Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 32
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    I'm curious if anyone is looking for a new world to run a campaign in. If so my world could use a few play test groups.

    I'd provide all the world documentation you'd need and would help with designing adventures.

    In return I'd like feedback on what you found works, where questions come up, what you'd like more info on.

    The Narrowlands campaign setting is a world of very low magic but high fantasy. It's gritty, dirty, and doesn't forgive foolish actions.

    If anyone is intrested shoot me an e-mail (should be able to from my user info) and I'll send you the documentation and we can start planning things.

    If anyone would like to see more details on something or has questions respond to this post and I'll toss some stuff up.


    Here are some of the changes and examples of those changes:
    Racial changes & Racial classes: Dwarves are now genderless beings carved out of stone around a specific precious gem stone. As they age they slowly turn back to stone. Once they have been stone for a few hundred years they wake again with most memories gone.
    Fate Points: Used to gain access to special feats or perform legendary actions. These points are a rare and finite resource for each character.
    Crafting Revision: Completely redone so that it's much easier and in my opinion more realistic.
    Weapon Familiarity: +1 atk/dmg per 2 levels you use a particular weapon as your main weapon (max +3/+3). This change was made as there are no typically magical weapons. It has the nice side affect of characters actually valuing their weapons rather than just trading them in all the time.
    Revised Healing: Low magic means no instant healing. All healing spells take place over 24 hours and also require a successful heal check.
    New Materials: Dwarves Heart: This exceptionally rare metal is found only in small quantities in the hearts of dwarves. To wield it is to declare your self utterly against the dwarves and all who stand with them. In order to harvest the metal you must remove the heart of a dwarf and within only a few minutes of death bath it in a reagent made from dwarven blood and the purest alcohol. After the heart has been submerged in the mixture it must be lit on fire. When the blood and alcohol has burned away a small lump of metal will remain that is in roughly the shape of a dwarf’s heart.


    If you'd like to read some character journals from a campaign I ran in the journal here yah go:
    http://karlam.deadjournal.com/
    http://aristol-m.deadjournal.com/
    http://quarli.deadjournal.com/
    http://turon.deadjournal.com/
    http://kiernan.deadjournal.com/

    And here's the blurb from the Player Info Sheet Intro to give you a feel of the campaign world.

    ************************************************** ********

    The chittering voice of my companion skitters across my mind coalescing into words. “We’ll feed well today, won’t we.” Ignoring my companion I glance through the grasses. A knight rides slowly down the road escorting a middle aged noble woman and her children. His attentive gaze scans for any sign of trouble.

    The chittering continues “These heathens never seem to notice what’s right in front of there face. All that training and they still can’t see their death coming. It makes me wonder how they stole your lands away from you.” Glancing down at the multiple glistening eyes staring at me a sigh escapes my lips.

    “Look let’s just get this done. The food is yours and we’ll split the spoils fifty fifty.” An exaggerated bow with one of his myriad legs held low indicates Shariltal is ready… mocking but ready. As I pull up my crossbow and take aim Shariltal creeps through the grass as only his kind can.

    Suddenly the knights lance drops and the knight is charging. Then the screams of the woman and her children start. I know they have just caught sight of Shariltal’s multi-legged form suddenly emerging from the grass a thirty feet farther down the road. Thundering hooves take the knight down the road in a breakneck charge to skewer the my companion on his lance. I debate holding my shot and letting him do just that but as he draws even a squeeze of my finger, not more than an inches movement, decides how this fight ends and blood flies everywhere as my bolt shatters the horse’s skull.

    The knight tumbles from the dead horse just as Sharitals leap brings his body smashing into him. By the time my second bolt is loaded he’s already being trussed up in webbing. I step out of the grasses along the side of the road and turn my eyes to the woman and her children who have fallen to the ground in terror. She is yelling at me pleading and begging with me to let them live. I can see the terror in her eyes as she hides her two children behind her. No doubt she’s heard of Sharitals kind and their unique appetites.

    My eyes start to water. To me this has always been the hardest part. The fight is done and now my actions are taken in cold blood with no excuse of battle to offer absolution. I feel the woman’s fear and pain; that desperate fear of not being able to protect your children. That is a feeling I know only to well. My crossbow recoils again as I see her mouth open in sudden surprise. At least I can save her the horror of seeing her children die while she watches helpless. It seems a small mercy but one I feel is important. She slumps slowly to the ground with a crossbow bolt centered in a red flower that grows slowly across her chest.

    “You know they keep better alive.”

    “Yah, I know. I’m not a monster like you are though.” Two more bolts and the screaming ends.


    ************************************************** ********
    Last edited by Umarth; 2006-11-27 at 07:56 PM. Reason: fixed a couple grammer errors

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Figure I'll share a part of the world every couple days for a bit.

    First up races.


    Races:
    Racial Ability Adjustments:
    • Dwarf: +2 con, -2 cha
    • Fey Elf: -4 str, +2 cha
    • Grey Elf: +2dex, -2con, -2 cha
    • Human: +2 fate points
    • Halfling: +2 Dex, -2 Str +1 Fate Point
    • Petty-Dwarf: +2con, -2int, -2wis, -2cha
    • Yaun-ti: +2 int, -2 wis



    Today we'll cover Dwarves. Next one up after Dwarves will be their most hated foes the Petty Dwarves who's very existance can only arise from the perminant murder of a "true" Dwarf.


    Dwarf:
    Dwarves are unique in the world for they are born from the world itself. Every Dwarf is carved from the mountain and is given life by the earth. They live long lives and are resistant to change and as immutable as the earth itself. The greatest kingdoms of the dwarves are high in the mountains who’s deepest halls are secrets the Dwarves reveal to no others.
    Personality: Dwarves are slow to show any emotions be it friendship or hatred though they are in general untrusting of the other races. They value skill in working stone, metal, and above all else gems. They are loath to lie and see honor as more important than life. When crossed they are implacable foes and if the insult or crime against them is great enough will not stop until their foe is dead.
    Physical Description: Dwarves tend to grow only to about four feet tall; though the dwarves of Belegost grow almost half a foot taller. Their weight however is normally half again as much as a human. Dwarves are fond of long and intricately braided beards they often adorn with gold and gems. Their hair can range from silver and gold to browns and red however the most common color is gray. Dwarves, along with petty-dwarves, are unique in that they are genderless. Dwarves live on average 400-500 years of age.
    Relations: Dwarves are untrusting of all the other races though they truly hate only Orcs and Petty Dwarves. Long in the past Dwarves have warred with men and elves over the lust felt by those races for the dwarves handiwork. Though the humans have forgotten and the elves for the most part forgiven to the dwarves these wars are still strong reasons to distrust the other races. Of all the other races Dwarves are most likely to get along with the, Rean Elves, Western Humans, and Yaun-Ti. Both the Rean Elves and the High Humans share the dwarves love for crafts and the making of fine items. Dwarves have both taught and learned a great deal from those races though their “friendships” tend to be very cool.
    It is with the Yaun-Ti that the dwarves greatest allies can be found. The common threat of Orcs to both races has necessitated alliance after alliance between them. The Dwarves also find much merit in the Yaun-Ti’s honor and sense of clan. Yaun-Ti and dwarvish realms often overlap but there is normally little conflict as the Yaun-Ti’s burrows and warrens tend to be much shallower than those of the Dwarves.
    Alignment: Dwarves tend strongly to both law and neutrality. It is rare to find a dwarf who has strayed more from their alignment than one step toward either chaos, good, or evil..
    Dwarven Lands: The dwarves bones are carved of stone as are their homes. Deep under the mountains of the world are found the Halls of the dwarves. These halls are mysteries to the other races for all but the very topmost chambers are off limits to those not of dwarvish blood. Most trade between dwarven lands occurs at the borders where dwarves have setup small trading posts.
    Names: Dwarves are born fully grown from the stone with the knowledge of how to speak and of their own names. Dwarvish names tend to be 2-3 syllables in length and contain the letters K, M, N, or a hard C.

