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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default My take on the Kai Monk

    The Kai Monk

    Requirements:
    To qualify to become a Kai Monk, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.

    Alignment: Any good
    Skills: Survival 6 ranks
    Other: Proficient with at least one martial weapon.

    Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
    1st +0 +2 +2 +2 Aura of Good, Kai Disciplines (2)
    2nd +1 +3 +3 +3 Kai Disciplines (4)
    3rd +2 +3 +3 +3 Kai Disciplines (6)
    4th +3 +4 +4 +4 Kai Disciplines (7)
    5th +3 +4 +4 +4 Kai Disciplines (8)
    6th +4 +5 +5 +5 Kai Disciplines (9)
    7th +5 +5 +5 +5 Kai Disciplines (10)
    8th +6/+1 +6 +6 +6 Kai Disciplines (11)
    9th +6/+1 +6 +6 +6 Kai Disciplines (12)
    10th +7/+2 +7 +7 +7 Kai Disciplines (13), Capstone
    Hit Die: d8

    Class Skills
    The Kai Monk’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), and Tumble (Dex).

    Skill Points at Level: 6 + Int modifier.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency:
    A Kai Monk is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with light armor and shields (except tower shields).

    Aura of Good (Ex):
    The power of a Kai Monk’s aura of good (see the detect good spell) is equal to their Kai Monk level plus one.

    Kai Disciplines:
    Kai Monks must master a wide range of skills. These skills are known as Kai Disciplines.

    At first level, the Kai Monk chooses two of the Kai Disciplines. At second and third level, the Kai Monk chooses another two of the Kai Disciplines. At each Kai Monk level after that, the Kai Monk chooses another Kai Discipline until they know all 13 at level 10.

    • Camouflage (Ex): You get a +4 bonus to all Bluff, Disguise, Hide and Move Silently skill checks.
    • Hunting (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus to all Survival skill checks. In addition, you get Detect Poison as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    • Sixth Sense (Ex/Sp): You get Uncanny Dodge, as the rogue class feature. In addition, you get Omen of Peril (SpC 149) as a spell-like ability usable thrice per day.
    • Tracking (Ex): You get Tracking and Urban Tracking as bonus feats. In addition, you get a +2 bonus to Spot, Listen and Gather Information checks. Lastly, you gain the Scent special ability.
    • Healing (Su): You get Cure Minor Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself.
    • Weaponskill (Ex): You get Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must choose the same weapon for both feats.
    • Mindshield (Ex): You have spell resistance equal to 10+your hit dice.
    • Mindsight (Su/Ps): You can sense the location of all creatures within 15 feet of you with an Int score of at least 5. In addition, you gain Empathy as a psi-like ability usable at will; creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune and the range/area is reduced to 15 feet.
    • Mindblast (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal damage equal to your Kai Monk level+your Cha modifier to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune.
    • Animal Kinship (Ex): You get Wild Empathy, as the ranger class feature (use your Kai Monk level as your Ranger level). In addition, you get a +2 bonus on all Ride checks.
    • Mind Over Matter (Sp/Ex): You get Mage Hand as a spell-like ability usable at will. In addition, you can endure heat and cold as the spell Endure Elements as a permanent effect.
    • Evasiveness (Ex): You get a +2 dodge bonus to AC. In addition, you get Evasion as the rogue class feature.
    • Understanding (Ex): You get Bardic Knowledge, as the bard class feature (use your Kai Monk level as your Bard level). In addition, you can use any Knowledge skill untrained.

    Capstone (??): At level 10, the Kai Monk gets some awesome ability that I haven't thought of yet.

    Spoiler: Old Version
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    The Kai Monk

    (This is just the Kai monks from the Lone Wolf book series. I have added two new disciplines to each set in order to make the numbers suit me better. I have also tweaked the lore circles to include these new disciplines.)

    Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
    1st +0 +2 +2 +2 Kai Disciplines (3)
    2nd +1 +3 +3 +3 Kai Disciplines (4)
    3rd +2 +3 +3 +3 Kai Disciplines (5)
    4th +3 +4 +4 +4 Kai Disciplines (6)
    5th +3 +4 +4 +4 Kai Disciplines (7)
    6th +4 +5 +5 +5 Kai Disciplines (8)
    7th +5 +5 +5 +5 Kai Disciplines (9)
    8th +6/+1 +6 +6 +6 Kai Disciplines (10)
    9th +6/+1 +6 +6 +6 Kai Disciplines (11)
    10th +7/+2 +7 +7 +7 Kai Disciplines (12)
    11th +8/+3 +7 +7 +7 Magnakai Disciplines (3), Lore Circles
    12th +9/+4 +8 +8 +8 Magnakai Disciplines (4)
    13th +9/+4 +8 +8 +8 Magnakai Disciplines (5)
    14th +10/+5 +9 +9 +9 Magnakai Disciplines (6)
    15th +11/+6/+1 +9 +9 +9 Magnakai Disciplines (7)
    16th +12/+7/+2 +10 +10 +10 Magnakai Disciplines (8)
    17th +12/+7/+2 +10 +10 +10 Magnakai Disciplines (9)
    18th +13/+8/+3 +11 +11 +11 Magnakai Disciplines (10)
    19th +14/+9/+4 +11 +11 +11 Magnakai Disciplines (11)
    20th +15/+10/+5 +12 +12 +12 Magnakai Disciplines (12)



    Alignment: Any good
    Hit Die: d8

    Class Skills
    The Kai Monk’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), and Tumble (Dex).

    Skill Points at 1st Level: (6 + Int modifier) ×4.
    Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 6 + Int modifier.

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency:
    A Kai Monk is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with light armor and shields (except tower shields).

    ----------

    Kai Disciplines:
    Kai Monks must master a wide range of skills. These skills are known as Kai Disciplines.

    At first level, the Kai Monk chooses three of the Kai Disciplines. At each additional Kai Monk level, the Kai Monk chooses another Kai Discipline until they know all 12 at level 10.

    Camouflage (Ex): You get a +2 bonus to all Bluff, Disguise, Hide and Move Silently skill checks.

    Hunting (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus to all Survival skill checks. In addition, you get Detect Poison as a spell-like ability usable at will.

    Sixth Sense (Ex/Sp): You get Uncanny Dodge, as the rogue class feature. In addition, you get Augury as a spell-like ability usable three times per day.

    Tracking (Ex): You get Tracking and Urban Tracking as bonus feats. In addition, you get a +2 bonus to Spot and Listen checks.

    Healing (Su): You get Cure Minor Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself.

    Weaponskill (Ex): You get Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must choose the same weapon for both feats.

    Mindshield (Ex): You have spell resistance equal to 5+your class level.

    Mindblast (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 1/2 your Kai Monk Level+your Cha modifier psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune.

    Animal Kinship (Ex): You get Wild Empathy, as the ranger class feature. In addition, you get a +2 bonus on all Ride checks.

    Mind Over Matter (Su): You get Mage Hand and Endure Elements as a spell-like abilities usable at will.

    Toughness (Ex): You get +2 natural armor and 1 additional hit point per hit die.

    Understanding (Ex): You get Bardic Knowledge, as the bard class feature. In addition, you are treated as trained in every Knowledge skill.

    ----------

    Magnakai Disciplines:
    At 10th level, the Kai Monk ascends to the rank of Magnakai Lord and begins to learn the powerful Magnakai Disciplines.

    At 10th level, the Kai Monk chooses three of the Magnakai Disciplines. At each additional Kai Monk level, the Kai Monk chooses another Magnakai Discipline until they know all 12 at level 20.

    Weaponmastery (Ex): You get Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must apply both feats to the same weapon you chose with the Kai Discipline of Weaponskill.

    Animal Control (Sp): You can use Speak with Animals and Summon Nature's Ally VII as spell-like abilities, usable at will.

    Curing (Sp): You get Cure Light Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself. In addition, you may now use your Cure Minor Wounds spell-like ability from the Kai Discipline of Healing on other creatures.

    Invisibility (Sp/Su): You get Invisibility and Disguise Self as spell-like abilities usable at will; you may only target yourself with these abilities. In addition, you gain Hide in Plain Sight as the Assassin class feature.

    Huntmastery (Ex): You get a +4 bonus on all Initiative checks and all Survival skill checks. In addition, your base land speed is increased by 5 feet per round.

    Pathsmanship (Ps/Ex): You gain Know Direction and Location as a psi-like ability usable at will. In addition, you get a +4 bonus to all Survival and Decipher Script checks.

    Psi-surge (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 4d6+Cha psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with SR or PR exceeding 25 are immune. Using this ability deals 1d6 psychic damage to you. In addition, your psychic attack from the Kai Discipline of Mindblast increases in damage to 2d6+Cha.

    Psi-screen: You have spell resistance equal to 10+your class level.

    Nexus (Ex/Sp): You resist heat and cold; this grants you Fire Resistance 5 and Cold Resistance 5. In addition, you gain Telekinesis as a spell-like ability usable at will.

