The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics

[AgentGandhi]

Even with Heavy Armor I wouldn't want negative Dex. I'd much rather have 8 Int 10 Dex. Or, in fact, 14 Dex 10 Str with medium armor, depending on weapon/cantrip choice and level of play.

So would you just stick with medium armor for the whole build? Do you think taking the movement hit is worth it, since a lot of the spells are ranged anyways? I'm not planning on being melee-focused.

[AgentGandhi]

So would you just stick with medium armor for the whole build? Do you think taking the movement hit is worth it, since a lot of the spells are ranged anyways? I'm not planning on being melee-focused.

For reference, I plan on taking the Sacred Flame and Toll the Dead cantrips, as well as Spiritual Weapon at Level 2.

[Arkhios]

Although I do appreciate that someone has had the time and patience to put up a guide over a topic, I would suggest taking everything they say in those guides with a grain of salt, tempered with your own deduction and thoughts. Just because they've done some guides, it's not like their opinions were any more infallible than anyone else's.

That said, having Dexterity 14 is just fine as well, in my opinion, if you think the character is better characterized as an agile and swift combatant. Regarding medium armor, there's no hit on movement, because medium armor doesn't have a minimum strength requirement. Armor strength requirement appears only in heavy armor, not in light or medium armor.

My opinion of an ideal array is based on that I truly think that an 8 in dexterity really doesn't make or break the game for you. Sure, you could take dexterity 10 and have intelligence 8, but that's not what I consider fun. I don't think it's fun to play a dunce. At least, not all the time.

In my opinion, if you really want to be focused on being a melee combatant, you should favor strength over dexterity, because dexterity limits your available weapon options much more than strength does. You can use all melee weapons with strength, but you can use only a select few melee weapons with Dexterity. Of course, as long as the weapons you use are statistically equal with each other, you can be just as effective as either strength or dexterity user. Meaning that the weapons must be those that deal at most 1d8 damage. Heavy weapons in general start from 1d10.

But, since you're not planning to be melee-focused, Str 10, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 8, Wis 16, Cha 8 is probably ideal for you. If you don't mind that your character is a bit dumb.

As a final statement, I'd like to point your attention towards a quote in my signature. Words mean things. Strength means something, as well as dexterity. It's not just a random number. It has a meaning, and that score measures it.
If you envision your character as a strong one, you should in my opinion, focus on Strength. If on the other hand, you don't think your character is strong, but agile, then go for Dexterity instead. It really is that simple.

[AgentGandhi]

Although I do appreciate that someone has had the time and patience to put up a guide over a topic, I would suggest taking everything they say in those guides with a grain of salt, tempered with your own deduction and thoughts. Just because they've done some guides, it's not like their opinions were any more infallible than anyone else's.

That said, having Dexterity 14 is just fine as well, in my opinion, if you think the character is better characterized as an agile and swift combatant. Regarding medium armor, there's no hit on movement, because medium armor doesn't have a minimum strength requirement. Armor strength requirement appears only in heavy armor, not in light or medium armor.

My opinion of an ideal array is based on that I truly think that an 8 in dexterity really doesn't make or break the game for you. Sure, you could take dexterity 10 and have intelligence 8, but that's not what I consider fun. I don't think it's fun to play a dunce. At least, not all the time.

In my opinion, if you really want to be focused on being a melee combatant, you should favor strength over dexterity, because dexterity limits your available weapon options much more than strength does. You can use all melee weapons with strength, but you can use only a select few melee weapons with Dexterity. Of course, as long as the weapons you use are statistically equal with each other, you can be just as effective as either strength or dexterity user. Meaning that the weapons must be those that deal at most 1d8 damage. Heavy weapons in general start from 1d10.

But, since you're not planning to be melee-focused, Str 10, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 8, Wis 16, Cha 8 is probably ideal for you. If you don't mind that your character is a bit dumb.

As a final statement, I'd like to point your attention towards a quote in my signature. Words mean things. Strength means something, as well as dexterity. It's not just a random number. It has a meaning, and that score measures it.
If you envision your character as a strong one, you should in my opinion, focus on Strength. If on the other hand, you don't think your character is strong, but agile, then go for Dexterity instead. It really is that simple.

