Wouldn't it be possible...

[Fishies]

...to avoid death by old age if you kill and reincarnate yourself when you're about to die? (You only lose a level, and you get resurrected into a Young Adult body)

[Stevenson]

They cover this in Complete Divine, actually. Most people don't do this because most people start to become one with their plane of existance when they die. Only people with strong forces of personality or unfinished business (like most PCs) really would want to come back from the dead in the first place, once they die.

[Fishies]

They cover this in Complete Divine, actually. Most people don't do this because most people start to become one with their plane of existance when they die. Only people with strong forces of personality or unfinished business (like most PCs) really would want to come back from the dead in the first place, once they die.

Yes, but I'm talking about avoiding death by old age. Would this actually work and beat the system? Oh, and if old age gives bonuses to mental stats, then you can probably have a high INT/WIS/CHA, right? And if you die at level 4 and get reincarnated to level 3, then when you level up again, would you get that +1 stat point?

[The_Snark]

Yes, but I'm talking about avoiding death by old age. Would this actually work and beat the system? Oh, and if old age gives bonuses to mental stats, then you can probably have a high INT/WIS/CHA, right? And if you die at level 4 and get reincarnated to level 3, then when you level up again, would you get that +1 stat point?

Yes, but you lost it when you lost level 4, so you aren't gaining anything you didn't have before. Same with feats and skill points.

As for beating the system, I think it works. Reincarnating yourself into a young body is pretty traditional fantasy, and the age bonuses aren't ever going to rise above +3.

[Dhavaer]

It does work, yes, although you might have trouble finding a way to reincarnate yourself.

The old age mental stat thing is very, very confusing, and I don't think there's a RAW method of resolving it. The only answer is 'ask your DM'.

[Fishies]

It does work, yes, although you might have trouble finding a way to reincarnate yourself.

So I can't just have my friend cast the spell on me?

[Bears With Lasers]

It does work, yes, although you might have trouble finding a way to reincarnate yourself.

Craft Contingent Spell.

[Fishies]

Or maybe I could throw an oil of reincarnate into the air where I'm standing, and then kill myself right before it lands...

[13_CBS]

If you kept doing this, though, wouldn't an Inevitable come after you?

[Orzel]

It works. But you kept doing this, an Inevitable would come after you!!

[Stevenson]

Well, more like going over to a random cleric and saying, "here's some money, revive me in about...say....20 minutes."

Yes, it would, technically, work. If, for some reason, the person in question was A) Rich and B) Had a real reason to want to come back. Something important, that is. Not just wanting to live. Because, as it says in complete Divine, every rich person doesn't keep coming back because they feel the pull of the afterlife too strongly once they're their.

[Fishies]

Just kill the inevitable...

[The_Snark]

Or maybe I could throw an oil of reincarnate into the air where I'm standing, and then kill myself right before it lands...

Reincarnate is one level too high for that. If you have a friend cast it, you're going to need an immortal friend, too, unless you're both druids. In which case you're both immortal.

And of course, the spell's only available to druids, and most of those tend to believe in living a fairly natural lifespan.

If you kept doing this, though, wouldn't an Inevitable come after you?

Very possibly.

[SpiderBrigade]

Yes. This is exactly one of the things Inevitables are FOR.

edit:

Just kill the inevitable...

Ok, that's quite plausible for adventurers, yes. So the next time, 10 Inevitables come. Or some kind of advanced Inevitable.

Or, not, depending on the campaign. There's no need to continually persecute the player with inevitables if A) you don't have a problem with endless life, or B) you didn't at least try to talk him out of it, if you do.

But, usually, anyone devoting serious time and energy to not perishing from old age is probably shooting for something to break the game with. Thus, Inevitables.

[crazedloon]

Yep it would work then an Inevitable would come and rock your socks right off and after that you will wish you were dead

[13_CBS]

@ Fishies: I can't imagine the other Inevitables being very happy if you kept killing their agents, though...

[Mewtarthio]

So I can't just have my friend cast the spell on me?

