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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Jan 2012

    Default World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    I know it says 2 years of gameplay, but how many hours is this? I'm having trouble finding an actual number. Thanks.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Anxe's Avatar

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Has anyone actually finished it in its entirety?

    Anyways, a good guess can be gotten by math. I think the designers intended each session to be 6-8 hours long. Let's say 6. Most people have a session every week, but sometimes stuff happens or its the holidays. Let's say 40 weeks a year.

    So... 6*40*2 = 480 hours

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Planetar

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Our group played it all the way through. Took about three years, including breaks. Take the breaks out and yeah, 2 years sounds about right.
    I'm the author of the Alex Verus series of urban fantasy novels. Fated is the first, and Book #10 in the series, Fallen, is out as of September 2019. For updates, check my blog!

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Zombie

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anxe View Post
    Has anyone actually finished it in its entirety?
    Yes.

    To answer the original question....If I remember correctly, it took us 1 year and 10 months. We did a full clear...every section. If we had just followed the natural chain of the dungeon, we could have shaved off a few months...but we were determined. And we had some marathon sessions that lasted over 12 hours....some as long as 16 hours. We were a well oiled machine.

    I would say that Anxe's estimate is fairly accurate.
    The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout "Save us!"... and I'll look down and whisper "No."

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Anxe's Avatar

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    I'm impressed that you guys actually finished it. My players objected once they realized they couldn't escape. :(
    Still, maybe I can use individual areas in my campaigns later on.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    JediSoth's Avatar

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    I ran WLD for my group for about 2 years. Technically we finished it, though I put into place a few things to let them skip a bunch to get to the last room because I was starting to suffer massive burnout. I had two TPKs (or near TPKs, I think each time one character survived from a player who wasn't present at that session).

    We could've easily spent another year of playing, I think. My big mistake was saying "Anything goes" and not putting any restrictions on the types of class/race character combos. WLD was balanced for a Core (PHB only) group of classes that included neither druids nor wizards (instead using the sorcerer). A goliath barbarian/cleric was Death Incarnate, as was a Warmage with the Orb spells memorized (few of the 3.0 monsters they used had any resistances that could stand up to a no save, ranged-touch attack Force Orb).

    WLD taught me to HATE goliaths, and the Orb spells.

    Also, don't let someone create a faerie dragon rogue to play in WLD. :p
    JediSoth
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  7. - Top - End - #7
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Zombie

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anxe View Post
    I'm impressed that you guys actually finished it. My players objected once they realized they couldn't escape. :(
    Still, maybe I can use individual areas in my campaigns later on.
    Well, the DM in our case had used the original writings on the dungeon origins being a prison for baddies and expanded on them. We were the group that was to restore order to the dungeon and keep the prison running, obviously. But he threw in some ways to keep us with gear. Like if you ever played Resident Evil 4...the guy you buy your weapon upgrades from who somehow always made it to your location..well he (or in this case, she) was found 1x in each section of the WLD to help us with gear unloads/purchases and sometimes having info we needed. Plus we were all given 2 handy haversacks from the start. We were also not the only PCs in the dungeon....we ran into other "groups" or a lone NPC from failed groups....that gave insight to other goings on/areas of the dungeon. Sometimes they traveled with us, sometimes not. Most of the time they died a horrible death. This was a good way to explain why a dead PC was replaced. How did he get there? You can't introduce players in normal ways in WLD when their previous PC died.

    As for using parts of it, I've had DM's do that and it works fairly well on everyone else....I've played it and I own it, so I know what to expect once I figure it out. I let the DM know that and I let them know that I will NOT spoil it for the rest of the group. I won't ruin someone else's fun.

    This may sound a little goofy but I got a kick out of it. Spoilered for length:
    Spoiler
    Show
    From the start of the game, the DM told us time is funny in the dungeon. When asked to elaborate, he told us 5 minutes COULD last years or years could last 5 minutes in the outside world. He rolled randomly for it after each section of the dungeon on a chart he made for time passage. He never told us the result or that he did it. So it was quickly forgotten by us, the PCs. His idea was that when we got out, the next campaign we played would take over from that point. Well, apparently, we kept getting great amounts of time passing outside.

    By the time we left the dungeon, it was modern day outside. Like, the year of our lord, 2003 modern day....The exit to the dungeon let us out in the grand canyon. We were the only ones of our classes to exist anymore. So we played a D20 modern game....with our current PCs. Reduced back down to 3rd level for campaign purposes. OR we could roll up D20 modern PCs if we chose but why do that. Some did, I did not.

    I was the greatest thief (rogue) the world had ever seen. It was glorious...


    All in all, I had a HUGE amount of fun playing it. I think it can be rewarding to finish it...once. I might play it again given the chance, but I would try to talk the group out of it for the restrictions it has on gameplay.
    The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout "Save us!"... and I'll look down and whisper "No."

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Mordokai's Avatar

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unseenmal View Post
    *stuff written here*
    This. This is what I've been saying all along. The designers made a fatal flaw, mostly by making the whole module too serious. Had they decided to go with a little eased up attitude, I think the module would be even better and I like it as it anyway.

    Would you, as somebody who has finished it, agree with this? What your DM did was great, but I was thinking of adding much gallows and/or black humor. My chief idea was for PCs to be hired as exterminators for the wacky old wizard, to clear his basement. Turns out, his basement is in fact WLD and they fall down 100 meters or so(surviving the fall thanks to a handily placed fluffly pillows at the bottom. You could take it from there. Much improvising needed, but I think it could be great fun.
    Adrie, half elven bard. Drawing by Vulion, avatar by CheesePirate. Colored version by Callos_DeTerran. Thanks a lot, you guys.
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  9. - Top - End - #9
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Ignore most of the houserules for the dungeon... here are some questions I give everyone who is thinking of playing in the game to ask the DMs. As DM, you should consider the possible answers to them, and tell the players the answers up front!

    1.) For characters that can invest resources in 'burrowing', 'earthgliding', and 'burrowing through stone' (there are several ways to do this, including Wild Shaping into a Thoqqua, for example, which specifically also leaves a usable tunnnel...), are the use of their abilities nerfed? IE, are inner room walls impervious as *well as* the obviously impervious outer walls? IE, will player characters sometimes be able to scout or bypass rooms in this way?

    2.) For characters who invest in being able to do things with crafting materials, will the DM be using the standard lack of crafting supplies in this dungeon? Or will supplies be found, or will you be able to convert GP value in items to generic crafting supplies at a particular ratio with a particular amount of time?

    3.) For characters who can replace animal companions or such things via summoning them, either a few times a day or via a 24 hour ritual, will those abilities work as advertised? What if characters want to release your existing animal companion and summon a new one? What about the magical paladin pokeball-mounts? Will those work normally?

    4.) For characters that invest in short range teleports, or becoming etherial, or things like that, do those work as advertised? At least for interior areas?

    5.) For characters that expect to be able to Take 10 or Take 20 on skills, do those work as in the PHB? Or is that nerfed, as the dungeon suggests? If you can't search things reliably, after all, you don't end up at the more interesting rooms...

    6.) For characters that invest in having access to, say, an Extended Rope Trick at level 5, does that work as advertised, to get access to a safe space? What are your rulings on Extradimensional or nondimensional spaces working in the dungeon? What if a Wizard wants to actually scribe scrolls, will the DM be handwaving the exotic inks necessary to do so? Maybe just subtract a GP worth of value of loot to do this? What if an Easy Bake Wizard (it's a named build using a few combinations of techniques) wants to spend some time scribing scrolls to his brain by burning incenses, will those be placed as treasure?

    7.) Will the DM be making intelligent adjustments to the 'security' of rooms or wandering monster based issues based on intelligent barricading techniques? Will the DM be enforcing the 'most locations are very dangerous and have hourly wandering monster rolls' rule? What if the party attempts to barricade themselves in one of the rooms that is NOT specifically marked as an obvious saferoom?

    8.) Will the DM be changing the treasure of the module? Most of the treasure of the module is supposedly completely useless -- ie, 'art', or 'not equipment' sorts of things, or things that doesn't actually HELP, or things too large to be taken, and thus doesn't actually help the party. Alternately, is the DM relaxing the restrictions on the feat 'Ancestral Relic', ie, it's the only real way to appropriately sacrifice the crappy treasure (like a huge amount of material you can't change to useful gear because it's too big) to make useful equipment, maybe give it out as a bonus feat or not make it 'good aligned only'? Is this feat suggested or appropriate for this particular campaign of World's Largest Dungeon?

    9.) The module suggests completely banning the entire category of 'battlefield control' spells from the game, and mentions that they will not be placed in the game. Typically, a few pages later, a Web scroll is given out as treasure. Are there any house rules on battlefield control spells?

    10.) For characters that want to do summons in general, with 'summoning' spells not actually acting like calling spells (ie, summoning spells don't summon an actual creature from somewhere, they instead summon a mystical 'genericized' example of the creature type in question), will those summoning spells work as normal, or will they be nerfed as the module says?

    ------

    The main thing I noticed is that the game is absolutely horribly, TERRIBLY written, and appears to be one of the most mind bogglingly boring, inane modules ever. All the interesting places are specifically those that are HARD to find. The place makes no sense, even given the backstory. The combat encounters are not interesting, are repetitive, and boring. The entire thing could be condensed immensely. You could bypass maybe 90% of the area with the party coming up with intelligent heuristics on searches and where to search and what to search and how, and the DM running the party on autopilot until they come up against something INTERESTING. The game doesn't reward creativity on the roleplayers' parts. It gives no impetus for anyone to CARE about the metaplot of any of the areas. It gives no useful or interesting treasure. In other words... the module SUCKS, in such a profound way it is hard to put in words. I'd be happy if you just arbitrarily hand waved all the exploration, and put all the interesting rooms in linear order without even trying to lay them out as a maze, and assuming people make their checks to find interesting rooms... This dungeon isn't large because it has interesting or noteworthy places. It is large because it has an excessive amount of padding and repetition, like the worst kind of grinding video games ever...

