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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    The Great White North

    Default Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground L

    Welcome, contestants, judges, and guests to Iron Chef L. Here in Optimization Colosseum, contestants will endeavor to create an optimized and flavorful character using a specified D&D3.5 prestige class as a "Secret Ingredient".

    Contestants: You will need to present a write-up of your build at at least one of the following points: 5th level, 10th level, 15th, 20th, and a "sweet spot" that you feel is the high point of the build, as well as presenting a fully-fleshed out 20-level build in the table below. Feel free to present as many of these as you like, and please give a rundown of the build's abilities and playability at all of the levels you didn't show. The rules are as follows:

    Menu: For most challenges, the "special ingredient" will be drawn from Core plus Completes. There will, from time to time, be special challenges that showcase secret ingredients from other books--for example, the XPH.
    32 point-buy is the presumed creation method, but we have generally allowed other levels of point-buy.
    If you do use a different point-buy, please make your case for its necessity in your entry. Keep in mind that for using exceptionally large or small point-buys may warrant deductions in elegance and/or power.

    Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Web-exclusive 3.0 or 3.5 materials by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden because I hate 'em.

    Cooking Time: Contestants will have until 11:59PM GMT on Monday, October 21st, 2013 to create their builds and PM them to the Chairman, Kuulvheysoon. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying. Judges will have until 11:59PM GMT on Monday, November 4th, 2013 to judge the builds and submit their scores. If no judges have scored by that point, only the scores of the first judge to submit will be counted.

    Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of Secret Ingredient.
    Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.
    Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is an automatic loss of one point per flaw in this category. Other things that will cause lost points here are excessive multiclassing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, will lose you points. Please note the following change: a legal source's relative obscurity should not be considered as penalizing Elegance, excepting the aforementioned issues with Unearthed Arcana. Using too many sources may be an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion, but a book's relative obscurity may not. In that same vein, drawing solely from the Core 3 (and the d20 SRD) should not be punished for lacking Originality.
    Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when reviewing the entries!
    Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry.
    Spoiler
    Show
    NAME OF ENTRY
    {table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

    1st|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    2nd|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    3rd|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    4th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    5th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    6th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    7th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    8th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    9th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    10th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    11th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    12th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    13th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    14th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    15th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    16th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    17th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    18th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    19th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    20th|New Class Level|
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |
    +x
    |Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

    Code
    Spoiler
    Show
    [b]NAME OF ENTRY[/b]
    {table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]Class[/b]|[b]Base Attack Bonus[/b]|[b]Fort Save[/b]|[b]Ref Save[/b]|[b]Will Save[/b]|[b]Skills[/b]|[b]Feats[/b]|[b]Class Features[/b]

    1st|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    2nd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    3rd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    4th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    5th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    6th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    7th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    8th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    9th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    10th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    11th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    12th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    13th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    14th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    15th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    16th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    17th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    18th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    19th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

    20th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

    For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)
    Spoiler
    Show
    Spells per day/Spells Known
    {table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

    1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

    Code
    Spoiler
    Show
    [b]Spells per day/Spells Known[/b]
    {table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]0lvl[/b]|[b]1st[/b]|[b]2nd[/b]|[b]3rd[/b]|[b]4th[/b]|[b]5th[/b]|[b]6th[/b]|[b]7th[/b]|[b]8th[/b]|[b]9th[/b]

    1st|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    2nd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    3rd|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    4th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    5th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    6th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    7th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    8th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    9th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    10th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    11th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    12th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    13th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    14th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    15th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    16th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    17th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    18th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    19th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-

    20th|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-[/table]

    For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.
    Speculation: Please don't post or speculate on possible builds until the "reveal," in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.

    Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners. If your entry includes a prestige class or ACF that grants Leadership or a Leadership-like ability as a bonus feat, the feat should be ignored and is not eligible to be traded away for another feat or ACF through any means.

    So! Who wants to sign up as a contestant, and who wants to sign up as a judge? Looking for as many contestants and judges as feel like playing!

    This week's special ingredient is:
    Heroes of Horror's Corrupt Avenger!
    We will award 1st through 3rd places, as well as a shout-out for honorable mention. The honorable mention prize is given to the most daring or unexpected build. Judges, contestants and guests alike are invited to vote for honorable mention via PM.

    Allez, optimiser!

