OOTS #897 - The Discussion Thread

[LadyEowyn]

Wow.

So 90% (at least) of forum speculation was wrong. They get control over V's soul, but not V's body. I don't think anyone called that.

[Forikroder]

Wow.

So 90% (at least) of forum speculation was wrong. They get control over V's soul, but not V's body. I don't think anyone called that.

not control, just ownership so they can do to it whatever they want but cant make it do anything

[Kish]

which is why I was saying it was a tie, the other side was right they could collect while he was alive, but incorrect that they could control her and I was wrong that they couldn't but right they could control her

at any right I was more wrong so I did lose the bet but I still remain that I was at least somewhat right

There aren't only two sides, Forikroder. Some people before the last comic went up were saying the fiends would do exactly what they just did.

I wasn't one of them; I was thinking (though I don't remember whether or not I actually said it) that the fiends' control of Vaarsuvius' soul would let them puppeteer Vaarsuvius' body. But I'm impressed that anyone did figure it out before it happened.

[Gift Jeraff]

Perhaps the fiends do not know of the affiliation between Sabine and V.. I mean it's assumed that if they were watching perhaps they say them at some point.. Or maybe Quarr said something to them. I think that IFCC do not know that they are acquainted and that what V learns will help the Order immensely.

Sabine was the one who made them aware of V.

[Forikroder]

There aren't only two sides, Forikroder. Some people before the last comic went up were saying the fiends would do exactly what they just did.

I wasn't one of them; I was thinking (though I don't remember whether or not I actually said it) that the fiends' control of Vaarsuvius' soul would let them puppeteer Vaarsuvius' body. But I'm impressed that anyone did figure it out before it happened.

there were multiple sides but I didn't make a bet with the whole forum

[Ninja Dragon]

I don't understand their plan. They gave the elf nearly unlimited power. That power enabled him/her to teleport to Azure City, challenge Xykon, and before leaving the city, sending Blackwing to throw the Phylactery in the gate, which made him finding out there is a planet in there. Now the next step in their evil plan is to use the contract to prevent V from using the information they gave to him?

Sounds like they made a mistake and now are trying to fix it. Maybe the other two fiends still have a purpose for V's soul.

[Forikroder]

I don't understand their plan. They gave the elf nearly unlimited power. That power enabled him/her to teleport to Azure City, challenge Xykon, and before leaving the city, sending Blackwing to throw the Phylactery in the gate, which made him finding out there is a planet in there. Now the next step in their evil plan is to use the contract to prevent V from using the information they gave to him?

Sounds like they made a mistake and now are trying to fix it. Maybe the other two fiends still have a purpose for V's soul.

I think everything is still going according to plan, they want the OoTS and TE to fight for as long as possible, so they need this gate to go so everyone moves on, V was (possibly) about to prevent that so they used one of there freebies to stop it

[rgrekejin]

so at this point do we call it a tie? they could take his soul while he was alive but they cant actually control him in any way

Yup, sounds fair to me. Your assertion that they couldn't control V's soul until her death was wrong, but I went too far in asserting that their control over V's soul would allow them to control her physical body. So, yup. Looks like a draw to me.

[With a box]

I wonder dimensional anchor can obviate that.
(i think it can, but I cannot sure.)

but I think V will use dimensional anchor on herself compulsively.

[Shale]

I don't understand their plan. They gave the elf nearly unlimited power. That power enabled him/her to teleport to Azure City, challenge Xykon, and before leaving the city, sending Blackwing to throw the Phylactery in the gate, which made him finding out there is a planet in there. Now the next step in their evil plan is to use the contract to prevent V from using the information they gave to him?

Sounds like they made a mistake and now are trying to fix it. Maybe the other two fiends still have a purpose for V's soul.

The plan was to cause V to lash out at Xykon, thus knocking Team Evil out of their nation-building rut and back onto the warpath. Mission accomplished: Xykon is on the move, and the fight is back on. The later use of V's soul was just a bonus - something that can help them tactically but was not their main objective in itself.

For that matter, it's entirely possible that destroying the Gate is the right thing for the Order to do here - the fiends want to stop either side from claiming a complete victory, which means it helps them not at all if Xykon wins right now.

[rgrekejin]

Though I must admit, I have no idea what the IFCC's plan is at this point. Why are they interested in the destruction of the Gates? And how could they have possibly known ahead of time that this exact situation would arise that they would need to avoid? Do they have someone with Oracular powers?

[Forikroder]

I wonder dimensional anchor can obviate that.
(i think it can, but I cannot sure.)

but I think V will use dimensional anchor on herself compulsively.

youd have to cast it on the actual soul though, just on the body wont work

maybe Eugene could help with that

[eras10]

Meh, I'm with Ninja Dragon. I trust this story and the author completely, but I'm a little nonplussed. That was a lot to offer V for a lousy 45 minutes of stasis for one good party member. It may have made an important difference, but it having done so was a low-probability event - blowing up the gate is already the most-likely outcome of this fight (and the others, as long as Xykon isn't losing).

Just think about how differently this would have gone... and how hosed the fiends' plan would be... if the Girarders were still alive. And the fiends didn't see that coming.

Seriously, they could have just swapped one word in the contract (from 'transfer' to 'ownership, or something like that, exact details unknown, etc), and V would have bought it.

Well, I'm sure the story will healthily survive this maybe-trying-a -little-too-hard-to-disagree-with-the-forum moment..

[exenia]

I really hope we get a V/Sabine conversation.

I think it's inevitable, can't wait. V stands to gain a lot here.

I doubt the fiends will be clumsy enough to let any major details slip, but V might be able to work some small piece of info out of them about the Gates and their goals. Sabine could give some insight into why Nale cares about the Gates at all, or if there's any deeper motive to them constantly bothering OOTS.

