your target makes a Fortitude save, and if it fails, it takes 1 point of Intelligence damage, plus 1 additional point of Intelligence damage for each dispellable magical effect currently affecting the target creature (such as the mage armor spell), to a maximum of half your caster level rounded down (Max 10 Int damage at caster level 20)


    Alfek's Mass Moon Bolt
    Level: Druid 8
    Target: Up to one creature per 3 levels, no two of which may be more than 30 feet apart

    This spell functions exactly like moon bolt (Spell Compendium), except as noted above.


    Alfek's Touch of Complete Decay
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 9, Druid 9
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Creature touched
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Save: Fortitude Half, see text
    SR: Yes

    With a flick of your wrist, you call a bit of essence from every poison in existence into your fingertips, then gently touch your opponent and watch them shriek in agony as they shrivel and wilt, while all aspects of their being crumble

    The creature touched takes 1d10+5 Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma drain (all calculated separately). Each instance of drain allows a Fortitude save for half drain.


    Alfek's Curse of Retribution
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 9, Druid 9
    Components: V, S
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: 1 round/level, see text
    Save: No
    SR: Yes

    You imbue yourself with deadly power. For the duration of this spell, whenever a creature attacks with you a non-reach melee weapon or a natural attack, that creature immediately takes 1d6 points of Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution damage (This effect allows spell resistance for each attack, and also has a duration of instantaneous). A creature only receives the effects of this spell once per round (so it would only affect the creature once on a full attack)


    Alfek's Curse of the Five-Starred Pentagram
    Necromancy
    Level: Sorc/Wiz 5, Druid 5
    Components: V, S, M, DF
    Casting Time: 1 round
    Range: Medium
    Area: 30 ft Burst
    Target: One or more creatures
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Save: Reflex Half
    SR: Yes

    As you cast the spell, a shadowy haze of mist appears and chokes all creatures in the area. Creatures who do not breathe are immune to the effects of this spell. All creatures in the affected area take 2d6 Strength damage, with a Reflex saving throw for half damage.

    Arcane Material Component: A five-starred pentagram drawn on a sheet of paper with blood taken from a living humanoid.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 10:30 PM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Who is this Alfek & why do I love him so?

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeta Kai View Post
    Who is this Alfek & why do I love him so?
    He's my character for a new game that I'm joining. These spells are actually spells he's researching.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    He's my character for a new game that I'm joining. These spells are actually spells he's researching.
    Shameless self-empowerment. I approve. Recommendations ho!

    First, a spell that allows you to deal small amounts of ability damage/burn to yourself to deal much higher amounts of damage (no save) on a target you make a ranged touch on. (hint: pair with Naberius)

    Second, one that allows you to convert damage dealt to yourself into ability damage to the foe that damaged you. Basically Black Karma Curse ++

    Third, one that deals Int damage based on the number/quality of buffs an enemy has (suck it, opposing casters!)

    Finally, one that allows you to sacrifice minions to deal no save, just suck ability damage on your melee attack(s).
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by TravelLog View Post
    Shameless self-empowerment. I approve. Recommendations ho!

    First, a spell that allows you to deal small amounts of ability damage/burn to yourself to deal much higher amounts of damage (no save) on a target you make a ranged touch on. (hint: pair with Naberius)

    Second, one that allows you to convert damage dealt to yourself into ability damage to the foe that damaged you. Basically Black Karma Curse ++

    Third, one that deals Int damage based on the number/quality of buffs an enemy has (suck it, opposing casters!)

    Finally, one that allows you to sacrifice minions to deal no save, just suck ability damage on your melee attack(s).
    Added the first and the third, thank you for your help.

    The second is too powerful in my opinion, and the fourth doesn't fit Alfek's character at all I'm afraid.

    Edit: Added Alfek's greater moon bolt, but I'm not sure if it should be a 7th or 8th level spell. What do you guys think?
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 01:57 AM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Added the first and the third, thank you for your help.

    The second is too powerful in my opinion, and the fourth doesn't fit Alfek's character at all I'm afraid.
    Necromancer without the occasional undead? Gasp!

    And the second was intended to be 8th/9th level by the way. But understandable to not be included. Have fun with Alfek!

    (I recommend you pick up the Blizzard spell if possible. Pair it with Blood Snow for massive constitution damage to multiple foes)
    Last edited by TravelLog; 2012-01-01 at 01:58 AM.
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by TravelLog View Post
    Necromancer without the occasional undead? Gasp!
    Psh. Druid necromancy is the only true necromancy. Resurrections are for clerics anyway.

    And the second was intended to be 8th/9th level by the way. But understandable to not be included. Have fun with Alfek!
    Ahhhh...Now I can see that. Okay, I'm going to make a 9th level version of that spell. *cracks my knuckles* Oh yeah, Seraphi is back, baby! It feels good to homebrew after such a long holiday!

