A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
You can get A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2 now at Gumroad
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 32
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Hello folks. So I am trying to build a PrC that actually makes a Paladin better at being what they are Fluffed out to be. They are supposed to be Divine Warriors. Instead, well they are kinda lame unless your pulling Uber-Mount shenanigans or something similar. So, Here is what I have been working on. Let me know what you think.


    The Blazing Soul

    Requirements:
    Skills: Sense Motive 5 Ranks, Heal 6 ranks, Diplomacy 9 ranks.
    BAB: +6
    Spells: Must be able to cast 2nd level Divine Spells as a Paladin.
    Special: Lay on Hands (Or similar Ability), Divine Grace, Turn Undead, the ability to Speak Celestial

    Table: The Blazing Soul Hit Die: 1d12
    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special|Class Features

    1st|
    +1
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |
    +2
    |Armor of The Faithful, Lay on Hands, Sword of the Archangels|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    2nd|
    +2
    |
    +3
    |
    +0
    |
    +3
    |Blessed Awareness, Wings|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    3rd|
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +1
    |
    +3
    |Strength of the Faithful, Animal Guide|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    4th|
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +1
    |
    +4
    |Mark of the Faithful|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    5th|
    +5
    |
    +4
    |
    +2
    |
    +4
    |Mercurial Casting|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    6th|
    +6
    |
    +5
    |
    +2
    |
    +5
    |Will of the All-Father|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    7th|
    +7
    |
    +5
    |
    +2
    |
    +5
    |Improved Wings, Master of War|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    8th|
    +8
    |
    +6
    |
    +2
    |
    +6
    |Power of the All-Father|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    9th|
    +9
    |
    +6
    |
    +3
    |
    +6
    |Divine Embrace|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    10th|
    +10
    |
    +7
    |
    +3
    |
    +7
    |Ascension|+1 level of existing Paladin spell casting
    [/table]

    Class Skills: 4+Intelligence Modifier per level
    Concentration (Con), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Jump (Str), Knowledge {Arcana} (Int), Knowledge {History} (Int), Knowledge {The Planes} (Int), Knowledge {Religion} (Int), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str)

    Armor of The Faithful: The Blazing Soul, once embraced by the All-Father, discover how to channel the force of their divine persona into a protective aura. This aura grants them an Insight bonus equal to their Charisma Bonus +1 for every 3 levels (Cha+0 at 1st, +1 at 4th, +2 at 7th, and +3 at 10th).

    Sword of the Archangels: Every Blazing Soul requires a weapon. Upon taking their 1st level in this class, they surrender their current weapon of choice (The weapon they have been using most, and has the greatest bonuses) to the Archangel who has come to reward their faith. This weapon need not be a sword, though this is most common. The archangel sunders and reforms this weapon as a symbol of the rebirth the Blazing Soul is about to undergo in accepting levels in this class. Upon being reformed, the weapon becomes a +1 weapon and has an additional Weapon Enchantment equal to +1, such as Flaming for example. At every level the Blazing Soul can spend 1 day fasting and meditating to reforge his weapon. In doing so the weapon is always at least a +1 weapon, but an addition +1 worth of enhancements can be added per level. This allows at 10th level for a weapon that has up to +11 worth of bonuses/enchantments. The Weapon can not possess greater than a +5 to hit an damage, all other +'s must be abilities. The DM is the final arbiter of what the All-Father finds acceptable for his warriors to wield in terms of powers.

    A Blazing Soul may spend gold as normal to improve his Sword of the Archangel, but any bonuses added through normal crafting may not be altered. Further, these increases are considerably expensive as they must build on the pre-existing bonuses of the weapon.

    Animal Guide: The path that a Blazing Soul must walk is fraught with danger. Often they must seek guidance from the All-Father to ensure they are fulfilling their role as his vassal. To do so, at 3rd Level, he provides them an Animal Guide. This creature is treated as a Wizard's Familiar, who's characteristics are based on the Blazing Soul's Total ECL. In addition to the standard familiar benefits, the Animal Guide can supply the Blazing Soul with an additional boon based on their type. All aspects of these boons are considered to be Extraordinary Abilities. This creature replaces any Animal Companion, Familiar of Special Mount you may have. Further, if you would gain one of these class features later you lose access to your Animal Guide.

    Raven: The Raven is all seeing. They are the eyes of the All-Father. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Raven can take aloft, soaring through the sky for 10 rounds. During this time the Raven's sight is transmitted to his master. Anything the Raven can see, his master is aware of. While in this state the Raven become completely unseen. No manner of detection will reveal it. Further, no magical or mundane means of purposely obscuring one's self will work on the Raven. For example, a party of Halfling Rogues is hiding in the bushes ahead. The Raven need not make a check to see them, it simply is aware of their presence. However, an old woman is cooking dinner in the small hut just off the path, as she is not attempting to obfuscate herself, her innocence allows her not to be spied upon. To ensure service the Raven must be paid at least 1 shiny coin per day. If at any time the payment is not met the Raven will leave.

