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  1. - Top - End - #91
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    I'm messing around with a Ape Shaman Druid, it gets the ability to rage as a Barbarian equal to it's level and can choose 2 rage powers at 12 and 16. It can't choose any rage power with a level requirement, and counts as 1/2 Barbarian for bonuses from level. What would you suggest I grab, and should I grab the feat Extra Rage Power?
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  2. - Top - End - #92
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Depends on what powers are helpful!

    If you want even more natural attacks from a form lacking in them, you could try animal fury and lesser fiend totem (beast totem is likely to clash with wild-shape, spirit totem relies upon charisma.)

    You may or may not want moment of clarity if you need to heal/buff someone mid-rage and don;t want to STOP raging.
    In a tripping/reach build, quick reflexes may be nice but probably sin;t worth it otherwise.

    Reckless abandon is quite good, particularly if combined with power attack, as it is effectively shock-trooper for pathfinder. combine with guarded stance and it has no penalty so long as you are in melee.
    Powerful blow/lethal accuracy probably aren't worth it unless you have the add ons, and you can't get those so...

    Knockback may be worth it (bull rush +str in damage), knockdown may not (as you can Trip with every attack already.)

    Strength surge is always, ALLWAYS worth it. If the foe doesn't have freedom of movement, it will basically guarantee at least ONE grapple or other combat maneuver, and it's pretty nice for picking heavy things up in general.
    Smasher is also good for the rare occasion when your pissed-off monkey-man need to bash down that door NOW.
    Last edited by Doorhandle; 2013-01-11 at 03:53 AM.
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  3. - Top - End - #93
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by grarrrg View Post
    There is nothing wrong with "plain" Barbarian.
    But chances are there is an archetype that will better fit whatever it is you want to do.
    The only exception, and it's a weird one, is Totem Warrior.
    EVERY Barbarian EVER should be Totem Warrior. But that's more due to Totem Warrior being really odd than anything else.

    And that goes for pretty much every class (cept the Totem Warrior part). The 'plain' version is always a perfectly viable choice.
    They errata'd the Totem Warrior or rather, the line in Ultimate Combat. The Totem Warrior now does only what it originally said it did. Which is nothing.
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  4. - Top - End - #94
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    I've been off the forums for some time. I'll try to do some minor updates now, but I'm not sure when a full feat section will be in place.
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    Knowledge (local) being trained only, and not a class skill for many classes, means that your average human may well not be able to identify other humans! This may explain the exceptional quantity of half-human hybrids.

  5. - Top - End - #95
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Doorhandle View Post
    Depends on what powers are helpful!
    So taking your advice into consideration, I think I'll take the feats Cleave, Power Attack, Natural Spell, 4 Extra Rage Power, Raging Vitality, Furious Focus, and the Powers Reckless Abandon, Animal Fury, Guarded Stance, Knockback, Strength Surge, and Smasher. For the Bonus Druid feats, the only useful ones seem to be Toughness, Endurance, and Diehard, and if I choose human as a race, I'll grab some feat like Combat Reflexes.
    EDIT: Oh, and if the DM allows it, Multiattack.
    Last edited by The Random NPC; 2013-01-11 at 03:43 PM.
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  6. - Top - End - #96
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Hi all - bit of a virgin post here - but a couple of things to add and ask.
    Preamble: I was a big big time 3.0-3.5 dnd player and my friends and I all ended up swapping over several games to pathfinder in the last year or so. I used to think barbarians were horrible but pathfinder barbarians with their rage powers are kind of amazing and I've
    1) made a barbarian for a low level game and 2) in an ongoing (curently level 12) campaign I'm using several tribes of barbarians as enemies.

    So to look at 1) for a little bit - I made a human invulnerable rager with superstition as an 'antimage' sort of character. Were doing a game where Mages rule everything so it was appropriate. Superstition + the favored class bonus make it stuck up super fast - 2 +7/12per level bonus to all saves vs most everything. I pretty much have to roll 1's to fail saves. I also have auspicious mark...which I personally think is pretty overpowered and lets me roll ones on saves and still succeed. I have yet to have a time its interfered with getting a buff - either I chug potions - someone casts spells beforehand - or I voluntarily end rage and then get a spell cast on me.

    ** Here is one thing to share I haven't seen on this forum yet**
    After doing that - rage is over - I'm fatigued - probably damaged from being the BSF - and about to get buffed... kind of a bummer right? Actually not a bummer at all. We have a paladin in the party - paladins have lay on hands - lay on hands REMOVES FATIGUE!! So I charge in - waste something - take all the damage - use up my 1/rage powers like auspicious mark - then end my rage and get healed/fatigue removed and I can keep going. This worked so well that our halfling paladin (holy gun) and I ended up putting a saddle on my barbarian so he could always be there to do this. Adding in the human luck feats (reroll 1's/make enemies reroll crits, add +8 to any roll) and good equipment/decent stock of potions and I've been been killing enemies CR 4-6 higher than I am when I was level 3-6. I hadn't even seen the Scared Rager which gets all the reroll/ 1/2 duration which seems to end up being just kind of silly added on to the superstition bonuses.... Although DR 1/2 level is pretty amazing and hard to give up.

