A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    Problems with the Monk: MAD as a hatter, with medium BAB, all the actually useful features way up at the front, really cool ideas at the back that end up being more trouble than they're worth. Flurry of blows is great, but unreliable.

    I'm sure other people can come up with other problems to address, but those are the ones I felt were most important. Sometimes people complain about the HD size or the skill points, but I've always felt the monk was not supposed to be a skill-monkey, or even that skillful, and the HD size could be worked around. For what a monk is supposed to be, he doesn't need a huge HD. He's got that monster speed bonus so he doesn't have to stick around and get smacked. Also, he doesn't need Knowledge skills, perform, profession, diplomacy, sense motive, or craft. His job is not to be party face, party know-it-all, or party tinkerer. His job is to be running way ahead of the group, ready to warn of trouble, and when it comes, to be flying around the battlefield at top speed setting up sneak attacks and stunning people and whatnot.

    This monk has 1 ability that is clearly the most important for him, and all the others are certainly handy. But this way, you can jack up Wisdom, dump Charisma through the floor, and arrange the others however you like. I added a couple official class features that I feel the monk should have, and then I added my own ideas for what a monk should be able to do.

    I'm not a very experienced homebrewer, so please give me feedback and criticism. Let me know what tier you think it is (I was aiming for 3). And no matter what you think, sit back and enjoy...

    The Monk

    {table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special
    1st|
    +1
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |
    +2
    |AC bonus, bonus feat, counterstrike, flurry of blows, mindful warrior, unarmed strike
    2nd|
    +2
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |Bonus feat, evasion
    3rd|
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |
    +3
    |Fast movement,flurry of blows (standard action), instinctive dodge, still mind
    4th|
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |ki strike (magic), slow fall, uncanny dodge
    5th|
    +5
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |
    +4
    |Flurry of blows (move action), purity of body
    6th|
    +6/+1
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |Bonus feat, mind over matter
    7th|
    +7/+2
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |
    +5
    |Flurry of blows (counterstrike and attack of opportunity), wholeness of body
    8th|
    +8/+3
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |Acupressurist, Improved uncanny dodge
    9th|
    +9/+4
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |
    +6
    |Improved evasion, mind of all truth
    10th|
    +10/+5
    |
    +7
    |
    +7
    |
    +7
    |Bonus feat, ki strike (aligned)
    11th|
    +11/+6/+1
    |
    +7
    |
    +7
    |
    +7
    |Diamond body, flurry of blows (swift action), mental acupressurist, improved flurry
    12th|
    +12/+7/+2
    |
    +8
    |
    +8
    |
    +8
    |Abundant step, ki strike (adamantine)
    13th|
    +13/+8/+3
    |
    +8
    |
    +8
    |
    +8
    |Diamond soul
    14th|
    +14/+9/+4
    |
    +9
    |
    +9
    |
    +9
    |Bonus feat, greater acupressurist, ki strike (cold iron)
    15th|
    +15/+10/+5
    |
    +9
    |
    +9
    |
    +9
    |Quivering palm, rapid flurry
    16th|
    +16/+11/+6/+1
    |
    +10
    |
    +10
    |
    +10
    |Ki strike (alchemical silver)
    17th|
    +17/+12/+7/+2
    |
    +10
    |
    +10
    |
    +10
    |Timeless body, tongue of the sun and moon
    18th|
    +18/+13/+8/+3
    |
    +11
    |
    +11
    |
    +11
    |Bonus feat, master acupressurist
    19th|
    +19/+14/+9/+4
    |
    +11
    |
    +11
    |
    +11
    |Empty body
    20th|
    +20/+15/+10/+5
    |
    +12
    |
    +12
    |
    +12
    |Greater flurry, perfect self[/table]

    Alignment: Any
    Hit Die: d8

    Class Skills:
    Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge(arcana) (Int), Knowledge(religion) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str),and Tumble (Dex).
    Skill Points at 1st Level: (6 + Int modifier) × 4
    Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 6+ Int modifier

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Monks are proficient with club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, siangham, and sling. Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields. When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.