Thanks you for the well thought out reply! And no worries, I have no plans to blindly follow anything, I just like seeking opinions, especially since this is my first spellcaster class. I just like to do my research and see get opinions from people with hands-on experience before deciding how to proceed.

And you're right, being stupid isn't fun, so I already decided I would at least have a 10 in INT, even though it might not be statistically ideal. I don't want to do the 15,15,15,8,8,8 min-max build so i'm not looking for complete maximization. But it's always nice to know what it would be and then customize from there.

I had considered being a melee character with this build because I wanted my character to have/use the warhammer but I think I can just flavor spiritual weapon to resemble a hammer instead. Plus the cantrips and spells will end up outclassing a normal melee attack anyways so I feel like dumping too much into strength might end up useless.

[Arkhios]

Thanks you for the well thought out reply! And no worries, I have no plans to blindly follow anything, I just like seeking opinions, especially since this is my first spellcaster class. I just like to do my research and see get opinions from people with hands-on experience before deciding how to proceed.

And you're right, being stupid isn't fun, so I already decided I would at least have a 10 in INT, even though it might not be statistically ideal. I don't want to do the 15,15,15,8,8,8 min-max build so i'm not looking for complete maximization. But it's always nice to know what it would be and then customize from there.

I had considered being a melee character with this build because I wanted my character to have/use the warhammer but I think I can just flavor spiritual weapon to resemble a hammer instead. Plus the cantrips and spells will end up outclassing a normal melee attack anyways so I feel like dumping too much into strength might end up useless.

Well, alternatively, you could use Str 14, Dex 10, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8, wear chainmail and wield a warhammer and shield, while still doing most of your damage with spells. Str 14 isn't half-bad as a back-up melee option. It's actually quite typical for a cleric, when looking back to several previous editions and their iconic characters.

[AgentGandhi]

Well, alternatively, you could use Str 14, Dex 10, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8, wear chainmail and wield a warhammer and shield, while still doing most of your damage with spells. Str 14 isn't half-bad as a back-up melee option. It's actually quite typical for a cleric, when looking back to several previous editions and their iconic characters.

Yeah I thought about that, but once I hit 5th level, Toll the Dead and Sacred Flame both become 2d8 damage so I figured it would do more damage than melee regardless right? Plus I can achieve the hammer flavor with spiritual weapon like I wanted to do.

[Yorrin]

Yeah I thought about that, but once I hit 5th level, Toll the Dead and Sacred Flame both become 2d8 damage so I figured it would do more damage than melee regardless right? Plus I can achieve the hammer flavor with spiritual weapon like I wanted to do.

Tempest does get you the 1/round 1d8 weapon damage at level 8, helping your weapons keep up in damage until high levels. And if you're feeling the warhammer flavor there's no shame in running the Str 14, Dex 10, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8 build with Chainmail + Shield, grabbing +2 Str at level 4 to meet Full Plate requirements. You'd be sitting at triple 16s, which makes you quite the generalist rather than being really great at any one thing, but depending on your party/DM that might be fine.

[AgentGandhi]

Tempest does get you the 1/round 1d8 weapon damage at level 8, helping your weapons keep up in damage until high levels. And if you're feeling the warhammer flavor there's no shame in running the Str 14, Dex 10, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8 build with Chainmail + Shield, grabbing +2 Str at level 4 to meet Full Plate requirements. You'd be sitting at triple 16s, which makes you quite the generalist rather than being really great at any one thing, but depending on your party/DM that might be fine.

Ah right, thank you for pointing that out. I guess it depends on the bonus action economy of the Cleric as well, because I do like the idea of just using Spiritual Weapon, but I'm not sure what else Cleric uses its bonus action for. I'll also most likely stick with spells since I've always just done melee characters so this will be something different.

[Yorrin]

Just wanted to let everyone know that the guide has been updated with content from Tasha's Cauldron of Everything. Let me know if I missed anything.

Twilight Domain is amazing, the new feats are amazing, new base class features are neat, and the racial stuff is a can of worms that I'm not even going to touch. Some of the new magic items seem to break game math a bit?

Some of the non-Cleric highlights for me are Armorer Artificer, Circle of Stars Druid, Psi-Warrior Fighter, Way of Mercy Monk, Soulknife Rogue, Clockwork Soul Sorcerer, and the Fathomless Patron Warlock. I also have a fun idea for a swarmkeeper Ranger (vampire themed with bat swarms). Overall I am quite pleased at all the new toys to play with, as will be my players. The power creep does feel pretty real, especially with the feats and magic items, but not yet unmanageable.

