Well my last thread made me wonder about immortality....

[randomhero00]

Would you truly want it?

I wouldn't. Any problems I have would be magnified by immortality.

[Forrestfire]

It all depends on what type of immortality it is. Assuming "perfect" immortality (I cannot die and I do not age, but my body still works as normal. Think something like the immortals in Baccano!), I would definitely go for it.

Humanity creates new things at a faster pace than I could experience them, and even if new things eventually dry up and creativity stagnates, the fact is that people are an endless source of entertainment.


I'm actually curious as to what you mean by "any problems I have would be magnified by immortality."

[danzibr]

Why is this in roleplaying games?

Anyways, I would have to say no. As tempted as I am to say yes now, I know after a while it would really, really suck and I'd want to die. If you're going down the you-can't-ever-die path, well... eventually the earth will die. Then what?

[randomhero00]

It all depends on what type of immortality it is. Assuming "perfect" immortality (I cannot die and I do not age, but my body still works as normal. Think something like the immortals in Baccano!), I would definitely go for it.

Humanity creates new things at a faster pace than I could experience them, and even if new things eventually dry up and creativity stagnates, the fact is that people are an endless source of entertainment.


I'm actually curious as to what you mean by "any problems I have would be magnified by immortality."

"I'm actually curious as to what you mean by "any problems I have would be magnified by immortality."

Well such as my addictions, my (*super* high ideals,) my fears,. etc.

[randomhero00]

Why is this in roleplaying games?

Because we (almost all) dream it. The adventures, the near immortality, etc. about our characters.

[Mr.Moron]

I like existing, I'd like to keep doing so. However, for mortals that really isn't an option.

[Jerthanis]

True undying, invulnerable immortality would be a pretty heinous curse. Sure, the first million years or so would be pretty fun, but then I'd eventually be crushed under the weight of the experiences I've had, grappling with a mind my own psychology is incapable of understanding or expressing. I'd want to discuss "The Princess Bride" with people for whom the word Princess has lost all meaning, and who haven't ever even experienced entertainment in a visual medium. I'd remember events that had occurred entire civilizations ago, I'd forget that the continents have drifted and world maps are different now... I'd sink into recollective fugues which would last hundreds of years similar to how we daydream and lose track of ourselves for a few moments.

This is to say nothing of the worries that I would be plagued by. Each major disaster could bury me under tons of rock, immobile and helpless for thousands of years. Threats to civilization could really mean I'd have to live through the aftermath, seeing all the things I value be destroyed and I'd have to endure it for as many human lifetimes as it takes to turn around again.

And then, when I had just about gone mad from all these things I'm totally unable to grapple with, I will realize one or two million years have gone by... and I have yet to even start to get through eternity. Life would yawn out in front of me and I would be overwhelmed. I would be mad before the inevitable, floating alone through space for billions and billions of years after our galaxy smashes into the Andromeda galaxy, waiting for something to change, unsure if anything WOULD ever change for me again. Indeed, I would be quite mad before that would have the chance to occur.

[wadledo]

@Jerthanis: Of course, all this implies certain facts about the brain that we simply can not know about.
I mean, for all we understand the mind, after about 200 years it would clip into perfect recollection mode, and you'd be able to absorb information again as well as you were a toddler.

Personal interaction would still be something of an issue.

[warty goblin]

Living forever would basically mean either an endless string of dead dogs, or no dogs at all.

Also having to keep up with an eternity of annoying technological developments. Cell phones are bad enough.

Not to mention that an eternity of human stupidity would be hard to stomach. Over a reasonably brief timespan one can pretend that we learn from our mistakes, but after the first couple millenium it'd be pretty hard to maintain.

[Morithias]

Immortality, yes.
Invulnerability NO.

It is estimate that on average you will die every 1700 years via some kind of accident.

So if I was careful and cautious I could live to see the year 4000, if I was really lucky even later.

But without having the invulnerability means that if I get shot, or buried under a ton of rocks, or the earth blows up. I won't be in an "and I must scream" type scenario.

[gibbo88]

I think I would take it, but it would be a massive struggle coping with everything you see. Look at people that have PTSD from war zones. Even if you didn't go into wars with you immortality (and let's face it, it would be tempting as hell) eventually you would see enough that you would just break. You would be constantly developing new identities if people began to notice that you looked the same 20 years after they met you.

It'd be weird.

[Tengu_temp]

This really belongs in Friendly Banter.

[bloodtide]

I'd want Immortality.


One problem is the mental one, that humans perceive time as moving faster as they grow older. So you would get to the point where time moved so fast for you that the rest of humanity just went by in the blink of an eye.

But I could care less about that....I experience enough of that right now as a mortal.

[Talakeal]

I would want to be immortal only under the following conditions:

1: I don't age.
2: I can heal regenerate scarring or missing body parts.
3: I can keep my memories organized.
4: I am not alone, and have atleast one immortal companion who is compatible enough with me that I would want to spend forever with them.
5: I am not conscious if I am put in a situation where I would "die" over and over again (trapped underground or underwater, blasted into space, the end of the world, etc.)