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Starbuck_II's Avatar

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    Enterprise, Alabama
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    Default Re: World's largest Dungeon Play time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    1.) For characters that can invest resources in 'burrowing', 'earthgliding', and 'burrowing through stone' (there are several ways to do this, including Wild Shaping into a Thoqqua, for example, which specifically also leaves a usable tunnnel...), are the use of their abilities nerfed? IE, are inner room walls impervious as *well as* the obviously impervious outer walls? IE, will player characters sometimes be able to scout or bypass rooms in this way?
    Huh, does it mention that? I think it didn't.
    2.) For characters who invest in being able to do things with crafting materials, will the DM be using the standard lack of crafting supplies in this dungeon? Or will supplies be found, or will you be able to convert GP value in items to generic crafting supplies at a particular ratio with a particular amount of time?
    Lack of crafting supplies?
    The forest has wood (though it isn't that close to entrance). Metal might be an issue though, but you vcould melt down the metal you find.
    3.) For characters who can replace animal companions or such things via summoning them, either a few times a day or via a 24 hour ritual, will those abilities work as advertised? What if characters want to release your existing animal companion and summon a new one? What about the magical paladin pokeball-mounts? Will those work normally?
    Animal companions aren't summons. They are real creatures so they should be possible. (they get stuck too)
    Now Pokeball Paladins... wouldn't be good to unsummon it. Since few areas you can resummon.
    4.) For characters that invest in short range teleports, or becoming ethearal, or things like that, do those work as advertised? At least for interior areas?
    Only for areas H, K, L, O and a few others allow it (only place you can access your bag of hold either).
    It says short range teleports are allowed if within line of sight or 100 ft (the lesser of the two.
    5.) For characters that expect to be able to Take 10 or Take 20 on skills, do those work as in the PHB? Or is that nerfed, as the dungeon suggests? If you can't search things reliably, after all, you don't end up at the more interesting rooms...
    Good point, where do they mention that? Found it pg 19.
    It mentions a few "compromises", since they forgot about the take 10/20 rules (choose 1 if allowing them):
    a. Limited to three of each per region per PC.
    b. Require a Conc check to take them (makes sense at least)
    c. The encounter conditions impart penalties (-1 to -10) when take 10/20
    d. You can do it, but the DM should increase Crit multipiers for all enemies(this one seemed vindictive).
    6.) For characters that invest in having access to, say, an Extended Rope Trick at level 5, does that work as advertised, to get access to a safe space? What are your rulings on Extradimensional or nondimensional spaces working in the dungeon? What if a Wizard wants to actually scribe scrolls, will the DM be handwaving the exotic inks necessary to do so? Maybe just subtract a GP worth of value of loot to do this? What if an Easy Bake Wizard (it's a named build using a few combinations of techniques) wants to spend some time scribing scrolls to his brain by burning incenses, will those be placed as treasure?
    Only in those specific rooms I mention. I'd definitely just say subtract the gp.
    The Module assumes it.
    7.) Will the DM be making intelligent adjustments to the 'security' of rooms or wandering monster based issues based on intelligent barricading techniques? Will the DM be enforcing the 'most locations are very dangerous and have hourly wandering monster rolls' rule? What if the party attempts to barricade themselves in one of the rooms that is NOT specifically marked as an obvious saferoom?
    Why are you adjusting?
    8.) Will the DM be changing the treasure of the module? Most of the treasure of the module is supposedly completely useless -- ie, 'art', or 'not equipment' sorts of things, or things that doesn't actually HELP, or things too large to be taken, and thus doesn't actually help the party. Alternately, is the DM relaxing the restrictions on the feat 'Ancestral Relic', ie, it's the only real way to appropriately sacrifice the crappy treasure (like a huge amount of material you can't change to useful gear because it's too big) to make useful equipment, maybe give it out as a bonus feat or not make it 'good aligned only'? Is this feat suggested or appropriate for this particular campaign of World's Largest Dungeon?
    Good point. You can burn it for crafting feats still like Craft Wonderous.
    9.) The module suggests completely banning the entire category of 'battlefield control' spells from the game, and mentions that they will not be placed in the game. Typically, a few pages later, a Web scroll is given out as treasure. Are there any house rules on battlefield control spells?
    It doesn't ban them, read pg 12. It just states they should be rare basically (they find them too strong).
    10.) For characters that want to do summons in general, with 'summoning' spells not actually acting like calling spells (ie, summoning spells don't summon an actual creature from somewhere, they instead summon a mystical 'genericized' example of the creature type in question), will those summoning spells work as normal, or will they be nerfed as the module says?
    It does allow summon monster spells but says when duration ends the monster won't be friendly for being trapped... (pg 14 at bottom, still no XP if kill). Mentions fiendish badger attacking wizard.
    This is why the demons/devils don't summon: they know it will try to turn on them (even if can't beat them, no likes to be wounded).

    Also, disintegrate will destroy the entrance barrier (it is just a walll of Force), so they can leave if they make it that far in levels technically.

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