Why do dragons live in dungeons?

[Slipperychicken]

Between their incredible flight-speed, ranged attacks, and skirmish ability, it seems to me like dragons are much better-suited for life aboveground. Being in the confines of a cave only seems to negate these natural strengths and make them easy to hit with melee weapons. Most of them don't even have burrow speeds, so they're pretty much boned if an overwhelming opponent enters the cave, or if a burrowing opponent hit-and-runs them to death.

I know they want to defend their treasure, but wouldn't that be more easily accomplished by stashing it high on a mountain, which would be more easily defended via hit-and-run attacks on invaders, and from which the dragon can still flee if necessary?

[saxavarius]

Quiet you fool! You'll give people ideas!

But seriously it's a trope. Makes no real sense, but darnit we want a dragon at the end of our dungeon!

[Mordar]

Between their incredible flight-speed, ranged attacks, and skirmish ability, it seems to me like dragons are much better-suited for life aboveground. Being in the confines of a cave only seems to negate these natural strengths and make them easy to hit with melee weapons. Most of them don't even have burrow speeds, so they're pretty much boned if an overwhelming opponent enters the cave, or if a burrowing opponent hit-and-runs them to death.

I know they want to defend their treasure, but wouldn't that be more easily accomplished by stashing it high on a mountain, which would be more easily defended via hit-and-run attacks on invaders, and from which the dragon can still flee if necessary?

They live in dungeons and bait their lairs with treasure because their preferred meal is "Adventurer Tartar" and adventurers are known to frequent dungeons more than any other locale. Sure, the occasional adventuring party might swing by an isolated mountaintop or inaccessible swamp, but they are much too few and far between.

The "guarding the horde" thing is just propaganda put out by the wyrms to draw more kibbles to the lair. Plus you must remember where all that wonderful loot comes from...the meals are delivered and come with tips!



- M

[Corvus]

Its the way they were in legends - it may be a matter of the stats not refleting the legends.

Its hard to carry all the gold around so they needed a lair. And it doesn't matter where the lair is - adventurers will get there. Don't forget, adventurers are the only natural predator of dragons. Above ground, in cave, in flight, it doesn't matter, they know ever trick in the book to kill dragons. When out hunting, dragosn do rely on those tricks to ravage villages etc. It is a different matter when they are being hunted.

[Weltall_BR]

Paraphrasing something I have read around here: because Fafnir did, Beowulf's unnamed dragon did and Smaug did Because that is just what dragons do. They are giant skimpy lizards who sleep in their lairs guarding their hoard until someone breaks in or pisses them enough to make them leave it and completely burn everyone in an area of 100 miles around them until they have indulged their rage.

[Thrudd]

Maybe dragons used to live wherever they wanted, but they have been driven into hiding by civilization. Or they pick places that are hidden and out of the way to hide their treasure. It would be a shame if a battalion of crossbow wielding soldiers was able to follow them home and kill them. But if there's a maze full of other dangerous creatures and traps they have to pass through on the way to get you, probably only a couple of them will even make it to the lair.

[Sith_Happens]

Also, just because you live in a cave doesn't mean it can't be a cave with lots of easy escape routes.

[Terraoblivion]

Also, if the primary thing they're trying to guard their hoard against is other dragons, going somewhere that negates the natural strength of dragons while giving them a home field advantage makes sense.

[Pokonic]

Chromatic one's might do it because they have a bunch of evil minions running around, and according to the monster manual anything that lives below ground has a decent chance to be in the shallow end of the alignment pool. Depending on the color, it's entirely possible for a dungeon to fall in there choice home listings. Black dragons might lurk in a big old cavern because it works with the whole "causing darkness" ability they have, White dragons might do it to make there ice-making abilities work better, with the enclosed enviromants, and so on and so on. It's all a natural extention of making a lair, really. What's a better lair than a place like a dungeon filled with monsters?

On that note, a dragon of decent age would never really expect an overwhelming threat to attack them, on virtue of them being a dragon. Besides, confronting a dragon in it's lair, presumably filled with traps and servants and, futhermore, the dragon itself, should be a hard encounter if done properly. That's why the whole image of heros going in to slay the dragon is such a statisfiing one.

