4.e Gorilla Race

[ExemplarofAvg]

Gorilla

Racial Traits
Average Height: 7.5 to 8.5 ft.
Average Weight: 300 to 400 lbs.

Ability Scores: +2 Dexterity, +2 Constitution
Size: Large
(Reach 2, 2x2 Square, One-Handed are Off-Hand, Two-Handed are Versatile)
Speed: 6 Squares
Vision: Low-Light Vision

Languages: Common
Skill Bonuses: +2 Athletics, +2 Acrobatics
Sharp Claws: You are proficient with your claws, each claw is treated as both a light blade and unarmed, deals 1d6 damage and a +3 proficiency bonus.
Smash: You can attack with both of your claws by linking them together and slamming them into your opponent the damage dealt is 2d6 with a +3 proficiency bonus.

Spoiler

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I've been recently getting really into DC's Congorilla and the Gorilla City in general, this isn't meant to represent them exactly (that would include a bonus to Intelligence) but I have the urge to play a Gorilla (Awakened) and this is what I ended up making.

I just want it P.E.A.C.H.-y
Thanks in Advance.

[vasharanpaladin]

Broken. Large size is completely infeasible for a PC race, nevermind that you've gotten the weapon rules for it wrong. No race gets natural weapons, ever. This one even lacks a racial power (dwarfs have their second wind ability, so that's no excuse). The only usable things here are the ability bonuses (though races get one fixed and a choice of two now... might I suggest Con with Str or Dex?) and skill bonuses.

Also, I don't think most primates have any more visual acuity than a human?

[Zelkon]

Broken. Large size is completely infeasible for a PC race, nevermind that you've gotten the weapon rules for it wrong. No race gets natural weapons, ever. This one even lacks a racial power (dwarfs have their second wind ability, so that's no excuse). The only usable things here are the ability bonuses (though races get one fixed and a choice of two now... might I suggest Con with Str or Dex?) and skill bonuses.

Also, I don't think most primates have any more visual acuity than a human?

All true, except for the natural weapons part. 4e races can have them, they just don't grant extra attacks. They're alternatives.

[ExemplarofAvg]

Broken. Large size is completely infeasible for a PC race,

Explain?

Nevermind that you've gotten the weapon rules for it wrong. No race gets natural weapons, ever. This one even lacks a racial power (dwarfs have their second wind ability, so that's no excuse).

How did I get the weapon rules wrong? Creatures with natural attacks always have a +3 proficiency with them. I merely added an option that removes their reach for higher damage, I can that the racial power if that makes it better, but I didn't see anywhere where it said that you have to have one.

The only usable things here are the ability bonuses (though races get one fixed and a choice of two now... might I suggest Con with Str or Dex?) and skill bonuses.

You might.

Also, I don't think most primates have any more visual acuity than a human?

Actually most animals see better in low-light environments. Our puny humans eyes need bright lights everywhere we go.

All true, except for the natural weapons part. 4e races can have them, they just don't grant extra attacks. They're alternatives.

And mine does not do that so I'm in the clear? All I did was allow the Gorilla to trade:
+3 1d6 Off-Hand Reach 2
for
+3 2d6 Two-Handed

So unless there's some reason that Large won't work as a PC race, I think this is good for play.

[Zelkon]

Explain?

So unless there's some reason that Large won't work as a PC race, I think this is good for play.

Automatic reach is completely broken, large size increases the value of all busts, better for flanking, and wield d20 weapons. There's more, but I don't remember it. I mean, there are sky blue rated epic destinies that grant the large size. It's really good. And besides, gorrillas are medium by game terms.

[ExemplarofAvg]

Automatic reach is completely broken, large size increases the value of all busts, better for flanking, and wield d20 weapons. There's more, but I don't remember it. I mean, there are sky blue rated epic destinies that grant the large size. It's really good.

Ah, I had it originally medium, but my DM suggested making it large, in 3.5 Large didn't offer the powers. So it didn't grant as many advantages.

