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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default What were the things Redcloak summoned

    The question is all in the title, and referring to the last three comics. I know the elementals are supposed to be based on modern elements rather than the four classical ones, and are supposed to be a joke, but what about the smaller and large demons? What DnD monsters are they?

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    They are most likely horned devils and bearded devils, since horned devils have the ability to summon 1-6 bearded devils. Bearded devils don't seem to have flight, but the Giant also gave succubi plane shift and imps telepathy, so it's not a stretch to think he gave bearded devils wings.
    Last edited by Gift Jeraff; 2012-01-13 at 12:02 PM.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    That does sound plausible, thanks a lot Jeraff

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    What I didn't understand was why redcloak was paying them, aren't summoned monsters forced to obey the summoner? It seems that he actually hired them by making contact with the infernal plane.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by hoff View Post
    What I didn't understand was why redcloak was paying them, aren't summoned monsters forced to obey the summoner? It seems that he actually hired them by making contact with the infernal plane.
    He was probably using the greater planar ally spell. Which DOES require you to pay them.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    The Summon Monster line of spells has limited duration. By summoning them through the Gate or Planar Ally spells and paying them, Redcloak could ensure that they'd stay there for the whole fight. At least, that's how it seems to me. There might be more to it.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Silva Stormrage View Post
    He was probably using the greater planar ally spell. Which DOES require you to pay them.
    This is probably the case. Using Summon Monster (X) would result in the devils lasting for 102 seconds before vanishing- hardly enough time to crush the entirety of the resistance.

    EDIT: Curse'd ninjas...
    Last edited by Othesemo; 2012-01-13 at 04:57 PM.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Gift Jeraff View Post
    They are most likely horned devils and bearded devils, since horned devils have the ability to summon 1-6 bearded devils. Bearded devils don't seem to have flight, but the Giant also gave succubi plane shift and imps telepathy, so it's not a stretch to think he gave bearded devils wings.
    I think its far more likely that those were either oversized fiendish satyrs or pit fiends with furry pants and serious issues with using their more powerful abilities.

    On a more serious note, what was that thing in the tunnel that killed the person? It looks a bit different from the other ones. Has anyone posted a hypothesis?
    Last edited by AlfredAmeoba; 2012-01-13 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Furry, not fury. Although fury pants would be interesting as well
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by AlfredAmeoba View Post
    On a more serious note, what was that thing in the tunnel that killed the person? It looks a bit different from the other ones. Has anyone posted a hypothesis?
    Someone suggested balor, but that would be a demon and I believe the common consensus is that he liked summoned devils.

    Could be a pit fiend. Lacks the "blah blah blah fire all around it" the SRD says they have, but then, artistic liberties. It's the only SRD devil with a CR higher than the horned devils (20 to their 16), and is large and massive, so make of that what you will.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Well I don't know jack about 3.5 monsters but someone suggested cornugon for the guy in the tunnel. But
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Can we determine what spell slots Redcloak used during this combat? I'm a newbie to 3.5 so correct me if I'm wrong, but...

    9th: Implosion
    9th: Unused
    8th: Planar Ally, Greater (Horned Devil #1)
    8th: Planar Ally, Greater (Horned Devil #2)
    8th: Earthquake
    6th: Word of Recall
    #th: Summon Elemental
    #th: Unnamed random spell used to kill paladin

    Assuming the two Horned Devils summoned their Bearded cousins, is it possible RC has his entire arsenal of 7th and lower spells, plus one 9th, still available?

    Edit: Forgot about Word of Recall.
    Last edited by Great Dane; 2012-01-13 at 07:13 PM.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Lvl45DM! View Post
    Well I don't know jack about 3.5 monsters but someone suggested cornugon for the guy in the tunnel.
    Cornugons and Horned Devils are the same thing. I believe that the monster in the tunnel and the ones in the cave (commonly believed to be horned devils) are generally considered to be different creatures.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Winter Light View Post
    Someone suggested balor, but that would be a demon and I believe the common consensus is that he liked summoned devils.
    Not to say, couldn't summon demons if he wanted to, since as a Lawful cleric he can't cast [Chaotic] spells.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    It's probably a Pit Fiend, but it could be a Malebranche from Fiendish Codex 2.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Great Dane View Post
    #th: Summon Elemental
    Probably Summon Monster VIII, that's the level at which you'd get one greater elemental.

    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonMonsterVIII.htm

    Earthquake is his "Destruction" domain spell.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Hmm... at 17th level, he used one too many 8th level spells.

    IMHO his other 9th level spell was "Extended Summon Monster VIII". So we saw all his 8th and 9th level spells.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Matter View Post
    Hmm... at 17th level, he used one too many 8th level spells.