    Description:
    Spoiler
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    AC Bonus (Ex): When unarmored and unencumbered, a monk gains a +1 bonus to AC at 1st level. This bonus increases by 1 at 5th level and every five monk levels thereafter (+2 at 5th, +3 at 10th, +4 at 15th, and +5 at 20th level).

    This bonus to AC applies even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses this bonus when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load.

    Counterstrike (Ex): Monks are highly trained in exploiting opponents' mistakes. If an opponent attempts to strike a monk and misses, the monk receives an attack of opportunity against that opponent. Use of this ability counts as an attack of opportunity for all intents and purposes.

    Flurry of Blows (Ex): When unarmored, a monk may strike with a flurry of blows at the expense of accuracy. When doing so, she may make one extra attack in a round at her highest base attack bonus, but this attack takes a –2 penalty, as does each other attack made that round. The resulting modified base attack bonuses are shown in the Flurry of Blows Attack Bonus table. This penalty applies for 1 round, so it also affects attacks of opportunity the monk might make before her next action. When a monk reaches 11th level, the penalty lessens to –1, and at 20th level it disappears.

    At 1st level, a monk must use a full attack action to strike with a flurry of blows. At 3rd level and above, a flurry may be performed as a standard action, at 5th level, as a move action, at 7th level, as a counterstrike or an attack of opportunity, and at 11th level, as a swift action. A monk can strike with a flurry of blows only once during her turn. If she is entitled to multiple attacks of opportunity or counterstrikes, such as from Combat Reflexes, she may only use one such as a a flurry of blows. A Flurry of Blows is considered a separate action from everything else the monk does in a turn. Thus, if the monk uses a move action to attack with a flurry of blows, she may then use her standard action for a single attack action. If the monk uses a flurry as a swift action at 11th level or higher, she could then make a full attack action in the same turn, or perform a single attack action and a move action, etc.

    When using flurry of blows, a monk may attack with unarmed strikes or with any weapons with which she is proficient. She may attack with unarmed strikes and weapons interchangeably as desired. When using weapons as part of a flurry of blows, a monk applies her Strength bonus (not Str bonus x 1-1/2 or x 1/2) to her damage rolls for all successful attacks, whether she wields a weapon in one or both hands.

    In the case of a double weapon, each end counts as a separate weapon for the purpose of using the flurry of blows ability. Even though double weapons require two hands to use, a monk may still intersperse unarmed strikes with double weapon strikes, assuming that she has enough attacks in her flurry of blows routine to do so.

    When a monk reaches 11th level, her flurry of blows ability improves. In addition to the standard single extra attack she gets from flurry of blows, she gets a second extra attack at her full base attack bonus (-1). At 20th level, it improves again, granting a third extra attack at her full base attack bonus.

    {table=head]Level|Flurry of Blows Attack Bonus
    1st|-1/-1
    2nd|+0/+0
    3rd|+1/+1
    4th|+2/+2
    5th|+3/+3
    6th|+4/+4
    7th|+5/+5
    8th|+6/+6
    9th|+7/+7
    10th|+8/+8
    11th|+10/+10/+10
    12th|+11/+11/+11
    13th|+12/+12/+12
    14th|+13/+13/+13
    15th|+14/+14/+14
    16th|+15/+15/+15
    17th|+16/+16/+16
    18th|+17/+17/+17
    19th|+18/+18/+18
    20th|+20/+20/+20/+20[/table]

    Mindful Warrior (Ex): A monk treats fighting as an art and a science, and practices for hours every day to master it, allowing her to use her training instinctively in the heat of battle. When unarmored and unencumbered, a monk may use her Wisdom bonus in place of her Strength and Dexterity for attack and damage rolls if she so desires. The monk also adds her Wisdom bonus to her AC. This bonus to AC applies even against touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. She loses this bonus when she is immobilized or helpless, when she wears any armor, when she carries a shield, or when she carries a medium or heavy load.

    Unarmed Strike: At 1st level, a monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply her full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all her unarmed strikes.

    Usually a monk’s unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but she can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on her attack roll. She has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling.

    A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.

    A monk also deals more damage with her unarmed strikes than a normal person would, as shown on the Unarmed Damage table.

    {table=head]{colsp=4}Monk Unarmed Damage
    Level|Small Monk|Medium Monk|Large Monk
    1-3|1d4|1d6|1d8
    4-7|1d6|1d8|2d6
    8-11|1d8|1d10|2d8
    12-15|1d10|2d6|3d6
    16-19|2d6|2d8|3d8
    20|2d8|2d10|4d8[/table]

    Bonus Feats: At 1st level, a monk gains Stunning Fist as a bonus feat. At 2nd level and every four levels after that (6th, 10th, 14th, 18th) a monk may select a bonus feat from the following list of feats. She must still meet all prerequisites for a feat, except for base attack bonus requirements, before taking it.
    Monk bonus feats: Axiomatic Strike, Blind-Fight, Cleaver Wrestling, Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Cunning Sidestep, Deflect Arrows, Diehard, Dodge, Earth's Embrace, Endurance, Extra Stunning, Fists of Iron, Flying Kick, Freezing the Lifeblood, Improved Critical, Improved Disarm, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Mobility, Pain Touch, Power Attack, Rapid Stunning, Roundabout Kick, Run, Snatch Arrows, Spring Attack, Stone Monkey, Sun School, Weakening Touch, Weapon Finesse

    Evasion (Ex): At 2nd level or higher if a monk makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, she instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if a monk is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of evasion.

    Fast Movement (Ex): At 3rd level, a monk gains an enhancement bonus to her speed, as shown on the Unarmored Speed Bonus table. A monk in armor or carrying a medium or heavy load loses this extra speed.

    {table=head]Level|Unarmored Speed Bonus
    1-2|+0 ft.
    3-5|+10 ft.
    6-8|+20 ft.
    9-11|+30 ft.
    12-14|+40 ft.
    15-17|+50 ft.
    18-20|+60 ft.[/table]

    Instinctive Dodge (Ex): At 3rd level and higher, a monk may add her Wisdom bonus (if any) to reflex saves, stacking with her Dexterity bonus.

    Still Mind (Ex): A monk of 3rd level or higher gains a +2 bonus on saving throws against spells and effects from the school of enchantment.

    Ki Strike (Su): At 4th level, a monk’s unarmed attacks are empowered with ki. Her unarmed attacks are treated as magic weapons for the purpose of dealing damage to creatures with damage reduction. Ki strike improves with the character’s monk level. At 10th level, her unarmed attacks are also treated as aligned weapons for the purpose of dealing damage to creatures with damage reduction. This alignment depends on the monk's own alignment, and counts as aligned on both spectra (Law/Chaos and Good/Evil). If the monk is Lawful Good, for example, her unarmed strikes are treated as lawful and good for these purposes. If the monk is neutral, she must choose whether her unarmed strikes will be considered lawful, chaotic, good, or evil, and once she has chosen, she cannot change it again, unless she changes alignments.

    At 12th level, her unarmed attacks are treated as adamantine weapons for the purpose of dealing damage to creatures with damage reduction and bypassing hardness, at 14th level, they are treated as cold iron for the purpose of dealing damage to creatures with damage reduction, and at 16th level, they are treated as alchemical silver for the purpose of dealing damage to creatures with damage reduction.

    Slow Fall (Ex): At 4th level or higher, a monk within arm’s reach of a wall can use it to slow her descent. When first using this ability, she takes damage as if the fall were 20 feet shorter than it actually is. The monk’s ability to slow her fall (that is, to reduce the effective distance of the fall when next to a wall) improves with her monk level until at 20th level she can use a nearby wall to slow her descent and fall any distance without harm.

