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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Hello, Playgrounders!

    I know archers have been done many times over now, but for me that just means plenty of material to compare against besides a friend of mine asked that I make a sniper for him so I thought it would be more fun to see how fast I could put one together instead of pointing him around the forums

    So without further ado, my take on...

    The Archer

    Starting Age: As Fighter
    Starting Gold: As Fighter
    Alignment: Any

    HD: d8
    Skills per level: 4 + INT
    Class Skills: Craft, Intimidate, Know (Local, History, Geography), Perception, Profession, Ride, Sleight of Hand, Stealth
    Proficiencies: All Simple Weapons plus Improvised (Arrows and Bolts), all non-firearm ranged weapons, all light armor, no shields

    {table=head]Level|BAB|Fort|Ref|Will|Special
    1th | +1 |+0 | +2 | +0 | Marksmanship, Archery Style
    2th | +2 |+1 | +3 | +0 | Bonus Archer Feat, Ranged Weapon Aptitude
    3th | +3 |+1 | +3 | +1 | Archer’s Shot
    4th | +4 |+2 | +4 | +1 | Archery Style I, Ranged Power Attack
    5th | +5 | +2 | +4 | +1 | Improved Sight
    6th | +6/+1 |+3 | +5 | +2 | Bonus Archer Feat, Improved Range
    7th | +7/+2 | +3 | +5 | +2| Archer’s Shot
    8th | +8/+3 | +3 | +6 | +2| Archery Style II,
    9th | +9/+4 | +4 | +6 | +3 | Ranged Combat Maneuvers
    10th | +10/+5 | +4 | +7 | +3 | Bonus Archer Feat, Improved Sight (Concealment)
    11th | +11/+6/+1 | +5 | +7 | +3 | Archer’s Shot
    12th | +12/+7/+2 | +5 | +8 | +4 | Archery Style III
    13th | +13/+8/+3 | +6 | +8 | +4 | Master Bowyer/Fletcher
    14th | +14/+9/+4 | +6 | +9 | +4 | Bonus Archer Feat
    15th | +15/+10/+5 | +6 | +9 | +5 | Archer’s Shot
    16th | +16/+11/+6/+1 | +7 | +10 | +5 | Archery Style IV, Melee Shot
    17th | +17/+12/+7/+2 | +7 | +10 | +5 | Bypass Winds
    18th | +18/+13/+8/+3 | +8 | +11 | +6 | Bonus Archer Feat, Ranged Threat
    19th | +19/+14/+9/+4 | +8 | +11 | +6 | Archer’s Shot
    20th | +20/+15/+10/+5 | +9 | +12 | +6 | Master of the Path
    [/table]

    Special Abilities:
    Marksmanship:
    The Archer adds his Dexterity Modifier to damage with ranged weapons.

    Archery Style:
    The Archer selects his preferred method of archery. The Choices are Sniping, Skirmishing and Volleying. The benefits of these styles are specified below.

    Archer Bonus Feat:
    At level 2 and every 4 levels afterwards the Archer gains a bonus feat. This feat must be specific to ranged weapons. The Archer counts as a fighter of equal level for qualifying for feats such as Weapon Specialization

    Ranged Weapon Aptitude:
    The Archer can swap any feat specific to a single ranged weapon for any other ranged weapon. He must still qualify for this feat. For example if an Archer trades his Weapon Focus (shortbow) to weapon focus (Longbow), he must also do the same for his weapon specialization in shortbow.

    Archer’s Shot:
    At level 3 and again every 4 levels after the Archer gains the ability to fire a special shot, listed below. These shots are each usable once per day per 5 Archer levels. Firing an Archer's Shot requires a standard action.

    Ranged Power Attack:
    The Archer gains the power attack feat. He can use this feat with ranged weapons. If he already has the power attack feat he gains another feat in its place.

    Improved Sight:
    The Archer gains low light vision if he does not already. He also gains a +4 bonus to perception and ignores half the cover bonus to AC that targets of his ranged attacks might have.

    At level 10 this ability improves, halving the concealment bonus due to cover granted to any targets of ranged attacks.

