Roleplaying thoughts

[Jendekit]

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall set me free.

—the Sith Code

There's an NPC Sith lord in a game I'll be starting soon that is a Light Side Force user, but is still a fervent believer in the Sith Code. I already know how I want to roleplay him, but I'd like to hear the playground's thoughts on the topic.

How would YOU roleplay a light sided Sith?

[Waddacku]

I... wouldn't? Obviously you can do what you want with it, but I'm pretty sure Light-side Sith just isn't possible in Star Wars.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I'll admit to having a pretty broad lack of knowledge about the Star Wars setting but I don't think that works that way.

The nature of the force is such that if you adhere to the sith code you -are- a dark side force user. It's not so much that the sith wrote that code then chose the dark side but that they wielded the dark side and then created that code as they explored how it worked.

I could, of course, be wrong about that but it's how I understood it to be.

I'll leave the fact that Lucas completely bastardized the Tao Te Ching and Zen Bhuddism to create his supernatural "force" alone though and just say that the source material has both sides as equal but different rather than one being good and the other evil.

[Coidzor]

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall set me free.

—the Sith Code

There's an NPC Sith lord in a game I'll be starting soon that is a Light Side Force user, but is still a fervent believer in the Sith Code. I already know how I want to roleplay him, but I'd like to hear the playground's thoughts on the topic.

How would YOU roleplay a light sided Sith?

You wouldn't. The other Sith trying to murder his ass for being a Light-Sided weakling would have made him angry if he survived and led to the Dark Side and the status quo for Sith or he would have had to flee them and would have likely become disillusioned with the Sith and gone his own way to form his own philosophy, because Jedi and Sith aren't the only options. I swear. Even though they're all no longer canon because of Disney's acquisition of the IP.

I mean, he could be a crazy Sith-Exile or something. He would not be a Sith Lord, though, he wouldn't have been able to ascend Sith society pre-Rule-of-Two and he wouldn't have been able to stay as either Master or Apprentice as a Light-Sider.

[Red Fel]

As others have pointed out, a Light-sided Sith is virtually impossible. That said, I'm going to assume for sake of argument that it is possible, and go from there.

Short answer? He thinks he's God. Capital-G God.

Here's why. The Jedi bring balance wherever they go. They encourage harmony, but they themselves endeavor to withdraw from the world, being impartial outsiders, observers, and adjudicators, unless they are forced into action to preserve balance. The Sith are the opposite; they live very much within the world, using the Force as a tool to advance themselves and their own aims, whatever they may be. They can at best be described as self-indulgent and self-promoting, and most importantly unrestrained.

Now for the two sides of the Force. The Light side is about subtlety, manipulation, and defense. The Dark side is about raw power and destruction.

The usual Jedi method is Light, because Jedi are subtle, and they use the Light to manipulate subtly. They abhor the Dark side because they're not about destruction, and the idea of raw power is a temptation they avoid. The Sith gravitate towards the Dark because it's easy and effective; brute force and destructive fury gets them what they want.

Now, take the Sith philosophy of using the Force as a tool to get what you want, and combine it with the Light's tendency to manipulate and defend, rather than brute force. Where does that put you?

It gives you a person who believes in himself first and foremost, whose powers can warp minds and move mountains, who renders himself unassailable. He knows what is best for the world. He doesn't fight his enemies; he makes them worship him.

Dark-siders you can trust to fight, to consume and destroy. But a Light-side Sith? He doesn't want the universe destroyed. He just wants it to revolve around him. He wields his Force powers, not like a bludgeon, but like a poison-tipped dart, a subtle and insidious weapon more deadly than Force Lightning.

That said? Wouldn't happen. The Sith teach the Dark Side, and the Jedi wouldn't teach the Light Side to someone with obvious Sith tendencies. Besides, the Light side requires focus, concentration and serenity; and as the Sith code teaches, passion, not peace, is the road to power.

Why does everyone try to make Gray Jedi?

[Arbane]

Why does everyone try to make Gray Jedi?