    Second section: Alternate Barbarian Builds
    In a game I'm running some of the enemies/allies are Barbarian tribes with their own Totem animals (lesser gods essentially with their own domains) and highly varied tactics. Here are some of the ones I have to share that you guys might appreciate.

    1) Titan Mauler Archtype: -use larger weapons, focus on attacks of opportunity with enormous weapons

    Rage Powers:
    (inspire ferocity, reckless abandon) - these are amazing for any barbarian that has a group that needs attack bonus....
    **Come and Get Me
    **Unexpected Strike (Ex): The barbarian can make an attack of opportunity against a foe that moves into any square threatened by the barbarian, regardless of whether or not that movement would normally provoke an attack of opportunity. This power can only be used once per rage. A barbarian must be at least 8th level before selecting this power

    new feats Feats: Combat Reflexes, dodge, mobility, Combat Patrol
    **Combat Patrol (Combat)
    You range across the battlefield, dealing with threats wherever they arise.
    Prerequisites: Combat Reflexes, Mobility, base attack bonus +5.
    Benefit: As a full-round action, you may set up a combat patrol, increasing your threatened area by 5 feet for every 5 points of your base attack bonus. Until the beginning of your next turn, you may make attacks of opportunity against any opponent in this threatened area that provokes attacks of opportunity. You may move as part of these attacks, provided your total movement before your next turn does not exceed your speed. Any movement you make provokes attacks of opportunity as normal

    **charge in and attack at range 10-15+, when enemies move towards you hit with unexpected strike, activate come at me and hit them again before they hit you, then get hit. Next turn set up combat patrol and take a 5ft step away move. as they provoke AOE you move with them to ensure continued provoking.

    **I feel that the best builds always have several options as opposed to one really really strong thing. This build can charge in and deal high VS damage, full round set up to protect allies, unexpected strike anyone at anytime in the area each time you rage cycle, and uses very very large weapons efficiency which adds lots of extra dice to each attack. Heaven forbid you get a crit threat with a VS and use furious finish for ~20ish D6 maxed.

    2) similar to my barbarian - I used a level 12 scarred rager template with superstition and class bonus. It had eater of magic, ghost rager, superstition, auspicious mark, the human luck tree line, and room for the lesser/normal/greater beast rage powers for pounce.
    +9 bonus to almost all saves you will ever make, +9 bonus to touch ac, a second save on most debilitation effects (sick/scared/ fatigues/frightened/ exhausted/nauseated /dazed/stunned) and you ignore most bleeding, and then ANOTHER save once per rage on almost any magical effect from eater of magic that gets you temp HP. And once per rage auspicious mark +1d6, once per day +8 from human luck feats, and a http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/...green-cabochon to let it continue raging.

    I play with alot of optimizers/min-maxers. This barbarian ignored/dodged/saved/survived/ate something like 8+ rounds of spells from a high DC evocer wizard 12 , a high DC focused save or die cleric 12, and a STUPIDLY high DC Binder12 (we ported it in from 3.5) and only died to a scout/ranger who finally killed it with arrows after full round attacking it with haste for 8+ rounds and because the binder/cleric swapped over to using vital strikes as well near the end.

    I was very impressed with how hard a challenge this was for a CR11 against a very strong level 12 party.


    Sorry for the super super long post and the host of spelling and grammar mistakes I've probably made....

  7. - Top - End - #97
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Fasteraubert View Post
    lay on hands REMOVES FATIGUE!!
    Fun fact, the only downside to not sleeping is Fatigue.
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  8. - Top - End - #98
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Hello everyone! First post here, so forgive me if this is the wrong place for this.

    I'm gonna be starting a campaign soon with a group of friends I've played with before, and I'm toying with the idea of making a half-orc urban barbarian (based on this build my DM found, which isn't exactly the same as what's on the original post). The basic character idea is to turn the stereotype of the half-orc barbarian on its head by making her someone who, in addition to typical barbarian things, also enjoys reading/writing poetry, but has awful stage fright (I'm thinking her mother was a bard), so she's usually quite stoic. Can anyone give me some advice about the build? I know I want good STR, CON, and DEX, but won't I also want semi-decent INT, WIS, and CHA to take advantage of the new Diplomacy, Knowledge, Linguistics, and Profession skills?

    I don't know much about the actual campaign itself, but I do know that:

    -- this group is VERY heavily based towards character and story (our DM's wife hates combat with a barbarian-worthy rage...)