    Improved Range:
    The Archer takes only a -1 penalty to attack per range increment instead of -2.
    Alternatively, the archer can choose to forgo this ability to gain its alternate variant: Height Advantage. The archer gains a +1 to attack and damage for every 20ft he is higher than his target.

    Master Bowyer/Fletcher:
    The Archer gets a +4 bonus on all craft & profession checks regarding ranged weapons and ammunition

    Ranged Combat Maneuvers:
    The Archer can make Trip, Disarm and Sunder attempts using ranged weapons.

    Melee Shot:
    The Archer can use ranged weapons while being threatened without incurring attacks of Opportunity

    Bypass Winds:
    The Archer can ignore any unfavorable wind conditions when using ranged weapons.

    Ranged Threat:
    The Archer can threaten (and flank) enemies within a 30ft range as if he were using a melee weapon

    Master of the path:
    The archer's capstone is dependent on his choice of path:
    Sniping: The Archer can make two attacks in one round and still gain all the benefits of only shooting one per round.
    Skirmishing: The archer can perform two special shots at once, gaining the benefits of both.
    Volleying: The archer can loose two arrows in one shot as easily as others loose one. When loosing two arrows in a shot the archer does not gain any strength or dexterity bonus to damage but all other damage is rolled as if he had hit with two arrows.
    Alternative #1: The Archer takes no penalty for using the Rapid Shot or Multishot feats or any feats with these feats as prerequisites.
    Alternative #2: The Archer can make a full attack against every target within one range increment as a full round action. To use this ability the Archer must make a move action in the round prior to ready himself and cannot move for one round after the storm of arrows has been launched.

    Archery Paths
    Sniping:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Level 1: The Archer gains the precision ability, dealing an extra 1d6 damage using ranged weapons per two archer levels when making only a single attack per turn. Attacks of opportunity do not impact this ability nor other Sniping abilities requiring only one attack per round.
    Level 4: If making only a single attack on their turn, an archer can attempt a stealth check to remain stealthed at no penalty.
    Level 8: For every consecutive round that a sniper studies his target he gains +1 to attack and damage on his next attack against that target.
    To Study a foe the sniper uses a standard or move action for that round, and cannot attack or move out of line of sight from the target being studied.
    Level 12: If a sniper kills his target while stealthed in one ranged attack he remains stealthed as if he did not shoot at all, and any creature not aware of the sniper's presence within 30 ft of the slain target must make a will save vs fear (DC = 10 + ˝ Archer level + Dex Bonus) or be frightened for one round. A successful save results in being shaken instead.
    Level 16: If the sniper studies his foe for 1d4 +1 (consecutive) rounds then makes a single precision attack on that target, that attack threatens a critical hit.


    Skirmishing:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Level 1: The Archer gains the Skirmish ability as a Scout of the same level, progressing once every two levels.
    Level 4: The Archers base movement speed increases by 10ft
    Level 8: The Archer gains the Hide in Plain Sight ability, becoming able to hide without cover or shadows nearby
    Level 12: The archer can make his attack(s) at any point during his move action.
    Level 16: The Archer can make both a full attack and a move action on his turn. Doing so means he cannot move more than 5ft on his next turn.


    Volleying:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Level 1: When using raged weapons, the archer gains a new iterative attack for every 4 BAB instead of every 5. The Table of BAB for a Volley Archer can be seen in the spoiler here:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Level 1: +1
    Level 2: +2
    Level 3: +3
    Level 4: +4
    Level 5: +5/+1
    Level 6: +6/+2
    Level 7: +7/+3
    Level 8: +8/+4
    Level 9: +9/+5/+1
    Level 10: +10/+6/+2
    Level 11: +11/+7/+3
    Level 12: +12/+8/+4
    Level 13: +13/+9/+5/+1
    Level 14: +14/+10/+6/+2
    Level 15: +15/+11/+7/+3
    Level 16: +16/+12/+8/+4
    Level 17: +17/+13/+9/+5/+1
    Level 18: +18/+14/+10/+6/+2
    Level 19: +19/+15/+11/+7/+3
    Level 20: +20/+16/+12/+8/+4

    Level 4: The Archer can roll damage from ranged attacks all together at the end of his turn instead of for each attack that hits. This means any damage reduction, damage resistance, etc the target has only applies once to the archers attack. Any other effects of the arrows are still applied individually.
    Level 8: Clustered Shots: For every ranged attack that hits the same target during his turn, the archer gains a cumulative +1 bonus to attack and damage against that foe.
    Level 12: The archer can use the Archer's Shot 'Arcing Shot' as an attack action when performing a full attack.
    Level 16: Multishot: The archer gains the ability to make four attacks at his highest attack bonus in place of a full attack. This ability cannot be used again for 1d4 +1 rounds once used.


