A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Sgt. Cookie's Avatar

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    Default Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Malice Born

    It is said that nothing is born evil. This is false, as there are many that are born with a burning hatred of all life. Things that are so filled with malice that they could only be born with it in their hearts. They are the Malice Born.

    Creating a Malice Born

    "Malice Born" is an inherited template that can be added to any creature with an int score, excluding Living Constructs (Referred to hereafter as the base creature)

    A Malice Born uses all the base creature’s statistics and special abilities except as noted here:

    Size and Type:
    The creature's size is unchanged. The creatures gains the Chaotic and Evil subtypes. If it previously possessed the Good or Lawful subtype(s) then it looses them.

    Hit Dice:
    All current and future Hit Dice are increased by one step (D4 becomes D6, D6 becomes D8, etc. D12 becomes D12 + 2.).

    Speed: Same as base creature.

    Armour Class:
    Same as base creature.

    Attack:
    Same as base creature.

    Special attacks:
    Malice Born gain the Deadly Touch ability, as per the Paladin of Slaughter class ability, except that points per day is equal to Hd X Strength Modifier. If the base creature has only one hit die, it uses Double its Strength Modifer instead.

    A Malice Born may use this ability in conjunction only with natural and unarmed attacks. It may make a touch attack as per normal, however.

    If the Malice Born gains Deadly Touch as a class feature, track the two separately.

    Special qualities:
    Damage Resistance (Ex):
    Malice Born gain DR Lawful and Good equal to half its Hit Die, rounded up, X 5.

    Aura of evil (Ex):
    Malice Born have an aura of evil equal to it's hit die, as though it were a cleric of an evil deity. This stacks with any aura of evil it would gain via other sources.

    All encompassing hate
    Because of a Malice Born's indiscriminate hate, except to other Malice Born who are never attacked simply due to this ability, the DM must roll a D% (Provided it is not a Party vs a single Malice Born), on a roll of 1-50, the Malice Born attacks the PCs and allies, on a roll of 51-100 the Malice Born attacks the other enemy(ies).

    Abilities: Malice born gain +8 to strength and a -8 to wisdom.

    Skills: As base creature.

    Alignment:
    Always Chaotic Evil (Even if the base creature's stat block says otherwise.)

    Challenge rating:
    Same as base creature + 3

    Level adjustment: + 2
    Last edited by Sgt. Cookie; 2012-01-19 at 12:07 PM.
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    Ponytar by Dirtytabs

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeWhyAreAllTheNamesTaken(Imgur)
    Chaotic neutral. Might rob you blind. Might save your life. Might do both.

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    Troll in the Playground
     
    PirateGirl

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Special attacks:
    Malice Born with two or more hit die gain the Deadly Touch ability, as per the Paladin of Slaughter class ability, except that uses per day is equal to Hd X Strength Modifier.
    This is overpowered for a +2 CR. For Fighter types, this becomes a ridiculous number of uses per day. A level 6 fighter with 18 Str could use it 24 times a day and that is a ridiculous number.

    Limiting it based on HD would be more appropriate. For example Creatures with 1-6 HD could use it once per day, Creatures with 7-12- HD could use it twice per day and Creatures with 13 or more HD could use it three times per day.

    Size and Type:
    The creature's size is unchanged, add (Or change) the subtypes (to) Chaotic and Evil.
    Pick one. The template does different things if the Subtype is added rather than changed. The Template should either change the Subtype or add to it definitively rather than leaving this to whim or chance.

    Debby
    Last edited by Debihuman; 2012-01-18 at 01:52 PM.
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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    This is overpowered for a +2 CR. For Fighter types, this becomes a ridiculous number of uses per day. A level 6 fighter with 18 Str could use it 24 times a day and that is a ridiculous number.

    Limiting it based on HD would be more appropriate. For example Creatures with 1-6 HD could use it once per day, Creatures with 7-12- HD could use it twice per day and Creatures with 13 or more HD could use it three times per day.
    It was based off the paladin of tyranny/slaughter's ability of the same name. It function's like the normal paladin's lay on hands ability, expect that it does damage.

    Here's a link: Paladin variants

    Pick one. The template does different things if the Subtype is added rather than changed. The Template should either change the Subtype or add to it definitively rather than leaving this to whim or chance.

    Debby
    What I mean is if the base creatre already has an alingment subtype, change it. For example, an outsider with the Good subtype, it looses the Good subtype and gains the Chaotic and Evil subtypes.

    I suppose I should clarify that.
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    Ponytar by Dirtytabs

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeWhyAreAllTheNamesTaken(Imgur)
    Chaotic neutral. Might rob you blind. Might save your life. Might do both.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    PirateGuy

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Maybe write it like this then

    Subtype: The creatures gains the Chaotic and Evil subtype. If it previously possessed the Good or Lawful subtype than it looses them.

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    If they're born that way, shouldn't it be an inherited template?

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mangles View Post
    Maybe write it like this then

    Subtype: The creatures gains the Chaotic and Evil subtype. If it previously possessed the Good or Lawful subtype than it looses them.
    Thanks, I wasn't really sure how to word it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yitzi View Post
    If they're born that way, shouldn't it be an inherited template?
    I'm not really that experienced with templates, so thanks for pointing that out.
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    Ponytar by Dirtytabs

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeWhyAreAllTheNamesTaken(Imgur)
    Chaotic neutral. Might rob you blind. Might save your life. Might do both.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Debihuman View Post
    This is overpowered for a +2 CR. For Fighter types, this becomes a ridiculous number of uses per day. A level 6 fighter with 18 Str could use it 24 times a day and that is a ridiculous number.

    Limiting it based on HD would be more appropriate. For example Creatures with 1-6 HD could use it once per day, Creatures with 7-12- HD could use it twice per day and Creatures with 13 or more HD could use it three times per day.
    To further elaborate on what Cookie said; it's not 24 uses per day, it'd be a total of 24 points of damage inflicted per day.


    And I think this makes this template over-CRed.

    Let's put it on a Hill Giant for example. The Giant changes as so:

    • Gains the Chaotic and Evil Subtypes. [Does nothing really.]
    • Gains 12 extra hit points. [The equivalent of a little over one extra hit dice with average hp taken.]
    • Can deal 108 damage per day as a touch attack, with a Will save halving that. [Woof. That is a lot of damage and can take the party Fighter (assuming average hp for hit dice rolls) almost out of the fight completely. But then there goes the daily allotment and the Giant needs to make a successful touch attack and then hope the Fighter blows their save.]
    • DR 5/Lawful and Good [Now this is nice, but still only DR 5.]
    • Can't really work well alongside anyone, meaning chances are it will always be ganged up on.
    • +4 Strength, -4 Wisdom [Hello Enchantment and Illusion schools of Magic!]


    Now, that Touch attack is one doozy of an option for the Hill Giant now, but I don't feel it really measures up to being a CR 10 monster.


    Now let's add it onto a lowly goblin:

    • Gains Chaotic and Evil Subtypes. [Again, nothing here.]
    • Gains either 0 Hit Points or 1 hit point. [If it only affects racial hit dice, it's the former. If not, it's the latter. And that's 1 stinking hit point.]
    • Doesn't even gain the Deadly Touch ability.
    • DR 5/Lawful and Good. [Ok, this let's the Goblin stay longer in the fight and is waaay more useful on the Goblin at its appropriate CR range than the Hill Giant.]
    • Is going to be encountered alone. A single Goblin.
    • +4 Strength, -4 Wis. [Enchantment and Illusion are knocking on the door to keep your pitiful strength bump company.]


    The Goblin is definitely not a CR 3 creature. I wouldn't even say it gives a party of level 1 Adventurers too much trouble. A Fighter with 20 Strength and swinging a Greatsword would cleave through the poor bugger slower, but he still would get the job done.

    Just my two coppers on this.
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-01-19 at 12:31 PM.

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    In respons to Troll's comments I have made some adjustments to the template.

    • Can work with other Malice Born.
    • Massive strength boost.
    • DR is now equal to half Hit Die X 2
    • Creatures with only one hit die gain Deadly Touch with points equal to double strength mod.


    If anyone has an idea for CR adjustments and LA, please suggest them.
    Open the lid and snatch a homebrewed treat from Cookie's Jar

    Ponytar by Dirtytabs

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeWhyAreAllTheNamesTaken(Imgur)
    Chaotic neutral. Might rob you blind. Might save your life. Might do both.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Cookie View Post
    DR is now equal to half Hit Die X 2
    You have it as x5.

    Edit:

    Also (1/2*X)*2 is just X.

    Edit Edit:

    -8 to Wisdom is also..well...kind of ludicrous. The Stat boosts given by a template don't need to balance out with the penalties.
    Last edited by Tanuki Tales; 2012-01-19 at 02:01 PM.

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Brau View Post
    You have it as x5.
    Sorry, yes. How it is in the OP is the correct one. Half Hit Die X 5.

    -8 to Wisdom is also..well...kind of ludicrous. The Stat boosts given by a template don't need to balance out with the penalties.
    My thoughts are now out of racial mode... Gonna change that to, -4 perhaps?
    Last edited by Sgt. Cookie; 2012-01-19 at 02:06 PM.
    Open the lid and snatch a homebrewed treat from Cookie's Jar

    Ponytar by Dirtytabs

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeWhyAreAllTheNamesTaken(Imgur)
    Chaotic neutral. Might rob you blind. Might save your life. Might do both.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Cookie View Post
    Sorry, yes. How it is in the OP is the correct one. Half Hit Die X 5.
    I hate using the word, especially since it makes me feel more dickish than I mean to be, but that is also ludicrous.

    The DR would scale as so:

    1:2
    2:5
    3:7
    4:10
    5:12
    6:15
    7:17
    8:20
    9:22

    And Boom.

    At 9 HD you've gone past most creatures with DR and at 11 you've gone past every non-epic creature I can think of.

    You end up with DR 50/Good and Lawful with 20 HD and I don't even think the Gods or Arch Devils as statted in 3.0 had DR that high.


    My thoughts are now out of racial mode... Gonna change that to, -4 perhaps?
    If you feel that's the way to go. Templates don't need to balance themselves out, they just need to balance out against the opportunity cost of applying them. A template is too good when it gives away more than enough to make up for the lost CR/levels.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Malice Born [Template, 3.5, PEACH]

    Hmmmm, I honestly didn't like this part:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt. Cookie View Post
    Hit Dice:
    All current and future Hit Dice are increased by one step (D4 becomes D6, D6 becomes D8, etc. D12 becomes D12 + 2.).
    Specially the part that says d12+2. By putting it that way, you're increasing the Hit Die to (an imaginary) d16: let's remember that, when you increase a Hit Die, you only increase the average hit points in 1 point per die, not 2. You would only increase it by 2 if you were maxing out all the rolls. Besides, it just reads bad, IMHO. Have you considered simply giving a +2 (or even +4) to Constitution?
    Last edited by Larkas; 2012-01-20 at 12:24 PM.
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