Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIX: "Understand the gravity of the situation."

[Somensjev]

what does everyone think of this abomination

particularly the first sentence of the second paragraph in the description

[Eldan]

what does everyone think of this abomination

particularly the first sentence of the second paragraph in the description

Heck no. It's yet more humans in tin cans. 40k has tons of them and they are all boring.

[Somensjev]

Heck no. It's yet more humans in tin cans. 40k has tons of them and they are all boring.

a friend showed me, and called it smurf village i laughed longer than i should have

[Artanis]

particularly the first sentence of the second paragraph in the description

Y'know, technically speaking, nightmares so horrible that they cause PTSD do fall into the category of "dreams"

[Lostintransit]

what does everyone think of this abomination

particularly the first sentence of the second paragraph in the description

I looked at the price and went When I got my entire chapter it was only 1000! Prices sure have changed...

[Somensjev]

Y'know, technically speaking, nightmares so horrible that they cause PTSD do fall into the category of "dreams"

may i sig this? i need it

[Requizen]

What is the better weapon for a Triarch Stalker between the Heavy Gauss Cannon and the Heat Ray? Inside 24", the HR seems like a better choice due to having 2 Melta shots and the flexibility of being an AoE as well. But, since Walkers always feel like early turn Pen bait to me (I've had mine blow up on Turn 1 two games in a row), the extra foot of range (not to mention the +1 S) on the HGC seems like a decent deal for 15pts.

Is it worth losing the flexibility and Melta power of the HR to get the range and Strength of the HGC?

[Artanis]

may i sig this? i need it

Be my guest

[Alexkubel]

just found the thread and I have a question who would object to my HQ choice

Spoiler: My HQ choice

Show

Baneblade

and as A personal rule I never fight Necrons.
I've had one guy kill an entire flying tryannid army. with a las pistol. I call it collateral damage, my opponent called it Heretical and clearly they're a cultist of Tzeech.

[Rakaydos]

The Escalation baneblade doesnt have the Command Tank upgrade, I believe. Only the Apocalipse version.

In an apoc game? Sure, go ahead.

[thedavo]

Speaking of Apocalypse, I've got what's ended up being a 15k a side one this weekend. Chaos, IG and Nids vs Eldar, Blood Angels and Space Marines.

Quite looking forwards to it!

[Cheesegear]

Speaking of Apocalypse, I've got what's ended up being a 15k a side one this weekend.

Rule 0. Bring snacks
It's most important. Hungry players are angry players.

#1. Take breaks
Tired players are angry players (tournaments all over the world have proved this several times over). Make sure you've scheduled some breaks. And then stick to that. Second, if some players need 'ten more minutes' or something, you let them have it.

#2. Time your turns
Part of getting your breaks in, is all about time. No-one likes sitting around doing nothing. I'd suggest setting up a half-hour timer for turns. Since nearly everyone has a phone these days, alarms and stop watches are everywhere.

#3. You don't need to see everything.
Part of getting your turns done quickly (and inside the time limit), is ignoring what everyone else on your team is doing. You don't need to see Guardsmen get killed by Boltguns. If you want to shoot at a players' models, and that particular player isn't rolling dice, then you get that player and make him pay attention to you.

#4. Limit Str-D Weapons
Send an e-mail or txt or Facebook message or something to your players. Right now! How many of them have Str-D ranged weapons? Particularly Blast weapons, too. If one side has more than the other, it's not going to be a fun time.

#5. Remember to Score
No, seriously. Also, it's helpful to set up story objectives. Although that requires time to balance, and it's not going to be for everyone.

#6. Don't use Unnatural Disasters
Just don't. Abaddon gets his Planet Killer once per game, and that's fine, because it's only one turn, and it isn't even a 'bad' Disaster.

[CN the Logos]

So, can anyone tell me how tall the Transcendent C'tan model that comes with the Obelisk/Tesseract Vault is, from the bottom of the skimmer base to the head of the model? Because I'd like to have one in the event that I find myself in a higher point game that will allow it, but I certainly don't want to spend $160 on the official kit. I figured what with the variety of possible C'tan, this would be a good conversion opportunity, but I need to know the dimensions of the official model.

