I'll NEVER Die! (A Guide to the 5E Barbarian)

[Aramis Rhett]

Haven't read the entirety of the thread, and seeing as many posts are very long I most likely will not, I will suggest a change to the race portion concerning halflings. Yes, great clubs are 2handed and not heavy, and do 1d8. Warhammers, longswords, and battleaxes are all 1d8 and 1handed, as well as being versatile. Meaning a halfling can still rock a 1d10 2hander, or a 1d8 + shield.

[MeeposFire]

Haven't read the entirety of the thread, and seeing as many posts are very long I most likely will not, I will suggest a change to the race portion concerning halflings. Yes, great clubs are 2handed and not heavy, and do 1d8. Warhammers, longswords, and battleaxes are all 1d8 and 1handed, as well as being versatile. Meaning a halfling can still rock a 1d10 2hander, or a 1d8 + shield.

That may very well be true BUT the value of the two handed weapon is less the damage die and more the heavy quality that allows them to get bonus damage from the great weapon fighting feat.

[Aramis Rhett]

Either way, the greatclub isn't heavy, so no bonus. Any of the others I mentioned do the same damage in one hand. For a feat, sentinel (if you pass the bear totem ability that has a similar function) or savage attacker. Rerolling a 1 on a damage roll is pretty sweet. And it is usable once per turn. Pretty good, but somewhat lackluster overall. But given the choices as a halfling, the good choices are gimped due to size.

[MeeposFire]

Either way, the greatclub isn't heavy, so no bonus. Any of the others I mentioned do the same damage in one hand. For a feat, sentinel (if you pass the bear totem ability that has a similar function) or savage attacker. Rerolling a 1 on a damage roll is pretty sweet. And it is usable once per turn. Pretty good, but somewhat lackluster overall. But given the choices as a halfling, the good choices are gimped due to size.

Right but that is why two handed weapons are not really worth it for the small races. I just don't think the small difference in damage dice is worth the loss in AC when you don't get things like the great weapon fighting bonus damage.

[Aramis Rhett]

Right but that is why two handed weapons are not really worth it for the small races. I just don't think the small difference in damage dice is worth the loss in AC when you don't get things like the great weapon fighting bonus damage.

That's the awesome about the weapons I mentioned. Keep the 1d8, and pick up a shield. Use the shield when you need to, stow it away and go to 1d10 when you don't.

Edit: Which I said in the last sentence of my first post. Just noticed it after posting.

[NeoSeraphi]

Sword and Boarding is sub optimal for a barbarian due to the existence of Fighting Styles. If you really want to use a sword and shield, you'd be better off going fighter or paladin for the Dueling Fighting Style, which on its own is equivalent to having a low level barbarian's Rage damage bonus always up. Missing out on that by going barbarian seems like a waste to me.

[MeeposFire]

Sword and Boarding is sub optimal for a barbarian due to the existence of Fighting Styles. If you really want to use a sword and shield, you'd be better off going fighter or paladin for the Dueling Fighting Style, which on its own is equivalent to having a low level barbarian's Rage damage bonus always up. Missing out on that by going barbarian seems like a waste to me.

Well a straight up barb keeps it easy by not having those styles. For a barb going sword and board means on average you will deal about 2 points of damage less per hit (assuming great axe vs long sword) and with two attacks that is about 4 damage per round versus having 2-5 points more of AC +possible other magical benefits.

Now this calculation changes significantly if you allow the great weapon fighting feat which clearly pushes two handed ahead in damage by far. However in this conversation we are talking about small races who cannot use that feat very well and cannot use the best weapons. In this case I think S+B is very competitive since without access to those weapons and feats I just don't see how the damage difference is really great enough to offset the survivability.

[Uthgar21]

I created an Uthgardt Barbarian (simple human race, berseker path) and it's really fun!!I tank amazingly, most of the times I am alone swarmed by enemies while my stupid allies argue about who must spend what for this or the other spell. :P Of course I almost died twice but I am still here so no problem!!I put 3 16s in Str,Con,Dex and 3 9s in the others.Now that I approach the 4th lvl I am thinking of boosting Con because I will have bonus both in AC and the HP.What do you think?