    Cat: The Cat is stealth incarnate. They are the stalkers of the All-Father. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Cat can lend its stealth to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul is treated as if under the effects of Improved Invisibility. In addition, they grant the Blazing Soul a +20 to all Hide and Move Silently checks. However, the Cat is fickle. It must be given a token of some sort every day, or else it will use this stealth to sneak away from the Blazing Soul. This could be a live mouse, a nice plump beetle, a little round bell, or even just a small ball of string. But the Blazing Soul must present this award joyfully to the Cat at the same time of the day in which they prepare their spells. If they are a spontaneous caster, they must do so at sunset each night.

    Stag: The Stag is balance in battle. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Mantis can lend its stability to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul Automatically succeeds on any balance checks. In addition it grants a bonus equal to the Blazing Soul's level to all checks to prevent being tripped, bullrushed, grappled. overrun, or disarmed. It provides half of this bonus to all attempts in which you are the aggressor. For example, Thesa is fighting a Gnoll that attempts to disarm him of his sword. He adds his Blazing Soul Level to the check to resist the disarm. Later, Thesa is fighting an Orc wielding a powerful magical blade, he attempts to disarm the Orc and as the one initiating the Disarm, he adds half his BS level. The Stag is a beast of purity and longing. It represents the need of the Blazing Soul to purify evil from this world, and his unending hunt to do so. As such the Stag requires that a Blazing Soul that embraces it never knowingly imbibe any substance that would harm them in mind, body or soul. This includes alcohols, drugs, and other such items. Should they do so, the Stag will leave them until they have atoned for their actions or summoned a new Guide.

    Hound: The hound is the hunter of the All-Father. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Hound can lend its hunting skills to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul can track any quarry unerringly. This can be done at full speed, even at a run. The Hound enables the Blazing Soul to track and find those that have acted against the will of the All-Father. Any creature so tracked essentially gives off a beacon that only the Blazing Soul and Angelic creatures are able to sense. The Hound seeks affection. For 10 minutes per day the Blazing Soul must scratch, pet, play with or otherwise demonstrate his affection for his Hound. If the Hound feels ignored, he will leave.

    Ram: Ram is hardy and stubborn. He is a reminder of the tenacity of spirit that the All-Father expects of his followers. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Ram can lend its tenacity and hardy nature to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul become completely immune to an negative effects related to any thing that he might ingest. Further he is unable to be weakened, fatigued or exhausted. In addition during this time he receives 2 temporary Hit points per level, these hit points are removed first, and once gone remain as such until this power is invoked again. The Ram demands dominance. Whenever the BS has established a home it must establish a space of equal space for the Ram. When traveling, the Ram expects to be treated as an equal to the Blazing Soul, requiring that either the BS sleep in the stables and fields with the Ram, or the Ram is given the same accommodations as his Master, whom he considers "partner".

    Horse: The Horse represents fertility, nature's power, rebirth and growth. As such, those that call upon the Horses of the All-Father are able to invoke this by gaining the following Spell-Like Abilities. They may use these abilities a total number of times per day equal to their Charisma modifier. The spells are: Plant Growth (Druid 3, PHB 262), Nature's Rampart (Druid 3 SplComp 146), Last Breath (Druid 4 SplComp 130), Primal Form (Wiz/Sorc 3, SplComp 161) Any DC is based on your Charisma Modifier, and your caster level is equal to your Blazing Soul Level + Your Charisma Modifier. Horses demand care and respect for the natural world. You must not cause unneeded harm to the world around you, and must feed and provide brushing and attention to the Horse for 10 minutes per day.

    Rabbit: The Rabbit is a creature of quickness, in mind and body. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Rabbit can lend its quickness to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul doubles their speed for all manner of movements that it is capable of using. In addition, they are able to use Bluff to feint in combat as a swift action. Rabbits require that they be pampered and fed well. They demand a safe, warm place to sleep, and abundant food. If this is not provided they will not grant their boon.

    Serpent: Many cultures think of the Serpent as a corrupter, a creature of evil, however, the All-Father recognizes that the Serpent is part of the natural order, and that through it's wit it culls the herd. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Serpent can lend its wits to its master, allowing the Blazing Soul to cast Charm Monster (CL= BS level + Charisma, DC based on Charism). Serpents require warmth and live food. As such they can be difficult for a Blazing Soul to keep.

    The Bull: The Bull is a symbol of rage and great power. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Bull can lend its rage and power to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul may enter a rage that is identical to the rage of a Barbarian. This ability increases as the Blazing Soul gains levels. At BS Level 5, the Bull grants Greater Rage, and at BS Level 10 the Bull grants Mighty Rage. The Bull requires access to breeding stock for 1 continuous week every year.