[DeltaEmil]

A dragon's most dangerous enemy is another dragon.

Living above ground means being food for another bigger dragon. Having your treasure in the open high in the mountains means another dragon will steal it easily while you're away. Living above ground means being attacked from all sides by a team of dragons that want to take you down and then divide your territory.

A dragon should only go outside of a dungeon/it's heavily defended and trapped cave lair for food, or a short raid for treasure, or when it is necessary to mate.

And woe befalls the dragon, if its rival dragon teams up with expendable but plentiful mortal wannabe-dragonslayers that know all the dragon's weaknesses, schedule, and behavior thanks to the rival, who bribed the wannabe-dragonslayers, or tricked them into doing its dirty work. A weakened dragon is then easier pray for the rival dragon. If the mortals still manage to kill off the dragon by themselves, that's also good for the rival dragon. Now it can either finish off the weakened dragonslayers, or get a share of the dead dragon's hoard, or simply take the dead dragon's territory for its own, which is still very lucrative, if the dragon was paranoid enough and had several hoards.

[Rhynn]

Dragons don't/shouldn't live in dungeons by choice, they live in lairs. A lair can be a dungeon, or adjacent to a dungeon, but usually the parts the dragon lives in are dragon lair first and foremost. Onysablet's lair in DL1 has immediate access to open air by the well, IIRC; the one dragon in D&D I can think of who lives in and cannot easily get out of a dungeon is the blue dragon in the Undermountain who's trapped in a single chamber by Halaster's magic tricks.

A dragon's lair should be easily defensible - that's why the dragon lairs somewhere - and probably genuinely hard to enter, with good exits and advantageous terrain. If your dragon is easier to defeat in its lair, you've built a horrible lair and are not doing justice to the dragon. (Unless, of course, this isn't D&D and your dragons are, for instance, big and dangerous animals, but not very smart.)

Also, ultimately: because they did in the stories.

[IW Judicator]

Its a known fact that dragons love ketchup (because adventurers are crunchy and good with it). By extension, most dragons would want to make a ketchup mine their home. However, most of those have already either been claimed by older, more powerful dragons or have long since had their ketchup stores run dry. Thus, most dragons make due with the closest reasonable approximation: a dungeon.

[Slipperychicken]

Dragons don't/shouldn't live in dungeons by choice, they live in lairs.

By "dungeon" I meant "cramped underground cavelike structure thing".

Also, it's mostly that I've rarely seen them encountered outdoors.

[Lord Raziere]

from a dragon:
"hey do you think I WANT to live here, mortal? no, I could be in a big freaking aerie or peak or something like that, all nest cozily up amongst the freezing winds! get a good spot of fresh and a view of the mountains and of course a good view of the prey like big herds of stuff.

but then you jerks came along and ruined it because we were too big in and in the open and "dangerous" so you started sending adventurers after us to kill us. the reason we hide in caves, is because you guys keep coming after us to kill us! We don't want that to happen! so by all means, go away either put up and start fighting like the attackers you are, or promise to not kill me and help me find a good peak or summit. I don't even hunt humans, its stupid to do so, wild animals are more vulnerable, have more meat and are more tasty, and often don't have weapons like those you wield right now."

[Sidmen]

It largely depends on the version of Dragonkind that exists in your setting.

For the most part, though, I've always seen dragons spoken of as sedentary creatures. Flying is HARD and takes a lot of energy, especially when you're old and big. So you want to sit around, maybe sleep for a century or two, and you don't want to be pestered by those mayfly mortals when you do it.

So what do you do?

Why not check out this ancient fortress that you saw being built when you were young - its got a swanky cave down there with easy access to a kobold cult you can subvert. And an old underground temple with some priests you can get to make sure the mortals in the surrounding countryside don't bother you.

[Drachasor]

By "dungeon" I meant "cramped underground cavelike structure thing".

Also, it's mostly that I've rarely seen them encountered outdoors.

Well, that's more like a home or den. It provides shelter and a place to store valuables safely. That doesn't mean they spend all their time there or even most of their waking hours.