    {table=head]Level|Slow Fall Distance
    1-3|0 ft.
    4-5|20 ft.
    6-7|30 ft.
    8-9|40 ft.
    10-11|50 ft.
    12-13|60 ft.
    14-15|70 ft.
    16-17|80 ft.
    18-19|90 ft.
    20th|Any distance[/table]

    Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 4th level, a monk retains her Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if she is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, she still loses her Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If a monk already has uncanny dodge from a different class, she automatically gains improved uncanny dodge (see below) instead.

    Purity of Body (Ex): At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases except for supernatural and magical diseases.

    Mind over Matter (Ex): At a 6th level and higher, a monk may add her Wisdom bonus (if any) to fortitude saves, stacking with her Constitution bonus.

    Wholeness of Body (Su): At 7th level or higher, a monk can heal her own wounds. Each day she can heal a number of hit points of damage equal to her monk level x her Wisdom bonus, and she can spread this healing out among several uses.

    Acupressurist (Ex): Monks train extensively with the concept of a body's flow of energy, and can severely damage or heal a person by putting pressure on certain vital areas of the body. A monk gains this ability at 8th level. The monk must declare that she is using this ability before using it, and she may only declare this at the beginning of her turn, before taking any other actions. In so doing she must choose a single physical ability score (Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution) and designate a single opponent as a target. She may only attack that opponent until the start of her next turn. During this time, if the monk successfully strikes that opponent 3 times with weapons or unarmed strikes, the subject of this ability must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 the monk's level + the monk's Wis modifier) or take damage to the chosen ability equal to 1/2 the monk's unarmed damage dice (roll dice, then divide result by 2) to minimum ability score of 1. Even on a successful save, the target takes the HP damage from the monk's attacks. If the monk can still make attacks during the round, and can strike the target another 3 times, the subject is forced to make another save at the same DC. If the subject has already resisted this attack, they get a +2 to their saving throw. This ability is only effective against creatures with a recognizable body (oozes, elementals, and swarms cannot be affected). Most creatures are affected by this ability. Even Undead and Constructs, though they are immune to critical hits, are still animated by some form of energy, and the monk can use this against them.

    If the target is not of the same type as the monk (for example if a Human (humanoid) Monk targeted a Centaur (monstrous humanoid)) the monk must spend 3 rounds studying the target before the ability works. The monk may not attack any other opponent during these 3 rounds, but may perform any other actions she wishes. However, each time she makes a swift, move or standard action, she must make a Concentration check (DC 15 for swift, 20 for move, or 25 for standard actions), unless the action was to attack the target. If the monk is attacked, forced to make a saving throw, or otherwise distracted, she must make a Concentration check with a DC of 10 + damage dealt by the attack or spell. If no damage is dealt, the DC is 15. If the damage done was mental ability damage, the monk automatically loses her concentration and must begin the process again.

    Alternatively, the monk may choose to heal with this ability. As a full round action, the monk may heal herself or a willing subject of physical ability damage equal to her unarmed damage, or eliminate or improve one of the following conditions: improve blinded to dazzled, eliminate dazzled, deafened, improve paralyzed to exhausted, improve exhausted to fatigued, eliminate fatigue, improve nauseated to sickened, or eliminate sickened. She may also stabilize a dying creature as a full round action. As before, if the subject is of a different type as the monk, the monk must spend three rounds studying the subject, making Concentration checks as before.

    At 11th level, this ability improves. The monk's attack can affect a physical or mental (Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma) ability of the monk's choice. As a full round action, the monk can also heal a willing subject of physical or mental ability damage, or eliminate or improve the following new conditions: improve panicked to frightened, improve frightened to shaken, improve cowering to shaken, eliminate shaken, confused, improve stunned to dazed, eliminate dazed (if it lasts longer than 1 round), or fascinated.

    Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 8th level and higher, a monk can no longer be flanked. This defense denies a rogue the ability to sneak attack the monk by flanking her, unless the attacker has at least four more rogue levels than the target has monk levels. If a character already has uncanny dodge (see above) from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum level a rogue must be to flank the character.

    Improved Evasion (Ex): At 9th level, a monk’s evasion ability improves. She still takes no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, but henceforth she takes only half damage on a failed save. A helpless monk does not gain the benefit of improved evasion.