    (I recommend you pick up the Blizzard spell if possible. Pair it with Blood Snow for massive constitution damage to multiple foes)
    I've got a maximized blood snow prepared already, but I'm worried blizzard might be difficult for my companions to navigate it (I'm in an [b]8 person party[/i], so I'm being extra careful with wide-radius spells). Thanks for the advice though!

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Superior Curse seems a little underpowered. Increasing the DC more might be too much, but it needs something else. Otherwise it would be more viable to just quicken a weaker spell. You could even create another more powerful version of base empowered curse that adds a bonus to the DC.
    I would worry about punishing curse doing extreme amounts of ability damage. The spell could basically turn into a save or die, which is impressive for a 2nd level spell. I would limit it somehow, maybe to a maximum of half your caster level.
    Moon bolt is also much too powerful to not allow a save. Otherwise your DM might start throwing spell reflecting monsters at you.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by eftexar View Post
    Superior Curse seems a little underpowered. Increasing the DC more might be too much, but it needs something else. Otherwise it would be more viable to just quicken a weaker spell. You could even create another more powerful version of base empowered curse that adds a bonus to the DC.
    Alright, it now also gives a +2 bonus to the ability score damage, which is pretty good for a 3rd level spell I think.

    I would worry about punishing curse doing extreme amounts of ability damage. The spell could basically turn into a save or die, which is impressive for a 2nd level spell. I would limit it somehow, maybe to a maximum of half your caster level.
    Alright. Limited to 1/2 CL, max 10.

    Moon bolt is also much too powerful to not allow a save. Otherwise your DM might start throwing spell reflecting monsters at you.
    Fair enough. But the increased damage alone isn't enough...at that point I might as well just cast maximized moon bolt instead. So what would you suggest?

    Added the requested Alfek's curse of retribution, and my personal favorite, the almighty Alfek's touch of complete decay.

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    Why not allow him to recover hit points equal to half the damage moon bolt deals, plus 5 hit points for each point of ability damage?

    And for your new stuff.
    Retribution is a tad powerful. I would limit it to once per round against any target or allow a save (but not both).
    Complete decay is powerful, but should be fine as a 9th level spell. As long as its not level drain I'm fine (they have always irked me).
    Last edited by eftexar; 2012-01-01 at 02:31 AM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Alfek's Insane God Mode spell
    No. Just no. Alfek's Touch of Complete Decay is insanity. This is
    Something I don't say often for 9th level spells. But, on average, dealing ~10 damage to all ability scores is madness. Paired with Divine Metamagic, you could cast it twice in a round (and maximize it under the right circumstances!) for 30 to all abilities.

    Lord help us.

    (On a serious note, with a bit of a nerf it'd be fine)
    Last edited by TravelLog; 2012-01-01 at 02:34 AM.
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Minor points:
    Su-Punishing should probably include a clause in the spell description for the save negating, just to be sure.

    Complete Decay says "damage" where it means "drain" at one point; this is intelligible, but a bit confusing. Perhaps reword it to something like this?
    The creature touched takes 1d10+5 ability drain in each ability score, calculated separately. The target may make a Fortitude save for half on each of these drains.
    Finally, Retribution is called "Aflek's", not "Alfek's" -- somehow this reminds me of a certain commercial, which is probably undesired.
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    That's RAW for you; 100% Rules-Legal, 110% silly.
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    "Common sense" and "RAW" are not exactly on speaking terms
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by eftexar View Post
    Why not allow him to recover hit points equal to half the damage moon bolt deals, plus 5 hit points for each point of ability damage?
    ...I dunno what version you're looking at, but the Spell Compendium version of moon bolt deals Strength damage only, no hit point damage.

    And for your new stuff.
    Retribution is a tad powerful. I would limit it to once per round against any target or allow a save (but not both).
    I guess I'll do that, but if that's the case, I'll bump it up to 1d6 per score (I was keeping it low with multiple attacks in mind)

    Minor points:
    Su-Punishing should probably include a clause in the spell description for the save negating, just to be sure.

    Complete Decay says "damage" where it means "drain" at one point; this is intelligible, but a bit confusing. Perhaps reword it to something like this?

    Finally, Retribution is called "Aflek's", not "Alfek's" -- somehow this reminds me of a certain commercial, which is probably undesired.
    Sure, fixed.

    No. Just no. Alfek's Touch of Complete Decay is insanity. This is
    Something I don't say often for 9th level spells. But, on average, dealing ~10 damage to all ability scores is madness. Paired with Divine Metamagic, you could cast it twice in a round (and maximize it under the right circumstances!) for 30 to all abilities.