    The Eagle: Creatures of Wisdom and Light, the Eagle is a power creature. These raptors are often called by war-focused Blazing Souls. 3+Cha Modifier times per day the Eagle can lend its wisdom and power to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul enters a trance during which, they may increase their maneuverability by one class. In addition the Blazing Soul is granted a sacred bonus to their Wisdom Score equal to half their Blazing Soul Level, and may cast Lightning Bolt (Sorc/Wiz 3, PHB 248) as a Supernatural Ability while in their trance, the caster level is equal to their BS Level + Charisma Modifier and the DC is based on Charisma. Equals require freedom and space. While they will tolerate the need to delve into a dungeon in service of the All-Father, they expect that otherwise they will be allowed to come and go as they please when not engaged in their duties.

    The Boar: The Boar is a creature of Courage and Fierceness. Those that call on The Boar are expected to have similar characteristics. 3+Cha Modifier times per day The Boar can lend its Courage and Ferocity to its master. For 10 rounds the Blazing Soul soul becomes immune to mind-effecting spells, powers, and supernatural abilities, though they are still vulnerable to more mundane methods such as Bluff. In addition they will continue fighting without penalty until they have reached -10 Hit Points. Even at this point they do not die. Instead they must make a Fortitude save each round equal to the 10 plus the amount of damage below 0 they have suffered. As long as they make the save they may continue to act without penalty If at the end of the duration of this ability they are still at or below -10 they die immediately. The Boar requires that once per month it be allowed to feast. During this feast the Boar must be fed fine foods until it is full, after which, any left overs must be given to the poor as a tithe.

    If your Animal Guide is destroyed you immediately take 1d4 damage per level of Blazing Soul. You may petition the All-Father to send you a new guide, but doing so takes time and preparation. You must create an alter (Craft Check carpentry or other appropriate, DC 10, which may be made untrained, followed by a Knowledge: Religion DC 15) and find a normal member of the animal species you wish to call. You fast and pray pray for 1 day per level of Blazing Soul, after which the animal that has been placed at the alter is transformed into your new guide. The materials needed for this ritual cost 1000gp.

    Regardless of the creature chosen they benefit from the Wings and Improved Wings class feature of the Blazing Soul so long as they are within 30 feet of the Blazing Soul. If at anytime they are further away the effect dissipates, if they are in the are, the descend as if under the effects of Feather Fall. You can willingly change your guide without them suffering death, however to do so requires the same steps as above. Those that do this often may draw the ire of The All-Father for their fickle and chaotic actions.

    Blessed Awareness: Your divine connect to the All-Father connects you to the world around you one an innate level. You sense the ebb and flow of primal basis of the world all around you. You may add your Charisma bonus to Initiative Checks.

    Lay on Hands: A Blazing Soul must learn not only to wage war on the enemies of the Faith, but also to heal those subjected to the wretchedness of their enemies. A Blazing Soul may use Lay on Hands as a Paladin whose level is equal to their Blazing Soul class level. If the Blazing Soul already has Lay on Hands or a similar ability, instead their levels in Blazing Soul stack with the levels of whatever class granted the ability.

    Wings: Like a Celestial creature, a Blazing Soul grows a pair of powerful feathered wings. These wings allow a Blazing Soul the ability to fly at twice base speed, with a maneuverability class of Average.

    Strength of the Faithful: A Blazing Soul must be strong in the face of great evil. Their connection to the All-Father empowers them with a great sense of purpose and this takes on an outward manifestation, granting them an aura of strength and power. A Blazing Soul may add their Charisma bonus to all Strength based checks, including damage.

    Mark of the Faithful: A Blazing Soul has many roles. Warrior, Healer, Protector. A Blazing Soul gains the ability to imbue target with a small portion of the Divine, which infuses his soul. As a standard action, by touching the target, with a touch attack if they are unwilling, he can spend Turn Undead Attempt to channel positive energy into the target. If the target is willing this heals 2d4 points of ability damage or drain and removes any status effects that may be negatively impacting the target. If used offensively, it instead renders the target nauseated for 1d4 rounds. In either case the target is branded with a glowing sigil of the All-Father. This deals 1d4 points of damage. This damage is dealt through the Divine power of the All-Father, and as such cannot be prevented in any way, and heals at the rate of 1 point per day.

    Mercurial Casting: The Soul and Mind of the Blazing Soul is fluid like quicksilver, and equally deadly. By spending a Turn Undead Attempt, a Blazing Soul may cast any spell on the spell list of their previous spellcasting class as an Immediate Action. In channeling this energy however, their imperfect body is strained by the divine surge. The Blazing Soul suffers 1 point of Ability damage to their choice of physical ability as the surge overwhelms them. This damage will heal only with time unless the magic used to heal it is done in a church dedicated to the All-Father.