Even just watching the TV will reveal Tarquin and Malack in the LG lineup, Durkon's vampirism and Belkar's vulnerability, OOTS talking about Xykon being on the move or even Xykon coming on the scene outside.

[Amphiox]

It should be noted that it was not Darth V that knocked Xykon out of his complacency, but actually regular V.

Xykon was never really impressed with Darth V's power. What really unsettled him was regular V endangering his phylactery with the explosive runes trick.

[Ninja Dragon]

The plan was to cause V to lash out at Xykon, thus knocking Team Evil out of their nation-building rut and back onto the warpath. Mission accomplished: Xykon is on the move, and the fight is back on. The later use of V's soul was just a bonus - something that can help them tactically but was not their main objective in itself.

For that matter, it's entirely possible that destroying the Gate is the right thing for the Order to do here - the fiends want to stop either side from claiming a complete victory, which means it helps them not at all if Xykon wins right now.

Seems plausible enough. It's just that I thought V's soul had some purpose in their master plan. Well, maybe it still does, but will still work even if they don't have ~40% of the soul time?

Though I must admit, I have no idea what the IFCC's plan is at this point. Why are they interested in the destruction of the Gates? And how could they have possibly known ahead of time that this exact situation would arise that they would need to avoid? Do they have someone with Oracular powers?

I think the point is they don't have oracular powers. They are basically playing with fire, and hoping the fire burns in the direction they want.

[Amphiox]

Meh, I'm with Ninja Dragon. I trust this story and the author completely, but I'm a little nonplussed. That was a lot to offer V for a lousy 45 minutes of stasis for one good party member. It may have made an important difference, but it having done so was a low-probability event - blowing up the gate is already the most-likely outcome of this fight (and the others, as long as Xykon isn't losing).

Just think about how differently this would have gone... and how hosed the fiends' plan would be... if the Girarders were still alive. And the fiends didn't see that coming.

Seriously, they could have just swapped one word in the contract (from 'transfer' to 'ownership, or something like that, exact details unknown, etc), and V would have bought it.

Well, I'm sure the story will healthily survive this maybe-trying-a -little-too-hard-to-disagree-with-the-forum moment..

I think we should consider the possibility that the IFCC were actually telling the truth when they said V's soul was just bonus, and not the main payoff they are expecting from their deal.

If the Girarders were still alive, the IFCC probably would not have chosen to use their soul option on V at this particular moment. Their ultimate plan may not need to focus on specific details such has how and when each individual gate is destroyed or not destroyed. They are watching, being flexible, and reacting to the situation as needed.

[mattie_p]

I really hope we get a V/Sabine conversation.

I think V is sitting out the rest of the book, the next book opens with a V/Sabine conversation (possibly in bonus comic form).

[Silverionmox]

Well, it depends... the IFCC said "three minutes, six seconds for you, 20 minutes, 35 seconds for him and me."

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0667.html

So, the question is does "for him and me" mean EACH, or TOTAL?

I suspect it means each, because Lee said "my colleague is exercising his option" implying that the 20 minutes currently being exercised was Cedric's alone. And regardless, Nero still has his three minutes coming, even if Lee's time is also being used right now.

V lost Haerta first after dealing with the Black Mamma Dragon, the two other souls later when being sledgehammered by Xykon. The call options of the fiends on V's soul correspond with the time he used their souls.

[Gift Jeraff]

If the Draketooths were still around, Z may have been able to zero in on the pyramid and Nale probably would have tried to turn the Draketooth Clan against the OOTS like Elan expected. Then Sabine or Qarr would have tried getting close the Gate to destroy it.

That's my guess.

[Ninja Dragon]

I think we should consider the possibility that the IFCC were actually telling the truth when they said V's soul was just bonus, and not the main payoff they are expecting from their deal.

If the Girarders were still alive, the IFCC probably would not have chosen to use their soul option on V at this particular moment. Their ultimate plan may not need to focus on specific details such has how and when each individual gate is destroyed or not destroyed. They are watching, being flexible, and reacting to the situation as needed.

Meh, I guess I'm too used to "Everything is going exactly according to my plan" types of villains, like Tarquin. Whatever, using the contract to stop V from ruining their plan is great timing. Let's see how this develops.

[pendell]

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for neutral elves to do nothing."

*Snicker*.

I'm a little bit surprised that the payment requires nothing more than restraining the elf for a period of time. I suppose this means the three fiends have a pretty fair idea of what the future holds and are willing to accept such paltry terms in exchange for the expected benefit. They must know *exactly* how much time they need and when.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Finn Solomon]

Nero's eyes kinda look like the Monster in the Darkness's for a moment.

[Syncrogti]

As I've read the OOTS comic, one of the things I've been most impressed with is Rich's storytelling ability. Specifically making characters who seem real and tangible. And surprisingly for me, that evil characters can behave honorably and respectably, despite not having my RL values. Thank you for a wonderful story and excellent character development.

Sabine watching TV while the IFCC works is hilarious!

[Dracon1us]

holy ****

redemption is not for everyone
it's a rare and special thing

[The Pilgrim]

That sweet moment in which the Fiends tell V that her assumptions were wrong...

[magic9mushroom]

I just failed my Will save against shipping Vaarsuvius/Sabine. Particularly given that lovely scene in Azure City between them.

[Clistenes]

Notice how they don't give a crap if V learns what they can/intend to do with his/her soul or that Sabine works for them. This is their End Gambit.

We are approaching the end of the comic.

[Mollez]

Why does Elan look so upset in the last panel? What does he know/suspect?

[hamishspence]

The expression's more "alarmed" than "upset" I'd say- maybe because he's closest to the knocking sound, and might think something's about to come through the wall.