[1337 b4k4]

Because dragons are adult female dwarves. No seriously. Now I can't take credit for this idea but for the life of me I can't find the source, if anyone has it please let me know.

The basic gist of it goes like this:

Dwarves love mining, and they love gold and jewels. Female dwarves especially love both gold and jewels so when a male dwarves seek to court a female, they mine for wonderous splendors. The dig great caverns and halls with 10 foot corridors and massive rooms filled with riches and wonders beyond imagination. And one of these great halls they build as the new home for their bride to be. And this hall in particular they fill with treasure, endlessly questing to bring sir love the greatest and brightest treasures in the land. But there is a flaw, as a female dwarf gets older, her body begins to change and soon she transforms into a dragon, and the great halls that were once her grand home and palace instead become her cage, leaving her trapped in her lair while her mate continues his quests to far lands for treasure. This incidentally is why you also almost never see female dwarves, it's a deep and dark dwarven secret.

I'll be honest, that description doesn't do the original write up I read justice, but it's definitely a fun little bit of flavor and myth.

[Rhynn]

By "dungeon" I meant "cramped underground cavelike structure thing".

Also, it's mostly that I've rarely seen them encountered outdoors.

That's mostly dragons being run badly. The first dragon I used in D&D 3.0 was a red dragon that the PCs annoyed. It killed half the party strafing them from maximum distance above them as they scrambled for cover.

I think killing a dragon in its lair should be possible, but only with a terrifying, deadly fight - unless the PCs are really clever. Dragonslayer and Vermithraxus Pejorative (and Volsungasaga/Nibelungenlied/Ring of the Nibelungs, of course) is a great example, IMO. Mostly, D&D-style dragons should be smart enough to make sure they have easy exits from their lairs, and a giant defensive advantage.

Of course, some dragons are, indeed, wyrms - wingless, even legless monsters.

[Slipperychicken]

Mostly, D&D-style dragons should be smart enough to make sure they have easy exits from their lairs, and a giant defensive advantage.

It says something about your species when a newborn is, on average, as intelligent as a fully-grown human.

[Sir_Thaddeus]

(spoiled for length)

Spoiler

Show

Because dragons are adult female dwarves. No seriously. Now I can't take credit for this idea but for the life of me I can't find the source, if anyone has it please let me know.

The basic gist of it goes like this:

Dwarves love mining, and they love gold and jewels. Female dwarves especially love both gold and jewels so when a male dwarves seek to court a female, they mine for wonderous splendors. The dig great caverns and halls with 10 foot corridors and massive rooms filled with riches and wonders beyond imagination. And one of these great halls they build as the new home for their bride to be. And this hall in particular they fill with treasure, endlessly questing to bring sir love the greatest and brightest treasures in the land. But there is a flaw, as a female dwarf gets older, her body begins to change and soon she transforms into a dragon, and the great halls that were once her grand home and palace instead become her cage, leaving her trapped in her lair while her mate continues his quests to far lands for treasure. This incidentally is why you also almost never see female dwarves, it's a deep and dark dwarven secret.

I'll be honest, that description doesn't do the original write up I read justice, but it's definitely a fun little bit of flavor and myth.

This. Is. Awesome. I am totally incorporating this into the next campaign I run.

With regards to the actual topic, I would like to second the people who cite older sources that D&D draws from as the originators of the idea. It may not make sense, but this is a game that draws heavily on tradition.

[Slipperychicken]

But there is a flaw, as a female dwarf gets older, her body begins to change and soon she transforms into a dragon, and the great halls that were once her grand home and palace instead become her cage, leaving her trapped in her lair while her mate continues his quests to far lands for treasure.

Even if it isn't setting canon, that sounds like an amazing curse to throw down on a dwarf who loves his wife above all else.

[BWR]

Dragons don't/shouldn't live in dungeons by choice, they live in lairs. A lair can be a dungeon, or adjacent to a dungeon, but usually the parts the dragon lives in are dragon lair first and foremost. Onysablet's lair in DL1 has immediate access to open air by the well, IIRC; the one dragon in D&D I can think of who lives in and cannot easily get out of a dungeon is the blue dragon in the Undermountain who's trapped in a single chamber by Halaster's magic tricks.