    Contestants

    Judges

    The Builds

    Past Competitions

    Iron Chef I: Entropomancer
    Iron Chef II: Psibond Agent
    Iron Chef III: Cancer Mage
    Iron Chef IV: Stonelord
    Iron Chef V: War Chanter
    Iron Chef VI: Master of Masks
    Iron Chef VII: Green Star Adept
    Iron Chef VIII: Pyrokineticist
    Iron Chef IX: Animal Lord
    Iron Chef X: Mythic Exemplar
    Iron Chef XI: Blade Bravo
    Iron Chef XII: War Mind
    Iron Chef XIII: Vigilante
    Iron Chef XIV: Seeker of the Song
    Iron Chef XV: Drunken Master
    Iron Chef XVI: Assassin
    Iron Chef XVII: Ardent Dilettante
    Iron Chef XVIII: Unseelie Dark Hunter
    Iron Chef XIX: Dread Pirate
    Iron Chef XX: Incandescent Champion
    Iron Chef XXI: Ghostwalker
    Iron Chef XXII: Dervish
    Iron Chef XXIII: Divine Crusader
    Iron Chef XXIV: Tactical Soldier
    Iron Chef XXV: Scion of Tem-Et-Nu
    Iron Chef XXVI: Shadowdancer
    Iron Chef XXVII: Mindbender
    Iron Chef XXVIII: Cryokineticist
    Iron Chef XXIX: Consecrated Harrier
    Iron Chef XXX: Initiate of Pistis Sophia
    Iron Chef XXXI: Shadow Sentinel
    Iron Chef XXXII: Temple Raider of Olidammara
    Iron Chef XXXIII: Drow Judicator
    Iron Chef XXXIV: Dragon Disciple
    Iron Chef XXXV: Death Delver
    Iron Chef XXXVI: Acolyte of the Skin
    Iron Chef XXXVII: Justiciar
    Iron Chef XXXVIII: Hand of the Winged Master
    Iron Chef XXXIX: Renegade Mastermaker
    Iron Chef XL: Nightsong Infiltrator
    Iron Chef XLI: Geomancer
    Iron Chef XLII: Shadowblade
    Iron Chef XLIII: Bladesinger
    Iron Chef XLIV: Urban Soul
    Iron Chef XLV: Talon of Tiamat
    Iron Chef XLVI: Cipher Adept
    Iron Chef XLVII: Cold Iron Warrior
    Iron Chef XLVIII: Shadow Sun Ninja
    Iron Chef XLIX: Thrall to Orcus
    Last edited by Kuulvheysoon; 2013-10-31 at 05:47 PM.

    Avatar by Iron Penguin.

    The Power of the Orient: A Wu Jen Handbook

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
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    Location
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    FAQ:
    What's this even about? I'm glad you asked, actually...

    Is Dragon Compendium Allowed? Yes (as well as its Errata), but individual issues of Dragon Magazine are not.

    What about 3.0 materials? 3.0 materials, whether online or in printed form, are allowed unless they've been officially updated to a 3.5 edition.

    Are Dragonlance, Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, or Kingdoms of Kalamar allowable sources? The Dragonlance Campaign Setting is allowed, but the subsequent books for Dragonlance are considered 3rd party, and are therefore not eligible, despite the "WotC approved" status of those books. The same holds for Oriental Adventures (1st party) and the subsequent Rokugan books (3rd party). Materials from Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, and Kingdoms of Kalamar are considered 3rd party for purposes of this contest, and are therefore not allowed.

    What about online sources in general? If the online source is a) published by WotC, and b) not replaced by an updated version at a later time, it is eligible. Use it, link it.

    Where's the line drawn with "acceptable/unacceptable" for Unearthed Arcana? This will likely vary a bit from Chairman to Chairman. Item Familiars and Gestalt have always been verboten, since before IC migrated to GitP; don't expect that to change. Flaws have similarly always been noted as warranting a deduction; while I am Chairman, I'm extending that to Traits, though they warrant 1/2 the penalty in Elegance that a Flaw would because they're roughly 1/2 as useful. Alternate spell systems, alternate skill systems and alternate crafting rules all create an uneven playing field, and as such, will be disallowed for as long as I am Chairman. Bloodlines are ripe for abuse, and will be strongly discouraged as long as I am Chairman. Note that judges are allowed to look askance at any use of Unearthed Arcana not specifically mentioned above, at their discretion, and otherwise penalize Elegance according to their preference.

    What, exactly, does the ban on Leadership mean? As folks have started to try to work around the edges of this one, I'm forced to spell it out more plainly. No Leadership, Draconic Cohort, or Feats that grant a similar ability are allowed EXCEPT Wild Cohort while Kuulvheysoon is chairman. Any PrC you choose with Leadership or a Leadership-analog has that ability entirely ignored for this contest, as it may neither be used nor traded away via any means whatsoever.

