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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

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    Here's my attempt to make a template that boosts intelligence without having it be broken beyond the fact that wizards and other high tier casters will strongly consider taking it. I would like to credit Vorpal Tribble for inspiring me to make this. Now down to business.
    EDIT: Morph Bark inspired me to make this much more logical and reasonable.


    Walking Library

    Sometimes a wizard needs a specific book frequently, but is far to lazy to carry it. When they also need somebody to carry them around due to that same laziness, a Walking Library is their solution. Sometimes constructs with free will have the same procedure performed on themselves to improve their cognizant functionality.

    Creating a Walking Library
    Walking Library is an acquired template that can be applied to any corporeal construct, although the template differs slightly for living constructs.

    Size and Type
    Maintains Construct type, gains no subtypes. Size is constant.

    Special Qualities
    Knowledge Bank (Ex): A Walking Library possess a large number of informative books inside of it. This books allow the Walking Library to make any knowledge check untrained as well as the knowledge skill bonuses described below.

    Book Retrieval (Su): A Walking Library may at any time as a free action return any number of it's lent books to their appropriate place on it's bookshelf. This ability functions across planes and over any distance.

    Book Repair (Ex) : When a Walking Library's bookshelf panel is closed and locked, the books contained within are automatically repaired to perfect condition within 1d4 days, using the information stored in the Walking Library's mind.

    Attributes
    If the Walking Library is a standard construct, adjust as follows: -2 Str, -2 Dex, Int becomes 1.
    If the Walking Library is a sentient but non-living construct, adjust as follows: -2 Str, -2 Dex, +2 Int.
    If the Walking Library is a living construct, adjust as follows: -2 Dex, -2 Con, +2 Int.

    Skills
    All Walking Libraries receive a +2 racial bonus to all knowledge checks. They may also make use of the masterwork knowledge books inside of them to further increase this.

    Challenge Rating
    +1 CR for gaining sentience, +0 CR otherwise

    Level Adjustment
    +0 LA For previously playable constructs.

    Becoming a Walking Library
    Creating or becoming a Walking Library is a relatively simple process. First one must pay a skilled artisan to carve a bookshelf and panel out of your or your constructs torso, this costs 50 GP or a skilled artisan at hand (You may do it yourself if you wish, DC 20). Next, you acquire a set of masterwork encyclopedias for each of the 11 knowledge skills (10 if you don't count psionics). These cost 450 GP (400 GP sans psionics). Then each book must be keyed to the Walking Library via a casting of arcane mark. Then the bookshelf panel must be enchanted with arcane lock so that only the Walking Library may open it. These spells are henceforth treated as permanent magic items, only becoming suppressed for 1d10 rounds by dispel magic. These spells cost 500 GP from a 3rd party wizard, or may be done by anyone with all the requisite spells. At this point, if intelligence is to be granted instead of gained, the owner of the construct must expend 2,000 GP to give the construct a basic mind.

    Alright, totally remade and hopefully better balanced. Thanks for the idea Morph.
    Last edited by Mithril Leaf; 2013-02-08 at 10:13 AM.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Troll in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    I can't imagine +4 Int, under any but the most extreme circumstances, being worth +0 LA. +2 to spell DCs for wizards and +2 skill points per level is huge and neither Dex nor Con will hurt people using the template properly after the first couple of levels.

    At the most, I might expect something similar to the dragonborn race from Races of the Dragon, replacing most race features with those of the "template" (perhaps a bit expanded) but adding +2 Int, -2 Dex, -2 Con to whatever ability modifiers the original race added.
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    okay RoC, that is enough! the gitp boards can only take so much awsome, you might actually hurt somebody with this one!
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  3. - Top - End - #3
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Realms of Chaos View Post
    I can't imagine +4 Int, under any but the most extreme circumstances, being worth +0 LA. +2 to spell DCs for wizards and +2 skill points per level is huge and neither Dex nor Con will hurt people using the template properly after the first couple of levels.
    This, basically. While it would be great if bonuses and penalties balanced out perfectly, in practice anything more than a +1 or -1 in either direction makes a race or template that doesn't have other penalties (usually in terms of Level Adjustment) into something that appeals greatly to those who have no use for the penalized statistics beyond a certain point, which making it incredibly unappealing for any characters who actually want the penalized statistics.

    For a Wizard, the +4 Intelligence on top of a +Intelligence race just might be worth the loss of a single caster level. If there's no level adjustment, any Walking Library Wizard who makes it to a point where he or she can cast defensive spells instead of relying on Dexterity and Constitution suddenly completely outclasses her non-Library compatriots.

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn_in_Tonic View Post
    For a Wizard, the +4 Intelligence on top of a +Intelligence race just might be worth the loss of a single caster level. If there's no level adjustment, any Walking Library Wizard who makes it to a point where he or she can cast defensive spells instead of relying on Dexterity and Constitution suddenly completely outclasses her non-Library compatriots.
    Except at that point defensive spells don't have saves now do they?

    I'll add some more penalties.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
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    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithril Leaf View Post
    Except at that point defensive spells don't have saves now do they?

    I'll add some more penalties.
    Defensive spells don't have saves. They do, however, allow his weak scores to not matter, while his powerful scores shore up his already potent offense, which typically does allow saves.

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Switching the Con and Dex penalties might be a bit better. -4 CON is a lot worse than -4 dex.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Synovia View Post
    Switching the Con and Dex penalties might be a bit better. -4 CON is a lot worse than -4 dex.
    Alright.

    Incidentally, I made it so it costs all your current special qualities and attacks.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
    My Homebrew Signature such as it is.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithril Leaf View Post
    Incidentally, I made it so it costs all your current special qualities and attacks.
    So you won't take other templates until after you take this one.

    Even at -2 Dex/-4 Con I see no reason why any Wizard wouldn't pick this up then immediately become a Necropolitan to negate the CON loss. With the way XP works the fact that he's a level behind won't matter, his CON penalty won't matter, he benefits from being a Necropolitan because he took it after becoming a Library, and he doesn't gain an LA to penalize him at all.

    It's basically trading Dexterity for Intelligence. A Gray Elf Library Necropolitan is looking at +6 INT, -2 STR, and +0 DEX.

    At -4 DEX/-2 CON he'd get +6 INT, -2 STR, and -2 DEX. In the end: I'd trade STR/DEX for *6* points of INT without ever looking back.
    Last edited by ZeroNumerous; 2013-02-07 at 05:08 PM.

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroNumerous View Post
    So you won't take other templates until after you take this one.

    Even at -2 Dex/-4 Con I see no reason why any Wizard wouldn't pick this up then immediately become a Necropolitan to negate the CON loss. With the way XP works the fact that he's a level behind won't matter, his CON penalty won't matter, he benefits from being a Necropolitan because he took it after becoming a Library, and he doesn't gain an LA to penalize him at all.

    It's basically trading Dexterity for Intelligence. A Gray Elf Library Necropolitan is looking at +6 INT, -2 STR, and +0 DEX.

    At -4 DEX/-2 CON he'd get +6 INT, -2 STR, and -2 DEX. In the end: I'd trade STR/DEX for *6* points of INT without ever looking back.
    Valid point, it autoswitches now.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
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  10. - Top - End - #10
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithril Leaf View Post
    Incidentally, I made it so it costs all your current special qualities and attacks.
    As Zero points out, this doesn't really fix the issues.

    Let's take a step back: what do you want this homebrew to accomplish? Is it a flavor thing, or are you just building a logical template to grant extra Intelligence? What's the main goal?
    Last edited by Djinn_in_Tonic; 2013-02-07 at 05:12 PM.

    Ingredients

    2oz Djinn
    5oz Water
    1 Lime Wedge


    Instructions

    Pour Djinn and tonic water into a glass filled with ice cubes. Stir well. Garnish with lime wedge. Serve.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn_in_Tonic View Post
    As Zero points out, this doesn't really fix the issues.

    Let's take a step back: what do you want this homebrew to accomplish? Is it a flavor thing, or are you just building a logical template to grant extra Intelligence? What's the main goal?
    Extra intelligence in a way that isn't too good to not take. I'd also like it to be logically consistent.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
    My Homebrew Signature such as it is.

  12. - Top - End - #12
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    I am saddened that this isn't an actual library walking. It would probably have been more along the lines of VT's creations, too, especially the Horror & Thriller area.
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  13. - Top - End - #13
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Morph Bark View Post
    I am saddened that this isn't an actual library walking. It would probably have been more along the lines of VT's creations, too, especially the Horror & Thriller area.
    Contruct with weakness to fire and bonus int, might be cool.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
    My Homebrew Signature such as it is.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    Dragonborn works because it gives a bonus to Constitution, which isn't a main stat for any class, except DFA, but it is a secondary for all classes, and so is its Dexterity penalty.

    An LA +0 template that gives a bonus to something a caster class would like, while giving penalties only to things melee classes care about will never be balanced. The reverse is also true; an LA +0 template that gives +4 Str, -4 Cha would be taken by every warrior.

    Therefore, you should balance this with something that casters care about (spell slots... caster level... none of these make sense here though), or give it an LA, as it has the potential to be just straight benefits.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    This was a totally bad idea, I was being tired and dumb. I'm scrapping it and remaking it from the ground up, saving the name.

    EDIT: Actually the abilities make sense too.

    EDIT2: No they really don't.
    Last edited by Mithril Leaf; 2013-02-08 at 09:43 AM.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
    My Homebrew Signature such as it is.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Bonus Intelligence? Don't mind if I do. [3.5 Template, PEACH]

    And the update is up.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
    Quote Originally Posted by kardar233 View Post
    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
    My Homebrew Signature such as it is.

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