Thanks.

[Renegade Paladin]

So, can anyone tell me how tall the Transcendent C'tan model that comes with the Obelisk/Tesseract Vault is, from the bottom of the skimmer base to the head of the model? Because I'd like to have one in the event that I find myself in a higher point game that will allow it, but I certainly don't want to spend $160 on the official kit. I figured what with the variety of possible C'tan, this would be a good conversion opportunity, but I need to know the dimensions of the official model.

Thanks.

I don't know exact measurements, but I do know the rough answer is "too small to be a credible Gargantuan Creature." I've heard that the normal C'tan Shard models are larger.

[hamishspence]

Normal Shards aren't mounted on Skimmer bases though.

Thanks to the increasing size of Monstrous creatures- the Transcendent C'tan is not the only undersized-looking Gargantuan Creature next to those.

The Gargantuan Greater Daemons all look a bit puny next to the Wraithknight.

[Renegade Paladin]

Yeah, but we all know that Wraithknights are really just the old Knight Titans brought back for baseline 40k and use the MC stats because they didn't want to put superheavy vehicle rules in core.

[Cheesegear]

So, apparently Highlander Lists are a thing now for some reason. Lists where you get only one of each non-Troop choice (there can only be one!), so, instead of having say, three Riptides, you can have one Riptide and one Crisis Team. I'm not sure this is a 'fix' that actually matters. Sure, you lose dual-Farseers and TRip-Tide builds, but it hurts way more armies than Tau and Eldar, and hurts other armies a lot more, to boot.

Sororitas are hamstrung.
Blood Angels are kind of screwed.
Daemons have ALL THE CHOICES!!!
Chaos Space Marines get exactly one Heldrake...
Dark Angels are simply boned.
Dark Eldar can salvage a list, especially in this meta.
Eldar are designed with a 'one-of-everything' style in mind, so don't care.
Grey Knights are fine.
Imperial Guard are laughing all the way to winning every game since they break the FOC anyway.
Necrons may find it tough, but doable.
Orks are just screwed. One unit of Lootas, one Dakkajet. You only get one Warboss or Big Mek, equals only one unit of Nobz, equals no spamming of Battlewagons...Sighface.
Space Marines - like Guard - have more than one good unit in every slot. Oh noes! You can't take two units of Sternguard? One of them has to be Legion of the Damned? How will you cope? You have to take a Stormtalon and Stormraven instead of three Stormtalons. Your list is obviously ruined. RUINED!
Space Wolves aren't happy. But if they just spam Grey Hunters like they do anyway, there's no real change. Just less Long Fangs. Use the points to buy Allies.
Tau don't care. As long as you don't take Stealth Teams or Vespid you can build a list out of anything in that book.
Tyranids are just sad. At least they're better than Dark Angels!



To me, Highlander encourages even more Death Stars.

[Wraith]

I can solve that problem for you, Cheesegear - just play more Necromunda.

'Cause that's what Unpronouncable and I did, all day yesterday, and we didn't even get kicked out of Warhammer World for playing a non-supported game. Lots of nostalgia, and despite a few hiccups with weirdly designed scenarios (I get d6 of my gang to fight 2d6 of yours? 1 guy versus 9, you say? Oh goody! ) still a very solid system.

Gotta say... GW need a big, quick payday bonanza, a là Space Hulk? Necromunda would do it in a heartbeat.

[Jormengand]

I can solve that problem for you, Cheesegear - just play more Necromunda.

'Cause that's what Unpronouncable and I did, all day yesterday, and we didn't even get kicked out of Warhammer World for playing a non-supported game. Lots of nostalgia, and despite a few hiccups with weirdly designed scenarios (I get d6 of my gang to fight 2d6 of yours? 1 guy versus 9, you say? Oh goody! ) still a very solid system.