    Mind of All Truth (Ex): At 9th level and higher, a monk adds her Wisdom bonus (if any) to will saves twice.

    Diamond Body (Su): At 11th level, a monk gains immunity to poisons of all kinds.

    Abundant Step (Su): At 12th level or higher, a monk can slip magically between spaces, as if using the spell dimension door, once per day. Her caster level for this effect is one-half her monk level (rounded down).

    Diamond Soul (Ex): At 13th level, a monk gains spell resistance equal to her current monk level + 10. In order to affect the monk with a spell, a spellcaster must get a result on a caster level check (1d20 + caster level) that equals or exceeds the monk’s spell resistance.

    Greater Acupressurist (Ex): This is available to the monk at 14th level. The monk no longer needs to study a creature of a different type before using this ability. Using this ability, a monk may attack as with Acupressure, but she may also add any condition she can also heal to affect the subject. If the subject fails a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 monk's level + monk's Wisdom modifier), the subject is knocked unconscious, is affected by the chosen condition upon waking up, and receives ability damage equal to 1/2 the monk's unarmed damage dice, to a minimum ability score of 1. Upon a successful save, the target remains conscious and unaffected by the condition, but the subject still takes ability damage equal to 1/2 the monk's unarmed damage dice, to a minimum ability score of 1.

    Quivering Palm (Su): Starting at 15th level, a monk can set up vibrations within the body of another creature that can thereafter be fatal if the monk so desires. She can use this quivering palm attack once a week, and she must announce her intent before making her attack roll. Constructs, oozes, plants, undead, incorporeal creatures, and creatures immune to critical hits cannot be affected. Otherwise, if the monk strikes successfully and the target takes damage from the blow, the quivering palm attack succeeds. Thereafter the monk can try to slay the victim at any later time, as long as the attempt is made within a number of days equal to her monk level. To make such an attempt, the monk merely wills the target to die (a free action), and unless the target makes a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 the monk’s level + the monk’s Wis modifier), it dies. If the saving throw is successful, the target is no longer in danger from that particular quivering palm attack, but it may still be affected by another one at a later time.

    Rapid Flurry (Ex): At 15th level, the monk may use her flurry of blows ability twice during her turn, as a standard and move action, as a standard and swift action, or as a move and swift action. She may also use a flurry of blows as an attack of opportunity or a counterstrike for every such one she is entitled to.

    Timeless Body (Ex): Upon attaining 17th level, a monk no longer takes penalties to her ability scores for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties that she has already taken, however, remain in place. Bonuses still accrue, and the monk still dies of old age when her time is up.

    Tongue of the Sun and Moon (Ex): A monk of 17th level or higher can speak with any living creature.

    Master Acupressurist (Ex): Finally, at 18th level, the monk masters acupressure. Using acupressure, the monk forces the subject to make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + monk's level + monk's Wisdom modifier) or take ability drain to the chosen ability equal to 1/2 the monk's unarmed damage dice and a number of negative levels equal to the monk's Wisdom bonus, as well as the condition of the monk's choice and loss of consciousness. On a successful save, the target is still subject to ability damage equal to 1/2 the monk's unarmed damage dice.

    As a full round action, the monk can also now heal ability damage or ability drain equal her unarmed damage dice, to a maximum ability score no higher than before it was affected, and heal negative levels equal to her Wisdom bonus.

    Empty Body (Su): At 19th level, a monk gains the ability to assume an ethereal state for 1 round per monk level per day, as though using the spell etherealness. She may go ethereal on a number of different occasions during any single day, as long as the total number of rounds spent in an ethereal state does not exceed her monk level.