[Felvion]

I created an Uthgardt Barbarian (simple human race, berseker path) and it's really fun!!I tank amazingly, most of the times I am alone swarmed by enemies while my stupid allies argue about who must spend what for this or the other spell. :P Of course I almost died twice but I am still here so no problem!!I put 3 16s in Str,Con,Dex and 3 9s in the others.Now that I approach the 4th lvl I am thinking of boosting Con because I will have bonus both in AC and the HP.What do you think?

If you play with heavy weapon (i assume you do) pick great weapon master feat. it will be a great offensive boost and will help finish your enemies before they kill you! In case you care more about defences con boost is nice and if you get hit by mind-affecting spells often you should also consider resilient (wis).

[Uthgar21]

If you play with heavy weapon (i assume you do) pick great weapon master feat. it will be a great offensive boost and will help finish your enemies before they kill you! In case you care more about defences con boost is nice and if you get hit by mind-affecting spells often you should also consider resilient (wis).

Yes, I use a greatsword!!I look into that, sounds good! :)

[Balor777]

He doesnt need resilient wis.He is a berzerker.
If i would tell you that at 4 you can get one of the following:
+2 point to put werever you want
1 feat of your choice.
Or one +1 weapon.
What would you choose?+1 weapon probably right?
If yes, put your 2 points at strength.

If you want to use reckless more safe,get +2 to attack rolls and +2 to AC ,dip a level in fighter and get duelist style.
+2 to attack rolls is a big bonus.Combine that with advantage to attack rolls and +2 AC and you will hit 90% of the time and 18AC with disadvantage is hardly the same with as 15AC without dissadvantage.You also get 1d10 +1 heal which is nice too.
Thats what i would do.

[NeoSeraphi]

Well a straight up barb keeps it easy by not having those styles. For a barb going sword and board means on average you will deal about 2 points of damage less per hit (assuming great axe vs long sword) and with two attacks that is about 4 damage per round versus having 2-5 points more of AC +possible other magical benefits.

Now this calculation changes significantly if you allow the great weapon fighting feat which clearly pushes two handed ahead in damage by far. However in this conversation we are talking about small races who cannot use that feat very well and cannot use the best weapons. In this case I think S+B is very competitive since without access to those weapons and feats I just don't see how the damage difference is really great enough to offset the survivability.

Yes, but that doesn't discount my point, which is that the smaller race who wants to use a sword and board should pick a different class, for both the higher damage and survivability. A weaker weapon, such as a long sword, does not benefit from powerful abilities such as Brutal Critical nearly as much, you can't take Great Weapon Master, and your AC bonus is negligible if you use Reckless Attack (and if you do not, then you are ignoring one of the best features about being a barbarian).

Meanwhile, if the halfling goes fighter or paladin, he gets Heavy Armor Proficiency, allowing him to grab Heavy Armor Master and have his AC significantly higher, along with getting the Dueling fighting style and Smites/Action Surge. This is much more optimal and efficient. So barbarian is a sub optimal choice for this playstyle, that's why I have not included a discussion about it in my guide.

[Uthgar21]

He doesnt need resilient wis.He is a berzerker.
If i would tell you that at 4 you can get one of the following:
+2 point to put werever you want
1 feat of your choice.
Or one +1 weapon.
What would you choose?+1 weapon probably right?
If yes, put your 2 points at strength.

If you want to use reckless more safe,get +2 to attack rolls and +2 to AC ,dip a level in fighter and get duelist style.
+2 to attack rolls is a big bonus.Combine that with advantage to attack rolls and +2 AC and you will hit 90% of the time and 18AC with disadvantage is hardly the same with as 15AC without dissadvantage.You also get 1d10 +1 heal which is nice too.
Thats what i would do.

I usually use two-handed weapons so I wouldnt be able to use the dueling style.Perhaps If I used a longsword and a shield to use the style you are proposing it could be fun because I would use reckless in every turn and with rage even if they pass my 18 AC the damage would be halved.And then I would have the heal to get it all back.Its a nice idea, havent thought of it!!
Also I liked the idea of the Great Weapon Mastery which combined with reckless attack I would hit most of the times and deal tons of damage (22 average I think) but then I would only have a 16 AC with disadvantage.Of course in the 5th lvl with frenzy and extra attack it would be certain that in my turn one enemy (at least) would die... :D
Or I could take +2 Con to have 17 AC and use reckless atk more safe.(I think that this is the worst idea of the 3 though)

[NeoSeraphi]

Great Weapon Mastery is likely the option you want to take if you are a Berserker. End fights quickly, get +20 to your damage rolls each round, and +30 when you hit 5, it's a very strong option.