    Divination (Ex/Sp): You can not be surprised; this means you can always take a standard action during a surprise round, unless you are physically restrained from doing so. In addition, you get Arcane Sight as a spell-like ability usable at will.

    Stoneskin (Ex): You get +4 natural armor and 2 additional hit points per hit die; these effects replace the Kai Discipline of Endurance.

    Comprehension (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus on every Knowledge skill. In addition, you get Identify as a spell-like ability usable at will.

    ----------

    Lore Circles (Ex):
    As the Kai Monk learns the Magnakai Disciplines, they can complete schools of training known as Lore Circles. By learning all of the Magnakai Disciplines listed in a Lore Circle, they get the bonus listed with the Lore Circle.

    Circle of Fire: Weaponmastery and Stoneskin
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of Fire get a +1 bonus on all attack rolls.

    Circle of Light: Animal Control, Comprehension and Curing
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of Light get an inherent +2 bonus to their Constitution score.

    Circle of Solaris: Invisibility, Huntmastery and Pathsmanship
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of Solaris get a +2 bonus on all Initiative checks.

    Circle of the Spirit: Psi-surge, Psi-screen, Nexus and Divination
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of the Spirit get a +1 bonus on all saving throws.

    ----------
    Last edited by qwertyu63; 2014-10-19 at 11:55 AM.

    My Homebrew-Estote clementes, et numquam desinete discere.-FanAdv

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2014

    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    I like the concept. A more skillmonkey-focused Monk is nice. However, criticisms:
    1.
    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    The Kai Monk
    Alignment: Any good
    Limited to three alignments = ew. Any nonevil would be a lot more forgiving, but my hatred of tight alignment restrictions is a personal preference.

    2. Some of the abilities are just too powerful:
    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Healing (Su): You get Cure Minor Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself.
    Like this one. You can have unlimited out-of-combat self-healing as early as first level, without cheese. I would recommend making it more like a Wholeness of Body ability, where it's based on class level*ability modifier. Speaking of which, these guys are non-ability-dependent. Is that intentional?

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Mindblast (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 1d6+Cha psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune.
    This is a weird one; it can one-shot a lot of enemies at 1st level if you've got high Charisma, but after that it starts being useless fast. Maybe a level-based thing again, where it deals 1/2 level + Charisma modifier?

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Mind Over Matter (Su): You get Mage Hand and Endure Elements as a spell-like abilities usable at will.
    Unless your intent is for the Endure Elements to be usable on others, might want to just say they gain a continuous self-only Endure Elements effect.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Animal Control (Sp): You can use Speak with Animals and Summon Nature's Ally VII as spell-like abilities, usable at will.
    At-will summons opens a lot of doors, even if it's just SNA; flight is only one of them. Might want to specify caster levels for these, otherwise the duration could be interpreted as unlimited (a la poor readings of Zceryll).

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Curing (Sp): You get Cure Light Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself. In addition, you may now use your Cure Minor Wounds spell-like ability from the Kai Discipline of Healing on other creatures.
    Now the whole party has unlimited out-of-combat healing. Wooooo

    I would advise that this one instead let you heal 2*level*ability modifier HP/day, divided among targets as you choose.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Psi-surge (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 4d6+Cha psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with SR or PR exceeding 25 are immune. Using this ability deals 1d6 psychic damage to you. In addition, your psychic attack from the Kai Discipline of Mindblast increases in damage to 2d6+Cha.
    I like the fact that you take a bit of damage; prevents spamming. However, at 10th level and above 4d6+Cha damage isn't all that much. If you take my above suggestion for the lesser version (1/2 level+Cha), then make this ability change damage to Level+Cha, and you take Cha damage when using it on targets with SR/PR > 25.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Divination (Ex/Sp): You can not be surprised; this means you can always take a standard action during a surprise round, unless you are physically restrained from doing so. In addition, you get Arcane Sight and Augury as spell-like abilities usable at will.
    What. Augury at-will would bog down gameplay hard as the PC uses it for every noncombat action and the DM has to come up with riddles on the fly. At-will Arcane Sight is also strong, but it's high-level so I'll let it slide. However, no surprise? Absurdly strong. Too much. I would, at most, allow a single move action during the surprise round, so that surprising enemies still get some benefit (i.e. the monk can't use an item to teleport away).