    Archer’s Shots
    Note: All save DCs for Archer’s Shots are (10 + half Archer level + Dex Modifier)

    Spoiler
    Show

    -Bouncing Shot: Attack can bounce off a solid surface up to 90 degrees, but takes a -2 penalty to attack after the bounce.
    -Pinpoint Shot: Attack avoids one form of AC on the target.
    -Vicious Shot: Attack also deals bleed damage equal to half the Archers Dex modifier. This bleed damage is applied at the beginning of the target's turn every round until healed by magical means or use of the heal skill.
    -Arcing Shot: The Attack is made against a square (AC 5), and hits the next round. If anything, including multiple targets, is in that square during thae round the arrow hits it must make a reflex save for half damage. This shot bypasses walls, cover and other barriers unless they are present above the targeted square.

    -Penetrating Shot: The attack Bypasses up to Dex modifier DR. Minimum level 7
    -Impeding Shot: The attack stops fast healing and regeneration for 1d4 +1 rounds. Minimum level 7
    -Staggering Shot: The attack forces a fort save or be staggered for 1d4 rounds. Minimum level 7

    -Undecieved Shot: Attack bypasses up to 20% miss chance. Minimum level 11.
    -Dazing Shot: The attack forces a will save or be dazed for 1d4 rounds. Minimum level 11
    -Disrupting Shot: The attack also delivers a targeted dispel magic attempt upon a hit, caster level equal to Archer level. Minimum level 11

    -Stunning Shot: The attack forces a will save or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. Minimum level 15
    -Piercing Shot: The attack is treated as a line attack out to one range increment, with a reflex save for half damage. Minimum level 15
    -Intercepting Shot: The attack stops the target from attacking or charging with a melee weapon for 1d4 rounds. Minimum level 15

    -Lethal Shot: The attack forces a fort save or be killed. Minimum level 19
    -Perfect Shot: The attack cannot miss and deals maximum possible damage. This does not guarantee a critical hit but maximizes damage should it occur. Minmum level 19


    Changes and Removed abilities:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Improved Range: At level 6 this ability improves to give a +1 bonus to attack and damage for every 10ft elevation you have higher than the target of your ranged attack.
    Reason: Too good in conjunction with level 1 Improved Range. You can choose one or the other if you like.

    Threat Range Increase:
    At level 8 and again at 14 the archer increases the threat range of all ranged weapons by one. This increase does not stack with any other means of increasing threat range and is applied after all other modifiers.
    Reason: Crossbows made this ability too good

    Called Shot:
    The archer gains the ability to cripple his targets with a directed shot. This ability is activated by-
    Reason: Called shots already exist in Pathfinder
    Last edited by Kane0; 2012-07-20 at 02:03 AM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Capstone: Archery Based:

    Sniping: Deadly Shot: Study a target for 5 turns, then make an attack against that target. All variable Numeric rolls are maximized (Max damage, Garenteed Vorpal)

    Skirmish: Dualwield Bows

    Volleying: Ballistics: Arrows carry with them a Fireball spell, as though with CL=10, with DC= (10+Half Archer Level+Dex Mod). Can have Energy Substitution applied, granting Electricity, Sonic, Cold, Fire, or Acid damage.
    My Homebrew: found here.
    When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes

    PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.

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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Griffon

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Interestingly enough, we went a very similar direction. Hope anything you find there helps!

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    The way I see it, there's quite a few problems with general balance here - I'm not the best person to pick them, but I can see few easy ones:

    - Improved Range is very potent ability, giving easy hits at huge ranges even from very early levels - attempting to shot something from 1000 ft becomes - 10 instead of - 20...