    Perfect Self: At 20th level, a monk becomes a magical creature. She is forevermore treated as an outsider rather than as a humanoid (or whatever the monk’s creature type was) for the purpose of spells and magical effects. Additionally, the monk gains damage reduction 10/magic, which allows her to ignore the first 10 points of damage from any attack made by a nonmagical weapon or by any natural attack made by a creature that doesn’t have similar damage reduction. Unlike other outsiders, the monk can still be brought back from the dead as if she were a member of her previous creature type.
    Last edited by Breitheamh; 2013-12-12 at 03:24 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Composer99's Avatar

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    Default Re: 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    I am not particularly skilled at commenting on monk classes, so I have nothing to say about the class per se (I assume it is good for a monk? ).

    I do note that as of this writing there is a typo where the table entry for "Slow Fall" matches the entry for "Fast Movement" - both tables have "Unarmored Speed Bonus" as the second column entry.

    (Also, if you re-format the tables you can reduce the number of rows by eliding rows with identical speed bonuses/slow fall heights.)
    ~ Composer99

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    This can be found in my extended homebrew signature!

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    Thank you. Edited for size and typo now.

    And yes, it is good for a monk. I did not actually take away any abilities, just added more.
    Last edited by Breitheamh; 2013-12-12 at 10:47 AM.

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    Orc in the Playground
     
    urkthegurk's Avatar

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    Default Re: 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    Have you seen this? Its the first thing to come up when you google 'oots monk fix'

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    Interesting Monk Fix. There are some things I really like, and somethings I don't.

    I really like Counter Attack. Awesome ability. Most of your changes are just minor improvements, I went the same route.

    Please, please give him more skill points/level. Its simple, but helps alot.

    I really don't like acupuncturist. Ok, that Ability Damage is Huge. 2d6+Wis+Str Con damage assuming no way of boosting unarmed damage(like the items that do just that). I'd much rather see it be a single attack(standard action) for a d6 ability damage.
    At 8th level is pretty much an at will save or die(at worst save or suck) ability.

    At 11th level, its becomes choose weakest attribute, win. Woe to any spellcaster that gets targeted, huge damage to their casting stat, etc. The damage is too him IMO.

    The Monk will be taking out most threats above his CR pretty consistently with this ability.

    Flurry of Blows, I don't like the action cost reduction. Just allow them to Flurry as a Charge, Standard, or Full Round action. Double Flurry as a Swift and Move action makes little sense to me and is getting into ridiculous amounts of dice rolls.

    If I'm reading it right, 14 attacks per round, every three that hit cause a nasty ability Drain. Not to mention 2,3,4, or more Opportunity attacks per round.


    Full BAB, your Monk already has a huge bonus, Wis to Hit and Damage, now he has Full BAB too. I don't feel this is needed and outpaces pretty much all other melee classes.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: 3.5 Monk Fix (yeah, I know)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    Interesting Monk Fix. There are some things I really like, and somethings I don't.

    I really like Counter Attack. Awesome ability. Most of your changes are just minor improvements, I went the same route.
    Thank you

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    Please, please give him more skill points/level. Its simple, but helps alot.
    As I said, I've never thought of a monk as a skill-monkey, though I suppose what I described him as needs more, so ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    I really don't like acupuncturist. Ok, that Ability Damage is Huge. 2d6+Wis+Str Con damage assuming no way of boosting unarmed damage(like the items that do just that). I'd much rather see it be a single attack(standard action) for a d6 ability damage.
    At 8th level is pretty much an at will save or die(at worst save or suck) ability.

    At 11th level, its becomes choose weakest attribute, win. Woe to any spellcaster that gets targeted, huge damage to their casting stat, etc. The damage is too him IMO.

    The Monk will be taking out most threats above his CR pretty consistently with this ability.
    Sorry, I should have clarified this. I intended for the ability damage to be only the damage dice, no Wis or Str added. So a monk 8 with a monk's belt will do 2d6 ability damage. But to do so, he needs to hit the target 3 times in the round, and he can't hit anyone else. He could use a flurry as a move action, then a standard action attack, making it essentially an ability damaging touch spell with a full round action casting time and performed as a melee attack rather than a touch attack. And then, even if he gets AoO's later that round, he cannot use them unless they are against the target. Or he might miss those 3 attacks, and then he relies on the target giving him at least 2 AoO's.