    -- we will be starting at level 4

    -- the campaign will take place entirely in and around a single city/town

    -- there will be a lot of emphasis on mysteries and puzzles, but there will be a low-to-reasonable amount of combat

    -- other members of the party include a mounted samurai (mounted because she's missing a leg), a sorcerer (played by our DM's wife, who's usually a diplomancer), a druid (a crazy old lady who lives in a swamp with a toothless crocodile), and a multiclassed ninja/alchemist (a small frog person race that I forget the name of).

    Sorry if this is a little long...but thanks for reading! Any help is appreciated.

  9. - Top - End - #99
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Umm, just to point out.

    An oracle's curse is based on her oracle level plus one for every two levels or Hit Dice other than oracle
    So a barbarian can gain fatigue immunity by taking a single oracle dip at level 9. Not 5 levels.

    Also under life revelations there is this:

    Life Link (Su): As a standard action, you may create a bond between yourself and another creature. Each round at the start of your turn, if the bonded creature is wounded for 5 or more hit points below its maximum hit points, it heals 5 hit points and you take 5 hit points of damage. You may have one bond active per oracle level. This bond continues until the bonded creature dies, you die, the distance between you and the other creature exceeds medium range, or you end it as an immediate action (if you have multiple bonds active, you may end as many as you want as part of the same immediate action).
    This will depend on your GM's interpretation but the type of damage is left unspecified so you can try to negate it with DR. So, if you get 5 DR/- (say a level 10 invulnerable rager) then you can effectively grant someone nearby free 5 fast healing with no cost to yourself.

  10. - Top - End - #100
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Peat View Post
    Does anyone have good examples of an Intimidate build?
    Hobgoblin
    -Switch out sneaky for fearsome (+4 to intimidate)

    Str: Primary Cha: Secondary Con: Tertiary

    Select "Scarred Rager" Archetype

    Feats
    1st: Intimidating Prowess
    3rd: Weapon Focus
    5th: Dazzling Display

    Rage Powers
    2nd: Intimidating Glare
    8th: Terrifying Howl

    At 3rd level, dip into Rogue and take the archetype "Thug". That one level will get you this Rogue ability:

    Frightening (Ex): Whenever a thug successfully uses Intimidate to demoralize a creature, the duration of the shaken condition is increased by 1 round. In addition, if the target is shaken for 4 or more rounds, the thug can instead decide to make the target frightened for 1 round. This ability replaces trapfinding.

    Combine this with Intimidating Glare (and later Dazzling Display) and you have a low level Barb that can already cause a majority of his/her opponents to flee instead of fight. Plus, since you took the feat "Intimidating Prowess", raging actually increases your Intimidate bonus. So when you consider that your intimidate bonus will be +4 racial, +str mod, +cha mod, +archetype bonus, +ranks, (Plus traits if you use them) you're looking at a level 1-2 character that already has an Intimidate bonus 12+.

    I don't include any rage powers or feats to take at later levels because if you continue to specialize your barb with only intimidate attacks, you'll only end up handcuffing their effectiveness, since later monsters tend to be immune to such attacks.

    To comment on the guide in general, I think Scarred Rager is better than you give it credit. Specifically when you look at its second ability.

    Tolerance (Ex): At 2nd level, a scarred rager who fails a save against an effect that causes her to become nauseated, sickened, fatigued, or exhausted can make a second save to negate the effect on the start of her next turn. Only one additional save is allowed. If the effect does not allow a saving throw, its duration is halved instead (minimum of 1 round). This ability replaces uncanny dodge.

    So when the Barb stops raging and becomes fatigued, you no longer double the amount of time you spent raging to determine the length of time having the condition due to the Tolerance ability essentially cancelling it out. Pretty sweet.

  11. - Top - End - #101
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Intimidate Build?
    Intimidating Prowess and Dreadful Carnage seem like excellent candidates as well.
    Intimidating Prowess adds your STR to your Intimidate checks (an absolute MUST have for such a build).
    Dreadful Carnage gives you a free action Intimidate to everything within 30ft when you drop someone. Wade into the crowd of weak and easy to kill enemies. Start chopping them down first, get lots of free Intimidates. Hilarious when you can drop 3-4 creatures per round.
    http://www.pathfindersrd.com/feats/c...carnage-combat

    Back that up with Intimidating Glare and Terrifying Howl and you're laughing.

    Combo that all up with Improved Overrun, Overbearing Advance and Overbearing Assault, you make things run for their lives, you then run around and knock them prone so they can't run, chop them to bits, cause more Intimidates, repeat. Think of it like an Ubercharger, but much less of a one trick pony.