    Height things also stacks up very quickly - just 100 feet of elevation (some mild hill) cancels whole penalty from 1000 feet and ads a lot of damage....
    At just 6th level.

    Good idea to encourage shooting from some distance, but completely broken compared to other martial builds.

    - Marksmanship also is pretty potent, banking up Dexterity gives a lot of damage

    And final problem - those are 1st level abilities, without any scaling (save improving Dex, of course) so generally one doesn't really need more Archer levels than just 1 for huge bonuses at high levels.

    Just go Cleric for some Ench. bonus to Dex and other Spell Buff goodness.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
    The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
    Rush in and die, dogs—I was a man before I was a king.

    Whoever makes shoddy beer, shall be thrown into manure - town law from Gdańsk, XIth century.

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    The Critical expander ability is possitively insane with a great crossbow
    My Homebrew: found here.
    When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes

    PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.

    Drow avatar @ myself

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    Pixie in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    I think you had a problem with the Call Shot CopyPaste

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    Kane0's Avatar

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Thanks for the feedback guys!

    Changes I've made:
    - Grabbing some material (mostly shots) from The Archer. Thanks!
    - Improved Range is now either Height Advantage or reduced penalty to range increments, not both. This is at level 6 instead of level 1
    - Critical Threat Range Increase removed. I hadn't considered crossbows and PF Firearms
    - Some abilities moved to give at least one new ability or ability improvement per level
    Last edited by Kane0; 2012-07-15 at 06:55 PM.

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    Spiryt's Avatar

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kane0 View Post

    Level 12: If a sniper kills his target while stealthed in one ranged attack he remains stealthed as if he did not shoot at all, and any enemy within 10 ft of the slain target must make a will save vs fear (DC = 10 + ˝ Archer level + Dex Bonus) or be frightened for one round. A successful save results in being shaken instead.
    Level 16: If the sniper studies his foe for 1d4 +1 (consecutive) rounds then makes a single precision attack on that target, that attack cannot miss and 1s are rerolled when determining damage.

    Range of 10ft is really, really low and doesn't make that much sense, although all kinds of "terrifying" abilities are always kind of hard to define.

    For example, what happens to enemy that doesn't care about dead patient at all? And what with some poor old guy who's not enemy at all - he's probably petrified with fear anyway.

    Seeing that effect is not really severe at all for the level of this ability, I would certainly make range greater - maybe 30 feet, maybe within range those enemies could communicate with each other, dunno.


    As for capstone of this path - auto hit is pretty nice, though with bonuses to hit etc. and single attack per round Sniper will be probably very accurate anyway.

    If my math doesn't fail me, re rolling 1's means like 0.5 point of damage per dice, so even if PC has a lot of dice for damage from whatever reason, it will be really rather insignificant.

    In any case, 'studying' needs clarification as Assassin ability, for example.



    When using ranged weapons the Archer uses the BAB progression that a monk using a monk weapon would receive.
    Like, with Flurry of blows? This needs clarification, I think.

    The Archer can roll damage from ranged attacks all together at the end of his turn instead of for each attack that hits. This means damage reduction, damage resistance, etc only applies once
    What about effects etc. which DC, or something else, depends on damage dealt?


    -Vicious Shot: Attack also deals bleed damage equal to half the Archers Dex modifier
    -Arcing Shot: The Attack is made against a square, and hits the next round. If anything is in that square during that round it must reflex save for half damage.
    I've seen some perks like that before, but I'm pretty sure than "bleeding" isn't really stated anywhere? If so, this needs some description - how long do the bleeding lasts, what kind of damage bleeding is, how does this interfere with Damage Reduction and so on.

    Same with ASh - does it hit all creatures in the square? Is attack made against the square, so AC of the square (something abysmal, I guess) counts? Etc.
    Last edited by Spiryt; 2012-07-18 at 02:54 AM.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
    The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
    Rush in and die, dogs—I was a man before I was a king.

    Whoever makes shoddy beer, shall be thrown into manure - town law from Gdańsk, XIth century.

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    Kane0's Avatar

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Thanks for pointing out those kinks Spiryt, I'll get to working on them ASAP

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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    For the capstone, why have just one capstone, why not swap it for a different capstone for each path.