    Will of The All-Father: The force of a Blazing Soul's intensity is such, that by spending a Turn Attempt, they become immune to any effect that would require a Will save for 1 round. This is an Immediate Action.

    Improved Wings: A Blazing Soul has improved his ability to fly. He has honed his skills in the air to be nearly on par with his skills on the ground. At this level a Blazing Soul gains Good Maneuverability, as well as an increase to his speed. He now has a fly speed of twice his base land speed.

    Master of War: As the name may suggest, a Blazing Soul is the embodiment of the All-Father's martial might. Once per encounter he may engage in a war-trance. In this state his Strength and Constitution bonus are doubled, he gains the Weapon Focus and Specialization line of feats up to and including Weapon Supremacy. This trance requires a Full Round Action to initiate, during which he can do nothing else. Any attacks made against him while entering the trance are made against his flat-footed AC. The Trance lasts for a number of rounds equal to 3+Charisma bonus, after which he is nauseated for 1 hour as the Divine energy drains from his Soul.

    Power of the All-Father: The Blazing Soul has learned to embrace the power of creation and life that the All-Father protects. He may cast any spell from the Healing, Creation, Renewal, Celestia, Elysium, or Purification Domains as a Spell-like Ability 1/day. He need not be able to cast spells of that level, however he must have a Charisma score of 10+ the Spell level. The Save DC's of the spells are 10+the Spell Level+the Blazing Sword's Charisma Modifier. He may cast only 1 spell in this way each day. This spell does not require memorization and is cast spontaneously.

    Divine Embrace: The Blazing Soul has further embraced and mastered the teachings of the All-Father. At this level he gains the ability to choose a single Domain from the following: Healing, Creation, Renewal, Celestia, Elysium, or Purification. The Blazing Soul benefits from the Granted Power of the chosen Domain. He gains the ability to cast 1 spell from each level of the Domain just as a Cleric would. This is limited to the level of spells he is normally able to cast.

    Ascension: Upon reaching 10th level, a Blazing Sword is granted the Saint template by the All-Father, regardless of whether they would normally be eligible for said template. They do not incur any Level Adjustment upon gaining this template.
    Last edited by lunaramblings; 2013-01-23 at 01:00 AM. Reason: Altering abilities based on suggestions. Also changed the name of the class.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    nonsi's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2010

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Paladin 2/Cleric 4/BS 10 . . .

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    Paladin 2/Cleric 4/BS 10 . . .
    And?

    Any suggestions to alterations or changes or anything else?

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Yes
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    He's saying the class is overpowered.

    Which it is, I suggest removing some of those caster levels, first level and every four levels after (level 5, level 9). And that's off to a nice start. The thing about melee casters, or combat casters, is that in turn for doing better with combat, you lose some spell casting ability (or become more specialized/less versatile in other areas of spell casting). The way you have it set up now is that there's no trade off, you're basically getting stuff for free on top of all the other goodies spell casters get.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Hi Sacrieur

    Thanks. I get that. To be honest I did the whole thing in one go off the top of my head, so I am sure that it is going to need some tinkering. I am going to go in now and edit the caster level progression. So your thinking that 1, 5, 9 would be good?

    Any feed back on the rest of the class? Will three dropped levels be sufficient? Thanks for the feedback! Keep it coming!

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    Paladin 2/Cleric 4/BS 10 . . .
    Not a legal build. Has a BAB of only 5. Could Certainly go with a Paladin 2/Cleric 6/BS10.

    That would, before I had changed it to losing CLs, be casting 8th level Cleric Spells and have a BAB of 17 at 18th level. Admittedly that looks powerful. However, compared to a DMM(Persist) build, it doesn't seem so much over powered, though I guess you could do the Persist with the BS.

    Anyway, just wanted to point out Pal2/Clr4 did not work as an entry into BS. I also added a requirement to cast 2nd level Divine Spells to entry the class now too, made sense with the gaining of caster levels. At one point I was going to use a unique list and separate progression, but seemed like it would be kinda lame.

    Though would it be better balanced if I did give it it's own progression and list?

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Instead of stripping caster levels, which hurts players coming in from straight paladin just as much as it does those coming in from a combination of cleric/paladin, how about making the class advance only paladin casting? Another idea is to require the ability to summon a special mount (only accessible through 5 levels of paladin) or the ability to cast 2nd level paladin-only divine spells (none come to mind right off the bat, but I'm sure you can find some, or even just make one up that goes thematically with the prestige class?

    You can accompany this with a note of the balance concerns that using this prestige class with the prestige paladin (from Unearthed Arcana) brings up (ie, suggest reducing the amount of casting granted by the class if using this variant).

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Aug 2010

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Hey, this reminds me of one of my earlier projects! (Mind you, this is done better - I do like the idea of paladins being more martial, while my idea pretty much made them Good Combat Ur-Priests who got Archon abilities... To be fair it was never made to be balanced. >.>; ).