    Dwarven Racial Traits:
    • +2 Constitution, -2 Charisma: Dwarves are as hard as the stone but often find the ways of others difficult to understand or influence.
    • Medium-size: As Medium-size creatures, dwarves have, no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
    • Dwarven Base speed is 20.
    • Darkvision: Dwarves can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and dwarves can function just fine with no light at all.
    • Stonecunning: Stonecunning grants dwarves a +2 racial bonus on checks to notice unusual stonework, such as sliding walls, stonework traps, new construction (even when built to match the old), unsafe stone surfaces, shaky stone ceilings, and the like. Something that isn't stone but that is disguised as stone also counts as unusual stonework. A dwarf who merely comes within 10 feet of unusual stonework can make a check as if he were actively searching, and a dwarf can use the Search skill to find stonework traps as a rogue can. A dwarf can also intuit depth, sensing his approximate depth underground as naturally as a human can sense which way is up. Dwarves have a sixth sense about stonework, an innate ability that they get plenty of opportunity to practice and hone in their underground homes.
    • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against poison.
    • +2 racial bonus on saving throws against spells and spell-like effects.
    • +1 racial bonus to attack rolls against orcs and goblinoids.
    • +4 dodge bonus against giants.
    • +2 racial bonus on Appraise checks that are related to stone or metal items.
    • +2 racial bonus on Craft checks that are related to stone or metal.
    • -4 racial penalty to swim checks.
    • Automatic Languages: Common and Dwarven.
    • Bonus Languages: Giant, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, Terran, Undercommon, and Yaun-Ti.
    • Favored Class: Fighter.


    Ageing:
    Dwarves: Every 90 + 1d20 years dwarves suffer -2 to their dexterity and gain +1 natural armor. When a Dwarf’s dexterity reaches due to ageing 0 it turns to stone. After 100 + 3d100 the Dwarf remerges from stone but with no memories of his past life.

    Dwarven Levels:
    Dwarves can take up to three levels in “Dwarf” at any time. Not all Dwarves take racial levels.
    Hit Dice: d12
    Skill Points at 1st Character Level: (2+intl mod) x4
    Skill Points at Higher Levels: 2+ Intl Mod
    Class Skills: Craft, Appraise, Balance, Jump, Know (Arch), Know (Geo), Survival
    Weapon/Armor Proficiencies: Dwarves are proficient with all simple weapons, and all martial hammers, picks and axes. Dwarves are proficient with all light, medium, and heavy armors as well as light and heavy shields but not tower shields.

    Dwarf
    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special
    1st|
    +1
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |Skin of Stone
    2nd|
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |
    +0
    |Sense of Stone
    3rd|
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +1
    |
    +1
    |+2 Con, -2 Dex, Body of Stone, Heroic Strike (feat)[/table]

    Skin of Stone: Once per day you can gain damage reduction x/- for a number of rounds equal to your constitution modifier where x equals your con modifier.
    Sense of Stone: You gain tremor sense 10’. Once per day you can extend this out to 120’ for 1 minute/5 levels.
    Body of Stone: For up to a number of rounds equal to your constitution modifier a day you are considered to have moderate fortification this means you have a 50% of ignoring critical hits and 50% of sneak attacks fail and are treated as normal attacks.

    Dwarven Racial Feat:

    Heroic Strike [General]
    Fate guides your hand making your attacks land with the most devastating effect.
    Prerequisites: Dwarf
    Benefits:You may spend a fate point to have every attack until your next initiative be a critical if you hit. These must be rolled and do not automatically inflict max damage.
    Special:You must be a dwarf to take this. This does not includes petty-dwarves.


    And finally a special Dwarven material. This is as you can imagine a rather rare material. The few sizable hordes of it are held by the Dwarven kings who gather it as punishment for the most sever treason.

    Dwarves Heart: This exceptionally rare metal is found only in small quantities in the hearts of dwarves. To wield it is to declare your self utterly against the dwarves and all who stand with them. In order to harvest the metal you must remove the heart of a dwarf and within only a few minutes of death bath it in a reagent made from dwarven blood and the purest alcohol. After the heart has been submerged in the mixture it must be lit on fire. When the blood and alcohol has burned away a small lump of metal will remain that is in roughly the shape of a dwarf’s heart. This process yields roughly one tenth of a pound of metal. Oddly this process fails utterly when attempted using a petty-dwarfs heart. A pound of Dwarves Heart costs 15,000gp. Items created from Dwarves Heart weigh half again as much as normal. Weapons crafted from Dwarves Heart grant a +3 bonus to hit and damage. Shields and armor forged from Dwarves Heart grants +3 AC as well as fire and cold resistance of 5. In addition armor, not including shields, made of Dwarves heart grant an additional 3/- damage reduction. Dwarves Heart has a hardness of 30 and 60 hit points per inch of thickness.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    On to race number two.

    Petty-Dwarves:

    First we'll start off with a bit of background info on the origin of Petty-Dwarves.

    Origin of Petty-Dwarves:
    Players of either Dwarf or Petty-Dwarf races know the following information. Non Dwarf/Petty-Dwarf races know this information on Knowledge Arcana check DC 30.

    Petty-Dwarves are the result of an alchemical creation that requires the destruction of a true Dwarf. By combining a Dwarfs heart and a number of other loathsome ingredients a thick viscous mixture can be created. If this mixture is then applied to the forms of Dwarves cut from stone, and lacking a Dwarfs heart, it will bring them to life as Petty-Dwarves.
    The Petty-Dwarves though lack the reincarnation of true Dwarves and once turned to stone are dead forever. Petty-Dwarves though can stave off this fate indefinitely if they regularly take an alchemical mixture similar to the one used to bring them to life.
    Dwarves view every Petty-Dwarf they see as a symbol of the true death of at least one Dwarf and the condemnation of innumerable future Dwarves to the same fate. Petty-Dwarves alternately see in true Dwarves everything they are not, a reminder of their own “secondary” nature, and as a potential sacrifice for their own continued existence. This irreconcilable difference is at the heart of the hatred the two races feel for each other.