    Lord help us.

    (On a serious note, with a bit of a nerf it'd be fine)
    Well, first of all, DMM is only for clerics, and is not something that you should balance crap around. (If your DM is allowing you to DMM Quicken 9ths, you've got bigger issues to worry about)

    That aside, how would you suggest I nerf it? I'm already allowing a saving throw, spell resistance, and the requirement to be in touch range and make a touch attack. (So the target gets its touch AC, spell resistance, and a Fortitude save against it, along with the AoO. That's 4 defenses right there)
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 02:44 AM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Sorry, I think I was looking at the Moon Blade spell. But recovering hit points might still be a useful mechanic, although I don't know if that would make up for the level of the spell. Maybe you could actually add damage to it though.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by eftexar View Post
    Sorry, I think I was looking at the Moon Blade spell. But recovering hit points might still be a useful mechanic, although I don't know if that would make up for the level of the spell. Maybe you could actually add damage to it though.
    Edit: Here we go! Updated and changed to Alfek's mass moon bolt! What do you think?
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 02:55 AM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Well, first of all, DMM is only for clerics, and is not something that you should balance crap around. (If your DM is allowing you to DMM Quicken 9ths, you've got bigger issues to worry about)

    That aside, how would you suggest I nerf it? I'm already allowing a saving throw, spell resistance, and the requirement to be in touch range and make a touch attack. (So the target gets its touch AC, spell resistance, and a Fortitude save against it, along with the AoO. That's 4 defenses right there)
    First, I didn't notice the SR: Yes, so that helps a great deal. That said, the reason it struck me as problematic is because when using this spell, the first thing any smart player would do is first lower the foes saves with other spells. A Balor, for example, has a Fort of 22. Even bare level optimizing I'd call the DC for this 30+ not including things like School Focus (Necromancy), etc. throw in a -5 to saves from other debuffs and the Balor is failing the saves 80% of the time. Even without maximize or empower, you'll succeed an average of 8 or so times using Celerity to pull it twice in a round. That's a lot of drain. And you'll probably hit Con too, immediately dropping 100 HP from the Balor.

    All in all, you probably reduced at least 2 scores by 20 and all the others by 10.

    That's nasty.

    I'm not sure what to nerf, but it's something you should at least consider.
    Last edited by TravelLog; 2012-01-01 at 02:56 AM.
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by TravelLog View Post
    First, I didn't notice the SR: Yes, so that helps a great deal. That said, the reason it struck me as problematic is because when using this spell, the first thing any smart player would do is first lower the foes saves with other spells. A Balor, for example, has a Fort of 22. Even bare level optimizing I'd call the DC for this 30+ not including things like School Focus (Necromancy), etc. throw in a -5 to saves from other debuffs and the Balor is failing the saves 80% of the time. Even without maximize or empower, you'll succeed an average of 8 or so times. That's a lot of drain. And you'll probably hit Con too, immediately dropping 100 HP from the Balor.

    All in all, you probably reduced at least 2 scores by 20 and all the others by 10.

    That's nasty.

    I'm not sure what to nerf, but it's something you should at least consider.
    ...Yeah, or, you know. You could use the same spell slot to imprison him instead. I don't understand why you're worried about serious drain when harm is still outdamaging (and has been for 5 levels), shivering touch is still paralyzing more, escalating enfeeblement matches the Strength drain as a penalty, but at 7 slots lower, and feeblemind makes the Int and Cha drain pretty useless.

    It's 17th level, TravelLog. Save-or-dies have been saving-or-dying for like, 6 levels. If you want ability damage to keep up with spells like destruction and imprisonment, well...it has to keep up.

    Edit: And your point about 20 drain to at least two scores is accurate, but...that's using 2 9th level spell slots. On a single creature, and you're not even expecting to kill him! How incredibly badly optimized is that?
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 03:01 AM.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    ...Yeah, or, you know. You could use the same spell slot to imprison him instead. I don't understand why you're worried about serious drain when harm is still outdamaging (and has been for 5 levels), shivering touch is still paralyzing more, escalating enfeeblement matches the Strength drain as a penalty, but at 7 slots lower, and feeblemind makes the Int and Cha drain pretty useless.

    It's 17th level, TravelLog. Save-or-dies have been saving-or-dying for like, 6 levels. If you want ability damage to keep up with spells like destruction and imprisonment, well...it has to keep up.