    Pushing Assault + Come and Get Me + Combat Reflexes and a reach weapon and a decent Dex = Hilarious. Enlarge Person take it all the way to 11. Nothing like covering a massive area with your reach weapon, and pushing enemies away from you and your friends every round. Makes Step Up/And Strike incredibly useful as well.


    @Rage Cycling
    Internal Fortitude makes you immune to Sickened/Nauseated
    There is an Ioun Stone, it's one of the flawed or cracked ones. Any time you would be Fatigued/Exausted you are instead Sickened/Nauseated. Which you are immune to. The stone costs 8K if I'm not mistaken.
    Internal Fortitude is available at level 8. One rage power slot, one Ioun stone, instantly immune to 4 different effects, Fatigue being one of them.
    Then you take rage powers like Flesh Wound and other 'once per rage' abilities.
    Enjoy making your DM throw books at you.
    Last edited by Karoht; 2013-02-06 at 11:26 AM.
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    Side effects include coughing, sneezing, and other flu like symptoms, cancer, breathing water like a fish, loss of dignity, loss of balance, loss of bowel and bladder control."

  12. - Top - End - #102
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    I'm not as much a fan of Dreadful Carnage, only because you have to wait so long to get it. Especially considering, in my opinion, the only worthwhile way to build an intimidate build is to dip into one level of rogue; you are essentially waiting till level 12 to get that ability. At that point, what little weak enemies are going to be realistically be around to warrant needing the feat?

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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by lluoc View Post
    Also under life revelations there is this:

    (Life Link SNIP)

    This will depend on your GM's interpretation but the type of damage is left unspecified so you can try to negate it with DR. So, if you get 5 DR/- (say a level 10 invulnerable rager) then you can effectively grant someone nearby free 5 fast healing with no cost to yourself.
    I'm pretty sure the devs have ruled somewhere that the damage you take from Life Link is from the link itself, so it's magic damage. DR won't work on it.
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Manflesh View Post
    I'm not as much a fan of Dreadful Carnage, only because you have to wait so long to get it. Especially considering, in my opinion, the only worthwhile way to build an intimidate build is to dip into one level of rogue; you are essentially waiting till level 12 to get that ability. At that point, what little weak enemies are going to be realistically be around to warrant needing the feat?
    The one level dip is probably the better way to go.
    At at level 15, our party Barbarian is killing at least one thing per round, usually 3 per round. That's 1-3 checks, for free, every round. Fun times.
    ~~Courage is not the lack of fear~~
    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
    "In soviet dungeon, aboleth farms you!"
    "Please consult your DM before administering Steve brand Aboleth Mucus.
    Ask your DM if Aboleth Mucus is right for you.
    Side effects include coughing, sneezing, and other flu like symptoms, cancer, breathing water like a fish, loss of dignity, loss of balance, loss of bowel and bladder control."

  15. - Top - End - #105
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    I guess I don't see liberally handing out the shaken condition at later levels to your enemies as an effective strategy. Sure -2 to most rolls is annoying, but not nearly as much as compared to early levels.

    Again, if you have the Rogue ability that allows you to cause higher versions of shaken within one roll, then it's okay. But I feel like their are better combat feats when you start going past level 11-12.

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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Hi! Long time forum lurker, first time poster. I'm here to fix the error in judgement about the archer barbarian. The problem is they're gear dependant, moreso than any other archer. If you've got access to standard gear compliant with WBL, you can do something no one has mentioned here. You can be a BETTER archer because of being a barbarian.

    Truth be told, I'd take 1 level as a fighter first to kick start the build and then follow with barbarian, but for the purposes of this build I'll ignore that obvious dip and go straight barbarian to prove it can be done. In doing so, I'll get to the cool stuff one level early.

    He's barely civilized, and has chosen to retain his tribal name: Makes It Rain

    Race:
    Human. We're feat starved. Half elf is an option though, as long as you take focus in your bow. Human makes superstition rock, and you want that.

    Stats:
    20 pt build
    16 Str
    18 Dex
    14 Con
    7 Int
    13 Wis
    7 Cha

    You don't need to min max really, 14 Str would be okay and allow you to bring up Int and Cha.

    Class Options:

    You're going urban barbarian for the additional flexibility. You can take invulnerable rager, and it's a good idea. Eventually you're going to be taking a hefty amount of damage, and you want that extra DR.

    Traits:

    Barbarian of the Society is nice for extra rage, but really just take what you like.


    I'll cover the build in broken incriments and note improvements to playstyle:
    Barb1 Point blank/Precise shot
    Barb2 (Reckless Abandon)
    Barb3 Rapid shot

    In the first three levels, things are pretty standard. You're using Reckless Abandon to mitigate the cover bonus people get while you're firing into melee. It's also mitigated by raging Dex. I'm assuming you have an avenue by which you can improve magic weapons, but if you don't you need to tighten your belt and take what the campaign gives you for equipment until you can afford to buy what you need.