    And it only works that easily if the target is the same type as the monk. Fighting a monstrous humanoid, outsider, undead, construct, animal, magical beast, aberration, etc. for a human monk means he needs to take 4 rounds of doing nothing but hitting the target, making Concentration checks every time something unexpected happens, and then finally in that last round he can deal 2d6 ability damage to one ability. I can't think of CR 8 creatures off the top of my head who have physical ability scores low enough to be one-shotted by this, and again, for most things, that shot is going to take 4 rounds to come. There's a chance that the target might be down by HP damage before the monk gets a chance to use it. As it is, at 8th level, the monk gets an at will save-or-suck ability, that takes a while to pull off. If he's fighting a humanoid, it might be more save-or-die ish, but still, the average damage he'll be doing is 7. So, if the target is really weak in one physical ability score, you have a 33% chance that you'll guess right, and the subject will be paralyzed or killed. You also have a 66% chance that you will make them weak, but not helpless.

    The ability at 11th level to be the bane of casters is kind of the point. Casters are obnoxiously good at being the bane of melee characters' existence, so why shouldn't melee characters be good at killing them right back?

    I noticed you didn't mention it past that point. Do you think the improvements at 14th and 18th level are more ok? What if I added the stipulation that until master acupressurist, this ability damage may not bring an ability score to 0? Would that work better? I could also increase the DC for the Concentration checks. Thanks for the feedback, by the way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    Flurry of Blows, I don't like the action cost reduction. Just allow them to Flurry as a Charge, Standard, or Full Round action. Double Flurry as a Swift and Move action makes little sense to me and is getting into ridiculous amounts of dice rolls.

    If I'm reading it right, 14 attacks per round, every three that hit cause a nasty ability Drain. Not to mention 2,3,4, or more Opportunity attacks per round.
    Until 11th level, he can only use flurry once during his turn, and once as an AoO/counterstrike during the round. So, level 1-10 he gets 2 flurries/round, each striking twice. That's 4 attacks. He could use the flurry during his turn as a standard or move action, allowing him to move before or after it, or cast a spell, or hit with one more strike. So max number of attacks during his turn is 3 (even with a full attack, which gives him a -5 penalty to one of those attacks, and he can't do anything else). During the round as a whole, he gets the same number of AoO's as he would normally, but on one of them he can decide to hit twice with a -2 penalty to the attack rolls. I don't feel like that could be considered broken.

    At 11th level, yes, he gets more attacks with his flurry and less of a penalty on them, but he can still only use a flurry twice in a round, and only once on his own turn. Now he can do it as a swift action though, so that makes it more dangerous. He can get a max of 6 attacks (3 flurry, 3 full attack, but that means he stands in one place and hits something six times) on his turn, and same deal as before with AoO's only now he gets one more attack total, with 3 of them at a -1 penalty.

    And now I think I just realized how confusing this thing is in my description. I will edit that.

    At any rate, I don't feel like he is truly breaking the action economy until 15th level, when he can use a flurry twice during his turn, giving him a total of 7 attacks during his turn (without moving, mind you) and 3 attacks for every AoO he gets. So, at 15th level, yes, he gets a lot of attacks, and if he focuses on a single target for the entire round, he can deal them quite a bit of ability damage, or even knock them unconscious. If he is fighting multiple enemies, he can get beat on by one as he takes down one, and he does not have a high enough HD to stand there and take the beating forever, so he may only get through one enemy this way before being forced to retreat and use more skirmishy tactics. If he is fighting one enemy, chances are that enemy will be strong enough that they can take the damage and the ability damage anyway, and make the save, or just not be hit at all.

    I will reword some thing to make them more clear and edit stuff to make it more balanced.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zman View Post
    Full BAB, your Monk already has a huge bonus, Wis to Hit and Damage, now he has Full BAB too. I don't feel this is needed and outpaces pretty much all other melee classes.
    If you think it works better, I could say Wisdom replaces Strength and Dexterity on attack and damage rolls, rather than stacking them.

    Thanks for the input.

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