[Dudu]

Quick take on the Tasha's clerics subclass ratings

Order

Domain Spells: The highlights here are Hold Person and Mass Healing Word, both of which are great spells, synergies well with the features of the domain.
Bonus Proficiencies: Heavy armor + divine strike shift you in a decidedly Str direction.
Voice of Authority: Very strong. Compatible with Bless, Cure Wounds, Death Ward, Healing Word, Aid, etc. You could conceivably trigger it every turn if you prioritized it, which in some parties might be optimal play.
Order's Demand: Strong against humanoids or other weapon users. Mediocre otherwise because of 5e charm.
Embodiment of the Law: This works with both Bless and Hold Person, which is awesome.
Divine Strike: Psychic is a strong type.
Order's Wrath: Situational 2d8/round is an underwhelming capstone, even if it is a nice type.

I rate order as, potentially, one of the strongest subclasses in the game. That voice of authority is a big deal. Of course, it heavily depends on party composition. If your party is mostly composed of casters who aren't really good with weapon damages, than it's not so significant. But if there's a ranged rogue, for example, than this can potentially double that rogue's damage, which is huge.

The spells are ok. Command is neat, but already in cleric's list. Heroism is good, but you have arguably better concentration spells. Hold Person can potentially end encounters. Commune is amazing if your DM is good in doing divinations, but again, already in cleric's list. Dominate Person is expensive, restrictive and janky, but when it works the impact is huge.

Some of their abilities are more tailored in campaigns with more humanoids. When facing beasts, undeads, constructs or oozes, for example, a good portion of their features is rendered useless.

Proficiency in heavy armor is always great for a cleric and, imo, more relevant than proficiency in martial weapons. Proficiency in Intimidation or Persuasion is great considering your features, this subclass might consider investing a bit more on social skills. Divine Strike isn't a big deal of a class feature, but doing psychic damage is as good as it gets.

So, in order to answer the question "is that option strong?" you have to ask "do we have a character in party that can deal consistently high damage per hit?" and "we will face a good number of humanoids?". If yes for both questions than the subclass will be very strong indeed.

Peace

Domain Spells: Not a lot of standouts here. Useful stuff overall, but not great.
Implement of Peace: You should probably pick Insight because of stat synergy, but free skill is free.
Emboldening Bond: It's like a free Bless with some extra goodies but also extra restrictions.
Balm of Peace: This is decent but not great. Will probably come up, but not everyday.
Protective Bond: This won't always come up, but will be handy occasionally.
Potent Spellcasting: You're solidly on the caster side of Cleric.
Expansive Bond: This is actually really good. Makes the party HP stretch a lot further

I feel like you truly underrated Peace domain. I call it the "free bless domain" and I think that feature is quite the big deal.

The spells are good. Sanctuary is something you might want to have prepared anyway, so it helps that it's a domain spell. Warding Bond is... curious. Extra strong if you can truly capitalize on it, such as casting it on a warlock buddy that has Armor of Agathys. Beacon of Hope is a typically good spell overshadowed by spells that are more impactful most of the time, but against really opressive boss fights, this spell aces. Rary's Telephatic Bond is a big standout, it all depends on how your DM handles communication. If he is very restrictive in how players share information between each other, than this spell is amazing. Plus, it's ritual and not in cleric's list.

You get to choose a free skill. I'm with you on Insight, it's a good skill, but so is persuasion.

Emboldening Bond is a big deal. It has similar effects to bless, with some important pros and cons. The big con here is that you can only roll that extra d4 once per turn. Notice that it isn't per round, so this might help with saves and be almost as good as a bless. Sucks for multiple attacks though. The pros are huge. First, it lasts 10min, which might be multiple encounters. Second, it is concentration free, which is immense. Third, nothing forbids you of using that feature AND bless, which is almost an increase of 5 into relevant checks, huge deal for a lvl 1 feature when your proficiency bonus is +2 and your best modifiers are likely +5. Fourth, it does apply to all d20s, including ability checks, which includes stuff like initiatives and athletics to not get prone. Overall, it's not strictly superior to Bless, but I would rate it higher.