    Every time you sell an item you're losing half the gold you invested. You are saving your money. The only thing you need is really a +1 bow with adaptive
    enchanted on it. This allows you to throw some strength into your rage when you know you'll hit but want some extra damage.

    Barb4 (Superstition)
    Barb5 Deadly Aim
    Barb6 (Witch Hunter)
    Barb7 Weapon Focus
    Barb8 (Internal Fortitude)

    Again, we're still building up to better things, but witch hunter is allowing you more damage against the most important targets and your rage/reckless is allowing you to hit often. We're not differentiated from other archers by our class abilities alone, but we're not doing terrible here. Our gear is upgraded obviously.

    At this point we've poured our wealth into our bow getting +2 Courageous/Furious. Now whenever we rage our bow is acting as +4 and also lending us a +2 to all our moral bonuses. You should buy potions/scrolls of heroism, or make sure the party member who can cast heroism knows it's now giving you +4 to all skills, attacks and saves (doesn't stack with Superstition, but it's a base moral bonus to the saves instead of just vs magic). Internal Fortitude will be of use later.

    At this point you should be on par with an archer fighter in terms of raw bonuses when it counts. Heroism is a long lasting buff, and Courageous is giving you more bonuses than you can reasonably keep track of.

    Your superstition is up by that same +2, so are your stats in rage, which means you should really be splitting your rage so you get +2 Dex/Str (making it +4 Dex/Str thanks to Courageous. You can swap to single stat rage if you like when you know you can/can't hit, but I like bigger benefits, so I stay 2/2 here.


    Barb9 Combat Reflexes
    Barb10 (Unexpected Strike)
    Barb11 Snapshot
    Barb12 (Come and Get Me)

    Internal Fortitude ties into unexpected strike and snapshot. You're going to be using the Ioun Stone mentioned in the guide to fuel your nausea inducing rage cycle to trigger an additional AOO every round via Unexpected Strike once you can snapshot. Obviously we're buying that ioun stone by the time we hit 9th level, it's within WBL.

    With the early capstone of Come and Get Me We're now able to fully utilize the build. Drawing people into combat to hit us, so we can dish more damage to them. Of course, we provoke when we shoot, which in turn allows us to shoot again if our enemies use the attack of opportunity on us. You can bait this by intentionally positioning yourself to provoke, but don't exceed your AOO's or hit points in doing so.

    Fully fuelling dex with your highest rage allotment at this level is is a great idea. You're always wanting more attacks. You'll need to look closely at how much damage you're taking vs how much you're dishing out.

    Barb13 Improved Snapshot
    Barb14 (Quick Reflexes)
    Barb15 Clustered shot
    Barb16 (Anything)
    Barb17 Manyshot

    If you weren't using all your AOOs before, improved snapshot should fix that. Since half your attacks on a given round should be AOOs, clustered shots has a somewhat diminished value in regard to what a normal archer would see, but I'd still take it.

    Once you have Improved Snapshot it becomes possible for you to fight a retreating battle by using the withdraw action repeatedly and making the enemy pay for every inch they advance on you with your reach, unexpected strike, and again if they manage to get off a melee attack (via CAGM).

    All in all the build begins slow, but it builds up to a point. A point no other class can really make. I can't imagine an archer that can get so many AOOs so consistently, while still making use of the full attack action.
    Last edited by hatchetman240; 2013-04-01 at 12:01 PM.

  17. - Top - End - #107
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by KnightOfV View Post
    I like the guide a lot, but I can't believe the Invulnerable Rager Archetype isn't blue. Lose the very situational immunity to Sneak attacks for half your level in DR? Yes. Please. I'm playing one right now in a game, and it's stupid how many hit points the DR saves you over a full session.
    Agreed, especially since most barbarians have a crappy AC. It also has a nice synergy with Come and Get Me and Reckless Abandon. There's no reason to play a regular barbarian when the Invulnerable Rager archetype is available.
    -Awww, man! I lost twice. I suck.

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  18. - Top - End - #108
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Animal Archive introduces the Mad Dog archetype.

    You get slower rage and rage power progression, and slower DR progression. and lose Uncanny Dogde.

    What do you get in exchange for all that? A full-progression animal companion that known some special tricks and the ability to share your rage and DR with that animal companion.

    AM MAD DOG smash puny action economy!

  19. - Top - End - #109
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    When are you gonna do feats/equipment? ):

  20. - Top - End - #110
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Novawurmson View Post
    Body Bludgeon (Ex) - This is the most amazing rage power ever written, but should probably never be attempted in a real game*.
    That, sir, sounds like a challenge.

    I give you: the Body Bludgeon Barbarian. It's probably awful in a lot of ways but by god who cares. I think my choices up to barbarian level 10 are pretty clever, at least. Let's see what you guys think.