If so, then hell yes. If not, then immortality isn't for me.

[Grinner]

I certainly don't want to live forever.

One problem is the mental one, that humans perceive time as moving faster as they grow older. So you would get to the point where time moved so fast for you that the rest of humanity just went by in the blink of an eye.

So they say.

I'd say it's a result of time compression. In other words, you don't experience time any more quickly. You just can't remember everything, so the act of reminiscing results in a perceived acceleration of time.

[Ninjadeadbeard]

True undying, invulnerable immortality would be pretty ****ing sweet. Sure, the first million years or so would be pretty fun...[and] I'd remember events that had occurred entire civilizations ago, I'd forget that the continents have drifted and world maps are different now... I'd sink into recollective fugues which would last hundreds of years similar to how we daydream and lose track of ourselves for a few moments.

Fixed that for you. This would be awesome. And the best part? There would always be more. In an infinite universe, there'd always be more.

And when this one ends, stick around for the next one. Cuz there's always more to see. Heck, after a few universes go by, start traveling in a blue box and basically yukking it up with whatever lifeforms want to chill. You'd have enough time to learn everything, how to do everything, how to be everything.

Sure, it's not possible. Sure, there'd be heartbreak if it was. But, oh man, would it rock.

[PersonMan]

Fixed that for you. This would be awesome. And the best part? There would always be more. In an infinite universe, there'd always be more.

And when this one ends, stick around for the next one. Cuz there's always more to see. Heck, after a few universes go by, start traveling in a blue box and basically yukking it up with whatever lifeforms want to chill. You'd have enough time to learn everything, how to do everything, how to be everything.

Sure, it's not possible. Sure, there'd be heartbreak if it was. But, oh man, would it rock.

The problem with 'well, if our galaxy is destroyed just wait for the next one' is that you would be floating around in space for however long that took. If 'more' is 10 million lightyears away, how long do you think it will take you to wish you didn't have to wait the next billion years to float there?

[Mystral]

I'd go with yes, I want immortality. I want to experience the world in the year 3000, and in the year 3000000. I won't be floating in empty space when the galaxies colide and the stars die, I'll be floating around in my pleasure dome the size of the death star. :D

Remember, if you are immortal, long time investments are a really smart idea. I'd be filthy rich before my 1000th birthday, even if I start with only 100 Euro.

[Gensuru]

Well it all depends on the specific details. To limit oneself to an indestructible body is essentially not grapsing the problems. Sooner or later the type of body you locked in immortality mode will be completely out of date. Whether you will look like a caveman to everyone around you or whether the dominant species will always remain humanoid is another thing entirely. Have fun being an immortal, indestructible human being when your body can not even begin to produce the type of signals that the current dominant race uses to communicate -_-


Likewise one has to be above any kind of need for food, air etc. Otherwise you have to spend a good portion of your time just securing the ressources to match your demands. Again, that problem only increases if our body is the only thing that remains unchanging. If everything that you can digest crumbles to dust with the planet you'd better hope you ammassed the ressources to grow that stuff elsewhere...and you'd better hope that you can do it on your own or people will start wanting to find out how to make use of you for their own immortality or just plain health.


Then there is the issue of going mad with boredom or your perception of time speeding up to a point where a decade is like an hour to you. But enough people mentioned this one as well


So, no. Immortality does not like like a good idea once you break it down. Especially if you lack omnipotence or something close to it. Being immortal does you little good when you have to hide that fact for fear of being imprisoned for various reasons.

You'd have to clarify a few things so. A fantasy setting or a real one? Because the fun part is that fantasy setting with the planes tend to give fairly definite proof for souls. And if you assume the existence of souls the question gets even more difficult. Are the souls eternal or can they be damaged? Do they remain perfectly aware of themselves and their lives when not bound by flesh? Do they reincarnate or is life a one time thing before immortal souls start cluttering up the afterlife with no apparent purpose? If anything the most convenient type of immortality (the only one I'd probably be able to find tolerable) would be to exist as a soul that will forever remain aware of itself and has the ability to implant itself into any type of lifeform. Either at birth only or even in between like a sort of dominating, mental parasite. A Lich that can take over any living being within range, if you will. That way ressources are hardly an issue as you can just replace your body as needed. Likewise boredom might be easier to stave off since you could easily lead any kind of life. Feel like living one lifetime as a beggar? Just to see how long you can make it last? A woman? A man? A Lizard or even a fly? Human beings died out? No problem, just switch to the next dominant race. Feel bored of it all? Don't chose a body for a few millenia and hibernate instead. Thing is, depending on your personal beliefs everyone already has this type of immortality except for one tiny fact: (if we have souls that reincarnate) we don't remember any of it.

[Mystral]

A word on the perception of time: You only perceive time faster in hindsight. Every day, every second seems the same, it's just your memory that is playing tricks on you. As long as you experience exciting stuff, learn new things and accomplish accievements, you will have these set as points standing out in your past, marker stones for your brain to remember. Guess what, the older you get, the less markerstones there are. When you are young, every day, you learn new things, meet new people, experience new things. When you turn fifty, most people spend 90% of the day doing the same thing they did yesterday, or the day before, or the same day last week. Even holidays or things you do for fun don't seem that exciting.

Luckily, there's an easy remedy for that: Experience new things! As long as you experience new sensations and try out new stuff, time might fly past you while you are having fun doing things, but it will be stuff worth remembering, and your memory will view your life as far grander and longer then when you just go trough your days like a robot.

[bloodtide]

I'd say it's a result of time compression. In other words, you don't experience time any more quickly. You just can't remember everything, so the act of reminiscing results in a perceived acceleration of time.

That is not it. The idea that you perceive time as moving faster as you get older makes more sense if you are older right now(like 30+). A older person does not seem to 'have enough time' to keep up with things as they have filled up their life with things. But the younger people, especially under 20, a day is forever to them and they can fill it up with tons of stuff.

You can easily see the effect when you talk to a younger person. They are just so 'off' about everything. Everything they say and do makes little sense. And that is just the gap of twenty years or so. But as you the immortal grows older, that gap will be 50, 100, or more years.

And the older you get, the less 'young stuff' will make sense. And as you get older and older, everything that the normal younger humans do will make no sense to you. You will be out of touch.

If your old enough, you can see this with just cartoons for example. 80's cartoons at least had basic plots and a bit of complexity. But look at any modern cartoon, they are 100% crap with no plot or story or anything....just a bunch of random animation.

[Scowling Dragon]

Eh, would suck. Watching everybody evolve whislt I was still stuck a human.

[Grinner]

That is not it. The idea that you perceive time as moving faster as you get older makes more sense if you are older right now(like 30+). A older person does not seem to 'have enough time' to keep up with things as they have filled up their life with things. But the younger people, especially under 20, a day is forever to them and they can fill it up with tons of stuff.

You can easily see the effect when you talk to a younger person. They are just so 'off' about everything. Everything they say and do makes little sense. And that is just the gap of twenty years or so. But as you the immortal grows older, that gap will be 50, 100, or more years.

And the older you get, the less 'young stuff' will make sense. And as you get older and older, everything that the normal younger humans do will make no sense to you. You will be out of touch.

And you want an eternity of that?

[boomwolf]

Invulnerable immortality? GIVE ME! seriously. you cant get any better. no more fears, no more race through life...you can just relax and enjoy yourself until earth gets destroyed, and by that time we could probably leave the plant already, and even if not-you are freaking immortal! you can just drift around until you find yourself some sort of planet to crash on, and then you got a RL minecraft experience...build your won world! time is not an issue! even if it would take you a million years to develop the most basic technology, you HAVE these million years!

Only thing you need to worry about is pain, find a way to get rid of pain and you are good to go.

[Mewtarthio]

You can easily see the effect when you talk to a younger person. They are just so 'off' about everything. Everything they say and do makes little sense. And that is just the gap of twenty years or so. But as you the immortal grows older, that gap will be 50, 100, or more years.

That's because you spend all your time hanging out with (relatively) old people. You are immersed in a particular subculture consisting of people your age, and so it's harder to relate to people outside that subculture. If you were immortal, you would by necessity be interacting with people 100+ years younger than you, and so the twenty-second century culture would not appear so alien.

If your old enough, you can see this with just cartoons for example. 80's cartoons at least had basic plots and a bit of complexity. But look at any modern cartoon, they are 100% crap with no plot or story or anything....just a bunch of random animation.

This is just the nostalgia effect. Nobody likes to remember bad things, so when we look at the past, we're looking at the edited version. Most cartoons in the 80s were, after all, glorified toy commercials of varying levels of quality. And, of course, the fact that you don't like modern animation in the first place means you're not likely to bother watching modern cartoons, which in turn means you won't see the good ones.

Though the statement that modern cartoons have no plot is objectively wrong.

[Xefas]

Yeeeeessss. Y'know that whole "Your mind will shatter into a million pieces from the weight of eons as you drift alone in an empty void for untold millennia before the universe collapses in on itself" problem?

I want that so hard. That's the whole appeal of immortality for me. I hate knowing that there will be so many experiences I will never have the chance to partake in. Ones that exist now but that I don't have the opportunity for, and ones that will only exist long after I'm dead and gone.

That last insane matter-singularity crunch feeling is just another experience I won't have. And that sucks.

Death is dumb and can go die in a fire.

[The Tygre]

I believe a far wiser man than I has already asked and answered this question for me.

[NikitaDarkstar]

No. I got this nagging feeling it would make life seem pointless. I got all the time in the world to do something and I can't die, so why bother with doing it today? (or tomorrow, or the day after.) On top of that I get to watch the people I care about grow old and die, I'd have to move every so often (and probably come up with a new identity) or people would start to ask questions. So where's the fun in that?

[Mewtarthio]

I believe a far wiser man than I has already asked and answered this question for me.

I reject your 80s pop culture reference and substitute my own!

[Ninjadeadbeard]

I reject your 80s pop culture reference and substitute my own!

I am sorry sir. Queen spoke first. Your music is invalid.