    And on to the racial Information:
    Petty-Dwarf:
    Viewed by true Dwarves as abominations fit only for destruction and by most others as dishonest, sneaky, cheats Petty-Dwarves don’t initially look like they have a lot going for them. That is until you consider the fact that they are about as hard to kill as a cockroach.
    Personality: Petty-Dwarves are in general touchy, inconsiderate, annoying, and rude. The primary concern of almost every Petty-Dwarf is survival pure and simple. They are not ashamed of any begging, pleading, or betrayals that keep them alive for one day longer.
    Physical Description: In many ways Petty-Dwarves appear as a poor imitation of the true dwarves. They are in general 6-12 inches shorter than true Dwarves though normally even stockier. Most Petty-Dwarves where there beards significantly shorter than true Dwarves and both their beard and hair tends to be disheveled no mater how much time they spend on it.
    Relations: Petty-Dwarves have never been common in the world and so most races as a whole don’t have an opinion about them. The one exception is Dwarves. Dwarves and Petty-Dwarves have a deep abiding hatred of each other and will never be found in each others company. In almost all cases of Dwarves learning of the location of a Petty-Dwarf the Dwarf will make hunting it down and killing it a top priority. If a Petty-Dwarf learns of Dwarves near by they will kill them if possible and flee if they think the Dwarf is likely to have the upper hand. In areas where Dwarves are more common and respected Petty-Dwarves are generally outlawed though not necessarily hunted down with any enthusiasm. In areas where Dwarves aren’t common it’s unlikely the general population is sufficiently well informed about either race to know the difference.
    Alignment: Petty-Dwarves tend to lead mean and chaotic lives so they lean heavily toward chaos and evil. Considering the requirements to sustain their existence any Petty-Dwarf more than 100-150 years old is extremely unlikely to be good.
    Petty-Dwarf Lands: Petty-Dwarves are few in number and secretive so they have few areas they openly claim as there own. It is much more common for Petty-Dwarves to live as small clans hiding in underground halls on the outskirts of other races civilizations.
    Names: Petty-Dwarves are very secretive of their language and names. They typically adopt use names that are common to what ever race or region they are around.


    Petty-Dwarf Racial Traits:
    • +2con, -2wis, -4cha
    • Improved Toughness (Bonus Feat +1hp/lvl)
    • As Small sized creatures Petty-Dwarves gain +1 attack, +1AC, +4 Hide, Weapon restrictions.
    • Carry loads as medium creature
    • Petty-Dwarves have a base movement of 20ft
    • Darkvision: Petty-Dwarves can see in the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is black and white only, but it is otherwise like normal sight, and Petty-Dwarves can function just fine with no light at all.
    • Petty-Dwarves need eat only ½ the food for a creature their size.
    • +2vs poison
    • +2vs spells and spell like effects
    • +2vs enchantment/compulsion effects
    • +1 to all saves
    • +1 racial bonus to appraisal and craft checks with metal or stone.
    • +2 move silently
    • Favored Class Rogue


    Ageing:
    Petty-Dwarves:Once every 10+4d10 years a Petty-Dwarf must imbibe a specially prepared potion created from the heart of a true Dwarf. Petty-Dwarves that fail to do this suffer a permanent -2 penalty to there dexterity. When their dexterity reaches 0 they turn to stone. Petty-Dwarves who turn to stone this way are forever dead and can in no way be brought back to life. A second application of the alchemical mixture used to create Petty-Dwarves does bring the stone back to life but it is inhabited by a wholly new spirit.


    Finally the Petty-Dwarf Racial class:

    Petty-Dwarf Levels:
    Petty-Dwarves can take up to three levels in “Petty-Dwarf” at any time. Not all Dwarves take racial levels.
    Hit Dice: d12
    Skill Points at 1st Character Level: (4+intl mod) x4
    Skill Points at Higher Levels: 4+ Intl Mod
    Class Skills: Appraise, Balance, Bluff, Craft, Hide, Move Silently, Survival
    Weapon/Armor Proficiencies: Petty-Dwarves are proficient with all simple weapons, light armor, and shields except tower shields.

    Petty-Dwarf
    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special
    1st|
    +0
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |+1 Dex; False Death
    2nd|
    +1
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +0
    |+1 Con; Life’s Blood
    3rd|
    +1
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +1
    | +1 Dex; Cling to Life[/table]

    False Death: when you are hit you may drop to the ground and pretend to be dead. Unless your opponent succeeds in an opposed bluff roll (heal or sense motive vs bluff) they believe you have died.
    Life’s Blood: Petty-Dwarves are immune to any ability that causes HP loss over time due to blood loss and automatically make any stabilization checks.
    Cling to Life: When a petty-dwarf would be reduced to 0 hit points or less by damage in combat (from a weapon or other blow, not a spell or special ability), the petty-dwarf can attempt to shrug off some of the damage. She makes a fortitude saving throw (DC = damage dealt) and, if successful, takes only half damage from the blow

    If anyone has comments or constructive feedback on any of my work that is always appreciated.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Visited two of the races so thought I'd throw out something a bit more crunchy today before going back and rounding out the Elvish races in the Narrowlands.

    As allways constructive feedback is welcome.

    Item Creation:

    In a low magic world non magical item creation becomes much more important. I wasn't happy with the standard D20 rules so I developed my own.

    Weapon/Armor/Item DC Chart
    {table=head]Quality|Type|DC|Weapon|Armor*|Item Materials Cost / Final price modifier**

    Shoddy|
    Simple
    |
    8
    |
    -1 Hit / -1 Dmg
    |
    AC -1/ Max Dex -1
    |2/3 market value, -15% final price

    Shoddy|
    Martial
    |
    9
    |
    -1 Hit / -1 Dmg
    |
    AC -1/ Max Dex -1
    |2/3 market value, normal final price

    Shoddy|
    Exotic
    |
    13
    |
    -1 Hit / -1 Dmg
    |
    AC -1/ Max Dex -1
    |2/3 market value, +15% final price

    Normal|
    Simple
    |
    12
    |
    No Change
    |
    No Change
    |½ market value, -15% final price

    Normal|
    Martial
    |
    15
    |
    No Change
    |
    No Change
    |½ market value, normal final price

    Normal|
    Exotic
    |
    18
    |
    No Change
    |
    No Change
    |½ market value, +15% final price

    Masterwork|
    Simple
    |
    22
    |
    +1 Hit
    |
    - 1 Armor Chk Penalty
    |1/3 market value, -15% final price

    Masterwork|
    Martial
    |
    25
    |
    +1 Hit
    |
    - 1 Armor Chk Penalty
    |1/3 market value, normal final price

    Masterwork|
    Exotic
    |
    28
    |
    +1 Hit
    |
    - 1 Armor Chk Penalty
    |1/3 market value, +15 % final price

    Faux|
    Any
    |
    +3
    |
    -1 Hit / Break*
    |
    2/3 AC, Break**
    |1/5 normal creation cost***

    Expensive |
    Any
    |
    +1/500gp
    |
    +1 DC per 500gp over base cost
    |
    1 DC per 500gp over base cost
    |1 DC per 500gp over base cost[/table]

    * Light armor counts as simple, medium armor counts as normal, and heavy armor counts as exotic. Sheilds all count as light armor (simple on the table)
    **Final price modifier is for items only. Armor and weapons use the final price listed in the PHB.

    Faux:
    • All Faux weapons, armor, and items have ½ the normal hardness and hit points the item they are reproducing normally has.
    • Creation Cost: All Faux weapons, armor, and items cost 1/5 the amount of the item they are duplicating would to create.
    • *Faux weapons have a base creation DC equal to the weapon they are imitating +3. Faux weapons break are rendered useless on any attack roll of 1. An appraise check equal to the item creation DC reveals a faux weapon for what it is. You may add your BAB as a circumstance modifier to this check.
    • **Faux Armor has only 2/3 the standard normal AC, grants no damage reduction, and has a 5% chance of losing 1 additional point of AC each time wearer is hit for more damage than the AC of the armor. An appraise check equal to the item creation DC reveals a faux weapon for what it is. A character who gets a chance to wear the armor in a real or mock fight may add his BAB to as a circumstance modifier to the appraise check.
    • ***Faux Items are commonly sold as paste jewelry in many markets. Faux tools impose a -1 skill check to any skill roles made using them. In addition they break on any natural 1 skill role.