    Anyway, some advice. Evasion doesn't seem to work well. Paladins, quintessentially, wear heavy armor, and even the image for the class is doing such. Evasion like the monk ability, only works when the character is wielding light armor. My suggestion is to either clarify that the class is meant to be lightly armored (using their Armor of Faith ability to pick up the slack), or give it a similar ability with a different name that works while in Heavy Armor.

    Also a recommendation to make sure that the class takes more levels of Paladin is to have the stipulation, "Must be able to cast Lesser Restoration as a 1st level divine spell." To my knowledge, only Paladins gain L. Restoration at that level, and it ensures at least 4 levels of Paladin to qualify for the class.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Israel

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Suggestion: if the player raps his words of justice, the effects double.
    Avatar by me auld friend and DM CoffeeIncluded
    Shqipper supreme. Purple Watchmaker of Light. Master class Thinkamancer. Infected with Rash Plague. 21st century's Charlmagne.
    Erudite Dudebro. King in Yellow. Level 20 Omnistalt everything. Prince of Void. 'The Fox'. Perched upon the very crucifex of Oblivion.
    Anxioused Aghast. Multipurpose Master at arms. Not a Vampire. Disaster Master: Shademaster. 10/10 on Auto. Punchbeef. Here comes a beautiful boy.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Deepbluediver's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    The US of A

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    When I first saw this thread and read the intro, I thought it was supposed to replace the paladin, but I guess it's really supposed to just enhance them.


    Some of the abilities, like Sword of the Archangels, seem very unique and interesting. Here are my thoughts/comments on a few of the others.

    For the spells, it should probably be listed as "+1 level of existing Divine spell casting". I'm not exactly sure how someone would use this in conjunction with an arcane caster, but I'm certain some one will find a way and it will be terrible. (terrible for balance, that is)

    Animal Companion- if you lose your animal companion, is there any way to get it back? If you want to change the companion, can you do so? Maybe "Ram" would sound more majestic than "Goat".

    It seems odd that this class get's both Uncanny Dodge and Evasion; normally the heavy-melee classes get things like Damage Reduction instead, to soak damage instead of avoiding it.
    Also, the monk's "Evasion" abilities only work in light or no armor, was that intentional?

    What about letting the Wings ability add a fly-speed to your mount (if you have one) instead? It doesn't have to be a paladin's special mount either, though some of the odder paladin-mounts I've heard of being used would only get more awesome with giant feathery wings.

    I've always found it odd, fluffwise, that a paladin (or similar class) can add Charisma to saves or other physically-related checks, such as damage (Strength of the Faithful). Unless it was called out as being divinely empowered, I just have trouble wrapping my brain around how this works.

    For Mercurial Casting, I appreciate the intent of the cost for the ability, but I think it loses some of the weight when the BS can probably heal themselves up right after the battle with another spell. (IMO, burning the extra resources doesn't seem to balance the immediate action, particularly if its used to cast more than one spell in a round)
    Maybe add in a line about how the ability damage has to heal naturally.

    I'm wary of Master of War's ability to let you add double your strength score, then double again if you are using a 2-handed weapon, then adding double your charisma, then piling Weapon Specialization on top of that. It's an awful lot of damage, even before you get into extreme op-fu.
    Also, how long does the nausea last?

    Power of the All Father: Is this supposed to be interpreted as only 1 SLA per day, 1 spell from each domain per day, or every spell once per day? This is the sort of ambiguity hours-long RAI arguments get started over.

    Sorry to be nit picky, but for Ascension, I think the proper grammar would be "They do not incur any Level Adjustment upon gaining this template."
    Last edited by Deepbluediver; 2013-01-07 at 05:03 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    It's not called common because the sense is common, it's called common because it's about common things.
    Homebrew Extended Signature!

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Yes
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Armor of The Faithful It meshes well with the class and adds some serious AC oomph. Also a reason to have Cha.

    Sword of the Archangels This is also a fun little perk. Although it's usefulness depends if the DM likes throwing holy avengers at paladins or not.

    Animal Guide Use this to replace the Paladin's mount. It adds some much needed variety to the class.

    Lay on Hands LoH is itself a pretty worthless ability, but it's nice to see it advance as well as casting.

    Uncanny Dodge Doesn't mesh with the class very well. Paladins tend to be pretty heavily armored. And you have your AC bonus from first level. Uncanny Dodge is a bonus to give fighter characters who don't wear as much armor a way to keep up to those that do. Best keep this for monks and barbarians.

    Wings Permanent wings? Good maneuverability? You've got my attention. One of the best if not the best class feature.

    Improved Uncanny Dodge Ehhh. Remember the thing about monks and barbarians getting that fun evasion stuff? It doesn't fit with the class.

    Strength of the Faithful This adds some terrific synergy, but only because it's terrifically strong. But I suppose it works with the class.