Because the Black and White, one-slip-and-you-turn-ugly-and-evil morality of the standard Star Wars makes for less interesting stories, as a wild guess. Besides, all that stuff is just Jedi propaganda - if they were REALLY so enlightened, why'd they nearly go extinct? (Yes, the Sith nearly went extinct too, but we know why - they're self-destructive dumbasses and everyone sane hates them.)

Heck, the Knights of the Old Republic MMO lets you make Light Side Sith. They'll still do some fairly reprehensible things, but it IS possible.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

I think it happens because it's a paradox people like to wrap their minds around. It's an intellectual puzzle. It's a problem that demands answers.

[Scyrner]

I don't think that a Light-Side Sith is an impossibility. I think it's pretty much an impossibility after the Rule of Two stuff, but in the Old Republic Era I think it could work. It would depend very much on the character of the sith's master; the master would need to value results and suchlike above methods. I think, for the most part, the Light Side Sith Warrior and Inquisitor in Star Wars: The Old Republic are quite good stories and versions of how that might play out.

Spoilers for Star Wars: The Old Republic Inquisitor Story-line below:

Spoiler

Show

Essentially, after the Inquisitor defends themselves against their master's assassination attempt and kills her you need to gather more power because *reasons* and the way you go about it is by binding and utilizing the power of ancient ghosts. Pretty much, the dark side option is force them to serve you, the light side option is convince them too

If they can survive the brainwashing of the Sith Academy, there's nothing inherently "evil" about the Sith. The issue is that people don't often have the willpower to sustain themselves against the allure of the Dark Side if they don't use the force in a somewhat less "loose" manner.

I think it'd be totally possible to have a Light Side Sith Archivist who believes the Sith Code is correct, but believes that passion doesn't necessarily mean anger, rage, fear, etc. It could be conviction or love (cheesy, but this is Star Wars). They might also not act in a evil way. It would be difficult to do, but it definitely could be done.


Edit: Realized I didn't actually address the question.

Aisling Aonar: Light Side Sith Ambassador, Sith Lord, Apprentice to the Heretic - Darth Grathan

Aisling was taken from her family as a child to become the apprentice of Darth Grathan on Drommund Kass. Grathan was largely laissez-faire regarding her education, beyond the tenants of the Sith Code, which she took too quickly. Aisling soon realized that, in a community of such tension and fear as the Sith Empire under Darth Vitiate, people often responded better to a kind ear than to bared teeth, as there is always someone scarier, but rarely someone willing to listen. In the beginning, her methods were driven by her desire to impress Grathan, and impress him she did, not with her methods, but with her results. That wasn't to say that Grathan didn't take notice of her peculiar way of interacting with her subordinates, but when he noticed that there were far more people willing to support her in a pinch, than his other, rather more stereotypical apprentice, he began to become curious. He began to watch her closely as she matured in her power and her understanding of the Sith Philosophy, and came to understand that her sympathy concealed not weakness, but an indomitable strength. Love her, and she will move mountains for you. Harm those she loves, and she will drop those mountains on you. When Darth Grathan was eventually killed and his position taken by a rival Sith Lord, Aisling began to plot against him, knowing that, with the power granted to her by the title Darth, she could build her influence throughout the Empire, until, eventually, the Sith Code would be understood not as a weapon of anger, but as a tool by which one can gain one's freedom, as it should be.

Back-story done, moving on:
She would be quiet and reserved, often holding her comments till the end while among other Sith, wary of their spontaneous rages. She would try to fly under the radar, as best she could, in order to avoid the attention of Sith who might take offense to her considerably more open minded viewpoint. She would cultivate allies in every reach of life, allowing them certain latitudes when possible, in order to reinforce herself against a more immediately powerful Sith's challenge. Her goal would be to fix the Empire because "The Empire will be destroyed by the Republic, because we will destroy ourselves. The Sith must change, they must develop, and they must embrace a different way of practicing the Code. As long as we embrace the Dark Side to find our passions, we will always find ourselves at odds with the Republic, and that is a war which we cannot win."

[kardar233]

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall set me free.