    IMHO his other 9th level spell was "Extended Summon Monster VIII". So we saw all his 8th and 9th level spells.
    Earthquake was cast from his Destruction domain spell level 8 slot.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Winter Light View Post
    Someone suggested balor, but that would be a demon and I believe the common consensus is that he liked summoned devils.
    Balors? You mean a [censored by the Tolkien Estate].



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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Nahmer View Post
    Earthquake was cast from his Destruction domain spell level 8 slot.
    Exactly. He's 17th level, he's got 2+1 8th level slots and 1+1 9th.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    I can't help to wonder if the OS elemental isn't individually more powerful than the horned devils. Not because it's made of a tougher and denser material and is way bigger, giving it advantage of range and mass. Not because it seems very agile in that it could actually capture someone. Not because it's a construct and as such, I imagine will pr. default have better resistance, and better endurance. No, I think it might be individually more powerful, despite being a lower level spell summon (though the devils have the advantage of spells, which could explain this), because there's only one OS elemental, while there are two horned devils. My gut feeling is that the single enemy is the most powerful one. I guess it's because one weaker guy won't add much to two stronger guys unlike two weaker guys and one stronger guys, but if this is why I think it'd be drama appropriate for the OS elemental to be the strongest individual unit (maybe beside Redcloak, though I imagine the summons are often close in power to the summoner otherwise summoning wouldn't be of much use, unless for crowd control, but that's what the bearded devils are for, is my guess), I'm not certain.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Lvl45DM! View Post
    Well I don't know jack about 3.5 monsters but someone suggested cornugon for the guy in the tunnel. But
    The devil in the tunnel is a pit fiend i think.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    @BaronOfHell: Elementals are not the same as constructs FYI.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by super dark33 View Post
    The devil in the tunnel is a pit fiend i think.
    Possible. The giant devil Qaar summoned didn't have the spiky scales that the one in the tunnel seems to.

    If a pit fiend is a bit powerful for a 17th level cleric to be making use of, a malebranche (Huge devil from MM2, same number of HD as a horned devil/cornugon) might be an alternative.
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2012-01-16 at 03:53 PM.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by BaronOfHell View Post
    I can't help to wonder if the OS elemental isn't individually more powerful than the horned devils.
    I doubt it. The Horned Devils are CR 16 and the Elder Elemental is CR 11. They both have DR 10 but it's the misc "devil" abilities (including regen) which are going to make life difficult.

    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/devil.htm
    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/elemental.htm

    Other differences:
    The Devils were paid, negotiated their working conditions, had to be summoned a head of time, took a lot longer to summon, were there more or less willingly, and were there a lot longer than the Elemental.

    The Elemental wasn't paid, but Redcloak was able to bring him in with a snap of his fingers on the spot after he knew what would be the best choice.

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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Matter View Post
    Exactly. He's 17th level, he's got 2+1 8th level slots and 1+1 9th.
    Plus any bonus slots for having a high intellect score.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Deepbluediver View Post
    Plus any bonus slots for having a high intellect score.
    You mean Wisdom score, since Redcloak is a Cleric and his casting is based on Wisdom.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Possible. The giant devil Qaar summoned didn't have the spiky scales that the one in the tunnel seems to.

    If a pit fiend is a bit powerful for a 17th level cleric to be making use of, a malebranche (Huge devil from MM2, same number of HD as a horned devil/cornugon) might be an alternative.
    Since gate allows for HD up to twice your CL when calling a single creature, it is quite possible said devil was indeed a Pit Fiend, I also like to think that as the comic is assumed to follow Core only. The only times we have seen anyone using non-core material it is usually brought to attention.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by KillianHawkeye View Post
    You mean Wisdom score, since Redcloak is a Cleric and his casting is based on Wisdom.
    D'oh! yes, that one.
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Quote Originally Posted by Dusk Eclipse View Post
    Since gate allows for HD up to twice your CL when calling a single creature, it is quite possible said devil was indeed a Pit Fiend, I also like to think that as the comic is assumed to follow Core only. The only times we have seen anyone using non-core material it is usually brought to attention.
    Usually- but not always. Sometimes noncore material passes without a mention of "Core" or the relevant splatbook- Warlocks, for example.

    If the splatbooks have appeared onscreen (MM2, BoVD, Fiend Folio- in the strips discussing Redcloak's creation of 3 Xykon decoys) might that imply that they're in use from now on?
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    Default Re: What were the things Redcloak summoned

    Although it's worth nothing that all of the Xykon decoys were older-edition monsters that had were "shuffled out" to non-core books in 3rd edition, and from what I can tell that makes them a bit more likely to show up without mention then non-core material new to 3.5, considering that one of the primary reasons the comic focuses on core is recognition. (The warlock may be the same principle in reverse, come to think about it).

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