    Item Creation Time:
    Items take 1 day per 3 points of the DC and 1 day per 250 gp of the items final cost. This time is reduced by 1 day for every 6 points you roll above the DC. If you roll well enough to reduce the time below one day it is reduced to half a day and then ¼ a day. ¼ a day is the minimum amount of time it takes to make any item. As a special note some items, such as arrows, are made in batches. For these items the minimum time is for a batch rather than one item.

    Item Creation Time = (Item DC)/3 + (Final Cost)/250

    For every 6 points you beat the item creation DC by subtract one day from the item creation time. If an item takes only one day to make reduce the item creation time to ½ day. If the item takes only ½ day to make reduce the item creation time to ¼ day.

    Example: It normally takes 5 days to craft a Martial Melee weapon. Turon though does very will on his roll and manages to get a 27 (20 roll +7skill). Since this is 12 points above the needed DC to make a normal martial melee weapon he makes it in 3 days rather than 5 days (-2 days for 12 points above the DC).

    Failing an Item creation roll:
    When crafting an item you must state what quality item you are trying to make. If you fail your roll but it's still high enough to make a lower quality item you make that item instead. If you roll high enough to make a higher quality item then you originally started out making you DO NOT make the higher quality. (High rolls will reduce the time needed to make the item though). If you fail an item creation roll when making a faux item all the materials are destroyed and need to be replaced.

    Armor Crafting Examples:
    Example: Turon wishes to craft two masterwork sets of armor for his friends; a set of Full Plate and a set of Padded. Since the Padded will take less time Turon sets about gathering the finest materials and spends 102gp and 3sp (5+150 x (1/3)= 51.6). He then makes a skill check DC 22. He gets lucky and gets a 30 on his skill check. After 6 days (22/3=7.3, rounded down, + 155/250 .63, rounded down to 0 days. This is reduced by an additional day since the skill check was more than 6 but less than 12 over what was needed.) the armor is finished.

    Turon takes the next day off to rest and purchase the materials needed for the Full Plate. He spends 544gp and 5sp (1,500 + 150 x (1/3) = 544.5) on expertly crafted steel plates, rivets, and other materials. He then rolls a skill check DC 28. Again he gets a 30 on his skill check. After 13 days (28/3 = 9.33, rounded down, + 1150/250 = 4.6, rounded down, for a total of 13 (9+4) days. There is no reduction in the creation time as the skill check was less than 6 over what was needed) the armor is crafted.

    Had Turon instead rolled a 26 when crafting the Full Plate armor (missing the DC by 2) he would instead have created normal Full Plate armor.

    Item Crafting Example:
    Example: Turon is making a gold ring. He spends 10gp on materials for the ring. If he wanted to make a shoddy martial gold ring it would have a final price of 15gp. A normal martial gold ring would price out at 20gp and a masterwork martial gold ring would have a final price of 30gp. Turon decides that he wants to try and make a normal gold ring.

    If Turon instead decided on a normal simple design it the ring would have a cost of 17gp, a normal martial ring would stay at 20gp while an normal exotic gold ring would have a final price of 23gp.

    Finally Turon decides to make a normal exotic gold ring. He pays 10gp for the base price and makes his skill check DC 18, takes 5 days to make, and the ring has a final price of 23gp.
    Last edited by Umarth; 2007-06-18 at 08:26 AM. Reason: Added armor = info.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    How to make a campaign Low Magic

    Well these are some of the key rules I used for it anyway.

    First we strip out almost all the full spell progression core classes and that leaves us with:

    Classes: Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger, Paladin, Rogue, Bard, and Adept

    Make some drastic changes to the way spells work. Note especially the healing line of spells.

    Spells and Magic:
    Note that Ranger, Paladin, Bard, and Adept have slightly modified Spell lists. Any big flashy (fireball, summonings, ect) are gone. Bards gain healing spells and healing as a class skill.

    Spell Changes:
    Cure spells: All cure/healing spells have a duration of 24 hours and the HPs they regenerate are replaced evenly over the 24 hour duration. Also a heal check must be made DC 10 +spell level to see how many HPs the spell will heal. 1 hp is restored for each point above 10 to max indicated by spell. The Heal spell negates the need to make a heal check.
    So if you're an adept and you cast cure critical wounds you make two rolls. First the healing spell: 4d8+12 (say 33 points) and then a heal check.

    For every 1 point above 10 that you make on the heal check your spell would heal a point of damage up to a max of 33 (the number you rolled on the spell). Those hit points would be evenly restored over a 24 hour period.

    Polymorph other/self: This line of spells has the additional material component of the skin of the creature you are trying to polymorph into. This skin must be draped over the creature to be polymorphed. The polymorph spell can be ended at anytime if the polymorphed creature removes the skin.
    Binding: This spell allows only for the Chaining, Slumber, Bound Slumber, and Hedged Prison options. All four bindings negate the need for food and drink however none of them stop the normal ageing process. There are a few other things to make note of.
    Chaining: This creates four magical chains that have a hardness equal to the caster level and hit points equal to double that. The chains attach at the ankles and wrists. The character bound by the chains cannot affect them. An outside agent may free them from the chaining by destroying each of the chains.
    Slumber: You may awaken someone from Slumber by inflicting 1 point of damage per caster level in a single attack against the slumbering creature.
    Bound Slumber: This can be ended early by first breaking the chains and then waking the subject as detailed in Slumber.
    Hedged Prison: Only by completely dismantling the prison can this be ended.

    Melee Changes

    Now we want to keep our power level up a bit since we just lost almost all our arcane and divine might so we change the feat progression.

    Feats: Feat progression slightly altered in the Narrow Lands. All Classes receive feats at 1,3,6,9,10,12,14,16,18,20.

    Since we don't have any "magic" weapons or armor we'll need to do something similar but non-magical.

    Familiarity Bonus:
    For every 2 levels you use a particular weapon (aka: The sword your father gave you when you left) as your primary weapon you gain +1 attack/damage with it. Max +3/+3 after 6 levels. If you’re a bard and applying this to your favored musical instrument you increase the DC by 1 for any spells cast using the instrument as well as a +1 familiarity bonus to perform rolls while using your favored instrument.

    AC Bonus:
    Each character gains a dodge bonus equal to ½ their base attack bonus.
    This is a dodge bonus and thus is lost anytime you would lose your dex modifier.


    Some Armor Modifcations:
    Armor and damage reduction: Armor in the Narrowlands grants the following damage reduction. The damage reduction for masterwork armor stacks with the armors default damage reduction.
    • Light armor:-/-
    • Medium armor:1/-
    • Heavy armor:2/-
    • Masterwork:+1/-


    Damage Reduction Stacking: Damage reduction granted by armor stacks with any natural damage reduction a creature may have. If the creature has a damage reduction of a different type then x/- apply the armors damage reduction and then the creatures damage reduction before applying damage to the creature. In addition any damage reduction granted by a shield stacks with damage granted by armor. Damage reduction from multiple shields or multiple suits of armor do not stack.