    For example, the Sniper would gain the Death Attack ability of the PF Assassin. They study the target for 3 rounds and then they can do a sneak attack that either paralyzes the target, or kills them if they fail a save.
    "I do not suffer from insanity, I enjoy every moment of it" - Edgar Allen Poe


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    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by toapat View Post
    Capstone: Archery Based:

    Sniping: Deadly Shot: Study a target for 5 turns, then make an attack against that target. All variable Numeric rolls are maximized (Max damage, Garenteed Vorpal)

    Skirmish: Dualwield Bows

    Volleying: Ballistics: Arrows carry with them a Fireball spell, as though with CL=10, with DC= (10+Half Archer Level+Dex Mod). Can have Energy Substitution applied, granting Electricity, Sonic, Cold, Fire, or Acid damage.
    Quote Originally Posted by masterstalker2 View Post
    For the capstone, why have just one capstone, why not swap it for a different capstone for each path.

    For example, the Sniper would gain the Death Attack ability of the PF Assassin. They study the target for 3 rounds and then they can do a sneak attack that either paralyzes the target, or kills them if they fail a save.
    Already beat you to the sugestion of path capstones
    My Homebrew: found here.
    When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes

    PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.

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    Kane0's Avatar

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    OK, filled in those dead path abilities and capstone with path capstones.

    Thinking of adding an ability that gains proficiency in arrows and bolts in melee.

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    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kane0 View Post
    OK, filled in those dead path abilities and capstone with path capstones.

    Thinking of adding an ability that gains proficiency in arrows and bolts in melee.
    Weapon Proficiency: Improvised Daggers (Arrows and Bolts)
    My Homebrew: found here.
    When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes

    PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.

    Drow avatar @ myself

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Seeing how Assasin DA is generally considered somehow lacking ability, due to ease of save, it may be a bit week capstone... Even though about ~ 30 more damage due to max. damage guaranteed.

    While I think that connected with Multishot, and some Archer's Shots, Volleying capstone may get way to crazy, even without Str. and Dex damage.

    Skirmishing capstone certainly seems way more potent.

    -Lethal Shot: The attack forces a fort save or be killed. Minimum level 19
    -Perfect Shot: The attack cannot miss and deals maximum possible damage. This does not guarantee a critical hit but maximizes damage should it occur. Minmum level 19
    By using those two at the same time, it seems to pretty much copy the Sniping capstone... While it can also do much more by combining other AS.

    Level 12: The archer can use the Archer's Shot 'Arcing Shot' as an attack action when performing a full attack.
    This suggest that Arcing Shot or other AS's cannot be normally used like that, while nothing in general description states so clearly. May use a clarification.
    Avatar by Kwarkpudding
    The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
    Rush in and die, dogs—I was a man before I was a king.

    Whoever makes shoddy beer, shall be thrown into manure - town law from Gdańsk, XIth century.

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Spiryt View Post
    Seeing how Assasin DA is generally considered somehow lacking ability, due to ease of save, it may be a bit week capstone... Even though about ~ 30 more damage due to max. damage guaranteed.

    While I think that connected with Multishot, and some Archer's Shots, Volleying capstone may get way to crazy, even without Str. and Dex damage.

    Skirmishing capstone certainly seems way more potent.
    They do seem a little unbalanced. Skirmish seems the most balanced at this point with Sniping being a little lacking (even with a max damage crit on a successful save vs dying) and Volleying being a little too much dakka. I'll see what I can think up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spiryt View Post
    By using those two at the same time, it seems to pretty much copy the Sniping capstone... While it can also do much more by combining other AS.
    The Archer only gets to choose one of those two, at level 19. Well, excluding epic levels that is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spiryt View Post
    This suggest that Arcing Shot or other AS's cannot be normally used like that, while nothing in general description states so clearly. May use a clarification.
    Good catch, I'll fix that up.

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    Default Re: Another Archer (3.5/P Base, PEACH)

    Tweaked the capstone, but still not sure about volleying though. I have a few options there, any and all feedback is welcome
    Last edited by Kane0; 2012-07-20 at 02:29 AM.

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