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Stoneskin (Ex): You get +5 natural armor and 3 additional hit points per hit die; these effects replace the Kai Discipline of Endurance.
    That is, by the way, +60 HP at level 20. Congrats, this class doesn't need constitution. I don't know; maybe make it +5 NA, +2 hp/HD, and 25% fortification.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Circle of Light: Animal Control, Comprehension and Curing
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of Light get an inherent +4 bonus to their Constitution score.
    This + Stoneskin Magnakai = +5 HP/HD over another character. They don't need that when they already have a d8.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Circle of Solaris: Invisibility, Huntmastery and Pathsmanship
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of Solaris get a +4 bonus on all Initiative checks.
    Interesting how you give an Initiative bonus from Huntmastery and from this. Also interesting that they're both untyped. Too much.

    Quote Originally Posted by qwertyu63 View Post
    Circle of the Spirit: Psi-surge, Psi-screen, Nexus and Divination
    Kai Monks who complete the Circle of the Spirit get a +3 bonus on all saving throws.
    So then their class base saves are actually +15/+15/+15?

    However, this is my main issue:
    At first level, the Kai Monk chooses three of the Kai Disciplines. At each additional Kai Monk level, the Kai Monk chooses another Kai Discipline until they know all 12 at level 10.
    At 10th level, the Kai Monk chooses three of the Magnakai Disciplines. At each additional Kai Monk level, the Kai Monk chooses another Magnakai Discipline until they know all 12 at level 20.
    This means that two Kai Monks will have exactly the same class features. There is no customization available for this class; no variable lists of bonus feats, no spell selection, no animal companions/special mounts to choose from, only skills and the basic feats that every character gets. I would very strongly recommend adding at least 3 to 5 Kai Disciplines, and reducing the number of Magnakai Disciplines learned at 10th level to one. Then there's at least some variability in class features. I also think that the Lore Circles should be nerfed or removed; they're statted out like a character only gets one, but they actually can't not acquire all of them under the current system.

    To sum up: Nice concept, and rather well-done right off the bat, but the execution still needs some work.
    Please use they/them/theirs when referring to me in the third person.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    Alright, first thing to note: This class was almost a 10 level prestige class that didn't have the Magnikai stuff at all. Still thinking of doing that actually. I'll make it and see how it looks.

    Second thing to note: my targeted balance point is very high (i.e. If I didn't reach or exceed high tier 3, I haven't done my job right yet).

    Quote Originally Posted by Extra Anchovies View Post
    I like the concept. A more skillmonkey-focused Monk is nice. However, criticisms:
    1.
    Limited to three alignments = ew. Any nonevil would be a lot more forgiving, but my hatred of tight alignment restrictions is a personal preference.
    Yeah, the Kai Monks are forces of good a la the Paladin; they almost got a code of conduct.

    2. Some of the abilities are just too powerful:Like this one. You can have unlimited out-of-combat self-healing as early as first level, without cheese. I would recommend making it more like a Wholeness of Body ability, where it's based on class level*ability modifier. Speaking of which, these guys are non-ability-dependent. Is that intentional?
    I have no issues with endless out of combat healing; I, in fact, consider it a good thing. That is the point of that ability.

    That said, making them NAD wasn't intentional; I've no great issue with it though.

    This is a weird one; it can one-shot a lot of enemies at 1st level if you've got high Charisma, but after that it starts being useless fast. Maybe a level-based thing again, where it deals 1/2 level + Charisma modifier?
    That's a good idea. I'll be stealing that.

    Unless your intent is for the Endure Elements to be usable on others, might want to just say they gain a continuous self-only Endure Elements effect.
    I did not, in fact, intend that to be usable on others; thanks for catching that. I wanted the continuous effect, but I couldn't get the wording right; I'm still fighting with it.

    At-will summons opens a lot of doors, even if it's just SNA; flight is only one of them. Might want to specify caster levels for these, otherwise the duration could be interpreted as unlimited (a la poor readings of Zceryll).
    Crap. I must have deleted the part where I stated the caster level (it's class level, BTW).

    Now the whole party has unlimited out-of-combat healing. Wooooo

    I would advise that this one instead let you heal 2*level*ability modifier HP/day, divided among targets as you choose.
    As above, so below, still not a bad thing in my book.

    I like the fact that you take a bit of damage; prevents spamming. However, at 10th level and above 4d6+Cha damage isn't all that much. If you take my above suggestion for the lesser version (1/2 level+Cha), then make this ability change damage to Level+Cha, and you take Cha damage when using it on targets with SR/PR > 25.
    I can't think of anything to say here yet, but I plan to respond later.

    [/quote]What. Augury at-will would bog down gameplay hard as the PC uses it for every noncombat action and the DM has to come up with riddles on the fly. At-will Arcane Sight is also strong, but it's high-level so I'll let it slide. However, no surprise? Absurdly strong. Too much. I would, at most, allow a single move action during the surprise round, so that surprising enemies still get some benefit (i.e. the monk can't use an item to teleport away).[/quote]

    What. How did Augury get back on that list? I meant to delete that. Thanks for catching that.

    However, this is my main issue:This means that two Kai Monks will have exactly the same class features. There is no customization available for this class; no variable lists of bonus feats, no spell selection, no animal companions/special mounts to choose from, only skills and the basic feats that every character gets. I would very strongly recommend adding at least 3 to 5 Kai Disciplines, and reducing the number of Magnakai Disciplines learned at 10th level to one. Then there's at least some variability in class features. I also think that the Lore Circles should be nerfed or removed; they're statted out like a character only gets one, but they actually can't not acquire all of them under the current system.
    That actually is as intended. Kai monks must (in the books) acquire all of the Disciplines before their training is complete.

    My Homebrew-Estote clementes, et numquam desinete discere.-FanAdv

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Troll in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    You only go up to Magnakai, and you lack Bardsmanship (Bardsmanship)? What is this?

    More seriously, your balance stuff is way off, both in representing what each power is capable of, and in the fact that you left out the scaling you get once you hit Magnakai.

    Here, have the Project Aon Reader's Handbook with the powers and their upgrades.

    Why, in fact, did you stop at Magnakai?

    More serious balance stuff:

    Kai Disciplines

    Camouflage (Ex): You get a +2 bonus to all Bluff, Disguise, Hide and Move Silently skill checks.
    This is... if I didn't have to take this, I never would. Getting this as my only benefit that level would make me sad.

    Hunting (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus to all Survival skill checks. In addition, you get Detect Poison as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Alright, fair enough; I seem to recall that they would get Scent at this point as well.

    Sixth Sense (Ex/Sp): You get Uncanny Dodge, as the rogue class feature. In addition, you get Augury as a spell-like ability usable three times per day.
    No. No. NO. This is Augury 3/day at 1st level. Augury is a pretty good 2nd level spell.

    Tracking (Ex): You get Tracking and Urban Tracking as bonus feats. In addition, you get a +2 bonus to Spot and Listen checks.
    Three-ish bonus feats. Eh, more or less fine; they really should get a bonus to Gather Information checks to help with Urban Tracking.

    Healing (Su): You get Cure Minor Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself.
    Ah yes, the discipline you would kick yourself if you didn't take it at 1st level. A cantrip at-will is fine, though it still means you are restored to full HP between every battle.

    Weaponskill (Ex): You get Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must choose the same weapon for both feats.
    Weaponskill... this is fine.

    Mindshield (Ex): You have spell resistance equal to 5+your class level.
    This is useless! Seriously, 5 + level keeps spellcasters 6 levels behind you off your back. If they roll below an 11. You know what else you could do to people 6 levels lower than you? Beat them up and take their stuff.

    Mindblast (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 1/2 your Kai Monk Level+your Cha modifier psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune.
    Psychic damage isn't a damage type in 3.5. This is pretty powerful at 1st level... not so much once you've hit 4th level.

    Animal Kinship (Ex): You get Wild Empathy, as the ranger class feature. In addition, you get a +2 bonus on all Ride checks.
    This is perfectly fine; you might want to specify that you use your Kai Monk class level in place of your Ranger level.

    Mind Over Matter (Su): You get Mage Hand and Endure Elements as a spell-like abilities usable at will.
    This works out - though this brings me to a question I have. Why don't you just give them Endure Elements as a constant Su ability? It fits the flavor better, is more mechanically elegant, and just plain works out.

    Toughness (Ex): You get +2 natural armor and 1 additional hit point per hit die.
    This is fine, though Kai Monks are forest ninjas - I'm surprised that you gave them this instead of, say, Evasion.

    Understanding (Ex): You get Bardic Knowledge, as the bard class feature. In addition, you are treated as trained in every Knowledge skill.
    The language you are looking for is "In addition, you can use any Knowledge skill untrained". And, again, you should specify that they use their Kai Monk class levels in place of their Bard Level for the purposes of Bardic Knowledge.

    Magnakai

    Weaponmastery (Ex): You get Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must apply both feats to the same weapon you chose with the Kai Discipline of Weaponskill.
    Woo. +1 attack rolls and +2 damage. Come on, Weaponmastery scales to eventually cover all weapons, boosts archery like woah, and makes you a lethal unarmed fighter. This is not representative of the skill in question at all.

    Animal Control (Sp): You can use Speak with Animals and Summon Nature's Ally VII as spell-like abilities, usable at will.
    Animal Control really was just Animal Kinship, but applying to Magical Beasts. They really should be getting Dominate Animal and the like, not Summon Nature's Ally (which, by the way, would let them summon Elementals and the like.)

    Curing (Sp): You get Cure Light Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself. In addition, you may now use your Cure Minor Wounds spell-like ability from the Kai Discipline of Healing on other creatures.
    This is... weaksauce. Really weaksauce. At least give them back Delay Poison/Remove Poison.

    Invisibility (Sp/Su): You get Invisibility and Disguise Self as spell-like abilities usable at will; you may only target yourself with these abilities. In addition, you gain Hide in Plain Sight as the Assassin class feature.
    This is more or less fine, though it's a lot to get as a lump sum.

    Huntmastery (Ex): You get a +4 bonus on all Initiative checks and all Survival skill checks. In addition, your base land speed is increased by 5 feet per round.
    Woah, I get 5' faster every round? I'll be going really uber fast! Kidding aside, the language you're looking for is "you gain a +5 bonus to your base land speed".

    Pathsmanship (Ps/Ex): You gain Know Direction and Location as a psi-like ability usable at will. In addition, you get a +4 bonus to all Survival and Decipher Script checks.
    OK, by this point I have a +12 bonus to all Survival checks... and still no Scent. Oh, and you have "find where I need to go" at-will. That's nice.

    Psi-surge (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 4d6+Cha psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with SR or PR exceeding 25 are immune. Using this ability deals 1d6 psychic damage to you. In addition, your psychic attack from the Kai Discipline of Mindblast increases in damage to 2d6+Cha.
    Again with the non-existent "Psychic" damage type. Still, this one otherwise works out (if a bit weirdly, and with terrible scaling).

    Psi-screen: You have spell resistance equal to 10+your class level.
    ...what.
    ...why didn't you give this out earlier? Seriously, 10 + class level is the minimum spell resistance that is useful, at all, against spellcasters around your level.


    Nexus (Ex/Sp): You resist heat and cold; this grants you Fire Resistance 5 and Cold Resistance 5. In addition, you gain Telekinesis as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Oh, nice, I get some piddly energy resistances... OH HI THERE TELEKINESIS, I'M GLAD TO SEE I GET YOU AT WILL.
    Telekinesis is pretty damn good, especially at will.


    Divination (Ex/Sp): You can not be surprised; this means you can always take a standard action during a surprise round, unless you are physically restrained from doing so. In addition, you get Arcane Sight as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    WHY NOT JUST GET ARCANE SIGHT AS A PERMANENT SU EFFECT?

    Stoneskin (Ex): You get +4 natural armor and 2 additional hit points per hit die; these effects replace the Kai Discipline of Endurance.
    Still no Evasion/Improved Evasion. Or Improved Uncanny Dodge. This doesn't "feel" Kai at all.

    Comprehension (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus on every Knowledge skill. In addition, you get Identify as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Sure, why not.

    Summary
    This is not a very good class. Your pacing is terrible (yes, I know, you're giving out disciplines at the same rate as the books, but you're ignoring the fact that there is a gap between the Kai series and the Magnakai series), the power level of the different disciplines is all over the place (hmm... I can take some piddly bonuses to one weapon first... or I could pick up Telekinesis at-will.)

    Your disciplines are either "bigger numbers" or "spell-like ability 3/day or at-will", your new disciplines don't fit the "what if Aragon was a Jedi?" concept, you don't keep the scaling benefits of the Magnakai disciplines...

    Seriously. One level dip to grab Toughness and Sixth Sense, then I'd never take a level in it again.
    Quote Originally Posted by segtrfyhtfgj View Post
    door is a fake exterior wall
    Let's play a game, shall we? Current Game: Soul Void. Updates Mondays, 6PM EST.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    Alright, responding now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amechra View Post
    You only go up to Magnakai, and you lack Bardsmanship (Bardsmanship)? What is this?
    Bardsmanship? What's that? Never mind, just read the New Order list.

    More seriously, your balance stuff is way off, both in representing what each power is capable of, and in the fact that you left out the scaling you get once you hit Magnakai.
    I tried to get that scaling, but I decided it was more hassle than it was worth.

    I had that open while writing this.

    Why, in fact, did you stop at Magnakai?
    *shrugs* Ran out of levels. Grand Master would go into epic if I kept going. I might write it later.

    More serious balance stuff:

    Kai Disciplines

    Camouflage (Ex): You get a +2 bonus to all Bluff, Disguise, Hide and Move Silently skill checks.
    This is... if I didn't have to take this, I never would. Getting this as my only benefit that level would make me sad.
    Increased to +4.

    Hunting (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus to all Survival skill checks. In addition, you get Detect Poison as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Alright, fair enough; I seem to recall that they would get Scent at this point as well.
    Ah, Scent; the ability I never think of... off hand, I don't know the rules for Scent. Off to the SRD.

    Sixth Sense (Ex/Sp): You get Uncanny Dodge, as the rogue class feature. In addition, you get Augury as a spell-like ability usable three times per day.
    No. No. NO. This is Augury 3/day at 1st level. Augury is a pretty good 2nd level spell.

    Ah yes. Changed to 1/day (I wish there was a weaker spell that did something like that; I would use it here).

    Tracking (Ex): You get Tracking and Urban Tracking as bonus feats. In addition, you get a +2 bonus to Spot and Listen checks.
    Three-ish bonus feats. Eh, more or less fine; they really should get a bonus to Gather Information checks to help with Urban Tracking.
    It will be done.

    Healing (Su): You get Cure Minor Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself.
    Ah yes, the discipline you would kick yourself if you didn't take it at 1st level. A cantrip at-will is fine, though it still means you are restored to full HP between every battle.
    I have no issues with "full healing between battles".

    Weaponskill (Ex): You get Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must choose the same weapon for both feats.
    Weaponskill... this is fine.
    K.

    Mindshield (Ex): You have spell resistance equal to 5+your class level.
    This is useless! Seriously, 5 + level keeps spellcasters 6 levels behind you off your back. If they roll below an 11. You know what else you could do to people 6 levels lower than you? Beat them up and take their stuff.
    The rough idea here was this: against casters of your level, your SR kicked in 25% of the time (I know, I got the number off by 1 for that; I screwed up the math). That said, increased to 10+level.

    Mindblast (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 1/2 your Kai Monk Level+your Cha modifier psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with any amount of SR or PR are immune.
    Psychic damage isn't a damage type in 3.5. This is pretty powerful at 1st level... not so much once you've hit 4th level.
    I was indicating the source, not the damage; that said, the wording has been changed.

    Animal Kinship (Ex): You get Wild Empathy, as the ranger class feature. In addition, you get a +2 bonus on all Ride checks.
    This is perfectly fine; you might want to specify that you use your Kai Monk class level in place of your Ranger level.
    It will be done.

    Mind Over Matter (Su): You get Mage Hand and Endure Elements as a spell-like abilities usable at will.
    This works out - though this brings me to a question I have. Why don't you just give them Endure Elements as a constant Su ability? It fits the flavor better, is more mechanically elegant, and just plain works out.
    Because I couldn't get the wording to work, my files say it that way now. I'll update the post one of these days.

    Toughness (Ex): You get +2 natural armor and 1 additional hit point per hit die.
    This is fine, though Kai Monks are forest ninjas - I'm surprised that you gave them this instead of, say, Evasion.
    Replacing this completely with +2 dodge to AC and evasion.

    Understanding (Ex): You get Bardic Knowledge, as the bard class feature. In addition, you are treated as trained in every Knowledge skill.
    The language you are looking for is "In addition, you can use any Knowledge skill untrained". And, again, you should specify that they use their Kai Monk class levels in place of their Bard Level for the purposes of Bardic Knowledge.
    Thank you and noted.

    Magnakai
    Side note: I am working on a PrC version that cuts these out entirely, ending at level 10 with some powerful capstone. Trying to Magnakai work is more trouble than it is worth.

    Weaponmastery (Ex): You get Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization as bonus feats. You must apply both feats to the same weapon you chose with the Kai Discipline of Weaponskill.
    Woo. +1 attack rolls and +2 damage. Come on, Weaponmastery scales to eventually cover all weapons, boosts archery like woah, and makes you a lethal unarmed fighter. This is not representative of the skill in question at all.
    My original idea started giving Weapon Focus/Specialization for 1 weapon for every Kai Monk level you had; I couldn't get the wording to work.

    Animal Control (Sp): You can use Speak with Animals and Summon Nature's Ally VII as spell-like abilities, usable at will.
    Animal Control really was just Animal Kinship, but applying to Magical Beasts. They really should be getting Dominate Animal and the like, not Summon Nature's Ally (which, by the way, would let them summon Elementals and the like.)
    This discipline is actually one I never used, so I never really knew much about it (never took it in the books, so never looked what its options did). That said, me forgetting that SNA contained elementals is inexcusable.

    Curing (Sp): You get Cure Light Wounds as a spell-like ability usable at will; you may only target yourself. In addition, you may now use your Cure Minor Wounds spell-like ability from the Kai Discipline of Healing on other creatures.
    This is... weaksauce. Really weaksauce. At least give them back Delay Poison/Remove Poison.
    No comment ATM.

    Invisibility (Sp/Su): You get Invisibility and Disguise Self as spell-like abilities usable at will; you may only target yourself with these abilities. In addition, you gain Hide in Plain Sight as the Assassin class feature.
    This is more or less fine, though it's a lot to get as a lump sum.
    K.

    Huntmastery (Ex): You get a +4 bonus on all Initiative checks and all Survival skill checks. In addition, your base land speed is increased by 5 feet per round.
    Woah, I get 5' faster every round? I'll be going really uber fast! Kidding aside, the language you're looking for is "you gain a +5 bonus to your base land speed".
    Derp. Thank you.

    Pathsmanship (Ps/Ex): You gain Know Direction and Location as a psi-like ability usable at will. In addition, you get a +4 bonus to all Survival and Decipher Script checks.
    OK, by this point I have a +12 bonus to all Survival checks... and still no Scent. Oh, and you have "find where I need to go" at-will. That's nice.
    Again, I never think of Scent.

    Psi-surge (Su): You can, as a swift action, deal 4d6+Cha psychic damage to any creature within 30 feet (this is [mind-affecting]); creatures with SR or PR exceeding 25 are immune. Using this ability deals 1d6 psychic damage to you. In addition, your psychic attack from the Kai Discipline of Mindblast increases in damage to 2d6+Cha.
    Again with the non-existent "Psychic" damage type. Still, this one otherwise works out (if a bit weirdly, and with terrible scaling).
    Noted.

    Psi-screen: You have spell resistance equal to 10+your class level.
    ...what.
    ...why didn't you give this out earlier? Seriously, 10 + class level is the minimum spell resistance that is useful, at all, against spellcasters around your level.
    See Mindshield.

    Nexus (Ex/Sp): You resist heat and cold; this grants you Fire Resistance 5 and Cold Resistance 5. In addition, you gain Telekinesis as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Oh, nice, I get some piddly energy resistances... OH HI THERE TELEKINESIS, I'M GLAD TO SEE I GET YOU AT WILL.
    Telekinesis is pretty damn good, especially at will.
    Alright, so remove Telekinesis. K.

    Divination (Ex/Sp): You can not be surprised; this means you can always take a standard action during a surprise round, unless you are physically restrained from doing so. In addition, you get Arcane Sight as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    WHY NOT JUST GET ARCANE SIGHT AS A PERMANENT SU EFFECT?
    Because... sigh... I didn't think of that.

    Stoneskin (Ex): You get +4 natural armor and 2 additional hit points per hit die; these effects replace the Kai Discipline of Endurance.
    Still no Evasion/Improved Evasion. Or Improved Uncanny Dodge. This doesn't "feel" Kai at all.
    Scraping this.

    Comprehension (Ex/Sp): You get a +5 bonus on every Knowledge skill. In addition, you get Identify as a spell-like ability usable at will.
    Sure, why not.
    K.

    Summary
    This is not a very good class. Your pacing is terrible (yes, I know, you're giving out disciplines at the same rate as the books, but you're ignoring the fact that there is a gap between the Kai series and the Magnakai series), the power level of the different disciplines is all over the place (hmm... I can take some piddly bonuses to one weapon first... or I could pick up Telekinesis at-will.)

    Your disciplines are either "bigger numbers" or "spell-like ability 3/day or at-will", your new disciplines don't fit the "what if Aragon was a Jedi?" concept, you don't keep the scaling benefits of the Magnakai disciplines...

    Seriously. One level dip to grab Toughness and Sixth Sense, then I'd never take a level in it again.
    Last edited by qwertyu63; 2014-10-03 at 10:03 PM.

    My Homebrew-Estote clementes, et numquam desinete discere.-FanAdv

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    please make an updated character box?
    Reality is my clay, Imagination my tools.

    Always have an idea on hand.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    Quote Originally Posted by infinitetech View Post
    please make an updated character box?
    Huh? What is a character box?

    My Homebrew-Estote clementes, et numquam desinete discere.-FanAdv

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Amechra's Avatar

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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    I think it's the same as a class table.

    I think.
    Quote Originally Posted by segtrfyhtfgj View Post
    door is a fake exterior wall
    Let's play a game, shall we? Current Game: Soul Void. Updates Mondays, 6PM EST.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Orc in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: My take on the Kai Monk

    yeah, sorry, term from another game
    Reality is my clay, Imagination my tools.

    Always have an idea on hand.

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