Gotta say... GW need a big, quick payday bonanza, a là Space Hulk? Necromunda would do it in a heartbeat.

I remember a Necromunda game where my gang was an Orrus. Just the one, with eight levels on him to start.

He had sustained fire, T5 and W2, and all sorts of fun things. He was always good at the "X of gang 1 fight Y of gang 2" scenarios for some strange reason.

Then there was That One Guy who took 40 devotees with knives. There isn't even anything stopping you from doing that.

It was still fun, though.

[CN the Logos]

I don't know exact measurements, but I do know the rough answer is "too small to be a credible Gargantuan Creature." I've heard that the normal C'tan Shard models are larger.

So, about the right size to be represented by a figurine of Bahamut (from one of the newer Final Fantasy games that I haven't played) once I've rebased the thing. I can work with that.

Some might argue that this is proxying instead, and that I should be hanged for this travesty. To which I'd reply that the rebasing, repainting, etc... is work, I've never even seen a GW store so their policies on proxies don't matter to me, and anyone who won't accept a giant robot dragon as a transcendent shard of the Void Dragon wasn't going to like anything I scratch-built either.

...I probably will build one from scratch eventually, but I have to start somewhere, right?

[13_CBS]

Thanks for the IG anti-Tau tips, everyone! My friend and I had a ball coming with anti-Tau strategies yesterday.

Speaking of which, what should the IG be doing against Eldar? What are the Eldar particularly good at, and what can the IG do to counter them? What would a tailored anti-Eldar list look like?

(Keep in mind that we're just treating this as an intellectual exercise, my friend doesn't intend to actually tailor his real-life list to make Tau/Eldar players mad.)

[lord_khaine]

So, apparently Highlander Lists are a thing now for some reason. Lists where you get only one of each non-Troop choice (there can only be one!), so, instead of having say, three Riptides, you can have one Riptide and one Crisis Team. I'm not sure this is a 'fix' that actually matters. Sure, you lose dual-Farseers and TRip-Tide builds, but it hurts way more armies than Tau and Eldar, and hurts other armies a lot more, to boot.

For us only having 2 max of anything, and no allies, worked a lot better to prevent the most stupid lists, even if i did steamroll over both Grey Knights and Blood Angels in the couple of battles in our league.

I did suspect that being more a question of both of my last opponents being slightly stuck in 5th though.. and not having read the Eldar codex

[Wraith]

I remember a Necromunda game where my gang was an Orrus. Just the one, with eight levels on him to start.

I was always told that Malcadon (The Spider-guy) was always the best choice, if you were going to try a solo run since his guns almost always incapacitate an opponent, and he's better at close combat which is the most efficient way to remove people from the game.... But all of the Spyrers are fun to have around.

Then there was That One Guy who took 40 devotees with knives. There isn't even anything stopping you from doing that.

It was still fun, though.

Scavvy Boss with Knife: 100creds
Scavvy with Knife: 25creds
Scavvy with Knife: 25creds
85d6 Plague Zombies: 850creds

Not sure what happens in your second game, of course, but one would assume by that point everyone else has given up and gone home.

[Eldan]

That reminds me of Mordheim game, where my starting band was only Skaven with troop, plus one assassin.

Later, I had a sorcerer who actually turned out to become my best fighter. Teleporting 12" and then immediately attacking with 5 attacks at S5 or 6, I odn't quite remember. Tail weapon+berserker spell+lucky stat points+flail.

[Darthteej]

what does everyone think of this abomination

particularly the first sentence of the second paragraph in the description

If nothing else, it disproves without a shadow of a doubt the "Thousand Marine Myth".

[Cheesegear]

Gotta say... GW need a big, quick payday bonanza, a là Space Hulk? Necromunda would do it in a heartbeat.

Kind of missed out on putting out a 25th Anniversary game of Blood Bowl last year. The Internet was certain that they would. ...And then they didn't. Instead their 'big, exciting release' for December was a pun on 'big'. Ergh.

Speaking of which, what should the IG be doing against Eldar? What are the Eldar particularly good at, and what can the IG do to counter them? What would a tailored anti-Eldar list look like?

Depends what Eldar list they're running. Wave Serpents are completely different to Jetbikes/Hyrbrid are completely different to Footdar.

But, your winners are going to be;
Hellhounds
Leman Russ Eradicators
Colossi
Hydras (for Wave Serpents and Jetbikes)

In case you didn't spot it, Eldar are all about the Cover Saves. Then, just in case of Wraithknights, you need to bring Vendettas and Ratlings (I swear by my Ratlings, but, they're not for everyone...For those people; Marbo). Plasma Commands aren't going to work as well either. So, break out your Meltaguns and Meltavets again from 5th Ed. and rumble them forward. As always, your goal is to smash anything that even looks like it has a Bright Lance - or is a Wraithknight - and then try and kill some Infantry.

A typical Eldar list has a lot of S6 and S7. But not a lot above that. So, any Leman Russ will do. Except the Punisher - which does nothing - and the Executioner - which is just expensive, and Eldar don't have 2+ Saves anyway outside of Protected Jetbikes.

For us only having 2 max of anything, and no allies, worked a lot better to prevent the most stupid lists

Yeah, it's better. But it's still the same pitfall. It doesn't actually hurt a balanced Codex with good choices (Tau, Eldar, Marines, Daemons), and the Codecies that it does hurt, hurts a whole lot worse.

[Alexkubel]

my group plays mainly apoc as we have one Huge board that is unfortunately tilted (it has a hill and town at the bottom end that arrests most movement and so far only one unit has manage d to actually all off that side), there's a house rule if something slides it slides, and hits everything in the way which has meant that all vehicles have additional armour for these down hill careening tanks, the main competitors are easily land raiders, Hammerheads, monoliths, Nottingham (my leman Russ Executioner), some chaos Space Marine walker that one of my group thought it be funny to model on a surfboard (I think it's a defiler) and Eldar Jetbikes. as a rule NONE of these are allowed at the top end of the table as the latest maximum units knocked down is held by Nottingham at EVERYTHING, which is in other words everything ended up at the bottom of the table as it first pushed the surfing demon engine which slid across and knocked the monolith, towards the centre, and yea you get the idea, it went right though melee.
btw that was yesterday. we decided not to bring anything fragile to bear because we expected it to happen. and guess what most infantry that was still standing broke. (as in failed a moral check) and ran away.

[13_CBS]

K
But, your winners are going to be;
Hellhounds
Leman Russ Eradicators
Colossi
Hydras (for Wave Serpents and Jetbikes)

2 questions:

I keep being told Hellhounds are awesome, which is understandable since 6th edition really seems to value cover busting...but how does one get the Hellhound into position? I know it's a Fast vehicle, but isn't it also very squishy?

I thought Hydras had trouble hitting anything that wasn't a flyer?

Then, just in case of Wraithknights, you need to bring Vendettas and Ratlings (I swear by my Ratlings, but, they're not for everyone...For those people; Marbo). Plasma Commands aren't going to work as well either. So, break out your Meltaguns and Meltavets again from 5th Ed. and rumble them forward. As always, your goal is to smash anything that even looks like it has a Bright Lance - or is a Wraithknight - and then try and kill some Infantry.

Hmm...why meltas over plasma? I'm not terribly familiar with what Wraithknights are capable of--will S7 AP2 not get the job done?

[Rizhail]

If I remember correctly, skyfire weapons like on the hydra can hit both flyers and skimmers at full BS (hence the 'for wave serpents' part). The fact that they're long ranged, twin linked, and ignore jink saves means they're still good against jetbikes.

[13_CBS]

If I remember correctly, skyfire weapons like on the hydra can hit both flyers and skimmers at full BS (hence the 'for wave serpents' part). The fact that they're long ranged, twin linked, and ignore jink saves means they're still good against jetbikes.

Well, that's what I get for not knowing the rules.