    Mercurial Casting A very strong and unique feature for paladins. It fits with the class and says, "Hey I didn't forget you could cast spells!" The ability damage is meh, since it is a paladin.

    Will of The All-Father Paladins already get a bonus Cha to their will save, if I'm not mistaken. This adds some variety, but pure immunity? I'm not sure this fits well with the class.

    Improved Wings While having wings is a huge advantage, this may tip it over the edge and make it a tad overpowered.

    Master of War Might make some things far too easy, especially with those wings you could just fly away, activate, then fly into battle and kill everyone.

    Power of the All-Father Pretty powerful casting ability for a martial class. With just a 19 Cha wham, you get access to level 9 cleric spells.

    Improved Evasion The class really, really doesn't need this. The paladin has armor and a bunch of other huge bonuses to AC and maneuverability.

    Words of Power and Justice What are you, a wizard? Ha, 10d6 sounds all well and dandy, but it averages out to around 30 points of damage. You're better off just running up and swinging your sword a bunch of times. Too weak and doesn't line up with the class.

    Ascension As if the character needs any more bonuses. Fast healing, immunity, DR... This is what you'd expect from a base class cap ability, not a PrC
    Last edited by Sacrieur; 2013-01-07 at 05:48 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Made several changes as recommended. Also changed the name of the class. Blazing Soul sounds better than Blazing Sword. Blazing Sword sounds more like a Martial strike or Martial discipline.

    Sacrieur: I embraced most of the changes you suggested. I kept the capstone ability. The capstone was inspired by the capstone from Walker in the Wastes, from Sandstorm, which turns you into a lich. Also Dragon Disciple I believe it is makes you a half dragon? It isn't unheard of for a Prestige Class to apply a template. I did have some issues with deciding what template. I was tossing it back and forth with Saint, Celestial Creature, Half-Celestial, and Sanctified. Is there a template you would suggest in place of the Saint template? I thought the flavor fit well.

    Also, you gain the template, as the class is currently written at 10th level of the Blazing Soul class. This is a minimum of ECL 18. As cool as those benefits from the Saint Template are, at that level, on a Paladin, at best I think it might bring the Paladin up a tier, but still not competing with Wizards, Druids, Clerics or Archivists. Or hell, really any full caster.

    The other thing I am struggling with is creating a class skill list. I could just basically copy/paste the Paladin list I guess.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    So I altered the Guide to reflect how to obtain a new one, the penalty for losing one, and changed Goat to Ram. Would like to come up with a couple more options, but not sure what else would be appropriate, flavor-wise and mechanically. I also gave the guides the ability to fly if you have Wings since it seemed like you shouldn't want to leave them behind, and it didn't make a ton of sense to do so. Should I create some more advanced options? Similar to the improved familiars or animal companions?

    I removed Uncanny Dodge and Evasion. I replaced Uncanny Dodge with an Initiative boost, both serve to help prevent you from getting caught with your pants down. Evasion is just gone.

    I heavily altered Master of War, replaced Words of Power and Justice with an ability to gain full use of a single domain from the same list used in Power of the All-Father, which I clarified. Also tweaked Wings and Improved Wings to be base speed/average and 2xbase speed/good. Mercurial casting now has to be healed with time or in a temple dedicated to the All-Father. Added fluff to Strength of the Faithful to better explain why you get Cha to Str.

    So, anything else? I think this is now pretty well balanced. I would love to hear more thoughts.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Yes
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    That's much, much better. Doesn't feel nearly as overpowered now.

    Though there is the two good saves that are still bothering me. I just don't know if the will save fits with the class. It's not like paladins with high Cha modifiers are going to have trouble with this, they do get their Cha to their saves.
    [PF] HP Calculator - Fractional HP, now without math!
    [PF] Initiator NPC Templates - Quickly applied maneuvers for DMs.
    [PF] Initiator Balance Rule - A lightweight fix to balance casting and martial classes.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by Sacrieur View Post
    That's much, much better. Doesn't feel nearly as overpowered now.

    Though there is the two good saves that are still bothering me. I just don't know if the will save fits with the class. It's not like paladins with high Cha modifiers are going to have trouble with this, they do get their Cha to their saves.
    Well, I looked at it as kinda the same reason Bards, Rangers, Clerics, Druids, Arcane Archers, Arcane Tricksters, Dragon Disciples, Dwarven Defenders, and Heirophants, just out of the SRD all do. I still don't understand why Rangers and Bards get 2 good and a Paladin doesn't. And your right, it is unlikely to make a huge different what with Divine Grace and all, but to me, if the class is ultimately about becoming a Divine being, then it makes sense that you would have good saves.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Yes
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Well, if you have a good will save the player may just try to brute force everything, but without it they may think through things a bit more and use some of those spells given to him every level.
    [PF] HP Calculator - Fractional HP, now without math!
    [PF] Initiator NPC Templates - Quickly applied maneuvers for DMs.
    [PF] Initiator Balance Rule - A lightweight fix to balance casting and martial classes.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by Sacrieur View Post
    Well, if you have a good will save the player may just try to brute force everything, but without it they may think through things a bit more and use some of those spells given to him every level.
    All they get is continuation of paladin casting until rather late in where they get an SLA and then later a domain. I have someone playtesting it currently. If we find that the second good save is too much we can swap it.