    There you go. A nice low magic world that won't see your players falling over dead every game session provided you as the DM follow the same rules. NPCs should be just as low magic as the players.
    Last edited by Umarth; 2006-12-06 at 03:56 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Banned
     
    XtheYeti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    HALO and HALO timeskip

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Hello I am the Dm of the playtest of this stuff i will be geting the campain together and put up soon

    Any one who would like to help play test please Pm me with a character idea, i dont know what level we will start at yet but i am thinking 10+

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Quote Originally Posted by Umarth View Post
    Also a heal check must be made DC 10 –spell level +HPs to be restored. 1 hp is restored for each point above 10 to max indicated by spell. The Heal spell negates the need to make a heal check.
    What does that mean, "HPs to be restored"? Do You mean all hit points missing to full health or the number of hit points the spell would normally restore? In any way, the heal checks are enormous: healing 25 missing hit points with a cure critical wound spell at level 7(<4d8+9>=25) requires a 31 check result - with a 10 + WIS bonus.

    XtheYeti:
    Why don't You start playtesting at low levels?
    bis denn

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Banned
     
    XtheYeti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    HALO and HALO timeskip

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Quote Originally Posted by icke View Post
    XtheYeti:
    Why don't You start playtesting at low levels?
    Because... i dont know yet i might, still trying to nail down exactly how i want to run this, plus we need more play testers, look for the OOC thread withing a week

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    [QUOTE=icke;1646588]What does that mean, "HPs to be restored"? Do You mean all hit points missing to full health or the number of hit points the spell would normally restore? In any way, the heal checks are enormous: healing 25 missing hit points with a cure critical wound spell at level 7(<4d8+9>=25) requires a 31 check result - with a 10 + WIS bonus.
    QUOTE]


    Yah that's not real clear (edited orginal post for clarity). The way it works is you roll a heal check + the level of the heal spell you cast. For every 1 point above 10 your heal spell heals.

    So if you're an adept and you cast cure critical wounds you make two rolls. First the healing spell: 4d8+12 (say 33 points) and then a heal check.

    For every 1 point above 10 that you make on the heal check your spell would heal a point of damage up to a max of 33 (the number you rolled on the spell). Those hit points would be evenly restored over a 24 hour period.

    The idea is instant healing doesn't mesh well with low magic but you also don't want your PCs out of commission for to long inbetween fights. This option lets you speed that process up with out having instant healing.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Good Idea, basically. I see the problem with the even distribution of hit points over the day, where do You draw limits? If a player regains 33hp over 24 hours, does he regain 1hp over 44 minutes, and who keeps track of time? ultimately, it will be a DM thing...

    Another question: what do multiple cure spells do on the same target?
    bis denn

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Only the cure spell that will cure the most hit points works.

    Your right it is primarly a DM thing. If they are getting 1hp every 44 minutes and you have a combat that takes place at some point while those hps are coming back DM just has to make a call and says it's been x length of time you get x hps back.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Now here is one of the biggest changes. This is based heavily on the EQ:RPG rules which are OGL content. Primary change I added was a Ponderous (8) iterative attack rating that was assigned to crossbows. I've never been a fan of the uselessness of crossbows and now they are slightly less useless.


    Iterative Attacks: Iterative Attacks work differently in the Narrow Lands than standard D20. Every weapon is assigned a speed which influences how quickly you gain iterative attacks with that weapon. Feats, special building materials, and some conditions can make weapon speeds increase or decrease though no weapon delay is ever less than 2 or slower than 8. No matter what your base attack bonus is you may never have more than five iterative attacks.


    Weapon Delay
    {table=head]BAB:|Preternaturally Quick (2)*|Very Quick (3)|Quick (4)|Standard (5)|Slow (6)|Very Slow (7)|Ponderous (8)

    0|0|0|0|0| 0|0|0

    1|1|1|1|1| 1|1|1

    2|2|2|2|2| 2|2|2

    3|3/1|3|3|3| 3|3|3

    4|4/2|4/1|4|4| 4|4|4

    5|5/3/1|5/2|5/1|5| 5|5|5

    6|6/4/2|6/3|6/2|6/1| 6|6|6

    7|7/5/3/1|7/4/1|7/3|7/2| 7/1|7|7

    8|8/6/4/2|8/5/2|8/4|8/3| 8/2|8/1|8

    9|9/7/5/3|9/6/3|9/5/1|9/4| 9/3|9/2|9/1

    10|10/8/6/4|10/7/4/1|10/6/2|10/5| 10/4|10/3|10/2

    11|11//7/5|11/8/5/2|11/7/3|11/6/1| 11/5|11/4|11

    12|12/10/8/6|12/9/6/3|12/8/4|12/7/2| 12/6|12/5|12

    13|13/11/9/7|13/10/7/4|13/9/5/1|13/8/3| 13/7/1|13/6|13

    14|14/12/10/8|14/11/8/5|14/10/6/2|14/9/4| 14/8/2|14/7|14/6

    15|15/13/11/9|15/12/9/6|15/11/7/3|15/10/5| 15/9/3|15/8/1|15/7

    16|16/14/12/10|16/13/10/7|16/12/8/4|16/11/6/1| 16/10/4|16/9/2|16/8

    17|17/15/13/11|17/14/11/8|17/13/9/5|17/12/7/2| 17/11/5|17/10/3|17/9/1

    18|18/16/14/12|18/15/12/9|18/14/10/6|18/13/8/3| 18/12/6|18/11/4|18/10/2

    19|19/17/15/13|19/16/13/10|19/15/11/7|19/14/9/4| 19/13/7/1|19/12/5|19/11/3

    20|20/18/16/14|20/17/14/11|20/16/12/8|20/15/10/5| 20/14/8/2|20/13/6|20/12/4 [/table]
    *no weapons have a delay of two naturally.


    Nonproficiency
    When using a weapon with which you are not proficient, you take a -4 penalty on attack rolls and the weapon counts as one delay slower than normal.

    Inappropriately Sized Weapons
    A creature can’t make optimum use of a weapon that isn’t properly sized for it. A cumulative -2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder and the weapon counts as one delay slower than normal per size category. If the creature isn’t proficient with the weapon a -4 nonproficiency attack penalty and -1 nonproficiency delay penalty also applies.
    The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder’s size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. If a weapon’s designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can’t wield the weapon at all.




    Weapons: Due to the change in the way iterative attacks work all weapons now have a delay. In addtion a number of weapons have had there base damage changed.

    Simple Weapons - Melee
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Unarmed Attacks
    Brass knuckles ** x2 Quick
    Gauntlet ** x2 Quick
    Strike, Unarmed (Large) 1d4S x2 Quick
    Strike, Unarmed (Medium) 1d3S x2 Quick
    Strike, Unarmed (Small) 1d2S x2 Quick
    Light Weapons
    Dagger 1d3 19-20x2 Quick
    Gauntlet, spiked 1d3 x2 Quick
    Mace, light 1d6 x2 Standard
    One-Handed Weapons
    Club 1d6 x2 Slow
    Mace, Heavy 1d8 x2 Standard
    Morningstar 1d10 x2 Slow
    Shortspear + 1d6 x3 Standard
    Two-Handed Weapons
    Quarterstaff 1d6/1d6 x2 Standard
    Spear 1d8 x3 Standard

    Simple Weapons - Ranged
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Bolts, crossbow (10) - - -
    Bullets, sling (10) - - -
    Crossbow, light 1d8 19-20/X2 Very Slow
    Dart 1d3 x2 Quick
    Sling 1d4 x2 Slow
    Bolts, crossbow (10) - -
    Crossbow, heavy 1d10 19-20/X2 Ponderous
    Javelin 1d6 x2 Standard


    Martial Weapons-Melee
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Light Weapons
    Axe, throwing 1d6 X2 Standard
    Hammer, light 1d4 X2 Standard
    Handaxe 1d6 X3 Standard
    Lance, light 1d8 X3 Slow
    Pick, light 1d4 X4 Standard
    Sap 1d6S X2 Quick
    Sword, short 1d6 19-20/X2 Standard
    One-Handed Weapons
    Battleaxe 1d8 X3 Standard
    Broad Sword 1d10 x2 Slow
    Flail, light 1d8 X2 Standard
    Lance, heavy 1d12 X3 Very Slow
    Longsword 1d8 19-20/X2 Standard
    Pick, heavy 1d8 X4 Slow
    Rapier 1d4 18-20/X2 Quick
    Scimitar 1d6 18-20/x2 Quick
    Trident 1d10 X2 Slow
    Warhammer 1d8 X3 Standard
    Two-Handed Weapons
    Falchion 2d4 18-20/X2 Standard
    Flail, heavy 1d10 19-20/X2 Standard
    Glaive 1d12 X3 Slow
    Greataxe 2d6 X3 Slow
    Greatclub 1d12 X2 Slow
    Greatsword 2d6 19-20/X2 Slow
    Guisarme 2d4 X3 Standard
    Halberd 1d12 X3 Slow
    Longspear 1d8 X3 Standard
    Ranseur 1d10 X3 Slow
    Scythe 1d10 X4 Slow
    Sword, bastard 1d10 19-20x2 Standard
    Two-Handed hammer 2d6 x2 Slow


    Martial Weapons-Ranged
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Shortbow 1d6 X3 Standard
    Arrows (20) - - -
    Shortbow, composite 1d6 X3 Standard
    Arrows (20) - - -
    Longbow 1d8 X3 Standard
    Arrows (20) - - -
    Longbow, composite 1d8 X3 Standard
    Arrows (20) - - -

    Exotic Weapons-Melee
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Light Weapons
    Kukri 1d3 18-20/X2 Quick
    One-Handed Weapons
    Sword, bastard 1d10 19-20/X2 Standard
    Waraxe, dwarven 1d10 X3 Standard
    Two-Handed Weapons
    Axe, orc double 1d8/1d8 X3 Standard
    Flail, dire 1d8/1d8 X2
    Sword, two-bladed 1d8/1d8 19-20/X2

    Exotic Weapons-Ranged
    Weapon Damage Critical Delay
    Crossbow, hand 1d2 19-20/X2 Slow
    Bolts (10) - - -
    Small
    Whip 1d2S X2 Quick
    Net * * N/A
    Last edited by Umarth; 2006-12-08 at 07:32 AM.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    I like the idea and really want to see how this effects the game. But.

    Why is a WOODEN club slower than a METAL mace? This one doesn't make sense.

    Same thing for halberd and longspear, both extremely cumbersome weapons, but with different delay.
    bis denn

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Let's call it balance (both in and out of game)

    Wooden club is a big heavy stick that's weight is spread across the whole weapon. A metal mace is designed so that the weight is better balanced allowing you to get ready for a second swing faster.

    If someone wanted a wooden club and was willing to pay the same price as a metal mace for it then I'd probably go with the faster delay. At a cost of 0 with no craft check the D20 wooden club really is just a stick you found on the ground.

    Out of game reason for it is a weapon that's free should not be as good as a weapon that's crafted and you have to spend some gold on.

    Halbard vs Longspear: Longspear is designed for thrusting which allows for quicker attacks than a Halbard which is primarly used to chop.

    Out of game both are considered Martial melee weapons one has a d8 and the other a d12 damage die. For the bigger damage die you trade off some speed.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    I don't agree with your in-game reasoning for the club, it's the other way 'round: the maces' weight is concentrated at the top, allowing for more damage but also making the weapon unbalanced. That's why a light mace does as much damage as a one-handed club.

    Concerning the out-game balance reasons: I'm fine with these.
    bis denn

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    To be honest, the healing thing seems like the main reason I'd avoid this like the plague. Doesn't make a huge difference in the 1-5 range, but as levels increase and as damage increases exponentially, the linear improvements in heal skill just don't cut it. In traditional D&D, a high level bard can lay 3 Cure Crits on the fighter who just got nailed by a troll, but in this mod the fighter's looking at a 3-day convalescence after a 3-round combat. If you were to limit things to an 8-hour period rather than 24, that would allow for a bit better recovery while still retaining the sense of slower healing.
    You'll want to be very careful about drain attacks too; with vastly limited regenerative/restorative casting ability it could be tough to avoid hosing the players.

    Troll Ranger with paired scimitars and two-weapon rend 4tw :)
    Don't bother trying to appeal to my better nature; I don't have one.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    So quick look at how long it really takes to heal.

    Say your level 10 and you've got 100hps. You get into a fight and get knocked down to 1hp so 99 to heal.

    Healing with full rest: 15hps/day 6.6 days total
    Healing with full rest and long term care: 30hps per day 3.3 days
    Healing with full rest and Long term care and Faster Healing (feat): 40 hps/day 2.5 days total
    Healing with full rest and Long term care, faster healing, and Cure serious wounds: Avg 66hps per day 1.5 days

    So if you have decent hps for your level and you are knocked almost all the way down your probably looking at something between 3.3 and 1.5 days before your 100% recovered.

    You are right that if you get smacked down in a fight it takes some time to recover and get back on your feat. But that's part of playing in a low magic world.

    Most drain attacks arn't really a worry because the typical creatures that inflict drain attacks arn't going to be found in a low magic world.

    A second part to this is that as a DM you need to design adventures diffrently. Dungon crawling doesn't work well with out instant healing so you've got to move your adventures above ground and away from the 4 combats a day standard.

    Still there is sometimes a need for instant healing so there is a feat casters can learn to do it. It's a rare feat though and not one that gets used frequently even when it is known:

    Fast healing
    The body burns itself in a fury of mortality. Wounds close on the outside as the fire of life is stoked to blazing inferno.
    Prerequisites:You must learn this feat from someone who already knows it.
    Benefits: When you cast a healing spell you can chose to have its healing take place in 1 round rather than over 24 hours.
    Normal: Healing takes place over 24 hours.
    Special:The creature healed rolls 1d(x) and loses that many HPs permanently. X= the most common die used to roll HPs. (exp. A 2nd lvl fighter would lose 1d10 hps. A 3rd lvl rouge 1st lvl fighter would lose 1d6hps).

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Low-healing HP/WP/Vitality varient.

    All players gain HP equal to their Con at "Level 0".
    No max HP at L 1.

    So a L 1 fighter with 10 con has 15 HP.