    What's the minimum score in a category? Assuming an entry is legal, the minimum score in any category is 1. If a judge is convinced that an entry is illegal by the RAW, the judge may give a 0 or decline to score a given entry. Because this contest focuses on Player Characters, an entry that is not technically allowed for a PC, but is viable as an NPC, counts as a legal entry, but may receive a minimum score at the judges' discretion.

    Ha hah, Kuulvheysoon, you fool! Time for NI Undead Taint shenanigans! I'm afraid not - for the purposes of this contest, assume that Undead (and [Evil] Outsiders) cannot gain any (additional) Taint, and only receive how much they are alloted by their Type (They automatically have effective corruption and depravity scores equal to one-half their Charisma score, +1 for undead or +2 for outsiders. They take no penalties due to these taint scores, but they can use them to qualify for feats or prestige classes). Creatures immune to the negative effects of Taint and other creatures with a non-ability for Constitution (Dustform Constructs, etc...) are treated as Undead.

    But what about the randomly generated Corruption/Depravity signs? I've decided to crack this one wide open - feel free to choose your own signs of Corruption.

    And the bonus feats granted by Taint? Yes, you must qualify for them (lacking any language to the contrary).

    Additional Rulings
    :
    Spoiler
    Show
    Ruling the First: Treat the 'Unnerved' condition as a fluff text for an improved shaken condition. In other words, it is in all ways identical to shaken except for the increased penalties.

    Ruling the Second: The condition lasts for a number of rounds equal to the Corrupt Avenger's Charisma modifier (minimum 1 round).

    Ruling the Third
    : A Corrupt Avenger's sworn foe can be selected from any of the Favored Enemies available to a vanilla (AKA no Alternate Class Features) PHB Ranger. While this does stack with a Ranger's Favored Enemy bonus, it cannot be used in place of any feat or class feature that requires a Favored Enemy.
    Exception: You may, at your option, select an Organization as the Ranger Alternate Class feature.

    Ruling the Fourth: Consider Heroes of Horror to be the primary source for the Taint rules.

    Ruling the Fifth: People, seriously? There are maximum limits to your Depravity/Corruption scores (unless you've become immune, in which case your Taint is fixed) before your character becomes an NPC (Which would be Bad).
    Last edited by Kuulvheysoon; 2013-10-31 at 05:49 PM.

    Avatar by Iron Penguin.

    The Power of the Orient: A Wu Jen Handbook

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    What is the cap for our corruption/taint score? I am assuming we don't want to all be running around with NI numbers here.

    Are the "tainted x" classes allowed? I was under the understanding they were normally barred for good reason.

    What are the rules regarding undead with this SI?
    Last edited by Venger; 2013-10-07 at 11:10 PM.
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by weckar View Post
    Venger, can you be my full-time memory aid please?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition
    Iron Chef Deep Freeze: Turning Tables on Old Dishes

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
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    The Great White North

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by Venger View Post
    What is the cap for our corruption/taint score? I am assuming we don't want to all be running around with NI numbers here.

    Are the "tainted x" classes allowed? I was under the understanding they were normally barred for good reason.

    What are the rules regarding undead with this SI?
    The Corruption/Taint caps are on Page 63 of Heroes of Horror.

    Rules concerning Undead are also published in the book.

    This one is a reward for putting up with the last couple of horrendous classes. Enjoy.

    Avatar by Iron Penguin.

    The Power of the Orient: A Wu Jen Handbook

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Venger's Avatar

    Join Date
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuulvheysoon View Post
    The Corruption/Taint caps are on Page 63 of Heroes of Horror.

    Rules concerning Undead are also published in the book.

    This one is a reward for putting up with the last couple of horrendous classes. Enjoy.
    so no houserules regarding taint.

    ...

    This is going to be an odd round.
    fight my brute! it's a lot of fun
    Quote Originally Posted by weckar View Post
    Venger, can you be my full-time memory aid please?
    Iron Chef Medals!
    Amazing Princess Mononoke avatar by Dispozition
    Iron Chef Deep Freeze: Turning Tables on Old Dishes

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Troll in the Playground
     
    The Viscount's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Oooook. This one is going to require some more clarification.

    1. For this, are we assuming that undead cannot gain more taint than they automatically begin with? I have seen some play that way, will we?

    2. For the sworn foe fury thing, how do we determine which duration to use? Do we simply choose? Do we use the longer? The shorter?

    3. Because this is an HoH PrC, the writers forgot they had to put a duration on frightful fury. What is it?

    4. Are we supposed to treat "unnerve" as a new status condition, or simply regard it as fluff text and increase the penalties from frightful fury? I'm assuming the duration on this is same as frightful fury.
    Last edited by The Viscount; 2013-10-07 at 11:28 PM.
    Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
    Quote Originally Posted by willpell View Post
    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
    Awards

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by The Viscount View Post
    Oooook. This one is going to require some more clarification.

    1. For this, are we assuming that undead cannot gain more taint than they automatically begin with? I have seen some play that way, will we?
    ...Would you believe that that was the only possibility I even thought possible? Yes, you should assume that that's how this will be run.

    2. For the sworn foe fury thing, how do we determine which duration to use? Do we simply choose? Do we use the longer? The shorter?
    Seems pretty clear to me - it's activated until you meet one of the two conditions - you've spent a number of rounds equal to your corruption score in a fury, or there's none of your sworn foes visible within 60ft.

    3. Because this is an HoH PrC, the writers forgot they had to put a duration on frightful fury. What is it?
    Assume that Frightful and Unnerving Furies are both upgrades to the Sworn Foe class feature.

    4. Are we supposed to treat "unnerve" as a new status condition, or simply regard it as fluff text and increase the penalties from frightful fury? I'm assuming the duration on this is same as frightful fury.
    Thats... a good question. for some reason, I was thinking that it was in amongst the shaken and cowering conditions. I'll toss it up to Curmudgeon.

    Avatar by Iron Penguin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Hmm well I missed the last two, and I am a sucker for Halloween events. I'm definitely in this time, and if I do not make a character for this one I must be ridiculed or something, because it will mean I have gone completely mad.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Just to make sure I've got things straight.

    2 Whichever comes first.

    Oh, I realize I asked 3 poorly. what I meant to ask was, when a foe is rendered shaken or "unnerved", how long does it last for? The writers forgot to include a duration, HoH is awful about that.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by The Viscount View Post
    Just to make sure I've got things straight.

    2 Whichever comes first.

    Oh, I realize I asked 3 poorly. what I meant to ask was, when a foe is rendered shaken or "unnerved", how long does it last for? The writers forgot to include a duration, HoH is awful about that.
    Alright, done. If I don't get an answer in the next couple days, I'll rule what I deem right. Sound fair?

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    The Power of the Orient: A Wu Jen Handbook

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    I'm going to have to read over the taint rules, but I've got some ideas kicking around for this one. One I really like, but I have to see how the rules work and fiddle with it a bit. The other is one I'm going too push off to the side and resist working on until I run out of other stuff. I might end up double submitting.
    Last edited by WhamBamSam; 2013-10-08 at 12:07 AM.

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Major question concerning taint and undead:

    Are Undead capable of gaining taint via other classes which give taint as part of their class abilities? Because... umm... I'm seeing several infinite loops here.

    Please clarify your position concerning Undead and Taint in your OP. There's a... very well known cheese build... which has certain aspects that can be horribly abused with RAW without actually duplicating the build. And one other PrC in specific.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by ShneekeyTheLost View Post
    Major question concerning taint and undead:

    Are Undead capable of gaining taint via other classes which give taint as part of their class abilities? Because... umm... I'm seeing several infinite loops here.

    Please clarify your position concerning Undead and Taint in your OP. There's a... very well known cheese build... which has certain aspects that can be horribly abused with RAW without actually duplicating the build. And one other PrC in specific.
    yes, didn't want to come out and name that class since I feared it would be against the rules, but I would also appreciate a ruling on this.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by ShneekeyTheLost View Post
    Major question concerning taint and undead:

    Are Undead capable of gaining taint via other classes which give taint as part of their class abilities? Because... umm... I'm seeing several infinite loops here.

    Please clarify your position concerning Undead and Taint in your OP. There's a... very well known cheese build... which has certain aspects that can be horribly abused with RAW without actually duplicating the build. And one other PrC in specific.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venger View Post
    yes, didn't want to come out and name that class since I feared it would be against the rules, but I would also appreciate a ruling on this.
    Adding something in the FAQ now - thanks, guys.

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    The Power of the Orient: A Wu Jen Handbook

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S. Kemp
    Frankly, I think the designers and novelists did great work in the post-Spellplague Realms. But, in the end, this wasn’t a new setting. It was the Realms, the Realms 100 years later, and therein lay the problem.

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Since my midterms are finishing I might be in again

    Could we define creature type? Because as far as I know creature type is humanoid, or monstrous humanoid and bugbears are most definitely not a creature type.
    Last edited by thethird; 2013-10-08 at 01:32 AM.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

  16. - Top - End - #16
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    Kobold

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Do you have to maintain a non-evil alignment and moderate taint? Or can you fall for the corruption and go full evil?
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Huh. I cannot help but look back at my comments in the last round regarding the Taint mechanic and wonder if there's causation, or merely correlation.

    In any event, I'll try to build for this contest.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    The more I read about this class the more poorly written it appears to me.

    What does ragelike fury mean?

    Does it has the restrictions of a barbarian rage, and thus disallows spellcasting?

    Does it count as rage for prerequisites?

    Is there a limitation to its uses or after having it finished would it just start again if the trigger "being in sight of a sworn enemy" is still active?

    Also... just to be clear since it is Ex it is not an action to activate is it?
    Last edited by thethird; 2013-10-08 at 08:42 AM.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    I'm going to be in this round one way or the other.

    I've never really played with Taint rules before so I'm going to have to study up on that.

    Holy easy prerequisites Batman!

  20. - Top - End - #20
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by thethird View Post
    The more I read about this class the more poorly written it appears to me.

    What does ragelike fury mean?

    Does it has the restrictions of a barbarian rage, and thus disallows spellcasting?

    Does it count as rage for prerequisites?

    Is there a limitation to its uses or after having it finished would it just start again if the trigger "being in sight of a sworn enemy" is still active?

    Also... just to be clear since it is Ex it is not an action to activate is it?
    My 2 cents: ragelike fury: I read it as a +2 Str +2 Con for corruption score rounds (or absence of sworn enemy).
    It's no rage ability.
    Yes it can trigger again after you made your fort save (therefor your corruption increases and so does the length).
    No action to activate.

    Any other interpetations?
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Huh. I'm going to need to read up on the Taint rules for this one.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by Korahir View Post
    My 2 cents: ragelike fury: I read it as a +2 Str +2 Con for corruption score rounds (or absence of sworn enemy).
    It's no rage ability.
    Yes it can trigger again after you made your fort save (therefor your corruption increases and so does the length).
    No action to activate.

    Any other interpetations?
    That would be my reading too, but wanted to confirm.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

  23. - Top - End - #23
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Happy 50th*, Iron Chef!

    You know I'll be participating in some vein. As a minor nitpick, shouldn't this be Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground L? XL was Nightsong Infiltrator, around last year's holiday season.

    *On GitP, at least.
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground L

    Quote Originally Posted by OMG PONIES View Post
    Happy 50th*, Iron Chef!

    You know I'll be participating in some vein. As a minor nitpick, shouldn't this be Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground L? XL was Nightsong Infiltrator, around last year's holiday season.

    *On GitP, at least.
    How did I not notice this? I love Roman numerals.

    As an aside, why does this feel like Cold Iron Warrior to me?

  25. - Top - End - #25
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by Korahir View Post
    My 2 cents: ragelike fury: I read it as a +2 Str +2 Con for corruption score rounds (or absence of sworn enemy).
    It's no rage ability.
    Yes it can trigger again after you made your fort save (therefor your corruption increases and so does the length).
    No action to activate.

    Any other interpetations?
    Just wondering what happens if you have no Corrpution score, say for example you find a way of reducing your Corruption to 0. What takes precedence, the number of rounds, or the lack of sworn enemies?

  26. - Top - End - #26
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaz View Post
    Just wondering what happens if you have no Corrpution score, say for example you find a way of reducing your Corruption to 0. What takes precedence, the number of rounds, or the lack of sworn enemies?
    If that were to happen you wouldn't meet the prereqs anymore.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

  27. - Top - End - #27
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Which has no bearing; r.e Complete Arcana/Warrior unique rule. It is down to the individual entrant and individual judge to make their own decision regarding that.

  28. - Top - End - #28
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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    Wouldn't it prevent you from advancing in the class?
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground XL

    chairman, there seems a general consensus that we need some rulings on how... like all of our class features work. thethird said it I believe most succinctly.
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground L

    Quote Originally Posted by dysprosium View Post
    As an aside, why does this feel like Cold Iron Warrior to me?
    Glad to know I am not the only one that felt that way...
    Last edited by Kreuz; 2013-10-08 at 11:42 AM.

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