    Does anyone else feel the saves are too much? Also, if I were to change it, I am thinking I would drop the Fort and keep Will as the High Save. But again, I just don't think a difference of +4 to Fort saves is going to unbalance things, when so many similar classes get the same type of progression.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Deepbluediver's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    The US of A

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by lunaramblings View Post
    Does anyone else feel the saves are too much?
    The general format for these things is that "pure" classes get 1 good save: warriors- Fort, sneaky/rogue- Reflex, casters- Will.
    Hybrid classes like the cleric and ranger get 2

    Since this class is basically PrC-Pally, 2 good saves (will and fort) does not seem that unusual to me.


    I've also been thinking about the animal companions again.
    This class has a very "norse" flavor to it, which I suspect is intentional. Ravens, goats, and dogs (or wolves) all show up in norse mythology plenty. Cats don't very much, but they are a fairly common animal wordwide. The Mantis, however, seems much more like an eastern styled-creature. Personally, I don't really mind, since the animals and the name of the abilities can be refluffed fairly easily.
    But if you where looking for either a creature to replace the mantis, or just another creature to add as a companion both horses and stags would be good candidates to fit the flavor of the class as given.
    Last edited by Deepbluediver; 2013-01-11 at 10:50 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    It's not called common because the sense is common, it's called common because it's about common things.
    Homebrew Extended Signature!

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by Deepbluediver View Post
    The general format for these things is that "pure" classes get 1 good save: warriors- Fort, sneaky/rogue- Reflex, casters- Will.
    Hybrid classes like the cleric and ranger get 2

    Since this class is basically PrC-Pally, 2 good will saves does not seem that unusual to me.


    I've also been thinking about the animal companions again.
    This class has a very "norse" flavor to it, which I suspect is intentional. Ravens, goats, and dogs (or wolves) all show up in norse mythology plenty. Cats don't very much, but they are a fairly common animal wordwide. The Mantis, however, seems much more like an eastern styled-creature. Personally, I don't really mind, since the animals and the name of the abilities can be refluffed fairly easily.
    But if you where looking for either a creature to replace the mantis, or just another creature to add as a companion both horses and stags would be good candidates to fit the flavor of the class as given.
    That was what I thought about saves.

    As for the Norse flavor, yes very much intentional.

    I would love to hear more ideas about animals. I added cat as I couldn't find an animal that matched the idea of a stealthy ambush predator like a cat. Mantis I will admit I added as a nod to a couple of my players who are big on anime, as well as Asian movies cultures and the like.

    I think I may rewrite Mantis as Stag since the bonus still works in flavor, just need a new ban.

    Will work on some other animals later this weekend. Maybe I should look at creating tiers like other such creatures have?

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Cats are totally Norse - just look up Norweigian Forest Cats. Other appropriate animal guides would be deer, wolves, horses, roosters, squirrels, and goats. Oh, and bears. Definitely bears.

    As to creating tiers of animals, I'm not sure - it would depend on how many you can create with the same balance point. If it becomes difficult, or you have to give up too much, then creating tiers might be a good idea. Making some of the animals dire or having dire template abilities to add in return for a lower effective level (sorta like how the Druid's animal companion works) could facilitate this.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by Deepbluediver View Post
    The general format for these things is that "pure" classes get 1 good save: warriors- Fort, sneaky/rogue- Reflex, casters- Will.
    Hybrid classes like the cleric and ranger get 2

    Since this class is basically PrC-Pally, 2 good will saves does not seem that unusual to me.


    I've also been thinking about the animal companions again.
    This class has a very "norse" flavor to it, which I suspect is intentional. Ravens, goats, and dogs (or wolves) all show up in norse mythology plenty. Cats don't very much, but they are a fairly common animal wordwide. The Mantis, however, seems much more like an eastern styled-creature. Personally, I don't really mind, since the animals and the name of the abilities can be refluffed fairly easily.
    But if you where looking for either a creature to replace the mantis, or just another creature to add as a companion both horses and stags would be good candidates to fit the flavor of the class as given.
    Quote Originally Posted by dawnsolara View Post
    Cats are totally Norse - just look up Norweigian Forest Cats. Other appropriate animal guides would be deer, wolves, horses, roosters, squirrels, and goats. Oh, and bears. Definitely bears.

    As to creating tiers of animals, I'm not sure - it would depend on how many you can create with the same balance point. If it becomes difficult, or you have to give up too much, then creating tiers might be a good idea. Making some of the animals dire or having dire template abilities to add in return for a lower effective level (sorta like how the Druid's animal companion works) could facilitate this.
    I will look into the forest cats.

    The druid tiers is kinda what I had in mind. I will work on it more tonight.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    I added several new animals. Would really love some feedback. Also in addition to feedback on the abilities granted, which I think I am going to go through and refer to as Boons, I need some help on the downsides or bans of each animal. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Bump! More PEACHING Please!

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    On first glance, the animals all seem about equal in power - rather situational, but when they are important, they're really good. And like everything else in D&D, their use goes up with creative playing.

    I'm afraid I'm not good for much else - classes are starting tomorrow and this is going to be my busiest semester yet. I'll be lucky to stay sane through it. But if I get the chance, I intend to playtest this class, and I'll let you know how it works if I do.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Titan in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2013

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Small thing: I'd like to see Intimidate added to the class skill list here. I know it's not on the basic Paladin list either... but really I'd think someone who is bringing forth a flaming angelic sword of smiting, shining with an aura of pure good, and all is "JUSTICE TIME FIENDS!" should be able to be intimidating. It just makes sense to me really. And you'd think a Paladin should be able to push neutral/evil doers around with their holy status via Intimidation and so as well.

    Just always stuck out as odd that it was missing.
    Currently sick as a dog and unable to focus properly. Will heal soon.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Deepbluediver's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    The US of A

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by ArcturusV View Post
    Small thing: I'd like to see Intimidate added to the class skill list here. I know it's not on the basic Paladin list either... but really I'd think someone who is bringing forth a flaming angelic sword of smiting, shining with an aura of pure good, and all is "JUSTICE TIME FIENDS!" should be able to be intimidating. It just makes sense to me really. And you'd think a Paladin should be able to push neutral/evil doers around with their holy status via Intimidation and so as well.

    Just always stuck out as odd that it was missing.
    Oh no no, being an intimdating bully is bad and according to the WotC book of Ultimate Evil that lays exactly what is and isn't good according to vaguely judeo-christian beliefs, paladins can't be like that.

    Ok, but in all seriousness, you bring up a good point. My counter argument would be that there is a difference between just being intimdating and making an Intimdate check. Also, I've always thought of class skills as things that every member of your class relies or, or that you pratice them simply as part of your every day routine. Paladins don't really seem the type to run around scaring shop keepers and force people to fear them (bad RP not withstanding), but I don't think I'd really object to see it added to this PrC.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    It's not called common because the sense is common, it's called common because it's about common things.
    Homebrew Extended Signature!

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Blargh . . . I can't believe I didn't notice/remember to ask about you only continuing Lay on Hands progression. Smite Evil (or just plain Smite, depending on what fix or whatever you're using) is a signature Paladin ability, as is the mount and turn undead (less so, but still cool). Do you want your prestige class to progress them? It would make sense (to me) and not terribly unbalance the class to have it advance or stack for one or two of them (in my opinion).

    Just something to consider, if it works with the flavor of the class.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by dawnsolara View Post
    Blargh . . . I can't believe I didn't notice/remember to ask about you only continuing Lay on Hands progression. Smite Evil (or just plain Smite, depending on what fix or whatever you're using) is a signature Paladin ability, as is the mount and turn undead (less so, but still cool). Do you want your prestige class to progress them? It would make sense (to me) and not terribly unbalance the class to have it advance or stack for one or two of them (in my opinion).

    Just something to consider, if it works with the flavor of the class.
    The Special Mount is taken over and replaced with the Animal Guide. Less physical for the most part, but I think more flavorful, and if you really want you could take Horse and ride it. Plus they are there all day.

    I suppose I could add Smite in. Wouldn't really unbalance things I reckon. But at what level(s) should I add it?

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Quote Originally Posted by lunaramblings View Post
    The Special Mount is taken over and replaced with the Animal Guide. Less physical for the most part, but I think more flavorful, and if you really want you could take Horse and ride it. Plus they are there all day.

    I suppose I could add Smite in. Wouldn't really unbalance things I reckon. But at what level(s) should I add it?
    Maybe 1, 5, and 10; 2, 5, and 8; or 2, 6, and 10; etc. 3 increases over the class should be enough since paladin only advances it every 5 levels, so just put them where it looks pretty that makes sense (that's what I do, anyway . . . yeah, a real rigorous standard).

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Paladin-esque PrC: PEACH

    Thinking 5 and 8 since 1 and 2 are already pretty potent levels, I don't want to put everything early and front load the class. Plus I think losing a little bit of Smite progression for all the other benefits is fitting. Also they get a their Cha to Attack and Damage with Strength of the Faithful at level 3. This may not add as much damage, but it does add a decent amount and is all the time. Maybe I shouldn't add the smite after all?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •