Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Results 1 to 13 of 13
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    The Pact Bargainer

    The path of a Binder is a tempting one indeed. The lure of power, despite the possible consequences, has beckoned many hapless adventurers down the path of the vestige. However, some Binders aren't in it for the power. Some Binders just really like to talk. Chatting, gabbing, chewing the cud, however you wish to phrase it, auditory interaction with another sentient being can be pretty cool. These chat-inclined Binders often find that their conversational skills can be of use when making pacts with vestiges. By offering alternate deals, debating offers, and haggling over soul-prices a Binder and a Vestige can arrange a deal more beneficial to both parties. The Binders that engage in these sort of practices with vestiges are called Pact Bargainers.


    A Karsite Pact Bargainer stands perfectly still as a large flame seemingly engulfs his scalp. Hopefully he's got immunity to fire damage.

    Alignment
    Any. A desire to parlay with vestiges can be present in any sort of individual. It's what that individual seeks to gain from their bargaining that truly defines their character.

    Hit Die
    d8

    Requirements:
    Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 5 ranks, Diplomacy 5 or Bluff 5 or Intimidate 5 (a Pact Bargainer may have 5 ranks in more than one of those skills, but they're only required to have invested in one).
    Special: Must be capable of binding third level vestiges.

    Class Skills
    Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha)), Gather Information (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Knowledge (Religion) (Int), Knowledge (the Planes) (Int), Profession, Sense Motive (Wis), Speak Language (None), Spellcraft (Int), Use Magic Device (Cha).

    Skill Points at Each Level
    2 + Int modifier.

    Table: The Pact Bargainer

    Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Special Invocations Known
    1st +0 +2 +0 +2 Convincing Bind, Minor Vestige Request, Soul binding +1 0
    2nd +1 +3 +0 +3 Hard Bargainer, Eldritch Arrangement, Soul binding +2 1
    3rd +2 +3 +1 +3 Intermediate Vestige Request, Soul binding +3 1
    4th +3 +3 +1 +3 Improved Eldritch Arrangement, Soul binding +4 2
    5th +3 +4 +1 +4 Major Vestige Request, Soul binding +5 2

    Class Features
    All the following are class features of the Pact Bargainer prestige class.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency
    A Pact Bargainer gains no additional weapon or armor proficiencies.

    Soul Binding Bonus
    At each Pact Bargainer level, your soul binding ability improves as if you had also gained a level in the binder class. Your Pact Bargainer levels and binder levels stack for the purpose of determining your bonus on binding checks, the effectiveness of your vestige-granted abilities, your ability to bind higher-level vestiges, and the number of vestiges you can bind. You do not, however, gain any other benefit a binder would have gained.

    Convincing Bind (Ex)
    A Pact Bargainer may substitute a diplomacy, bluff, or intimidate skill check rather than a normal binding check when attempting to bind a vestige. The skill check's DC is equal to the normal binding DC of the vestige.

    Minor Vestige Request (Su)
    If a Pact Bargainer utilizes the Convincing Bind and makes a good pact, they gain additional abilities as long as the vestige bound in that pact remains bound. They may only gain these additional abilities for one of the vestiges they have bound, regardless of how many they bound in conjunction with the Convincing Bind ability. The additional abilities a Pact Bargainer gains vary based on what type of skill check they decided to use when using the Convincing Bind ability to bind the vestige. If the Pact Bargainer made a diplomacy check then they have made an Appealing Bargain. If the Pact Bargainer employed a bluff check then they have made a Deceitful Bargain. If the Pact Bargainer used an intimidate check then they have made a Forceful Bargain.

    Appealing Bargain: The Pact Bargainer may add their charisma score modifier to their knowledge and sense motive skill checks. This bonus may either replace the modifier the original ability score provided, or supplement it, whichever would be more beneficial. They may make knowledge checks untrained. The Pact Bargainer may also take 10 on both knowledge and sense motive skill checks.

    Deceitful Bargain: The Pact Bargainer may use Disguise Self as a supernatural ability at will. If a Pact Bargainer uses this ability to hide one of their vestige's signs, then they do not lose access to any granted abilities that would be unavailable if the vestige's sign was not being displayed. If the Pact Binder is already under the affect of Disguise Self from a different source, then this ability instead grants a +4 bonus to disguise checks.

    Forceful Bargain: A Pact Bargainer gains a natural armor bonus of 3, this bonus stacks with other natural armor bonuses.

    Hard Bargainer (Ex)
    At second level Pact Bargainers gain the Force of Personality (Complete Adventuruer p. 109) as a bonus feat. If the Pact Binder already possesses the Force of Personality feat, they may gain any other bonus feat they desire.

    Eldritch Arrangement (Su)
    At second level, while bound to a vestige using the Convincing Bind ability, a Pact Bargainer receives a least single invocation from either the Warlock or Dragonfire Adept list. The Pact Bargainer may switch this invocation out for any other least invocation off the Warlock or Dragonfire Adept list any time they bind a vestige. A Pact Vestige does not suffer arcane spell failure chance in any sort of armor when using this invocation, but all other rules concerning normal invocations apply. The Pact Bargainer may not pick any invocations that modify or rely on a Dragonfire Adept's breath attack or a Warlock's Eldritch Blast unless they already possess one of those two abilities. The Pact Bargainer's effective caster level for these invocations is equal to her soul binding level. Any saving throws are determined by 10 + invocation level + charisma modifier.

    Intermediate Vestige Request (Su)
    At third level, the Pact Bargainer's Minor Vestige Request ability improves, granting new abilities based on the type of Convincing Bind made.

    Appealing Bargain: The Pact Bargainer gains a +2 bonus to either charisma or intelligence, chosen during the initial binding. The bonus may be shifted to the other attribute with a move action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity.

    Deceitful Bargain: The Pact Bargainer gains a +2 bonus to either charisma or dexterity, chosen during the initial binding. The bonus may be shifted to the other attribute with a move action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity.

    Forceful Bargain: The Pact Bargainer gains a +2 bonus to either charisma or strength, chosen during the initial binding. The bonus may be shifted to the other attribute with a move action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity. In addition, the Pact Bargainer's natural armor bonus from the Minor Vestige Request ability increases to 4.

    Improved Eldritch Arrangement (Su)
    At fourth level, while bound to a vestige using the Convincing Bind ability, a Pact Bargainer receives a lesser single invocation from either the Warlock or Dragonfire Adept list. The Pact Bargainer may switch this invocation out for any other lesser invocation off the Warlock or Dragonfire Adept list any time they bind a vestige. A Pact Vestige does not suffer arcane spell failure chance in any sort of armor when using this invocation, but all other rules concerning normal invocations apply. The Pact Bargainer may not pick any invocations that modify or rely on a Dragonfire Adept's breath attack or a Warlock's Eldritch Blast unless they already possess one of those two abilities.

    Major Vestige Request (Su)
    At fifth level, the Pact Bargainer's Minor Vestige Request ability improves yet again, granting new abilities based on the type of Convincing Bind made. The Pact Bargainer may make use of one of two invocations, chose during the Convincing Bind. The invocations available are determined by the type of Convincg Bind the Pact Bargainer has made. The caster level for these invocations is equal to the Pact Bargainer's soul binder level and any saving throws have a difficulty class equal to 10 + invocation + charisma modifier. The Pact Bargainer suffers no arcane spell failure chance when using these invocations, but all other normal rules for invocations apply.

    Appealing Bargain: The Pact Bargainer may choose between the Charm invocation (Dragon Magic p.79 or Complete Arcane p.132) or the Voidense invocation (Dragon Magic p.81 or Complete Arcane p.136).

    Deceitful Bargain: The Pact Bargainer may choose between the Flee the Scene invocation (Complete Arcane p.134) or the Walk Unseen invocation (Dragon Magic p.81 or Complete Arcane p.136).

    Forceful Bargain: The Pact Bargainer may choose between the Ignore the Pyre invocation (Dragon Magic p.82) or the Fell Flight invocation (Complete Arcane p.134).
    Last edited by Blueiji; 2014-04-03 at 11:16 AM.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  2. - Top - End - #2
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC) [

    I've added cleared up some existing abilities as well as typing out some new ones.

    Also, bump.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Boston, MA

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC) [

    The idea is certainly interesting. I'm worried about the substituted check ability- skill checks are much easier to bump up than binding checks.

    It might be nice also if one could get some mechanical advantage representing information one has learned from chatting with vestiges. Maybe adding class level as a bonus on knowledge checks?
    My homebrew:

    Spoiler
    Show


    Completed:
    ToB disciplines:

    The Narrow Bridge
    The Broken Blade

    Prestige classess:
    Disciple of Karsus -PrC for Karsites.
    The Seekers of Lost Swords and the Preserver of Future Blades Two interelated Tome of Battle Prcs,
    Master of the Hidden Seal - Binder/Divine hybrid
    Knight of the Grave- Necromancy using Gish



    Worthwhile links:

    Age of Warriors

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Serpent's Throne
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    I'd like to see it expanded, but overall, I still like this class very much. The opportunities for roleplaying and character interaction has always been one of the draws of Binding to me, having Cthulhu and Andras ride on your shoulders so to speak, but I've seen woefully little actually explore it. Very nice work.
    Spoiler
    Show
    My Characters
    According to this test, I am a LN Half-Orc Cleric, Lvl.2.
    "And in the layer of the Deep Ones, we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever." - H.P. Lovecraft

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC) [

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshuaZ View Post
    The idea is certainly interesting. I'm worried about the substituted check ability- skill checks are much easier to bump up than binding checks.
    That was the intention, it's important for Pact Bargainers to be able to pass their binding checks. Most of their class features rely on a good pact, and it sucks to lose out on fives levels worth of class features.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshuaZ View Post
    It might be nice also if one could get some mechanical advantage representing information one has learned from chatting with vestiges. Maybe adding class level as a bonus on knowledge checks?
    If you make an Appealing Bargain then your Minor Vestige Request ability gives you a bonus to Knowledge checks. Should I give that ability something else and make the knowledge check bonus a universal ability?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tygre View Post
    I'd like to see it expanded, but overall, I still like this class very much. The opportunities for roleplaying and character interaction has always been one of the draws of Binding to me, having Cthulhu and Andras ride on your shoulders so to speak, but I've seen woefully little actually explore it. Very nice work.
    Thank you. What did you have in mind when you said that you would want to see it expanded?
    Last edited by Blueiji; 2013-03-24 at 07:01 PM.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    In an apartment
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Its not much, but what if a character took a level in warlock in dragon adept? Would be nice if they could modify their ability, even a little.
    If you feel like quoting something that I have said, you have my permission to use it. Unless it makes me look stupid.
    Gaming Laws, Fallacies And More
    Avatar by Kymme
    My Homebrew
    Feel free to browse and comment on any of my Homebrew. I enjoy feedback.
    Love my Avatar? Well, why not check out the comic that it came from?

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Waker View Post
    Its not much, but what if a character took a level in warlock in dragon adept? Would be nice if they could modify their ability, even a little.
    Do you mean some sort of theurge support?

    I suppose I could make an ACF that traded out some abilities for an increase in invoker level, is that what you meant?
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    In an apartment
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Not so much a theurge option, just commenting on the text in your bargaining. It explicitly calls out invocations that modify blast or breath. It would be nice if someone who took the less optimal choice of dipping one of the two classes still could change their blast/breath.
    If you feel like quoting something that I have said, you have my permission to use it. Unless it makes me look stupid.
    Gaming Laws, Fallacies And More
    Avatar by Kymme
    My Homebrew
    Feel free to browse and comment on any of my Homebrew. I enjoy feedback.
    Love my Avatar? Well, why not check out the comic that it came from?

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Waker View Post
    Not so much a theurge option, just commenting on the text in your bargaining. It explicitly calls out invocations that modify blast or breath. It would be nice if someone who took the less optimal choice of dipping one of the two classes still could change their blast/breath.
    Ahh, I see what you mean, thanks for suggesting that. I'll add a clause.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  10. - Top - End - #10
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2009

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blueiji View Post
    Class Features
    All the following are class features of the Ebon Raven General prestige class.
    such a lie.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by sreservoir View Post
    such a lie.
    Wow, thanks. I can't believe I didn't notice that copy pasta.

    Here's the actual Ebon Raven General, if you're interested. It's a pretty nifty prestige class.

    - - -

    Bump. I could still use some more PEACHing on this, if anyone was obliged.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    In an apartment
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blueiji View Post
    Bump. I could still use some more PEACHing on this, if anyone was obliged.
    Oh fine, I suppose I could talk about it a bit.

    Requirements:
    Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 5 ranks, Diplomacy 5 or Bluff 5 or Intimidate 5 (a Pact Bargainer may have 5 ranks in more than one of those skills, but they're only required to have invested in one).
    Special: Must be capable of binding third level vestiges.
    Requirements could be written as
    Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 5 ranks and 5 ranks in one of the following skills: Bluff, Diplomacy or Intimidate
    Makes it a bit shorter of a read.
    Not sure if you intended it or not, but a Binder can easily meet the requirements for this class at level 2 by taking the Improved Binding feat.
    Hard Bargainer (Ex)
    At second level Pact Bargainers gain the Force of Personality (Complete Adventuruer p. 109) as a bonus feat. If the Pact Binder wishes, they may instead gain a +2 untyped bonus to their will saving throws.
    It isn't bad or anything, but why do you offer them the choice of the untyped save? I could understand having a choice of a different feat if you already have it.
    If you feel like quoting something that I have said, you have my permission to use it. Unless it makes me look stupid.
    Gaming Laws, Fallacies And More
    Avatar by Kymme
    My Homebrew
    Feel free to browse and comment on any of my Homebrew. I enjoy feedback.
    Love my Avatar? Well, why not check out the comic that it came from?

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Blueiji's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Ordial Plane

    Default Re: The PACT BARGAINER - For Binders who like to chat up their vestiges. (3.5e PrC)

    Quote Originally Posted by Waker View Post
    Requirements could be written as
    Skills: Knowledge (Arcana) 5 ranks and 5 ranks in one of the following skills: Bluff, Diplomacy or Intimidate
    I hadn't thought to write it like that, I'll change it now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Waker View Post
    Not sure if you intended it or not, but a Binder can easily meet the requirements for this class at level 3 by taking the Improved Binding feat.
    I realized this while writing the class, and I know that typically, prestige classes aren't supposed to be available before level six, but for some reason the prospect of an early entry didn't bother me that much. Binders can't do very much at the early levels, and I this prestige class gives them a few extra options.

    Quote Originally Posted by Waker View Post
    It isn't bad or anything, but why do you offer them the choice of the untyped save? I could understand having a choice of a different feat if you already have it.
    I had intended the will save bonus for the rare Binder who had a negative charisma but still wanted an increase in will saves from this class feature (since FoP relies on charisma).

    Allowing an alternate feat (such as Iron Will), does seem like a better method though. I'll change it.
    You found the hidden text! Have a cookie.

    Thanks to The Stoney One for the awesome avatar!

    Spoiler: My homebrew!
    Show
    The Bladebound Martyr!
    Quasi-Elemental Genasi (Plus New Feats and a Subtype)!
    My Extended Signature!


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •