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Thread: Random question about outsiders
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2012-01-31, 09:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Random question about outsiders
So, for the characters that are evil with a chaotic bent, they would most likely summon a demon, and Lawful and evil characters would summon devils.
i BELIEVE NE is Yugoloths?
good characters go with celestials, but it appears Law/Chaos is less important to them (or i dont have enough monster manuals fleshing them out.
And finally Neutral characters get Slaadi and Modrons (i suppose)
So my question is, am I missing any aligned outsiders? Guess its something new and exciting to research if i can just get a little assistance pointing me in the right direction)
thanks in advance
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2012-01-31, 10:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
It depends on the edition. 1st edition had far more categories of fiends than 2nd... demodands comes to mind, but I can't recall all the divisions.
The Cranky Gamer
*It isn't realism, it's verisimilitude; the appearance of truth within the framework of the game.
*Picard management tip: Debate honestly. The goal is to arrive at the truth, not at your preconception.
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2012-01-31, 10:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
It is inevitable, of course, that persons of epicurean refinement will in the course of eternity engage in dealings with those of... unsavory character. Record well any transactions made, and repay all favors promptly.. (Thanks to Gnomish Wanderer for the Toreador avatar! )
Wanna see what all this Exalted stuff is about? Here's a primer!
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2012-01-31, 11:54 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Hm, well, inevitables work fairly well for lawful characters in 3.5. On the celestial side of things, you have angels for lawful good, eladrin for chaotic good, and guardinals (animal-headed creatures) for neutral good. The first two are definitely in the first Monster Manual; off-hand I don't remember if guardinals made the cut.
I also think the different flavors of Genie make suitable summons depending on your alignment: CG for djinni and LE for efreeti (I think there are a couple other kinds but I don't know what they are).
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2012-02-01, 12:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
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2012-02-01, 01:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Lawful Good:
Formians
Archons
Neutral Good:
Guardinals
Chaotic Good:
Eladrin
Asuras
Any Good:
Angels
True Neutral:
Rilmani?
Lawful Neutral:
Modrons
Inevitables
Chaotic Neutral:
Slaad
Lawful Evil:
Bladelings
Baatezu (Devils)
Neutral Evil:
Vapporighu
Yugoloths (Daemons)
Gehreleths (Demodands)
Hordelings
Night Hags
Chaotic Evil:
Tanari (Demons)
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2012-02-01, 01:34 AM (ISO 8601)
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2012-02-03, 06:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
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2012-02-03, 06:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
No, Azatas are the Pathfinder name for Eladrin.
Where is Eldan when you need him, he knows his Planescape.We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.
Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying
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2012-02-03, 06:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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2012-02-03, 06:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Chaotic Good outsiders from the Book of Exalted Deeds. No idea if they have any more background than that.
We are not standing on the shoulders of giants, but on very tall tower of other dwarves.
Spriggan's Den Heroic Fantasy Roleplaying
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2012-02-03, 07:57 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Asleep, duh. It's my holidays
Okay, then.
Traditionally, the great wheel has seventeen outer planes, only nine of which correspond exactly to one alignment. These have their own outsiders.
Going Clockwise:
Elysium, the neutral good plane, has Guardinals, seven humanoids with animalistic features. Those were a bit sidelined in 3.5, and were changed in pretty much full half-animal humanoids. They are mostly peaceful, but from time to time go on crusades against the lower planes.
The Beastlands, between neutral good and chaotic good, have mostly animals, but also some guardinals and the Animal Lords, such as the famous Cat Lord which, I think, was updated in the epic handbook.
Arborea, the chaotic good plane, has Eladrin, fey-like humanoids. They are the only outsiders with the ability to wander the mortal worlds at will, as long as no one recognizes them for what they are, in which case they are banished. As such, they mostly work as advisors, sages and guides to mortals, unless the need is dire, in which case they start whooping ass. I still think they were partially inspired by Gandalf. The olympian gods and many fey also dwell here.
Ysgard, the plane between chaotic good and chaotic neutral, again, has no really relevant outsiders. There are giants, dwarves, elves and nordic gods here, and Tome of Battle has the Valkyries. Einherjar, too, are mentioned a few times, but I think were never updated to third edition.
Limbo, the plane of chaotic neutral, has the Slaad. These used to be shapeless monstrosities able to take any form they could imagine, until the four strongest of their race magically locked them into a toadlike shape and set them into an endless war against each other so that none could ever threaten their place.
Pandemonium, the plane between chaotic neutral and chaotic evil, is mostly empty caves free of all live. The theme here is darkness, isolation and madness.Howlers come from here and should be in the monster manual. The Fiend Folio has Darkweavers which are also natives.
The Abyss, the plane of chaotic evil, has the Demons or Tanar'ri. There's a dozen books on them, so I don't think I need to say much. There's a few critters here that aren't technically Tanar'ri, also in the demon entry. The older, original inhabitants of the plane are known as Obyriths. Of them, not much is known, except what is detailed in the Fiendish Codex.
Carceri (or Tartaros), the plane between chaotic evil and chaotic neutral, is inhabited by Gehreleth, a race of three kinds of fiends created by a rogue Baernoloth (see below.) Furthermore, the original great titans are imprisoned here.
Hades, or the Grey Waste, is the plane of neutral evil. From here originate Hordelings, near-mindless beings with a kind of group-mind subtly influencing them, Night Hags, malicious, magically gifted crones that control the soul trade, and the Baernoloth, the possibly most ancient of the evil races. These created the Yugoloth, which now inhabit both Hades and Gehenna, the plane between neutral and lawful evil.
Gehenna: see Hades.
Baator, or the Nine Hells, is home to the Devils or Baatezu. These are well-detailed in several books .Depending on the cosmology, some of them, including Asmodeus, their lord, are fallen Archons or Angels. Other inhabitants are the Ancient Baatorians, the imprisoned original inhabitants of the plane.
Acheron, the plane between lawful evil and lawful neutral has, as far as I remember, no original inhabitants.
Mechanus, the plane of lawful neutral, was originally home to the Modrons, which were all but removed from third edition. They are losing a gigantic war against the Formians, which are invading their plane from Arcadia after a planar catastrophe made the crossing possible. Other inhabitants are the crystal-like Moderators, the Moignos, which are based on mathematical equations given flesh, and the Inevitables, which enforce cosmic law.
Arcadia lies between lawful neutral and lawful good. It is the native home of the ant-like Formians.
Celestia, or the heavens, are home to Archons, the crusaders of lawful good. They, too, are in the monster manual.
Finally, there's the Rilmani on the Outlands, the plane of true neutrality. They can be found in the FIend Folio as well.
Then, there's Angels. They are not true outsiders in the sense that they come from a plane. Instead, they are created by various gods to be their servants. Evil gods tend to have their personal servants custom-made, such as the Minions of Set, shapeshifting crocodile-men.
Asuras, mentioned above, are archons that have fallen, not to evil, but to chaos. As such, they are even more zealous, but crusade for chaos, not law.Resident Vancian Apologist
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2012-02-03, 02:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
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2012-02-03, 04:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Ummm "Always Lawful Neutral" begs to differ. They are giant ant things. They function on the hivemind mentality. Sounds text book LN to me. Plus I believe their home plane is Mechanus, the LN plane.
Last edited by MesiDoomstalker; 2012-02-03 at 04:42 PM.
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2012-02-03, 04:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
They are Arcadian originally. Close enough to LG.
Resident Vancian Apologist
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2012-02-03, 04:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
I was just going off the top of my head, and I remembered they were from Arcadia which is a LG plane.
Also, not sure how you could define textbook lawful neutral for an outsider, as law represents many wildly different concepts which are often at odds to one another. Loyalty, honor, honesty, obeying tradition, logic, obeying the law of the land, etc. are all honorable things which, when taken to the extreme, are directly at odds with one another.Last edited by Talakeal; 2012-02-03 at 04:50 PM.
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2012-02-03, 04:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-02-03, 04:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Planescape kinda used half-alignments. Under that system, Formians would be Lawful Good-ish.
Resident Vancian Apologist
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2012-02-03, 04:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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2012-02-03, 05:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Under AD&D, "Lawful Good-ish" was usually expressed as "Lawful Neutral with Good tendencies" or "Lawful Neutral (Good)," abbreviated LN(G). So formians are LN already, just leaning a bit to the Good side of things, so it wouldn't be necessary for them to lose that tendency and become "fully" LN if they took over Mechanus.
Last edited by PairO'Dice Lost; 2012-02-03 at 05:01 PM.
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2012-02-03, 05:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
Well, either they'd turn LN, or whatever part of Mechanus they had would switch back to Arcadia.
Looking at how they are handled in 3.5, I guess they were turned fully neutral.Resident Vancian Apologist
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2012-02-04, 10:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Random question about outsiders
The Cranky Gamer
*It isn't realism, it's verisimilitude; the appearance of truth within the framework of the game.
*Picard management tip: Debate honestly. The goal is to arrive at the truth, not at your preconception.
*Mutant Dawn for Savage Worlds!
*The One Deck Engine: Gaming on a budget
Written by Me on DriveThru RPG
There are almost 400,000 threads on this site. If you need me to address a thread as a moderator, include a link.