Dark Elves question.

[Icwer]

Good day all!

I'm soon going to undertake the Test of High Sorcery and my DM pointed out a problem.
My Silvanesti elf is Lawful Neutral and therefore will probably enroll with the Red Robes. However, since elves don't agree with this they'll most certainly outcast me and I'll become a dark elf.
My question is: if I do become a dark elf, will I immediately change into a dark-skinned, white haired elf (just to be stereotypical) or am I just treated as an outcast?
I know I could just clean up my act a little and become Good, buy hey, where's the fun in that?

[Khantalas]

Drow don't exist in Dragonlance. You are simply an outcast.

[silentknight]

Drow don't exist in my campaign either. A dark elf is an elf who is evil and/or has done something that causes them to be outcast from society.

Yeah, becoming an outcast elf in Dragonlance just means you are labeled "dark elf", you don't change into a drow.

[Matthew]

No Drow in Dragon Lance. No Drow in my Homebrew world either, just Dark Elves in the sense of 'fallen' or 'Outcast'.

[Khantalas]

My homebrew campaign has no elves. It has aelfans, less fey versions of elves. The closest thing to drow would be deep aelfans, as in they both live deep beneath the surface. Although deep aelfans live beneath the branches of tall trees, are albinos and good creatures.

Yes, good albinos.

[Yuki Akuma]

How... how would being an outcast suddenly change your species? This question makes no sense...

[Icwer]

It could be a curse, heck if I know, I don't know much about the game surrounding this matter.

But thanks for the replies, now I am far less worried.

[Thomas]

"Dark elf" is just a designation in Ansalon. It's not a race. You get dark silvanesti, dark qualinesti, dark kagonesti, and dark aquatic elves (I forget the two races' names; dark aquatic elves turn into sharks, which is the only difference any Dragonlance dark elf has from the base race's abilities).

Dalamar was a dark elf, but looked like any other elf.

[Dhavaer]

Since we seem to be discussing elves in our own campaign:

My campaign world has elves, who are short, slim, like archery and nature and tend to be eco-terrorists, although most aren't terribly violent about this. There are also drow, who are tall, average to slim build, have a somewhat hive-like attitude towards each other and tend to engage in commerce, generally backed up by the ability to beat the snot out of you if you try and cheat them.
Elves and drow are completely different species, having only pointy ears, good senses and notable agility in common. They don't particularly like or dislike one another and have no mutual history, since elves like plains and forests while drow lived in tundra and cave networks.

[Thomas]

Aldryami (Gloranthan elves) are the best elves. They're intelligent, humanoid plants. Mreli (brown elves) are deciduous, vronkali (green elves) are evergreens (and defend the forests during the winter, when the brown elves sleep), and embyli (yellow elves) are tropical. Embyli only have males, and breed with their dryad queens. (Dryads are sort of aldryami spirits; nymphs of the trees and plants.) Other aldryami include pixies, related to flowers, and runners, related to vines (they look something like small apes or monkeys). The depiction of aldryami has varied a lot, but basically they're human-shaped plants. I personally love the depictions of Aldryami warriors as bark-covered humanoids.

We don't talk about slorifing (red elves). They're related to ferns, live in swamps, are also called goblins, and are repulsive. Voralan (black elves) are mushroom elves, and even weirder than slorifing. Voralan aren't really Aldryami; slorifing probably are, but I don't imagine other Aldryami would like to own up to that.

Gloranthan non-human species are the best, in general. They're different, weird, inhuman, and detailed.

[Athenodorus]

Holy derail batman! :)
In my campaign world, Elves had a vast magical empire, but destroyed themselves, and therefore are not available as player races...though I may bring in survivors as plot hooks at the high levels. I'm sure it's been done before a million times, though. :(

[JadedDM]

and dark aquatic elves (I forget the two races' names; dark aquatic elves turn into sharks, which is the only difference any Dragonlance dark elf has from the base race's abilities).

Dargonesti = Dolphins
Dimernesti = Sea Otters

[Thomas]

Dargonesti = Dolphins
Dimernesti = Sea Otters

Them's the ones. I think turning into a shark beats turning into an otter... advantage: Burns-- er, I mean, the bad guys.

[silentknight]

"How... how would being an outcast suddenly change your species? This question makes no sense..."

Surviving the Test of High Sorcery can exact some very potent changes, curses, or magical altering of the mage in question. If I was the DM, I just might turn an elf into a drow as a result of the Test.

[Shadow of the Sun]

Yeah, drow are a bit weird. A cool idea to use in a homebrew campaign is that dark elves are outcasts who ritually tattoo themselves completely black to signify something (significance pending).

[JadedDM]

The confusion comes from the term "Dark Elf." Drow are known as dark elves. But there are no drow on Krynn.

On Krynn, a 'dark elf' is any elf (Qualinesti, Silvanesti, Kagonesti, Dimernesti, or Dargonesti) that has turned away from the 'light' (i.e., the Good alignment). They do not go under any kind of physical change. A dark elf looks just like any other elf. They are simply banished from their homeland.

A good example is Dalamar. He was a Silvanesti who joined the Black Robes and was therefore outcast from his people. He was still a Silvanesti and looked like one. His skin did not turn black, his hair did not turn white, his eyes did not turn red--and he certainly did not gain any special Underdark powers. He was just an exile, that's all.

[Dan_Hemmens]

Does anybody else find it a bit ludicrous that you can become an outcast from Elvish civilisation for becoming (gasp) Neutral!

Is the Elvish High Council run by Zap Brannigan or something?

"What happened? Did you turn Neutral, or were you just born with a heart filled with Neutrality?"

[Matthew]

*Laughs*

No, I think they are against the Red Robes rather than Neutral Alignment, if you see what I mean.

[Leon]

Good day all!

I'm soon going to undertake the Test of High Sorcery and my DM pointed out a problem.
My Silvanesti elf is Lawful Neutral and therefore will probably enroll with the Red Robes. However, since elves don't agree with this they'll most certainly outcast me and I'll become a dark elf.
My question is: if I do become a dark elf, will I immediately change into a dark-skinned, white haired elf (just to be stereotypical) or am I just treated as an outcast?
I know I could just clean up my act a little and become Good, buy hey, where's the fun in that?

All that'll happen is you'll get the cold shoulder from the rest of your kin and have to live life away from the glory of elven civilisation

@ Thomas: i like your elves


Last campain i ran the primary population were Dark Elves (not "drow") i used the Gary elves as the basis

[Thomas]

Does anybody else find it a bit ludicrous that you can become an outcast from Elvish civilisation for becoming (gasp) Neutral!

Especially considering how Silvanesti are more Lawful Evil than anything. "Oh, look, Kagonesti. Let's enslave- I mean, let's offer them gainful employment as indentured serva- I mean, as retainers, cleaning our boots and wiping our asses at half a gold per month."

Heavy-handed, hackneyed portrayal of moral and societal hypocricy? Where?

[Setra]

Just a thought, but while Dark Elves aren't Drow, I am fairly sure Drow do exist in Dragonlance.

Didn't Raistlin have to fight one as part of his Test?

I think I recall the group meeting another Drow somewhere...

Then again I've only read the books, and have no clue as to the actual campaign.

[Thomas]

Just a thought, but while Dark Elves aren't Drow, I am fairly sure Drow do exist in Dragonlance.

Didn't Raistlin have to fight one as part of his Test?

I think I recall the group meeting another Drow somewhere...

Then again I've only read the books, and have no clue as to the actual campaign.

No, no, and nope.

Raistlin faced a dark elf. Not a drow. A dark elf, like Dalamar.

This is pretty clear and explicit. No drow in Krynn.

[Matthew]

There is the odd random occurrence. I think the Banshee in Pax Tharkas might also be described as a Drow. Probably a conflation of terms, but other theories suggest Planar Travellers. What seems certain is that Drow are not native to Dragon Lance.

[Setra]

No, no, and nope.

Raistlin faced a dark elf. Not a drow. A dark elf, like Dalamar.

This is pretty clear and explicit. No drow in Krynn.

Odd... oh well..

You sure he faced a Dark Elf though? I vaguely remember something about 'a deadly scream' or something to that extent, Argh I really need to find my copy of Dragons of Autumn Twilight so I can check. Too bad my brother kidnapped it.

[Matthew]

According to Wikipedia:

Drow

Dark Elves in Dragonlance are occasionally (and no doubt accidently) conflated with Drow (in the familiar sense) in published material.

[Setra]

Alrighty then.

Though now I wonder where I remember hearing about 'a deadly scream' in Dragonlance.

[Matthew]

Pax Tharkas, I believe. After the party pass into the lower fortress they have to face a Banshee.

[The J Pizzel]

Hate to play devils advocate...but the Companions DO face an undead Drow in Pax Tharkas (i find this very amusing considering i finished the book LAST NIGHT). Raistlin yells 'Dark Elf' and then from that point on the writer as well as the Companions refer to it as a Drow. Actually, they face it in Sla-Mora (or something like that, don't have the book with me), the secret tunnel going into Pax Tharkas, right after Tanis gets Wrymslayer.
jp

[Matthew]

Yes, that's what we are saying. However, it is not clear that Drow refers to anything other than a synonym for Dark Elf [or Fallen Elf]. There is no direct description of a Drow in the core Dragon Lance material, as far as I am aware. However, elsewhere Drow and Dark Elves are described in the more widely understood sense (White Hair, Black Skin). These are generally considered contradictory and errors on the part of the authors. Alternatively, it has been suggested that such instances are Planar Travellers.
There are mistakes, Dalamar is not dark skinned in the core material, but ancillary texts confuse his description as a Dark Elf as meaning Drow.

The canon stance is that there are no Drow in Dragon Lance.

[mikeejimbo]

Good day all!

I'm soon going to undertake the Test of High Sorcery and my DM pointed out a problem.
My Silvanesti elf is Lawful Neutral and therefore will probably enroll with the Red Robes. However, since elves don't agree with this they'll most certainly outcast me and I'll become a dark elf.
My question is: if I do become a dark elf, will I immediately change into a dark-skinned, white haired elf (just to be stereotypical) or am I just treated as an outcast?
I know I could just clean up my act a little and become Good, buy hey, where's the fun in that?

Yeah, I agree, where's the fun in becoming Good? I say dirty up your act a bit, become Evil, join the Black Robes and then murder your kin in their sleep.