    Edit: And your point about 20 drain to at least two scores is accurate, but...that's using 2 9th level spell slots. On a single creature, and you're not even expecting to kill him! How incredibly badly optimized is that?
    I suppose you're right. Part of me just balks at that kind of drain.
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Argh. My DM didn't approve a single one of them. Ah well. They were fun to make at least.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Argh. My DM didn't approve a single one of them. Ah well. They were fun to make at least.
    D'aww. The only suggestion that I personally was going to make is that requiring six separate fortitude saves for the Touch of Complete Decay is a bit excessive, tends to bog things down a bit. Bumping it down to one fort save.
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    It's 17th level, TravelLog. Save-or-dies have been saving-or-dying for like, 6 levels. If you want ability damage to keep up with spells like destruction and imprisonment, well...it has to keep up.
    Or you could make the ability damage spells start to be multitarget.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    Or you could make the ability damage spells start to be multitarget.
    That's what I tried to do with Alfek's mass moon bolt, but...*sighs*

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    Quote Originally Posted by TravelLog View Post
    That said, the reason it struck me as problematic is because when using this spell, the first thing any smart player would do is first lower the foes saves with other spells.
    Only if he has the high-power spells (and time) to spare, and has a substantially better chance of "hitting" with the save-lowering spells than the primary spell (or he's using low-power spells to lower the save, and has the time and spells to try them several times, and also a decent chance of "hitting")

    A Balor, for example, has a Fort of 22. Even bare level optimizing I'd call the DC for this 30+ not including things like School Focus (Necromancy), etc. throw in a -5 to saves from other debuffs and the Balor is failing the saves 80% of the time.
    Of course, that needs a setup, and might be unworkable if you can't stick the save-lowering spells.

    using Celerity to pull it twice in a round.
    How's that work?

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    That's what I tried to do with Alfek's mass moon bolt, but...*sighs*
    But what? Seems potentially decent.

    Although it might be better to make it a true area-effect ability. Hits everything in the area (no matter how many), but allows a Reflex save. Sure, it means that evasion will stop it, but it's still a great way to take mooks (who are probably just one ability drain spell away from needing a 20 to hit) out of the picture in decent numbers.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    How's that work?
    Celerity. Spend an immediate action, get a standard action. You cast Alfek's touch of complete decay, end your turn, then at the start of the next creature's turn, interrupt with celerity, and cast Alfek's touch of complete decay again.

    But what? Seems potentially decent.
    But my DM has already disapproved all the spells I've posted so far, so a mass ability damager wasn't getting through.

    Edit: Added Alfek's curse of the five-starred pentagram.
    Last edited by NeoSeraphi; 2012-01-01 at 05:37 PM.

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    Alfek's Touch of Complete Decay is exactly what a 9th level spell should be, IMO. At least in image. Not sure about the numbers.
    Quote Originally Posted by jamieth View Post
    ...though Talla does her best to sound objective and impartial, it doesn't cover stuff like "ask a 9-year-old to tank for the party."
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Qwertystop View Post
    Alfek's Touch of Complete Decay is exactly what a 9th level spell should be, IMO. At least in image. Not sure about the numbers.
    Why thank you! That's exactly what I thought when I came up with it.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Arcane Material Component: A five-starred pentagram drawn on a sheet of paper with blood taken from a living humanoid, which you must lick off as you cast the spell.
    You totally had me until that last bit. Also ironically, creatures without tongues cannot use this spell. Suck it Gelatinous Cube wizard!
    Last edited by TravelLog; 2012-01-01 at 10:27 PM.
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    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by TravelLog View Post
    You totally had me until that last bit. Also ironically, creatures without tongues cannot use this spell. Suck it Gelatinous Cube wizard!
    You don't like it? Well, okay then, I'll remove that part.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Argh. My DM didn't approve a single one of them. Ah well. They were fun to make at least.
    Did your DM say why they were not approved? As a DM my first glance at the spells is 'no way', but after looking them over they might not be that bad.


    And for Alfek's Curse of the Five-Starred Pentagram, did you really want a reflex save? A person is going to jump out of the way of a 'cloud of necromantic magic'? Would not the standard Fortitude save go here? It's kind hard to dodge a mist. And if the spell does a choking effect, that's a fortitude save, as you can't 'dodge' choking.

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    Default Re: 3.5 Ability Damage Spells! (PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by bloodtide View Post
    Did your DM say why they were not approved? As a DM my first glance at the spells is 'no way', but after looking them over they might not be that bad.
    The main reaon is that I think they are for the most part redundant with either metamagic versions of existing spells or other supporting spells (such as assay resistsance) providing the same effects.

    For the most part being swift actions for the boosts using lower level slots is no way suitable or balanced for a higher level game where the low level slots have less value and action conservation is more important as fights are over very quickly. THe level 2/4 boosts while not a massive game changer at 7-10th level have a massively different impact at 15th level. Particularly for a PC where all the spells are built around dealing ability damage.
    Last edited by DrK; 2012-01-02 at 01:50 AM.

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