Balm of Peace is mild, but it's a better cure wounds. Now, when you think about it, you have a feature that emulates an improved bless and another that emulates an improved cure wounds. This is healthy for your spell slots.

Protective Bond, man, this might be a big deal. Not only you can potentially save a key party member (like, sparing the wizard who is concentrating on Hold Person and letting your barbarian take the damage, who is concentrating in nothing) but you allow the saving party member to move as reaction. Speaking of damage, it says nothing about resistance, so I assume it applies.

They don't get any proficiencies, but I consider their features so busted I don't mind it at all. Might consider multiclassing to increase their defensiveness, luckily, clerics aren't too greedy with their own levels and are good at getting levels of other classes.

Increased cantrip damage is, in this context, more interesting than Divine Strike, so it's ok, but far from a big deal. Their capstone improves their bond to a big deal.

Overall, I would flavor this domain as a Community domain far more than a Peace domain tbh. Nonetheless, a rate it a great, great domain. It might even be more of a cleric^2 than the life cleric.

Twilight

Domain Spells: Stand outs include Faerie Fire and Greater Invisibility. Solid list.
Bonus Proficiencies: Always a good start to a Domain. Joins Tempest and War in the full Proficiencies category.
Eyes of Night: Darkvision is nice, especially with the extra range. Sharing Darkvision can be super nice.
Vigilant Blessing: This is really cool. Rogues and Rangers often get buffs on the first turn and would appreciate the boost.
Twilight Sanctuary: That's a lot of temporary hitpoints. Makes you and your party noticablly tougher. Also nice for races with Sunlight Sensitivity, not that any of those are good Cleric races.
Steps of Night: Tactical flight at sixth level is really solid.
Divine Strike: It's radiant, which is fantastic. And you have the weapon proficiencies to take advantage of it.
Twilight Shroud: Even more tankiness for you and nearby allies while your Sanctuary is up. Great overall package.

Perhaps you overrated that one, but it's a very good domain nonetheless.

The domain list is good. Faerie Fire is not on clerics list and can shift the encounter heavily in party's favor. See Invisibility is a great concentration-free spell but not necessarily an everyday spell. Leomund's Tiny Hut is amazing and one of the best rituals in the game. G Invisibility is great if you have someone that can capitalize on it, such as a rogue.

Proficiencies not only in heavy armor but martial weapons as well is great, of course, but I don't mind the martial weapons so much as a cleric tbh.

The darkvision thing is, cool, I admit. But not a big deal in my honest opinion. The best feature is that the range is immense and you can share it with an archer that can effectively hit targets that aren't likely to hit you back. Or that archer could be you, come to think of it, this subclass could be a passable archer.

Twilight Sanctuary is the big deal of this domain for me. It's a huge defensive buff in that it can great a sizeable temporary HP to everyone and it creates an area of dimlight which is relevant to your other features.

Steps of Night is why I would consider this cleric to be ranged. It's a concentration free flight, at lvl 6.

Playing as this cleric I would suggest my fellow party members to travel by night. Investing in perception could make this guy a great scout.

------------------

Overall, I find it hard to dismiss any of the three, all of them look solid to me. Order is slightly stronger if your campaign includes more humanoids and social encounters. Twilight is stronger if you intend to wander through dark places and even stronger if you intend to wander through places where the foes aren't used to darkness but you did during nighttime (like sneaking inside a fort).
Peace domain is strong in most dnd campaigns really, only if the DM likes to split the party such domain would not feel impactful.

[Yorrin]

Overall we seem to be in agreement.

I feel like you truly underrated Peace domain.

The main downside of Peace, at least for parties I play with, is the needing to stay close together part. My parties tend to spread out as much as possible on purpose to avoid enemy AoEs, so this would either exclude some people or force them to clump together. Obviously if your party is mostly frontliners this becomes way less of an issue.

Also- funny you should mention Order Domain with archer Rogues. I played that exact setup when Order was printed in GGtR and it was devastating. Buffed/healed the Rogue archer every round and she decimated everything in sight. She also had dipped a bit into Champion, and off-turn sneak attack crits really swing battle math. That being said, Order relies almost entirely on that one ability. The rest of the kit is alright, but largely only applies to humanoid foes and/or social encounters. Still an enjoyable character, but does rely heavily on the party.