I doubt a Druid would be particularly keen on doing that if your only reason was "I wanna live forever!" Of course, an Archivist that somehow got a copy would work, as would a Chameleon with sufficient Wisdom. I could even see a villain doing this to prevent recognition. The downside is that eventually you get these nasty Maruts who get upset and try to kill you.

[Orzel]

It's hard to kill 5 maruts.

[Bears With Lasers]

It's not that hard.

[Fishies]

It's hard to kill 5 maruts.

Unless if you're epic.

I could even see a villain doing this to prevent recognition. The downside is that eventually you get these nasty Maruts who get upset and try to kill you.

Yeah, I was thinking that this would be an annoying tactic for a recurring villain...

[Orzel]

It's not that hard.

Lies!
They are greater dispel magic, dimension door, and chain lightning spamming monsters.

Poor Nopus the Lich.

[Assassinfox]

If you're gonna go through all the trouble of setting up a chain of reincarnation, you might as well craft something to protect you from Maruts.

[Fishies]

Lies!
They are greater dispel magic, dimension door, and chain lightning spamming monsters.

Poor Nopus the Lich.

112 HP... I think a high level sorcerer can take them in a few rounds.

[13_CBS]

Question; how many Maruts can come at you? Even high level spellcasters would have trouble with, say, a dozen+ Maruts, no?

[Mewtarthio]

Question; how many Maruts can come at you? Even high level spellcasters would have trouble with, say, a dozen+ Maruts, no?

Answer: As many as your opponent, who's been sequestered in his basement casting Greater Planar Binding (or, worse, Ally), manages to call.

...Say, technically, should an Inevitable even demand payment for doing its duty? Shouldn't it be thanking you for showing it the violation and giving it the means to exact justice?

[Orzel]

They normally come alone. Once you get to multiples, running is the best option even at level 20.

[Emperor Tippy]

Not really. Time Stop + Dimensional Lock + Forcecage + Teleport

Congrats, you just single handedly contained a Marut for the next 40 hours. There is no possible way for him to escape.

The maruts can't track you easily at all and they are compelled to follow you. After you have rested and about 20 hours have passed cast greater invisibility on your self and teleport back to the marut. Lower the forcecage And next round hit him with a disintegrate. His SR won't stop a 20th level wizard and if you really want you can Assay Spell resistance first. His fort save is only +7 so its highly unlikely if its even possible that the marut woudl make that save on anything except a natural 20. Average Damage is more than a Maruts HP.

You can do that pretty much forever without much risk. You destroy 1 every 2 days and get 1,000 XP for each one. So after 20 you reach level 21. 22 more and your at level 22. 23 more and your at level 23. Another 23 and your at level 24. 24 more and your at level 25.

So at 1 per 2 days (and you could really do 1 per day) it only takes you 224 days to reach level 25. Never were you really in any danger. In fact this is actually one of the easiest ways to level. Piss off the Inevitable's because they just keep sending them at you and they are easy to beat.

[The_Snark]

You can kill them... but if there isn't an inevitable whose job it is to remove people who kill too many inevitables and persist in their flaunting of the laws, there should be.

And if you get unlucky and annoy a Lawful Good god with all this, you'll be eating one of the Book of Exalted Deed's Aleaxes. No matter how awesome you are, it likely still kills you. Then you have to deal with the god, who probably demands you stop your infinite reincarnation change.

[Orzel]

At level 20, they'd send 3+ maruts at you. They spam greater dispel, walk up to you, and beat you senseless.

[Assassinfox]

You can kill them... but if there isn't an inevitable whose job it is to remove people who kill too many inevitables and persist in their flaunting of the laws, there should be.

And if you get unlucky and annoy a Lawful Good god with all this, you'll be eating one of the Book of Exalted Deed's Aleaxes. No matter how awesome you are, it likely still kills you. Then you have to deal with the god, who probably demands you stop your infinite reincarnation change.

Can't only the particular deity you worship create aleaxes of you?