And besides, gorrillas are medium by game terms.

See, I was looking for that, but I only have the 1st Monster Manual so I don't have any statistics.

[Zelkon]

Ah, I had it originally medium, but my DM suggested making it large, in 3.5 Large didn't offer the powers. So it didn't grant as many advantages. See, I was looking for that, but I only have the 1st Monster Manual so I don't have any statistics.

Here is a skeleton comparison of humans and gorillas:

Seems pretty medium to me.
EDIT: from Wikipedia
"Adult males are 1.7 to 1.8 m (5.6 to 5.9 ft) tall, with an arm span that stretches from 2.3 to 2.6 m (7.5 to 8.5 ft)."

[ExemplarofAvg]

Here is a skeleton comparison of humans and gorillas:

Seems pretty medium to me.

Haha, well yes. But I'm looking at non-standard gorilla's. The best I have is 3.5's "Ape" entry in the 1st Monster Manual which lists them as large. Heck, even the Dire variant rates large. This is not your average intelligent Gorilla. This is some DC level stuff, where the Gorilla's are smart use weapons and out-size even the full grown heroes.
I don't see that much of an issue with the large size. But if it makes it more balanced I could go to Powerful Build rather than Large.

[Zelkon]

Haha, well yes. But I'm looking at non-standard gorilla's. The best I have is 3.5's "Ape" entry in the 1st Monster Manual which lists them as large. Heck, even the Dire variant rates large. This is not your average intelligent Gorilla. This is some DC level stuff, where the Gorilla's are smart use weapons and out-size even the full grown heroes.
I don't see that much of an issue with the large size. But if it makes it more balanced I could go to Powerful Build rather than Large.

Powerful build is the main reason large is broken, and therefore not suitable for PCs. Every barbarian, fighter, and ranger (hell, all weapon wielders) now have their best choice chosen for them.

[vasharanpaladin]

All true, except for the natural weapons part. 4e races can have them, they just don't grant extra attacks. They're alternatives.

Only race that gets natural weapons is the gnoll, which has to spend a feat for them. Minotaurs don't get them at all.

[Zelkon]

Only race that gets natural weapons is the gnoll, which has to spend a feat for them. Minotaurs don't get them at all.

Cool. It's not like they're overpowered, except, wait, slam. Slam is quite good (2d6, +3 prof is better then most all superior weapons.

[vasharanpaladin]

Cool. It's not like they're overpowered, except, wait, slam. Slam is quite good (2d6, +3 prof is better then most all superior weapons.

Okay, I was going to pick at this, but then I reread the provided block.

Unfortunately, there's not much I can suggest here, except for starting with a race that already exists and refluffing. Half-orc would be my suggestion for that.

[EugeneVoid]

Really, REALLY bork bork borked in 4e. Especially, because a Gorilla Ranger, would then have the option to dual-wield gouges. Let me repeat that. THEY CAN DUAL-WIELD GOUGES AT LEVEL 1. A +2, 2d6b1, axe-spear.

[brutticusforce]

Really, REALLY bork bork borked in 4e. Especially, because a Gorilla Ranger, would then have the option to dual-wield gouges. Let me repeat that. THEY CAN DUAL-WIELD GOUGES AT LEVEL 1. A +2, 2d6b1, axe-spear.

They dont have to though. Where you paying attention? the claws a +3 2d6 weapon in both main and off. With reach. It would be the biggest light, which means it gets all the insane light blade support (Including Surprising Charge... which is the main reason to go gouge on a charge man).

The claws by themselves break the race. The size by itself breaks the race. Together, they are head and shoulders above all races that are geared towards melee, like Warforged or Half Orc.

I hate to tell you, but in 3.5, large size on a race was worth at least +1 LA by itself, +2 if the race had anything else that didn't make it suck. 4e has almost entirely different design priciples than 3.x.

Try this thread for a little guidence