    Race: Half-Giant. One could take Human for the extra feat, but for reasons you'll see below that's not entirely necessary for this build. Half-Giants are huge doods who get a special race feature (Powerful Build) that's pretty useful for a grappler. Also, with a little DM haggling it might even affect Body Bludgeon? Only way to find out is ask.

    Class: Well, Barbarian, obviously. You'll want to take the Brutal Pugilist archetype, of course. And also of course, it'll be your favored class. Once you hit barb level 5, you'll get Greater Savage Grapple. This states "She also is treated as one size larger than her actual size when determining whether she can grapple or be grappled by another creature." So it's like getting Powerful Build twice. Would that affect the Body Bludgeon size limit though? Again, you'd have to haggle with your DM on that one, probably.

    But...

    ... you'll want to START with 1 level in Monk, using the Martial Artist archetype. All the level 1 benefits of a Monk without the Lawful alignment requirement! I'm sure I'm not the first person to think of this, but it's important because it really helps this build come together something fierce, due to the abilities, feats, and the nice little bump in Will.

    Starting Ability Scores: with a 15-point start, this is a decent spread I came up with:

    Str 18 <- +2 from Race
    Dex 12 <- -2 from Race
    Con 10
    Int 10
    Wis 12 <- +2 from Race
    Cha 10

    Unfortunately you need to get Dex up to 13 for the later grapple feats (since just having Improved Grapple isn't enough). But since you start as a monk, you can get Improved Grapple without needing Dex 13. This lets you start with Dex 12 and add the extra point from ECL 4 before you get the rest of the Grapple feats. This lets you start with more Str or Wis or whatever. Also you could just pull some points out of Int and/or Cha for more points in Str and Wis.

    Traits: Grab the combat trait Coherent Rage, which lets you use Escape Artist freely while raging. Then grab the Religion trait "The Flexing Arm" to be able to add your Strength bonus to Escape Artist. Proceed to break out of everything.

    Feats:
    1 - Catch Off-Guard. Use this to hit things with other things when not grappling. Preferably things that give you more than 1d6 damage or have reach or something. Then you can just drop said thing on the floor when it comes time to grapple, because it's probably some crap you just picked up off the environment. Also, this is important for later, as the creature used as the bludgeon in Body Bludgeon counts as a two-handed improvised weapon. You want to avoid that -4 penalty on the attack roll.

    Monk Bonus Feat: Improved Grapple. Remember you don't need Dex 13 to get this one. But you do need Dex 13 to get other grapple feats.

    3 - Extra Rage Power: Animal Fury. First of all, you had to wait for ECL 3 to get your first rage power, so you can use this handy feat to make up for some lost time. Furthermore, Animal Fury lets you make a free 1d4 + 1/2 str bonus bite attack BEFORE every grapple check. Nice early on, and even better later when you get extra grapple checks per round and Elemental Rage. Nothing like giving your victim an electric nibble before slamming them into something else.

    5 - Uh... this is actually kind of a free spot that I have no idea what to do with. You could move Catch Off-Guard here and get something else you'd rather have at level 1, if you want. Heck, get Extra Rage Power again. Whatever.

    7 - Greater Grapple! This lets you do grapple checks with move actions, allowing you to do two checks a round to do two grapple actions. This is key, as Body Bludgeon's description SEEMS to imply that you can get an attack out of Body Bludgeon for every individual grapple check as long as the enemy is pinned. At your highest attack bonus each. Crazy.

    9 - You've got a few options here. Either take Improvised Weapon Master, or one of the grappling feats listed below in "13 and onward." Improvised Weapon Master will net you raw damage off of your Body Bludgeon attacks, both against the target of the attack AND the creature being used as a bludgeon.

    Note: YOU DON'T WANT VITAL STRIKE. Vital Strike only applies when you take an "attack action." This is a specific type of standard action. Bite attack and Body Bludgeon attacks don't count because they're both part of grapple actions. Sucks, but dems da breaks.

    11 - Rapid Grappler. If you succeed at a grapple check using Greater Grapple (which should be all your grapple checks), you can then make ANOTHER grapple check as a swift action. This means even more bludgeoning.

    13 and onward: Take whatever. You've got all the key feats for Body Bludgeon at this point. There's a lot of grapple feats to choose from: Chokehold, Body Shield, Sleeper Hold, and Pinning Rend. Especially Chokehold, since it lets you pin an enemy a size larger than you. Which... may apply to Body Bludgeon? I'm not sure. Might be something to discuss with your DM.

    Rage Powers:
    2 - Either Guarded Life or Superstition. Guarded Life to help deal with raw damage, or Superstition to deal with unwanted magic effects. Of course, Superstition kinda sucks if you actually want help from a friendly caster.