—the Sith Code

There's an NPC Sith lord in a game I'll be starting soon that is a Light Side Force user, but is still a fervent believer in the Sith Code. I already know how I want to roleplay him, but I'd like to hear the playground's thoughts on the topic.

How would YOU roleplay a light sided Sith?

Well, the Sith Code as written doesn't, strictly speaking, direct you towards the Dark Side. It's easy to go that way, depending on your interpretation of the third and especially fifth line as you could use that to justify a lot, but it is definitely possible to abide by the Sith Code and stay Light Side.

I'd play that person as being fiercely individualistic, humanist, and equally as compassionate as the Jedi you might compare them to. They'd believe that instead of solving peoples' problems, they should empower people to solve their own problems. Rather than be a monastic monk like the Jedi, they'd seek out connections and things to care for, to fight for, because passion is strength and the more you care about the stronger you are. They'd believe in the ability of regular people to do amazing things because they set their mind to it and they care about it, and damn anyone who says otherwise.

Play Kamina. Be the one who believes in people when no one else will. Show everyone what they can do if they really care, and never, ever back down, because who the hell do they think you are?

[JusticeZero]

I'd say it is not possible full stop to be a "Light side Sith", but don't think that it actually matters.
You get power from things like "I want to use a defensive power, I will harness fear!" "I need to damage something, I will use anger!" "I want to help someone else, I will use love!" "I want to go faster, I will harness joy!" ALL of those will get you a Dark Side Point.
The codes themself are a sort've odd Lawful/Chaotic dichotomy, and don't address good or evil; the canon, however, reads like propaganda written by the winners of a grey vs. grey war. The Jedi have done a lot of very shady things, even in the canon, and the Sith Code is full of things that most people would consider positive.
As a result, you should be able to make a "Good Sith", because the cosmology from a more neutral standpoint is one where the magic system mainly cares about your Lawful/Chaotic score, thus permitting Chaotic Good. That said, all the games tend to conflate Light/Dark with Good/Evil on a lot of things. When poking around on SWTOR, I see a lot of DSP choices that don't actually violate anything in the Jedi Code and don't actually follow the Sith Code; similarly, lots of choices offer up Light side points even though they fly in the face of the Code.

A Light Sith would be a hard core Dark Side force user because they will be absolutely bubbling over with Dark Side power, because they do a lot of things like channeling their joy, making and helping close friends, and raging against oppression and evil in favor of freedom in the manner of an activist. All of that stuff will push them to the Dark Side, and none of it will make them a bad person.
I was actually reading this on the subject today.

[azoetia]

I agree that it wouldn't be possible during the Rule of Two era, but during the KOTOR era it's not just possible but has probably happened at least a few times. The Sith code is all about drawing strength from your passions. The issue that people face in the Star Wars universe is absolute power corrupting absolutely, as one's passions are a critical avenue for corruption when one possesses the power of the Force.

A very reasonable and sensible person could be a light-sided Sith Lord. Lana Beniko, for example, doesn't exactly seem light sided, but she at least seems grey because of her even-keel personality and restraint. I would use her as a good example from which to begin building such a character. Her passion is in civic duty, preserving and advancing her society. She indulges in this passion without letting it take control over her. Darth Marr has the same passion for preserving the Empire, but it leads him to a far darker place than Lana. I'm not aware of anything she's done that was any more shady than what the Jedi have.

[BWR]

I'd say it's not impossible (though highly unlikely) for someone trained and raised in the Sith traditions to turn to the Light Side. Thing is, they'd end up being pretty much the same as a Jedi and would reject the Sith ideals. The extreme selfishness and need to dominate that is the core of the Sith is entirely at odds with the sublimation of the self and attempt at harmony with the Universe that is the focus of the Jedi. Light and Dark aren't so much about good and evil, it's more balance and imbalance, attuning yourself to the flow of the universe or trying to force it (ha) to do what you want, about accepting and adapting or trying to dominate it. Feelings cloud your judgement and unrestrained passion as the Sith preach it is basically selfishness. I suppose a believer in the Sith code could conceivably come to the heretical conclusion that the truest strength is surrender and acceptance rather than conflict and dominance but you'd have to do some really twisty thinking to believe that the Sith code can be interpreted this way. Not that twisted thinking is a problem for nuts.