A dragon's lair should be easily defensible - that's why the dragon lairs somewhere - and probably genuinely hard to enter, with good exits and advantageous terrain. If your dragon is easier to defeat in its lair, you've built a horrible lair and are not doing justice to the dragon. (Unless, of course, this isn't D&D and your dragons are, for instance, big and dangerous animals, but not very smart.)

Also, ultimately: because they did in the stories.

What he said.

As a player I've never encountered dragons just holed up in a cramped space waiting to be killed by passing strangers. They were all encountered fully prepared for a fight, often ambushing us.

As a DM I've run only a few dragons (5, IIRC). Of those, only 1 was encountered in an actual dungeon (abandoned dwarf fortress, of course). That was a young green dragon who had just laid claim to some territory and was in the process of solidifying its control over the area when those pesky adventurers showed up, ignored its entirely reasonable offer of working form him and killed him (not before he felled 3/4 of the party). The rest were encountered out in the open where they could use their flight, speed and breath/spells to the fullest.

And all those dragons were from scripted adventure or adventure seeds.

[Hyena]

Because small tunnels with nowhere to run except backwards and fire breath mix well.

[Yondu]

Because if they live outside, they will be too difficult to kill, an airborne dragon is a perfect killing machine, unstoppable, except by a fully prepared war party....
And a RPG is a game so creators has made an horror ( a 50 yards fire breathing flying armored lizard .... imagine a giant T-REX covered with crocodile skin with wings spittting white phosporous....erkkkkh) and they choose to find a way to lessen their mistake, so it has to be in a small place to avoir TPK al the time

[hymer]

It seems to me that having a big hoard of treasure sort of requires that you don't have it lying about in the open. People could come from any direction and just take your stuff and walk off with it again in any direction. Not to mention exposure to the elements.
No, it's better to keep it in an underground lair of some sort, where you can control the environment a little and keep locks, traps and guard on the entrance. Incidentally, this also makes a spiffy place to spend the night and avoid some attempts to kill you in your sleep.
Preferably, you'll do your fighting in the open against small groups, but bottlenecks are important to deal with armies, and lairs are natural bottlenecks.

At least, it seems to make no less sense to me than so many other things. :)

[valadil]

All this is making me want to run a game with a dragon who is trying to acquire the world's largest bag of holding, so he has somewhere to stash his hoard without living in a cave.

[GungHo]

Also, it's mostly that I've rarely seen them encountered outdoors.

Why not? All that treasure has to come from somewhere, and it's not like you can trust goblins to bring you a bunch of cows.

[MukkTB]

I've mostly seen Dragons outside. The few times I've seen one in a cave, the cave's structure was such that it didn't hamper the Dragon. Large spaces, easy escape routes, traps, ect.

[Dovius]

I'd say that it's a pretty safe bet for a Dragon to make his lair in a dungeon/cave, just for a simple advantage:

Outside, while dragons certainly will have the advantage in mobility, the adventurers will be able to have freedom of movement that will help them evade their attacks.

Meanwhile, if the Dragon chooses a proper dungeon/cave, the adventurers will be nice enough to come into it's personal lair through the only entrance accessible to them, at which point the dragon will hose down the 10-15 feet wide entrance with a gargantuan blast of his/her native element, taking out half the party by blasting the lot of them while they're bottlenecking themselves close together.

Bonus points if the dragon's waiting for this exact situation by hanging on the wall over said entrance, and if he/she has prepared an escape route (hole in the ceiling too high for the adventurers to reach both from the in and outside of the building).

[LibraryOgre]

1) Defense against other dragons, especially while napping. An open aerie is an open invitation.

2) Defense against thieves. In an open aerie, three guys with fly spells and a portable hole can rob you blind. In a dungeon, they have to get to you.

3) Symbiotic organisms. A whole bunch of things live near dragons, trading relative safety for occasionally being eaten or assaulted by adventurers. See point 2.

4) Comfort. A cave is a constant temperature... usually cool, but you can go near volcanic vents for real heat. It is also comfortingly close and dark, if you like that sort of thing... and if you're raising dragonlings, it might be just the thing.