    4 - Lesser Elemental Rage. Mostly you're taking this to get Elemental Rage in four levels, but it's still probably going to help you harm the crap out of something for one round, since while it doesn't apply to regular grapple damage, it will apply to the bite attack from Animal Fury (since it counts as a melee attack). And then, of course, it applies to Body Bludgeon attacks (since those also count as melee attacks). Also its good even after you get Elemental Rage, since you can use it to gain TWO types of extra elemental damage for one round, instead of the usual one.

    6 - Greater Guarded Life or Ghost Rager, depending on what you got at barb level 2. The former will make you pretty damn hard to kill, and the latter will help you out a lot with your lack of magical weapons (as well as bolster the effects of Superstitious). If somebody can think of some other way to make your Body Bludgeon magical though (or otherwise useful against weird higher-level stuff), the Guarded Life route may be better? I dunno. Depends on how worried you are about saves. Also, hey, you could always do something totally different with barb levels 2 and 6.

    8 - Elemental Rage. Now you can apply elemental damage to all your melee attacks, all the time. I mentioned this in the Lesser version, but: that's both the pre-grapple bite attacks AND the Body Bludgeon attacks. So not only can you bite them with your acid teeth, you can then proceed to SET THEM ON FIRE AS YOU SWING THEM INTO ANOTHER UNLUCKY CLOD. And remember: all the damage done to the target of the melee attack from Body Bludgeon is ALSO done to the creature used as the bludgeon. ALL of it. That fire WILL hurt.

    10 - Flesh Wound. HAHAHA JUST KIDDING BODY BLUDGEON.

    12 and onward: who cares BODY BLUDGEON.

    Final Thoughts:
    Well, I'd say that's the crux of it. Now, how effective this build is is going to hinge a LOT on what you can convince your DM to do regarding the interaction between Powerful Build, Greater Savage Grapple, Chokehold, and Body Bludgeon. You can possibly get some pity-points due to the fact that you're even attempting such a pants-on-head ridiculous build. Or you could pick him up and slam him into the table until he complies. Either way.

    Also it goes without saying, but: you probably want to get your hands on stuff that makes you bigger. Even magical effects, since even if you get Superstition you're only FORCED to resist the effects of spells that are CAST on you.

    At any rate: once you're able to pick up, say, a normal-sized creature and use it to body bludgeon (and you succeed on your grapple checks and attack rolls) your going to be making these damage rolls 3 times per round that you have something grappled and pinned:

    pre-grapple check bite: 1d4 + 1d6 + 1/2 str bonus
    body bludgeon (vs grappled creature AND target of melee attack): 1d12 + 1d6 + 1-1/2 str bonus

    Crank those 1d6s up to 2d6s if you stack on Lesser Elemental Rage for that round. Also... since I think the pinned status persists after you succeed at it the first time, could you also do grapple damage on each check as well? That'd be another 1d6 if you used your monk unarmed damage. (not sure if str bonus gets added to the grapple damage)

    I imagine that, in action, it'd look something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsNdLbvdxbA
    Or this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WStTBOWdW5g

    A final quandary regarding Body Bludgeon: according to its description, the grappled creature used as a bludgeon is dealt the same damage as the damage done to the target of the attack. Would that be BEFORE or AFTER the target's damage reduction? Or an inanimate object's hardness? It'd be kinda weird for a DM to argue that the bludgeon creature would take LESS damage from being slammed into a HARDER object, but I could somehow see one trying to argue that for the sake of some kind of weird sense of "balancing." What do you guys think?
    Last edited by Darlos9D; 2013-06-14 at 11:55 PM.

  21. - Top - End - #111
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    *necros* After reading this i made a good one.

    Lvl 10 Invulnerable Rager, Hurler. Teifling with large arms

    Rage powers: Hurling, Lesser; Hurling; Beast totem, lesser; Beast totem; Body Bludgeon

    Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike; Improved Grapple; Greater Grapple; Rapid Grappler; (must get polymorphed other up one size)Snatch

    The rest is up to you.

    Though Body Bludgeon you can't duel weild gnomes because it uses them as a two handed weapon reguardless of size. Size only effects damage.

    But With this charater I can attack 3 times (2 claws, 1 bite) With snatch all three have grab. and all you need is 2 grapple checks to pin in the round. With 4 checks a round (if you grapple them with an attack.

