[3.5] Knight/Marshal multiclass feat PEACH

[WalkingTheShade]

Hello board !

I feel like the Knight does not get enough love.
In my current game, I have a player that for mostly fluff reasons plays a Knight 4/Marshal 2. He plans to dip into Marshal for at most 2 more levels.

I was thinking of how to help him not lag (too much) behind the Prestige Paladin or the Druid, not necessarily in term of raw power, but in term of options during a fight.

Here's what I came up with:
_____________

Chivalrous Commander
[Generic]
Your inflexibility in serving your ideals brings the highest respect from your comrades in arms. Being an example of discipline and valor helps you push them beyond their limits.

[Prerequisite]
Knight's challenge class feature, Knowing at least one Major aura from the Marshal's list

[Benefit]
Your knight and marshal levels stack for the purpose of determining the options available for your Knight's challenge feature and the DC to resist them.
For example, a 4th-level knight/4th-level marshal would be able to use Call to battle as a 8th level knight, and the DC to resist his Test of mettle would be 14 + his Cha modifier. (However, your marshal levels are not taken into account to determine the number of your daily challenges.)
In addition, anytime you have a major aura active, you can, as a swift action, spend one of your Knight's challenge daily uses to produce one of the two following effects, for a duration in rounds equal to your Cha modifier :
- increment the bonus given by any aura by 1,
- activate a second known major aura (you can have at most one minor and two major auras active at the same time).
You cannot use the first ability to more than double an aura's bonus.
_____________

What's your opinion?
The goal is to enable the Knight to keep progressing his key feature, but also to give him a couple minor options to burn his swift actions and challenges.
Moreover, the possibility to spend all your challenges to boost the same aura over a few rounds is deliberate.

Be nice, it's my first post in the Homebrew section.

[Amnoriath]

Hello board !

I feel like the Knight does not get enough love.
In my current game, I have a player that for mostly fluff reasons plays a Knight 4/Marshal 2. He plans to dip into Marshal for at most 2 more levels.

I was thinking of how to help him not lag (too much) behind the Prestige Paladin or the Druid, not necessarily in term of raw power, but in term of options during a fight.

Here's what I came up with:
_____________

Chivalrous Commander
[Generic]
Your inflexibility in serving your ideals brings the highest respect from your comrades in arms. Being an example of discipline and valor helps you push them beyond their limits.

[Prerequisite]
Knight's challenge class feature, Knowing at least one Major aura from the Marshal's list

[Benefit]
Your knight and marshal levels stack for the purpose of determining the options available for your Knight's challenge feature and the DC to resist them.
For example, a 4th-level knight/4th-level marshal would be able to use Call to battle as a 8th level knight, and the DC to resist his Test of mettle would be 14 + his Cha modifier. (However, your marshal levels are not taken into account to determine the number of your daily challenges.)
In addition, anytime you have a major aura active, you can, as a swift action, spend one of your Knight's challenge daily uses to produce one of the two following effects, for a duration in rounds equal to your Cha modifier :
- increment the bonus given by any aura by 1,
- activate a second known major aura (you can have at most one minor and two major auras active at the same time).
You cannot use the first ability to more than double an aura's bonus.
_____________

What's your opinion?
The goal is to enable the Knight to keep progressing his key feature, but also to give him a couple minor options to burn his swift actions and challenges.
Moreover, the possibility to spend all your challenges to boost the same aura over a few rounds is deliberate.

Be nice, it's my first post in the Homebrew section.

Well it definitely makes a better Marshal. A Knight's challenge abilities can really lend well to a leader type. I really don't see any problems with it as normally the major aura boots are often really small.

[ironwizard]

Seems reasonable. You might might even want to let the levels stack for purposes of determining Auras Known as well. It would still be a reasonable feat.

[eftexar]

Honestly I would just fold the aura's of the Marshal class into the Knight (at least for your player), instead of having him multiclass for it. The Knight and Marshal are two of the weaker classes in the game.
Especially the Marshal class. Even though it has some neat abilities it can use so few of them at a time your player will fall behind if he takes too many levels in the class.

[DR27]

That feat would be fine, but tbh it seems like the marshal was underpowered because the author thought it was a NPC class or something, and the Knight just isn't all that powerful. (but is still pretty well written) Allowing that particular character to Gestalt between the two classes would be a better solution to allow them to participate in a party that has both a Prestige Paladin and a Druid.

[nonsi]

I support the free-of-charge gestalt motion.

[The Dragon]

How about having the feat be on par with the other multiclassing feats? I'd shoot for swift hunter here, it's not going to brea anything.

Letting him advance both major auras, and knight challenge, with the additional way of using night challenges shouldn't be too much, while it still eeps away from going gestalt, which, while I support it balance wise, might not be so easy to sell to your player. He'd have to rework his character a bit.

[WalkingTheShade]

Thanks for the replies !

Honestly I would just fold the aura's of the Marshal class into the Knight (at least for your player), instead of having him multiclass for it. The Knight and Marshal are two of the weaker classes in the game.
Especially the Marshal class. Even though it has some neat abilities it can use so few of them at a time your player will fall behind if he takes too many levels in the class.

Allowing that particular character to Gestalt

I support the free-of-charge gestalt motion.

I don't want to let him Gestalt, since it would create a precedent. Others in the party are a Swift Ambusher, a polearm Fighter/Monk and a Bard. (The latter synchronizes quite well with the Marshal.) We might get a new player with a Swift Hunter.
Moreover, none of the players are so experienced with 3.X, meaning that both the Druid and the Prestige Pal' are not playing at full capacity.

I don't want the Knight to be more powerful: the player chose a class he knew is weaker than a full caster.
I just want to give him more options.

Another reason not to let him Gestalt is to force him to choose between the secondary Knight and Marshal abilities.
I think the fun in creating a character is in making difficult choices. I just want it not to be too difficult.

How about having the feat be on par with the other multiclassing feats? I'd shoot for swift hunter here, it's not going to brea anything.

Letting him advance both major auras, and knight challenge, with the additional way of using night challenges shouldn't be too much, while it still eeps away from going gestalt, which, while I support it balance wise, might not be so easy to sell to your player. He'd have to rework his character a bit.

Seems reasonable. You might might even want to let the levels stack for purposes of determining Auras Known as well. It would still be a reasonable feat.

That would be a better way to go in my opinion.
I'm still pondering if let the feat advance both the number of aura known and the major aura bonus.

[DR27]

I don't want to let him Gestalt, since it would create a precedent.

I don't want the Knight to be more powerful: the player chose a class he knew is weaker than a full caster.
I just want to give him more options.

Another reason not to let him Gestalt is to force him to choose between the secondary Knight and Marshal abilities.

I think the fun in creating a character is in making difficult choices. I just want it not to be too difficult.

Everything besides the precedent is poppycock. Gestalt between those classes isn't going to be more powerful - he will be channeling the majority of his power through his allies, and they will appreciate/not notice it, definitely not think "this guy is way better than us!"

Forcing a player to choose between mediocre and crappy isn't some sort of fun, exciting choice. Your solution of a half-assed multi class feat isn't going to "lessen the difficulty" - it just fools the player into thinking he is getting a good deal when he is just getting an ok one.

Personally, I would just show him T.G. Oskar's Marshal Retool and let him play that.