    Use 1/2 max roll for bonus HP/level. If you would gain 0 HP/level, gain 1/2 a HP per level. -1 is 1/3. -2 is 1/4. -3 is 1/5.

    Your HP is split into two pools. Half of your pool (rounded up) is WP (wound points), the other half is VP (vitality points).

    A L 1 fighter with 10 con has 8 WP and 7 VP.

    VP recover after every encounter. (if there isn't a full break between encounters, the DM can have the players regain 1/2 of their lost VP). Magical healing heals VP instantly and effectively in combat.

    When you take damage, it comes off your VP.
    For every 10 VP you take from any single blow, or fraction thereof, you take a WP as well.

    If you run out of VP, damage falls into your WP pool.

    If you run out of both VP and WP, you are K.O.d.

    If you run out of WP, you start taking constitution damage instead of WP damage.

    ...

    WP heal slowly. Over a 6 hour period, a character will heal (3+con mod) WP.

    A successful Heal check will boost this rate. The healer gets a +10 bonus if the target is resting for the entire 6 hours, and a bonus equal to the target's con. Magical healing spells grant a +5 bonus per spell level to the healing check. Only one magical healing spell per target can be used in this way, and the bonus from one spell only applies to one target.

    Caring for multiple patients places a -5 penalty per patient on every patient to the Heal check.

    The result of the roll determines the rate of healing over that 6 hours:
    DC 20 2x the healing rate.
    DC 30 3x the healing rate.
    DC 40 4x the healing rate.
    etc.

    ...

    Crits do not bypass VP.
    WP damage does not cause fatigue.

    Healing in combat is somewhat important, because it is much easier to heal VP than WP. But the party can make do without any magical healer in the group. (having someone with Heal skill is, however, very much worth it.)
    Last edited by Yakk; 2006-12-08 at 05:08 PM.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    So, under the above "weak healing WP/VP model", how long does healing take?

    L 10 fighter with 20 con
    120 HP: 60 WP 60 VP.
    +3 con mod. 8 healing per 6 hours.

    Takes 13 blows of 5 damage each.

    45 WP 0 VP.
    After a brief rest:
    45 WP 60 VP

    15 WP of damage. How long does that take to heal?

    Over 6 hours:
    8 WP healed
    With a DC 20 heal check:
    16 WP healed.

    thanks to the high CON, the fighter heals fast.

    A L 10 rogue with 12 con, meanwhile:
    52 HP -- 26 WP 26 VP

    Takes 8 blows of 5 damage each.

    6 WP 0 VP (gah!)
    after a brief rest:
    6 WP 26 VP

    20 WP of damage

    He's back up at 32 HP -- but he's still in serous danger. A few blows and he starts taking CON damage!

    Over 6 hours:
    4 WP healed
    so it would take 30 hours for the Rogue to heal up, or a DC 50 heal check over 6 hours.

    A L 10 priest with 20 wisdom and 13 heal skill...
    d20 + 18
    casting a L 4 healing spell
    +20
    caring for one extra pateint
    -5
    =
    d20 + 33

    On a 7 or higher, gets a DC 40 roll. x4 healing, or 16 WP over 6 hours.

    On a 17 or higher, gets a DC 50 roll. x5 healing, or fully healed.

    ...

    Skirmishes accumulate WP damage (which requires rest to heal). Big bad fights can dip you past your VP into WP (which you are afraid of taking too much of!).

    Healing in combat still exists -- but it only adds to your temporary (VP) HP. It is still damn useful, because it helps shield your WP from damage.

    You can run out of WP and still survive, but from then on damage becomes seriously scary -- every point of WP you take (which happens on every hit) you lose con!

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    I've never played a game with the WP/VP system. To me it's always seemed like it makes things needlessly complex, requires more tracking, and changing all the monsters.

    I'm also curious what benefit does this bring over the normal HP system? Looking over it it seems like the primary advantage is that it lets you run low magic games in the standard 4 encounters per day high magic method by replacing the physical cleric with a VP "cleric" that heals you up after each fight.

    I can see how that keeps more to the low magic idea, no wounds suddenly vanishing, but it has some major ramifications on how encounters in the game need to be designed.

    I guess maybe part of what I don't understand is: Why is it bad to have 2-5 days downtime after a serious fight or a number of smaller skirmishes?

    I'm also not sure I understand exactly how the system your proposing works.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yakk View Post
    Low-healing HP/WP/Vitality varient.

    All players gain HP equal to their Con at "Level 0".
    No max HP at L 1.

    So a L 1 fighter with 10 con has 15 HP.

    Use 1/2 max roll for bonus HP/level. If you would gain 0 HP/level, gain 1/2 a HP per level. -1 is 1/3. -2 is 1/4. -3 is 1/5.
    I don't follow the above.

    Is it you're HPs at level one equal your con plus 1/2 your HD.
    Examples:
    Level 1 Warrior 10 Con: 15hps
    Level 1 Barb 10 Con: 16hps
    Level 1 Cleric 10 Con: 14hps

    Then as you level up you get 1/2 your max hps each level (fighter 5, barb 6, cleric 8, ect)?

    This part I really don't follow: If you would gain 0 HP/level, gain 1/2 a HP per level. -1 is 1/3. -2 is 1/4. -3 is 1/5.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    My apologies -- you gain (1/2 max HD + con bonus) when you level up.

    So a wizard (2 HP per level) with -2 con should gain 0 HP/level. A wizard with -3 con should gain -1 HP/level.

    One could cap this at 1 HP/level, but then -2 con doesn't change the wizard's HP much. Instead, have it go from 1 HP/level to 1 HP/2 levels. Then 1 HP/3 levels.

    ...

    The problem with a game in which you need a week's rest after any challenging fight is that, well, that does get in the way of dramatic tension.

    D&D combat is an attrition system. Attackers tend to succeed at doing damage, one way or another, and the game is balanced around losing HP in most conflicts.

    The "Low-healing VP/WP" system is an attempt to allow the standard D&D balance to exist, but not have magical healing that can cure all damage instantly.

    but it has some major ramifications on how encounters in the game need to be designed.
    Not hugely. In standard D&D, at mid to high levels, healing spells are pretty cheap to use outside of combat. If you occasionally stress the players, they can burn gold and use healing potions and scrolls.

    Groups can heal up between fights pretty easily.

    The low-healing WP/VP system makes fights if anything more dangerous, simply because you can take WP damage which cannot be healed between fights easily.

    It also frees the party from you must have a divine healing battery along issues. Cure spells become, for the most part, combat spells, not "must have this spell to be able to finish a dungeon in less than a year's time" spells.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Still concerning the iterative attack rules

    I'm still hanging on the iterative attack rules, I've got a problem there with special attacks:

    1) You decreased unarmed damage, to balance speed and number of attacks. How does that affect the monks' unarmed attack/number of attacks?

    2) What about sneak attack? Can a rogue take a dagger and flank someone for possible 40d6 of sneak damage per round?

    3) If a character takes the Two-Weapon Fighting feat tree, how many attacks does he get with two daggers - compared to two bastard swords?
    bis denn

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Artemician's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Singapore.

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    what icke is saying is true, you should clarify the rules regarding TWF and flurry. Now that the iterative attack system has been changed, mechanics that are dependent on it have to be rebalanced as well.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Banned
     
    XtheYeti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    HALO and HALO timeskip

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    I am now going to put up the Ooc thread and add me to the recruting thread

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Still concerning the iterative attack rules

    Been busy at work and home so slow posting.