  22. - Top - End - #112
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    I wanted to point out that 2 levels in Horizon Walker gets you immunity to Fatigue. That lets you Rage Cycle at 8th level for the cost of 2 levels, a feat, and 6 skill points. Plus with the new retraining rules you have the option to get rid of those when they're no longer useful to you.
    See when a tree falls in the forest, and there's no one there to hear it, you can bet we've bought the vinyl.
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  23. - Top - End - #113
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by The Random NPC View Post
    I wanted to point out that 2 levels in Horizon Walker gets you immunity to Fatigue. That lets you Rage Cycle at 8th level for the cost of 2 levels, a feat, and 6 skill points. Plus with the new retraining rules you have the option to get rid of those when they're no longer useful to you.
    It takes three levels of Horizon Walker - 2 just gets you immunity to exhaustion, 3 gets you immunity to fatigue. Still a potential choice for many Barbarian builds.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CTrees View Post
    Knowledge (local) being trained only, and not a class skill for many classes, means that your average human may well not be able to identify other humans! This may explain the exceptional quantity of half-human hybrids.

  24. - Top - End - #114
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    D'oh, I mentally put the Terrain Dominance one level lower.
    See when a tree falls in the forest, and there's no one there to hear it, you can bet we've bought the vinyl.
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  25. - Top - End - #115
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    First, I'd like to say thanks for the guide. It helped me alot in forming my new barbarian.
    Second.
    "Body Bludgeon (Ex) - This is the most amazing rage power ever written, but should probably never be attempted in a real game*.

    *It's difficult to pull off, and you have to be level 10 before you even pick it up, but if you pull off this ability in a game, I will add your name to this optimization guide. If, in a real game, you level a Barbarian 1-10, pick this rage power, and dual-wield enemy gnomes in combat, calling them "Gnome-Chucks," and provide proof of your epic deed, I will mail you a cookie if you live in the continental United States."
    Challenge Accepted.

    I will be playing my barbarian in a new campaign gmed by a friend I met on roll20. We will be starting at level 1, and assuming we make it to level 10, my group has agreed to let me attempt this if we come across any gnomes.

  26. - Top - End - #116
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Believe me, every time I read through Barbarian Rage Powers I want to make Body Bludgeon a thing.

    Godspeed to you sir. May your cookie be delicious.
    Last edited by Karoht; 2014-01-09 at 11:35 PM.
    ~~Courage is not the lack of fear~~
    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
    "In soviet dungeon, aboleth farms you!"
    "Please consult your DM before administering Steve brand Aboleth Mucus.
    Ask your DM if Aboleth Mucus is right for you.
    Side effects include coughing, sneezing, and other flu like symptoms, cancer, breathing water like a fish, loss of dignity, loss of balance, loss of bowel and bladder control."

  27. - Top - End - #117
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    If I wasn't one of only two melee tanks in our party, I would totally go for a drunk body-bludgeoning barbarian brawler, chugging ale and enlarge person potions before battering my enemies with my enemies.

  28. - Top - End - #118
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyros731 View Post
    First, I'd like to say thanks for the guide. It helped me alot in forming my new barbarian.
    Second.
    "Body Bludgeon (Ex) - This is the most amazing rage power ever written, but should probably never be attempted in a real game*.

    *It's difficult to pull off, and you have to be level 10 before you even pick it up, but if you pull off this ability in a game, I will add your name to this optimization guide. If, in a real game, you level a Barbarian 1-10, pick this rage power, and dual-wield enemy gnomes in combat, calling them "Gnome-Chucks," and provide proof of your epic deed, I will mail you a cookie if you live in the continental United States."
    Challenge Accepted.

    I will be playing my barbarian in a new campaign gmed by a friend I met on roll20. We will be starting at level 1, and assuming we make it to level 10, my group has agreed to let me attempt this if we come across any gnomes.
    Make sure to record your epic deed :D
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    Quote Originally Posted by CTrees View Post
    Knowledge (local) being trained only, and not a class skill for many classes, means that your average human may well not be able to identify other humans! This may explain the exceptional quantity of half-human hybrids.

  29. - Top - End - #119
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    What form of recording are you aiming for?

    I fully expect that the DM (and probably the party) might be taken by surprise on this one. I mean, 10 levels of fully functional monster truck barbarian. Followed by BAM! Dual-Wielding Gnome-chucks. I really want to see the look on the face of pretty much everyone at the table.
    ~~Courage is not the lack of fear~~
    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
    "In soviet dungeon, aboleth farms you!"
    "Please consult your DM before administering Steve brand Aboleth Mucus.
    Ask your DM if Aboleth Mucus is right for you.
    Side effects include coughing, sneezing, and other flu like symptoms, cancer, breathing water like a fish, loss of dignity, loss of balance, loss of bowel and bladder control."

  30. - Top - End - #120
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: [PF] Anger Management: A Pathfinder Guide to the Barbarian

    Update: As of now I'm level 3 and the campaign is still going strong.

    As for recording, as I said we're playing on roll20 virtual table top, and using skype and roll20 chat for talk. I will most likely find a good audio/video recording program when I hit level 10.
    Last edited by Kyros731; 2014-01-12 at 03:35 PM.

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