[Dudu]

The main downside of Peace, at least for parties I play with, is the needing to stay close together part. My parties tend to spread out as much as possible on purpose to avoid enemy AoEs, so this would either exclude some people or force them to clump together. Obviously if your party is mostly frontliners this becomes way less of an issue.

You just need to have one ally affected inside the 30ft range. Maybe we really diverge on playstyle, but it seems an easy condition to meet. Unless you are fighting in open spaces I'd say the condition is automatic met on most circunstances. And even outside of corridors and tunnels I'd say you can have some space between party members and still have the bonus apply.

Also, clumping together is not necessarily a bad thing. My friends usually call it the "fireball formation", but if you have a paladin, for example, or someone with counterspell, there are ways to counter this. Overall, I think every Tasha domain works better when you talk with your party about the optimal playstyle. I just feel Peace restrictions are much more easily met than the other two. For a cleric, everyone moderately close (<30 ft.) is close enough for stuff like Revivify, Freedom of Movement or Restoration spells, which is great.

Also- funny you should mention Order Domain with archer Rogues. I played that exact setup when Order was printed in GGtR and it was devastating. Buffed/healed the Rogue archer every round and she decimated everything in sight. She also had dipped a bit into Champion, and off-turn sneak attack crits really swing battle math. That being said, Order relies almost entirely on that one ability. The rest of the kit is alright, but largely only applies to humanoid foes and/or social encounters. Still an enjoyable character, but does rely heavily on the party.

Cool! I wanted to hear from someone with "field experience" tell me wether that combo is good or not, and it seems it is.

[PunyPaladin]

Dawn(C): Like Flaming Sphere for Clerics, but in a higher level spell slot and requiring an expensive focus. Not a terrible way to keep up bonus action damage, given a small enough battlefield.

This feels like it's selling Dawn quite a bit short.
Am I missing something? Dawn is only like Flaming Sphere in that it's a bonus action to move it.

The AOE of Dawn is so much bigger!
It's fantastic battlefield control, it's sunlight, and radiant damage instead of fire damage.

[Yorrin]

This feels like it's selling Dawn quite a bit short.
Am I missing something? Dawn is only like Flaming Sphere in that it's a bonus action to move it.

The AOE of Dawn is so much bigger!
It's fantastic battlefield control, it's sunlight, and radiant damage instead of fire damage.

Yeah, my description might be a bit misleading there. I'll update it later today when I have more time. Still- it's one of those AoEs where you have to worry about friendly-fire, which makes it more situational.

[MrStabby]

This feels like it's selling Dawn quite a bit short.
Am I missing something? Dawn is only like Flaming Sphere in that it's a bonus action to move it.

The AOE of Dawn is so much bigger!
It's fantastic battlefield control, it's sunlight, and radiant damage instead of fire damage.

Caused me to look at some of the 5th level spells.

these are an interesting lot. I am not sure I agree witht he OP on some. Some of this comes down to feeling rather than anything else, others are from good experience.

Dawn first. I think that I would agree this spell is OK, but not fantastic. Big area, radient, sunlight... all good stuff. The downside is that unlike spells like spirit guardians it doen't hurt anyone moving into the area and the damage is end of turn not the stat. The effective area denial of the spell is a lot less than advertised as NPCs can dart in and out of the area with no damage. Given every time you cast it or move it your enemies get their turn to move out of its effects, it is only really soft area denial at best. Concentration means that a creature can also avoid damage by breaking your concentration anyway. In general at 4d10 damage per turn it is painful, but not solidly lethal.

Flame strike... is rated blue. I would have gone Black. It does fireball damge but in a smaller area and from a spell slot two levels higher. I mean, it has a point - not a worthless spell by any means, but it hardly shines. For a 5th level spell you could be doing 5d8 from spirit guardians per turn (in a similar radius), which is broadly similar and you can do turn after turn. I would say to leave blasting to those with fireball and spend your spell slots on the effects you are good at.

On the other hand I love commune. Its a ritual - just once per day asking three questions, say just before a rest, can give a huge insight into how to prepare for the next day. Clerics are awesome for this - as a prepared spellcaster with access to all of their spells unlike a wizard, they can pick the tools most useful for the next day. There are a lot of powerful, but very situational spells on the cleric list. In high magic campaigns this can even be applied to working out which items to attune to. Cast as a ritual this is a lot of free power.

[Dudu]

Caused me to look at some of the 5th level spells.

these are an interesting lot. I am not sure I agree witht he OP on some. Some of this comes down to feeling rather than anything else, others are from good experience.

Dawn first. I think that I would agree this spell is OK, but not fantastic. Big area, radient, sunlight... all good stuff. The downside is that unlike spells like spirit guardians it doen't hurt anyone moving into the area and the damage is end of turn not the stat. The effective area denial of the spell is a lot less than advertised as NPCs can dart in and out of the area with no damage. Given every time you cast it or move it your enemies get their turn to move out of its effects, it is only really soft area denial at best. Concentration means that a creature can also avoid damage by breaking your concentration anyway. In general at 4d10 damage per turn it is painful, but not solidly lethal.

Flame strike... is rated blue. I would have gone Black. It does fireball damge but in a smaller area and from a spell slot two levels higher. I mean, it has a point - not a worthless spell by any means, but it hardly shines. For a 5th level spell you could be doing 5d8 from spirit guardians per turn (in a similar radius), which is broadly similar and you can do turn after turn. I would say to leave blasting to those with fireball and spend your spell slots on the effects you are good at.

To sum it up. Spirit Guardians exist, and those two spells compare unfavorably with it.

Dawn is very niche and I think you could consider using it to face creatures with light sensivity. But for a 5th spell slot... maybe you're better at using Daylight which lasts one hour and doesn't take concentration.

Flame Strike is a spell that I honestly don't even consider preparing it. It's just damage, and not very efficient per spell slot. The plus side is that you can blast without dropping your concentration, but in most cases I wouldn't even bother preparing it.

On the other hand I love commune. Its a ritual - just once per day asking three questions, say just before a rest, can give a huge insight into how to prepare for the next day. Clerics are awesome for this - as a prepared spellcaster with access to all of their spells unlike a wizard, they can pick the tools most useful for the next day. There are a lot of powerful, but very situational spells on the cleric list. In high magic campaigns this can even be applied to working out which items to attune to. Cast as a ritual this is a lot of free power.

There were few campaign that I used Commune and everytime I used it turned out to be very meaningful. You can get very creative with the questions and the DM can get very creative with the answers. It's both fun and powerful, but heavily dependent on DM. Some DMs, unfortunately, are super weak at dealing with divination spells, which makes a lot of players see them as poor spell choices when they have the potential of being great.

The fact that it's ritual encourages players to cast it more often, and maybe make their DMs more used with Divination spells, because it's a shame how underused those spells are in the average campaign.

[Yorrin]

Updated the text on Dawn.

Flame strike... is rated blue. I would have gone Black. It does fireball damge but in a smaller area and from a spell slot two levels higher. I mean, it has a point - not a worthless spell by any means, but it hardly shines. For a 5th level spell you could be doing 5d8 from spirit guardians per turn (in a similar radius), which is broadly similar and you can do turn after turn. I would say to leave blasting to those with fireball and spend your spell slots on the effects you are good at.

Flame Strike is a spell that I honestly don't even consider preparing it. It's just damage, and not very efficient per spell slot. The plus side is that you can blast without dropping your concentration, but in most cases I wouldn't even bother preparing it.

Yeah, you've persuaded me to drop Flame Strike to black. As fun as it can be, blasty Clerics are probably doing it wrong. Flame Strike does have range over Spirit Guardians, but that's about it.

[nitekrawler1285]

I think 3 levels of Swarmkeeper Ranger really opens up some fun combat options for Clerics and is worth recommending in the multiclass section. Gathered Swarm works on attacks generally including spell-attacks, and takes no action.

So long as you hit with an attack once on your turn you get to select one of the following:

A) Add 1d6 piercing which isn't too much less than Colossus Slayer(Rated blue) and even works on an undamaged enemy. Admittedly, the extra damage is the least exciting benefit to me even if extra damage is always useful.

B) Control ie forced 15ft horizontal movement of the target of your attack if they fail a strength save. This is a "free" Pushing Attack Maneuver for all your attacks or spell-attacks. Guiding Bolt(light them up for advantage and position them perfectly for your Rogue or Paladin buddy) and Spiritual Weapon come to mind.

Or C) Disengage(You are moved 5 ft horizontally by the swarm) Touch spells like Contagion and Inflict Wounds feel like better options when I don't have to stick around.

Druidic Warrior can net you some fun attack cantrips since only Arcana, Death and Nature can get attack roll cantrips.

I hope your vampire build is using Primal Savagery. Love the flavor of that spell and you hardly see anyone take PS because shillelagh works with all the wepaon-based hijinks. No longer says Swarmkeeper.

Other strange things that feel oddly compatible out of TCoE. Grappling Strike is similarly compatible with melee attacks including even melee spell-attacks so you can bonus action grapple so no one can escape your vampire's Primal Savagery inside another swarm of Spirit Guardian Bats. Or even Grapple after Vampiric Touch if you are Grave or Death Cleric. Maybe Death because Touch of Destruction works with melee spell attacks.

[Yorrin]

I think 3 levels of Swarmkeeper Ranger really opens up some fun combat options for Clerics and is worth recommending in the multiclass section. Gathered Swarm works on attacks generally including spell-attacks, and takes no action.

So long as you hit with an attack once on your turn you get to select one of the following:

A) Add 1d6 piercing which isn't too much less than Colossus Slayer(Rated blue) and even works on an undamaged enemy. Admittedly, the extra damage is the least exciting benefit to me even if extra damage is always useful.

B) Control ie forced 15ft horizontal movement of the target of your attack if they fail a strength save. This is a "free" Pushing Attack Maneuver for all your attacks or spell-attacks. Guiding Bolt(light them up for advantage and position them perfectly for your Rogue or Paladin buddy) and Spiritual Weapon come to mind.

Or C) Disengage(You are moved 5 ft horizontally by the swarm) Touch spells like Contagion and Inflict Wounds feel like better options when I don't have to stick around.

Druidic Warrior can net you some fun attack cantrips since only Arcana, Death and Nature can get attack roll cantrips.

I hope your vampire build is using Primal Savagery. Love the flavor of that spell and you hardly see anyone take PS because shillelagh works with all the wepaon-based hijinks. No longer says Swarmkeeper.

Other strange things that feel oddly compatible out of TCoE. Grappling Strike is similarly compatible with melee attacks including even melee spell-attacks so you can bonus action grapple so no one can escape your vampire's Primal Savagery inside another swarm of Spirit Guardian Bats. Or even Grapple after Vampiric Touch if you are Grave or Death Cleric. Maybe Death because Touch of Destruction works with melee spell attacks.

Some fun ideas here

I'll definitely give swarmkeeper a mention in the multiclassing section- good call.

[jaappleton]

One of my favorite things to do post-Tasha's is to utilize Dragonmarked races for spellcasting classes, especially if your table also lets you utilize the Ravnica backgrounds.

Now you can utilize all those spells, add them to your class list, and shore up any weaknesses.

"Well I'd be the only spellcaster, so I basically have to be a Bard to cover all this ground" NOT ANYMORE!

Personally, I love utilizing Mark of Passage for a Cleric. Very nice spell list indeed.

Anyone else like Circle of Wildfire and Circle of Stars as two level dips for a Cleric? You basically get Spiritual Weapon via Stars if you utilize the Archer, and of course the healing benefits of Chalice and the Concentration utilization of Dragon. Wildfire is another nice way to utilize a bonus action without hurting your spell slots.

Also, for MCing, the Artificer might be a top tier choice now simply for one particular Infusion: Mind Sharpener. Just choose to succeed on a Concentration save, with a number of charges per day? I know the stats don't align perfectly, but it should warrant some heavy consideration.

[Yorrin]

One of my favorite things to do post-Tasha's is to utilize Dragonmarked races for spellcasting classes, especially if your table also lets you utilize the Ravnica backgrounds.

Now you can utilize all those spells, add them to your class list, and shore up any weaknesses.

"Well I'd be the only spellcaster, so I basically have to be a Bard to cover all this ground" NOT ANYMORE!

Personally, I love utilizing Mark of Passage for a Cleric. Very nice spell list indeed.

Yeah, that's an extremely potent build that I would imagine most DMs are not okay with

Anyone else like Circle of Wildfire and Circle of Stars as two level dips for a Cleric? You basically get Spiritual Weapon via Stars if you utilize the Archer, and of course the healing benefits of Chalice and the Concentration utilization of Dragon. Wildfire is another nice way to utilize a bonus action without hurting your spell slots.

Also, for MCing, the Artificer might be a top tier choice now simply for one particular Infusion: Mind Sharpener. Just choose to succeed on a Concentration save, with a number of charges per day? I know the stats don't align perfectly, but it should warrant some heavy consideration.

The Druid stuff is... okay? I'd consider the stars dip on a high level Cleric, but mostly I'd rather be progressing my core class instead. Same with the artificer, really, since I don't typically want to invest the Int and I haven't had much trouble with Concentration checks until higher levels.

[MaxWilson]

One of my favorite things to do post-Tasha's is to utilize Dragonmarked races for spellcasting classes, especially if your table also lets you utilize the Ravnica backgrounds.

One of my favorite things about Dragonmarked races as originally designed is the way they make taking this road not a no-brainer. Tasha's of course throws that design out the window, but IMO that's a good argument for not playing by Tasha's racial rules.

[RainInTheWoods]

I've gotta gush about my tabaxi Trickery 7/Arcane Trickster 3 a bit.
While of course he's specced ultra hard into stealth and scouting, he's ended up being a very potent generalist, capable of doing basically whatever needs doing, assuming it doesn't require big muscles.

He can heal as well as any non-Life cleric.
He can stab pretty hard with Booming Blade+Sneak Attack, and soon to include Blessed Strikes.
He can even hold the line pretty well, combining Shield of Faith and Shield for a pretty stellar 26 AC.
He can sneak better than near anyone, stacking Stealth expertise with Pass Without Trace.
He can see everything, stacking Perception expertise and Observant for 26 passive perception, as well as the Dagger of Blindsight.

We were allowed to apply Tasha's racial stuff after the fact, which slightly unsettled his stats, but it gave him room to take Fey Touched next level, to round out his wisdom and nab Misty Step as well as Gift of Alacrity.

Is this an 'optimized' character?
Certainly not.
Has he been a successful character?
Oh yeah, big time.

[Yorrin]

Hey guys, just added the races from Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. Sorry they're a bit late, but I've gonna be honest: this whole direction of whitewashing the ability scores off of races has really got me demotivated to keep updating the guide with them.

[Theodoxus]

Yeah, since it's an optional rule, you'd basically have to have two sections, or at least two color codes for each race - one based on their hard coded attribute bonuses, and the second valuation on just their racial traits. That'd be a ton of work of an unknown value to the community.

[Jakinbandw]

I'm surprised you don't recommend a peace cleric 1 dip. I'm building a bard with it and it means that at 2nd level I can buff party members by 2d4 to skill checks, saves, and 1 attack a round. It also grants access to a bunch of useful spells if your playing a bard or sorcerer.

[No brains]

Hey guys, just added the races from Van Richten's Guide to Ravnica. Sorry they're a bit late, but I've gonna be honest: this whole direction of whitewashing the ability scores off of races has really got me demotivated to keep updating the guide with them.

Thank you for fighting the malaise to keep us updated. Although Ravnica is the other place with vampires, we're looking for Ravenloft. We got really lost in the mist this time.

[Yorrin]

Thank you for fighting the malaise to keep us updated. Although Ravnica is the other place with vampires, we're looking for Ravenloft. We got really lost in the mist this time.

Haha, right, thanks.

[Yorrin]

Finally got around to updating the guide with Wild Beyond the Witchlight races. I rated them under the assumption that Fariy is supposed to be +2 Cha/+1 other, which is the only thing keeping it from a top tier rating, and Harengon might honestly also be top tier but I refuse to give that distinction to anything they don't assign proper ability scores to.

[Linneris]

I think you may be undervaluing aura of vitality.

In combat, it's solid, but fairly situational healing, useful when a party member is reliably getting dropped to zero every turn, but otherwise it demands constant use of your bonus action, which you'd probably rather spend on something else, like spiritual weapon.

Out of combat, however, it's ten charges of 2d6 healing, for a total of 20d6, that you can distribute among your party as you see fit. For a third level slot, this is great. For Life clerics (and druids, paladins, and lore bards dipping into Life cleric) it's outright amazing, as every charge heals for 2d6+5 instead.