    Quote Originally Posted by icke View Post
    I'm still hanging on the iterative attack rules, I've got a problem there with special attacks:

    1) You decreased unarmed damage, to balance speed and number of attacks. How does that affect the monks' unarmed attack/number of attacks?

    2) What about sneak attack? Can a rogue take a dagger and flank someone for possible 40d6 of sneak damage per round?

    3) If a character takes the Two-Weapon Fighting feat tree, how many attacks does he get with two daggers - compared to two bastard swords?
    1) You know monks aren’t an allowed class in my world (core classes are: Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger, Paladin, Rogue, Bard, and Adept) so I haven't looked at it. I can tell you in EQ 2 which that is based off of they don't get a special attack rate. They do however get:
    An extra attack at level 3 that improves at 12.
    "Double Attack" at level 9 (most martial classes get it at 12) which lowers the delay of any weapons, including unarmed, by 1.
    Several improvements to Unarmed damage starting at level 2.

    2) They would be able to make 4 iterative attacks at level 18 with a quick weapon or level 14 if they had some way to decrease the weapon speed to very quick (feat or magic item). That would let them do 40d6 sneak attack a round yes.

    3) I wasn't planning on changing the two weapon fighting feats. If you take two weapon fighting you get an extra attack, Improved TWF 2 extra attacks, Greater TWF 3 extra attacks.

    I don't think having those feats modify the iterative attack progression is a good idea. To me they seem to work well as is.


    Quote Originally Posted by Yakk View Post
    My apologies -- you gain (1/2 max HD + con bonus) when you level up.

    So a wizard (2 HP per level) with -2 con should gain 0 HP/level. A wizard with -3 con should gain -1 HP/level.

    One could cap this at 1 HP/level, but then -2 con doesn't change the wizard's HP much. Instead, have it go from 1 HP/level to 1 HP/2 levels. Then 1 HP/3 levels.

    ...

    The problem with a game in which you need a week's rest after any challenging fight is that, well, that does get in the way of dramatic tension.

    D&D combat is an attrition system. Attackers tend to succeed at doing damage, one way or another, and the game is balanced around losing HP in most conflicts.

    The "Low-healing VP/WP" system is an attempt to allow the standard D&D balance to exist, but not have magical healing that can cure all damage instantly.
    Yakk -
    Thanks for the clarification that makes sense.

    Combat in the Narrowlands tends to occur at a different frequency (probably partially because of the lack of healing or using a WP/VP system) than in typical D&D. When I was putting the characters in a situation where they had to worry about attrition I'd drag that out over a weeks worth of game time rather than a day.

    I think probably one of the biggest changes are just an overall reduction in the number of combats that take place and forced focus on less violent means of resolving issues.

    I appreciate the feedback but I think that a WP/VP system brings the world back to close to the feeling of standard d20. Part of the flavor of the world comes from the fact that combat, any combat, is deadlier and takes longer to recover from than standard.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Still concerning the iterative attack rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Umarth View Post
    2) They would be able to make 4 iterative attacks at level 18 with a quick weapon or level 14 if they had some way to decrease the weapon speed to very quick (feat or magic item). That would let them do 40d6 sneak attack a round yes.

    3) I wasn't planning on changing the two weapon fighting feats. If you take two weapon fighting you get an extra attack, Improved TWF 2 extra attacks, Greater TWF 3 extra attacks.

    I don't think having those feats modify the iterative attack progression is a good idea. To me they seem to work well as is.
    But, with the Improved/Greater TWF feats, You gain extra attacks at BAB-5/-10. Since the speed of the particular weapon Your character is using affects the occurance of the second and third attack(a prerequisite for Improved/Greater TWF), one would have to modify the prerequisites to fit the speeds.
    For example, if a warrior with two clubs and a BAB of 6/1 takes Improved Two Weapon Fighting, she normally attacks with 4/4,-1/-1 attack bonus(Strength not added). With the low speed of the clubs, she would not be able to do the second row of attacks at all...
    One can handle that by ruling out secondary attacks with weapons to slow to use them yet, but then one gets a problem with the fast weapons: Why shouldn't they be able to do the second off-hand attack earlier?
    bis denn

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Artemician's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Singapore.

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Wait... I think i get it now.

    When you take TWF, you get an extra attack with your off-hand weapon with a penalty equal to its delay.

    Is that it?

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Quote Originally Posted by Artemician View Post
    Wait... I think i get it now.

    When you take TWF, you get an extra attack with your off-hand weapon with a penalty equal to its delay.

    Is that it?
    If You're talking about the extra attacks from Improved/Greater TWF, yes, that's it.
    But that makes fast weapons much more effective, since they get their off-hand attacks earlier and at a lower BAB. So everyone will use scimitars with this, the quick weapon with the best damage die, and be able to do six attacks at level 9 - not including any speed-up feats Umarth mentioned.
    bis denn

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    The fact that someone would be able to do 6 attacks at level 9 is part of the reason I don't think the feats should be changed.

    While I do see some logical reasons for arguing that the TWF feats should be based off when your able to make 2nd, 3rd, and 4th iterative attacks I suspect that balance issues are going to have to over rule logic in this situation.

    Again though that's part of the reason I need to play test some of this stuff to see how it actually winds up working. The weapon speed changes are one of the things I haven’t run a game with yet.

    I could see possibly changing the feats to read as they are below. What do you think of those?

    Two-Weapon Fighting - Stays the same.

    Improved Two-Weapon Fighting [General]
    Prerequisites:
    Dex 17, base attack bonus +3 (dropped from 6)
    Benefit
    In addition to the standard single extra attack you get with an off-hand weapon, you get a second attack with it, at a -5 penalty in addition this attack and all other attacks you make this round suffer a -1 penalty for each point your BAB is under 6. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.

    Greater Two-Weapon Fighting [General]
    Prerequisites
    Dex 19, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack bonus +7 (rather than 11).

    Benefit
    You get a third attack with your off-hand weapon, albeit at a -10 penalty additionally this attack and all other attacks you make this round suffer a -1 penalty for each point your BAB is under 11See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Potsdam
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Narrowlands: Looking for a group to playtest

    Quote Originally Posted by Umarth View Post
    Improved Two-Weapon Fighting [General]
    Prerequisites:
    Dex 17, base attack bonus +3 (dropped from 6)
    Benefit
    In addition to the standard single extra attack you get with an off-hand weapon, you get a second attack with it, at a -5 penalty in addition this attack and all other attacks you make this round suffer a -1 penalty for each point your BAB is under 6. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.

    Greater Two-Weapon Fighting [General]
    Prerequisites
    Dex 19, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack bonus +7 (rather than 11).

    Benefit
    You get a third attack with your off-hand weapon, albeit at a -10 penalty additionally this attack and all other attacks you make this round suffer a -1 penalty for each point your BAB is under 11See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.
    You should fill in a paragraph that characters only get a second/third attack if they would be able to get it fighting one-weapon with the used weapon.

    Also, I don't see what the attack penalty does. A level 3 Fighter with Improved TWF makes his second off-hand attack at BAB-8, giving him an overall attack bonus of -5+STR+feats etc.?
    bis denn

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •