Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XXXII

[Amphetryon]

I've no objections to setting-specific. FR, Eberron, Dragonlance, and OA are the only ones I think would get any significant volume of entries, though.

Two of those would be limited to one source book apiece, and there are no other official settings by the contest's parameters, so that's sort of a given, isn't it?

[Yorrin]

Two of those would be limited to one source book apiece, and there are no other official settings by the contest's parameters, so that's sort of a given, isn't it?

::facepalm::

You'll have to excuse me. What with this being my first IC I forgot about the "official" settings clause on the first page.

[Aeryr]

Isn't Ghostwalk technically also a setting?

[Aeryr]

Isn't Ghostwalk technically also a setting?

[Amphetryon]

Isn't Ghostwalk technically also a setting?

1) It's a single, standalone book dealing primarily with a CITY (Manifest), rather than a world - although that city opens up the possibility of other places - so calling it a "setting" is stretching things a mite.

2) It wasn't included in Yorrin's example at all, which makes your question read just a bit like a "gotcha" comment. Was that your intent?

[Aeryr]

No, I just stumbled into it while searching for spirit/dream stuff for a homebrew class that I am working on so it was wait I didn't account for that. Sorry if it sounded like a gotcha' I was more checking that I got things straight.

BTW are there any other stretched city settings or similar? Can't remember atm if manual of the planes goes into different settings.

[Cieyrin]

Hmm, I posit Gnomish Artificer as a possible ingredient, as it looks so cool in concept, comes up not that often and is so clunky in execution.

[Amphetryon]

No, I just stumbled into it while searching for spirit/dream stuff for a homebrew class that I am working on so it was wait I didn't account for that. Sorry if it sounded like a gotcha' I was more checking that I got things straight.

BTW are there any other stretched city settings or similar? Can't remember atm if manual of the planes goes into different settings.

Ptolus is a massive city-setting from Monte Cook, but it's technically for his Arcana Unearthed/Arcana Evolved d20 product.

[Amphetryon]

Hmm, I posit Gnomish Artificer as a possible ingredient, as it looks so cool in concept, comes up not that often and is so clunky in execution.

Gnome Artificer is an interesting theory. It has minor issues with being a 3.0 class, though - check the pre-reqs.

[Aeryr]

I restumbled today into Yathrinshee I hope that never makes it to a SI

[Kuulvheysoon]

I restumbled today into Yathrinshee I hope that never makes it to a SI

There's some pretty odd/terrible PrCs out there in setting-specific land. Reforged and a few FR ones spring to mind.

Guys, I just figured out what the next SI is going to be:

Iron Chef Optimization XXXIII: Illithid Body Tamer (Underdark)

[mattie_p]

Serpent Kingdoms Fang of Sseth.

[Feytalist]

I'd like to see Gnome Artificer as well. Shame it's 3.0, but I'm sure it can be updated to 3.5 with very little trouble. It's just the skill requirements, after all.

I'm also down with Illithid Body Tamer, heh. But isn't Underdark 3.0 as well?


Although I bet the setting is going to be Greyhawk

[TerrickTerran]

Gnome Artificer would definitely be cool. I really like the PrC despite its flaws.

[Amphetryon]

I'd like to see Gnome Artificer as well. Shame it's 3.0, but I'm sure it can be updated to 3.5 with very little trouble. It's just the skill requirements, after all.

I'm also down with Illithid Body Tamer, heh. But isn't Underdark 3.0 as well?


Although I bet the setting is going to be Greyhawk

Underdark is 3.5 (references to Survival instead of Wilderness Lore abound).

[Kuulvheysoon]

I'd like to see Gnome Artificer as well. Shame it's 3.0, but I'm sure it can be updated to 3.5 with very little trouble. It's just the skill requirements, after all.

I'm also down with Illithid Body Tamer, heh. But isn't Underdark 3.0 as well?


Although I bet the setting is going to be Greyhawk

IIRC, it was one of the first 3.5e books after the 'conversion'.

[Feytalist]

Cool. I haven't actually taken a look at it for some time. Is that also the one with the Prime Underdark Guide? I've always liked the look of that class. Got its own spell list too.

[Venger]

Cool. I haven't actually taken a look at it for some time. Is that also the one with the Prime Underdark Guide? I've always liked the look of that class. Got its own spell list too.

yep. page 40.

how're 3.0 local knowledges handled? do you need local (region) as a class skill, or do you just need local and can pick whatever region?

[Cieyrin]

yep. page 40.

how're 3.0 local knowledges handled? do you need local (region) as a class skill, or do you just need local and can pick whatever region?

The region thing was never an official rule, that was specific to settings like FR and Greyhawk, where it worked that way.

[Venger]

The region thing was never an official rule, that was specific to settings like FR and Greyhawk, where it worked that way.

ah, okay then.

[Aeryr]

I'm also down with Illithid Body Tamer, heh. But isn't Underdark 3.0 as well?

Wow Illitid body tamer is awesome, changeling warshaper with racial emulation, anyone?

(Racial emulation shouldn't work illithid aren't humanoid )

[Venger]

Wow Illitid body tamer is awesome, changeling warshaper with racial emulation, anyone?

(Racial emulation shouldn't work illithid aren't humanoid )

depends on your definition of "illithidkin" which doesn't have any real in-game designation.

while half-illithids are aberrations and alhouns/illithiliches are undead, debatably voidmind would work, so you could enter as a changeling without even having to burn a feat on racial emulation, even if you'd have to eat the LA of 3, but we see pixies all the time in these, so it's not like it's the highest ECL booster thus far (highest I think was the drider in shadowdancer)

[Amphetryon]

Wow Illitid body tamer is awesome, changeling warshaper with racial emulation, anyone?

(Racial emulation shouldn't work illithid aren't humanoid )

There's at least one other work-around.

[Yorrin]

There's at least one other work-around.

If 3.0 is allowed there's a workaround for any racial requirement. The Old Blood feat in Bastards&Bloodlines

[Kuulvheysoon]

There's at least one other work-around.

I think that we're thinking of the same thing - do you think so? IT's that thing, with the book, and that other thing in the book, right?

[Venger]

There's at least one other work-around.

since bloodlines are, at best, frowned upon in IC historically (think the only one I saw was glum in cancer mage), I think you're referring to the illithid heritage feat from complete psionic.

good idea. then you can get in without any LA. you'd obviously need to take illithid grapple, to get a tentacle attack to put the weapon focus on, and some other illithid feat besides illithid heritage to qualify for that, so that's 3 already, then illithid body tamer requires great fortitude, PA, and WF(tentacle), so that's 6. assume a martial class for quickest entry to get the 6BA, human for the extra feat. 2 flaws gets you in at 7 on time, without them, you must wait until level 13 and be unable to finish the class.

brutal.

best case scenario, you've got 3 levels to kick around. I never thought I'd say this, but flayerspawn psychic might work to kill that time. you're in the unlikely circumstance of already having the feat tax paid, and can get another lame tentacle for free, at least.

real question is, do any of the psionic classes have full BA? I know psions and lurks have half, wilders and psyrogues and ardents and psywars have avg. anyone have full? expanded knowledge for psycharm gets you flayerspawn psychic (if you want it) even if just for the mind blast. you can ax the 3rd lvl and dip mindbender at that point since you'll have the hard parts out of the way

[Zombimode]

real question is, do any of the psionic classes have full BA? I know psions and lurks have half, wilders and psyrogues and ardents and psywars have avg. anyone have full? expanded knowledge for psycharm gets you flayerspawn psychic (if you want it) even if just for the mind blast. you can ax the 3rd lvl and dip mindbender at that point since you'll have the hard parts out of the way

Lurks have 3/4 Bab.
(Ilithid) Slayers progress psionics at 9/10 rate and have full bab.
Warminds have their own progression (with accelerated PP, compared to PsiWar at least) and come with full bab.

Thats all I've got.

[mattie_p]

real question is, do any of the psionic classes have full BA? I know psions and lurks have half, wilders and psyrogues and ardents and psywars have avg. anyone have full? expanded knowledge for psycharm gets you flayerspawn psychic (if you want it) even if just for the mind blast. you can ax the 3rd lvl and dip mindbender at that point since you'll have the hard parts out of the way

The only other psionic class that I have been able to find with full BAB is the psychic weapons master, a 5/10 manifesting PrC. Technically, the 3.0 diamond warrior gets full BAB with unarmed attacks, but medium with all else. But no Ranger/Paladin type manifesting base classes, that I have been able to find.

[Aeryr]

you'd obviously need to take illithid grapple, to get a tentacle attack to put the weapon focus on, and some other illithid feat besides illithid heritage to qualify for that, so that's 3 already, then illithid body tamer requires great fortitude, PA, and WF(tentacle), so that's 6. assume a martial class for quickest entry to get the 6BA, human for the extra feat. 2 flaws gets you in at 7 on time, without them, you must wait until level 13 and be unable to finish the class.

WF and PA are fighter bonus feats, since you are already taking martial class levels... Or that could be a plus to be a psychic warrior.

Ps. Illithid body tamer is quite an awesome class, I'll check bastards and bloodlines once I get back to my books.

[Amphetryon]

If 3.0 is allowed there's a workaround for any racial requirement. The Old Blood feat in Bastards&Bloodlines

There is no "If 3.0 is allowed" as that's addressed specifically in the rules and FAQ for the contest. Bastards & Bloodlines is a 3rd party book, and therefore not allowed, so that would not be the workaround I'm referencing.