I really don't like the 'gray Jedi' nonsense. IME, every single one is basically an excuse for someone to do Dark stuff like lightning blasting people but they don't want to be evil. It's the SW version of "I'm not evil I'm CN".

[Vitruviansquid]

There are force-users in the Star Wars universe who are told to be Jedi, but who become Sith, right?

Wouldn't there be force-users in the Star Wars universe who are also told to be Sith, but then become Jedi?

Maybe someone trained by Sith, but who somehow winds up seeing it as violent and counterproductive for some reason. Their beliefs would now be closer to the Light Side, but for one reason or another, other Sith haven't killed or expelled the character yet.

[JusticeZero]

I'd say it's not impossible (though highly unlikely) for someone trained and raised in the Sith traditions to turn to the Light Side. Thing is, they'd end up being pretty much the same as a Jedi and would reject the Sith ideals. The extreme selfishness and need to dominate that is the core of the Sith is entirely at odds with the sublimation of the self and attempt at harmony with the Universe that is the focus of the Jedi.

And see, this is how the propaganda reads. There is nothing in the core Sith beliefs that demands selfishness; it's about being passionate and trying to change things. Go look at all of the people protesting any of the several social injustices of the day; every single protester and activist there is following the Sith code. What they are doing is indeed the epitome of the Dark Side.
It's just that the Sith Code doesn't exist in a vacuum. The order itself has a lot of jerks in it right now. They have some good reasons to be angry, mind you. The Jedi, as an organization, is also pretty thoroughly evil in a lot of ways, but they're the ones that are connected to the side that gets to write the history.

Light and Dark aren't so much about good and evil, it's more balance and imbalance, attuning yourself to the flow of the universe or trying to force it (ha) to do what you want, about accepting and adapting or trying to dominate it.... a believer in the Sith code could conceivably come to the heretical conclusion that the truest strength is surrender and acceptance rather than conflict and dominance but you'd have to do some really twisty thinking to believe that the Sith code can be interpreted this way.

We're in agreement on that point at least, which is why I find "Light Side Sith" and "Grey jedi" to both be a mess. The former is a severe mess of dysfunctional theology, and the latter is just someone who agrees that the Jedi Code requires certain things, which they just don't want to do.

Also, there is nothing unreasonable about even a blackhearted Sith adopting the Light Side - the Dark Side is said to be the fast and easy way - but the flip side of that is that the Light Side can be seen as a sort of Magicarp Power, which a long-planning Sith might find appealing.

[Jendekit]

I don't think that a Light-Side Sith is an impossibility. I think it's pretty much an impossibility after the Rule of Two stuff, but in the Old Republic Era I think it could work. It would depend very much on the character of the sith's master; the master would need to value results and suchlike above methods. I think, for the most part, the Light Side Sith Warrior and Inquisitor in Star Wars: The Old Republic are quite good stories and versions of how that might play out.

Spoilers for Star Wars: The Old Republic Inquisitor Story-line below:

Spoiler

Show

Essentially, after the Inquisitor defends themselves against their master's assassination attempt and kills her you need to gather more power because *reasons* and the way you go about it is by binding and utilizing the power of ancient ghosts. Pretty much, the dark side option is force them to serve you, the light side option is convince them too

If they can survive the brainwashing of the Sith Academy, there's nothing inherently "evil" about the Sith. The issue is that people don't often have the willpower to sustain themselves against the allure of the Dark Side if they don't use the force in a somewhat less "loose" manner.

I think it'd be totally possible to have a Light Side Sith Archivist who believes the Sith Code is correct, but believes that passion doesn't necessarily mean anger, rage, fear, etc. It could be conviction or love (cheesy, but this is Star Wars). They might also not act in a evil way. It would be difficult to do, but it definitely could be done.


Edit: Realized I didn't actually address the question.

Aisling Aonar: Light Side Sith Ambassador, Sith Lord, Apprentice to the Heretic - Darth Grathan

Aisling was taken from her family as a child to become the apprentice of Darth Grathan on Drommund Kass. Grathan was largely laissez-faire regarding her education, beyond the tenants of the Sith Code, which she took too quickly. Aisling soon realized that, in a community of such tension and fear as the Sith Empire under Darth Vitiate, people often responded better to a kind ear than to bared teeth, as there is always someone scarier, but rarely someone willing to listen. In the beginning, her methods were driven by her desire to impress Grathan, and impress him she did, not with her methods, but with her results. That wasn't to say that Grathan didn't take notice of her peculiar way of interacting with her subordinates, but when he noticed that there were far more people willing to support her in a pinch, than his other, rather more stereotypical apprentice, he began to become curious. He began to watch her closely as she matured in her power and her understanding of the Sith Philosophy, and came to understand that her sympathy concealed not weakness, but an indomitable strength. Love her, and she will move mountains for you. Harm those she loves, and she will drop those mountains on you. When Darth Grathan was eventually killed and his position taken by a rival Sith Lord, Aisling began to plot against him, knowing that, with the power granted to her by the title Darth, she could build her influence throughout the Empire, until, eventually, the Sith Code would be understood not as a weapon of anger, but as a tool by which one can gain one's freedom, as it should be.

Back-story done, moving on:
She would be quiet and reserved, often holding her comments till the end while among other Sith, wary of their spontaneous rages. She would try to fly under the radar, as best she could, in order to avoid the attention of Sith who might take offense to her considerably more open minded viewpoint. She would cultivate allies in every reach of life, allowing them certain latitudes when possible, in order to reinforce herself against a more immediately powerful Sith's challenge. Her goal would be to fix the Empire because "The Empire will be destroyed by the Republic, because we will destroy ourselves. The Sith must change, they must develop, and they must embrace a different way of practicing the Code. As long as we embrace the Dark Side to find our passions, we will always find ourselves at odds with the Republic, and that is a war which we cannot win."

I like Aisling more than the NPC that I had, may I use her?

[Jay R]

If you want to play that kind of game, go ahead, but why would you use Star Wars to simulate something inconsistent with Star Wars?

[Scyrner]

I like Aisling more than the NPC that I had, may I use her?

Certainly, go right ahead! Lemme know how it goes, I'd be interested to be kept in the loop

[Jendekit]

Do you have a specific Darth name in mind or should I make one for use in my game?

[kardar233]

If you want to play that kind of game, go ahead, but why would you use Star Wars to simulate something inconsistent with Star Wars?

Because Star Wars itself is very inconsistent with what constitutes Light and Dark. I'm sure there's evidence to support JusticeZero and BWR's interpretations that the Light Side is more like D&D's Law than Good, but most of what I've seen displays Light as solidly Good and Dark as solidly Evil, with the Law and Chaos dichotomy begin a product of the doctrines of the Jedi and Sith rather than being directly sourced from the Force. In that case a Light Side Sith would be a theologically consistent Chaotic Good.

[Jay R]

Because Star Wars itself is very inconsistent with what constitutes Light and Dark. I'm sure there's evidence to support JusticeZero and BWR's interpretations that the Light Side is more like D&D's Law than Good, but most of what I've seen displays Light as solidly Good and Dark as solidly Evil, with the Law and Chaos dichotomy begin a product of the doctrines of the Jedi and Sith rather than being directly sourced from the Force. In that case a Light Side Sith would be a theologically consistent Chaotic Good.

Is this a random guess, or do you have any evidence that the Dark Lords of the Sith aren't inherently dark?

Here's my evidence for stating that the Sith are inherently connected to the Dark Side. It's the start of the definition of the Sith, from the official website:
Sith
An ancient order of Force-wielders devoted to the dark side, ...

From the movies-
Luke: Never. I'll never turn to the Dark Side. You've failed, your highness. I am a Jedi, like my father before me.

Obi-wan: Your father... was seduced by the Dark Side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and "became" Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed.

The Emperor: Strike me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!

So what's your evidence. Do you have any evidence from any movie or other official source that there is any way to become a Sith Lord other than turning to the dark side?

[kardar233]

I'm not saying that the Sith Lords aren't Dark, as historically they have been universally. I'm saying that the association of Light (and thus Good) with Law is a product of the Jedi Order, and that similarly the association of Dark (and Evil) with Chaos is a product of the Sith.

The Sith code that Jendekit posted at the top of the page isn't necessarily a moral stance; it doesn't dictate Good or Evil. It just presents an individualist, passionate method of living your life as a counterpoint to the Jedi way. It's true that every Sith we've heard of has been some kind of Dark monster or another, but that doesn't necessarily follow from the Sith Code. I therefore say it is theoretically possible to follow the Sith Code as written but be a good person and thus Light.

[JusticeZero]

Right, it mostly then becomes a question of whether the Dark Side is evil, and the fact that the Sith Code is NOT evil is an artifact, or whether the Dark Side is chaotic in tune with the Code, and the evil of the organization is an organizational quirk.
As far as the code equalling evil, as noted, if you were to talk to say, modern anti-slavery activists trying to overcome bureaucratic inertia to change the law to make it easier to prosecute slavers when they are trying to kidnap and traffic people.. you will find that every single one of them is a perfect model of the Sith Code, full blast.
The code isn't at all evil. But organizational cultures can become toxic under a variety of situations. Given that both organizations have shifted over history in various ways, with the codes being relatively stable, I am led to believe that it is a situation where there is a harmony vs. passion dichotomy in the magic system, which the two relative organizations adapt to to stay within tolerances for their respective sides, but then the organization surrounding that effort would administratively migrate here or there morally within that.
The places we normally see the Sith menacing the Jedi are, after all, points where historically, the Jedi had recently finished kicking their puppy in nasty and corrupt ways and done horrible things to them.. it's like demonizing bees for chasing someone and starting the cameras rolling right after the victim had hit the nest with a stick and tossed the stick to the side. "Omagerd, the people we *cough* tried to slaughter in a mass genocide for daring to secede *cough* have raised an army and are attacking us! They are pure evil and powered by greed!"

[Jendekit]

I asked some friends of mine this question, and one response was the following (paraphrased):

The hardest part with the Sith Code in playing a light sider is the first part, "Peace is lie" but there are ways of interpreting it to where it can work. One way would be to play them as a cynical individual, they believe that no matter how hard people try, there will always be conflict. That having been said, he is still a caring person that is willing to use his gifts to help others.

Another way of interpreting that line, which is used in the Sith Inquisitor storyline, is in reference to a means rather than an end.
"Peace is a noble goal, but it's not a means to an end."
"So what you're saying is, peace is a lie?"
"When it comes to making real change, yes...I guess I am."

As for the rest of the code, think of a Chaotic Good D&D Barbarian. A devout believer in individual freedoms being what is best for people, and also willing and capable of utilizing their emotions to help others.

Spoiler: For those who haven't played D&D

Show

(For those unfamiliar with the D&D barbarian class, the core class mechanic is a short term buff that enhances their strength, constitution, and ability to resist mind influencing affects, but at the cost of a small hit to their ability to avoid incoming attacks and when it ends they are tired out for the rest of the encounter. The name of this buff is Rage. Fluff-wise, I have always seen the barbarian rage as a cold rage. Whereas most sith use a hot rage to fuel their abilities, the barbarian rage is more a Tranquil Fury. It isn't the screaming, raging fury. It is instead the state where you become so infuriated, that you are calm.)

[Jay R]

None of which changes the fact that the definition of the Sith begins, "An ancient order of Force-wielders devoted to the dark side, ..."

I asked for a citation - any quote from any official source, to put up against this. I've gotten lots of words, but no source at all.

If you want to change the definition of the Sith from what it is to something else, own up to it and admit you're changing it.

[kardar233]

None of which changes the fact that the definition of the Sith begins, "An ancient order of Force-wielders devoted to the dark side, ..."

I asked for a citation - any quote from any official source, to put up against this. I've gotten lots of words, but no source at all.

If you want to change the definition of the Sith from what it is to something else, own up to it and admit you're changing it.

I'm not denying that the Sith Order have been devoted to the Dark Side. I am saying that the Sith Code as written does not specifically promote or indicate a Dark Side leaning, and so it is possible to play a Light Side character who abides by the Sith Code.

[Jay R]

I'm not denying that the Sith Order have been devoted to the Dark Side. I am saying that the Sith Code as written does not specifically promote or indicate a Dark Side leaning, and so it is possible to play a Light Side character who abides by the Sith Code.

Sure, she can abide by the Sith Code. She could likewise abide by the Boy Scout Oath without joining the Boy Scouts, or swear an oath of fealty without being a knight, or boldly go where no one has gone before without joining Starfleet. So what?

But she is not a member of the Sith unless she is part of "An ancient order of Force-wielders devoted to the dark side, ..." [emphasis added.]

[azoetia]

I'm not denying that the Sith Order have been devoted to the Dark Side. I am saying that the Sith Code as written does not specifically promote or indicate a Dark Side leaning, and so it is possible to play a Light Side character who abides by the Sith Code.

In addition, a graduate of the Sith Academy on Korriban could pass the trials while remaining light-sided, defying all attempts at corruption while still succeeding in his or her objectives. Or turn to the light side later in life like Darth Gravid did, intending to reshape and redefine the Sith in order to ensure their survival. There are a number of in-universe ways to make that happen, some of which having been explored in EU materials like SWTOR and the Darth Plagueis novel. I would say that even though the definition of the Sith Order being a dark side-using tradition is accurate, in a huge, messy galaxy full of individuals with their own motivations, personalities, and talents, anything can happen, especially in the KOTOR era when there were thousands of Sith lords running around. If someone follows the Sith code and has been declared a Sith, being light-sided doesn't change anything, unless that person chooses stop identifying as Sith or someone else can takes that title away.

[gom jabbarwocky]

Ai-yi-yi, how is it even possible to have an argument about moral relativism in a fictional universe where morality is literally black and white?

Then again, I'm also the guy who pretends the prequel trilogy never happened, which makes it a lot easier from where I'm standing to say that the Jedi are good and the Dark Side is bad. It's hard to argue that when it is established in the PT that the Jedi Order is a weird cult of child abductors supporting a corrupt system of government who end up leading armies of disposable people into war despite preaching respect for all forms of life.

On the other hand, if you want a "light-side" Sith, I can recommend something that I did for my SW game a few years back...

Spoiler: Gom's Guide to "Good" Sith

Show

In SWd20, you rack up Dark Side Points if you do bad stuff. However, you aren't considered truly "Dark" unless you've racked up more DSPs than you Wisdom score (IIRC), and even then, if you can make a crazy high Will Save, you can stave off going "Dark" for quite some time. So I just made a character min-maxed with an insanely high Will Save, so despite racking up DSPs, whenever someone sensed him in the Force, he only ever registered as "tainted". The PCs just thought he was a 'grey' Jedi - until he finally jumped off the deep end.

Also, the Sith Code doesn't say anything about evil, because, naturally, if you're a Sith, you don't see yourself as evil. The Sith Code isn't some kind of endorsement for badness, but it is a justification for it. People don't follow the Sith Code to become evil - they take up the Sith Code after they've already become evil.

[azoetia]

Also, the Sith Code doesn't say anything about evil, because, naturally, if you're a Sith, you don't see yourself as evil. The Sith Code isn't some kind of endorsement for badness, but it is a justification for it. People don't follow the Sith Code to become evil - they take up the Sith Code after they've already become evil.

Or they're brought up against their will under the code. There are a lot of possibilities to explore.

[gom jabbarwocky]

Or they're brought up against their will under the code. There are a lot of possibilities to explore.

I suppose. That does bring up some interesting explorations of a theme - say, a character that rejects the Sith Code out of rebellion from it. Probably still not a good character, though, at least morally speaking. There are a lot a different ways to be bad, and just because you are opposed to the Sith won't make you a good guy.

Could make for an interesting ancillary villain in a SW game. The enemy of my enemy is my friend? Not always....