[Uthgar21]

Great Weapon Mastery is likely the option you want to take if you are a Berserker. End fights quickly, get +20 to your damage rolls each round, and +30 when you hit 5, it's a very strong option.

Why +20, i thought it was giving only +10? Btw I can use the extra attack when I beat someone to 0 HP as many times as I want or only once per turn?I think I can use it as much as I like during my turn, it could be fun if there are a lot of enemies with low HP.

[NeoSeraphi]

Why +20, i thought it was giving only +10? Btw I can use the extra attack when I beat someone to 0 HP as many times as I want or only once per turn?I think I can use it as much as I like during my turn, it could be fun if there are a lot of enemies with low HP.

It's +10 per attack, and you get 2 attacks with Frenzy, 3 attacks with Extra Attack. Frenzy increases your damage output considerably, but even moreso when you factor in Great Weapon Fighting.

[Uthgar21]

It's +10 per attack, and you get 2 attacks with Frenzy, 3 attacks with Extra Attack. Frenzy increases your damage output considerably, but even moreso when you factor in Great Weapon Fighting.

Yes it would be great, but I dont like the exhaustion that you get in the end of your rage.It would be bad If the fight is not over when rage ends or if we get into another encounter before rest.But I dont have a real problem with that because without it it would be too OP I guess.

[Aramis Rhett]

Of course, it is worth noting that frenzy does allow an extra attack, it also gives you one level of exhaustion each time you enter frenzy. A big drawback, especially if you use it more than twice a day.

[Uthgar21]

Of course, it is worth noting that frenzy does allow an extra attack, it also gives you one level of exhaustion each time you enter frenzy. A big drawback, especially if you use it more than twice a day.

Perhaps it would be better to use frenzy in the late stage of the encounter so that the enemies would already have lost some of their owns and you will be able to play again during the same rage and therefore to use the second attack more than once.

[Aramis Rhett]

Perhaps it would be better to use frenzy in the late stage of the encounter so that the enemies would already have lost some of their owns and you will be able to play again during the same rage and therefore to use the second attack more than once.

True, but many DMs work several encounters (6+) per game day. That may leave many barbaric folks nervous about when to use it try to make exhaustion have the least impact on the adventuring day.

[Balor777]

It's +10 per attack, and you get 2 attacks with Frenzy, 3 attacks with Extra Attack. Frenzy increases your damage output considerably, but even moreso when you factor in Great Weapon Fighting.

You DO realise that "power attack" even with recless attack you will hit a 16 AC enemy about 50% of the time right? A sword shield with duelist style attacks the same target with around 85% probability.
Its still higher dpr with powerattack greay weapon but it definately NOT free 10 damage.
Its actualy more like 2 points more damage per round
(18STR barbarian rage +2prof using greatsword vs 1handed with duelist style.Both attacking reclessly a 16AC enemy)

[NeoSeraphi]

Yes it would be great, but I dont like the exhaustion that you get in the end of your rage.It would be bad If the fight is not over when rage ends or if we get into another encounter before rest.But I dont have a real problem with that because without it it would be too OP I guess.

How would it be bad if the fight didn't end before you got exhausted? One level of exhaustion doesn't affect your combat ability that much, just any skill checks you make during it.

Obviously, Frenzy is red. That's why I put it as red in the list. But I figured if you were playing a Path of the Berserker you were doing it so you could Frenzy, so I figured I'd encourage you to take the good option for it, which is GWM.

You DO realise that "power attack" even with recless attack you will hit a 16 AC enemy about 50% of the time right? A sword shield with duelist style attacks the same target with around 85% probability.
Its still higher dpr with powerattack greay weapon but it definately NOT free 10 damage.

Yes, but with Frenzy, you have extra opportunities to hit that 50% chance. It's not 10 free damage this early, certainly, but it's quite a lot, especially when you factor in other bonuses that this player may have, such as Combat Inspiration from his party bard, or bless. I'm talking about a character, not TO here. We don't know what his party consists of, but assuming there's at least one buff machine, his chance to hit is higher than 50%.

[MeeposFire]

Yes, but that doesn't discount my point, which is that the smaller race who wants to use a sword and board should pick a different class, for both the higher damage and survivability. A weaker weapon, such as a long sword, does not benefit from powerful abilities such as Brutal Critical nearly as much, you can't take Great Weapon Master, and your AC bonus is negligible if you use Reckless Attack (and if you do not, then you are ignoring one of the best features about being a barbarian).

Meanwhile, if the halfling goes fighter or paladin, he gets Heavy Armor Proficiency, allowing him to grab Heavy Armor Master and have his AC significantly higher, along with getting the Dueling fighting style and Smites/Action Surge. This is much more optimal and efficient. So barbarian is a sub optimal choice for this playstyle, that's why I have not included a discussion about it in my guide.

You are being far too limited in your views. A player that wants to play durable warrior that can tank better than most anybody and wants to play a small race should play a barbarian. Going with a shield the character will still get solid offense along with great durability. You are not going to get that from other classes as well.

Further for a small race the difference between two handed and using s held is tiny. We are talking on average of 1 point of damage per hit which for a small race is going to be at most 2-4 damage per round on average (and this is assuming you are going the lackluster frenzy path where you are using the bonus action attack and you also get the reaction attack which is not always true. For most barbs they will be only damage ahead).

Yes reckless attack diminishes the value of the shield but you don't use reckless attack at all times and even so I still think its bonus is overall comparable to an average 4 points of damage a round or less.

Seriously though for a small character what should you play if you want to play a fantastically durable warrior type character? Fighters, paladins, and rangers are certainly warriors but are far less durable. You seem to be hung up on maximizing damage but that is only one part of being a barbarian and the other is being fantastically durable which a sword and shield barb is while still being nasty enough offensively to be an effective melee force in the party.

[NeoSeraphi]

Paladins are certainly not "less durable" than barbarians. Barbarians take less damage, but paladins heal like crazy, not to mention they get hit far less often with no Reckless Attack and heavy armor. Plus, again, Heavy Armor Master is an excellent feat that allows you to absorb a lot of punishment, just like rage. And since Oath of the Ancients paladin gets resistance to all spell damage, they can soak a lot of damage just as well as barbarians can, only they have Lay on Hands and cure wounds in addition to their heavy armor and Heavy Armor Mastery.

[goto124]

Should this guide be recommended to a player who's never played a tabletop before?

[NeoSeraphi]

Should this guide be recommended to a player who's never played a tabletop before?

Hmmm...I think so? I tried to keep it as basic as possible. Of course I'm not the best person to ask, as I have a personal bias.

[Malifice]

He doesnt need resilient wis.He is a berzerker.
If i would tell you that at 4 you can get one of the following:
+2 point to put werever you want
1 feat of your choice.
Or one +1 weapon.
What would you choose?+1 weapon probably right?
If yes, put your 2 points at strength.

If you want to use reckless more safe,get +2 to attack rolls and +2 to AC ,dip a level in fighter and get duelist style.
+2 to attack rolls is a big bonus.Combine that with advantage to attack rolls and +2 AC and you will hit 90% of the time and 18AC with disadvantage is hardly the same with as 15AC without dissadvantage.You also get 1d10 +1 heal which is nice too.
Thats what i would do.

Duelist gives +2 to damage not to hit, and it doesnt work with 2 handed weapons. I have no idea where the +2 to AC is coming from.

[Uthgar21]

Duelist gives +2 to damage not to hit, and it doesnt work with 2 handed weapons. I have no idea where the +2 to AC is coming from.

He means to be a duelist wielding longsword and shield.The shield will give the +2 AC (without negating my Unarmored Defence) and since I will have only one one-handed weapon I will get the +2 damage which combined to the +2 from the rage is not bad.
However I think personally I will go with Heavy Weapon Mastery, its more barbarianny! :D

[Balor777]

He means to be a duelist wielding longsword and shield.The shield will give the +2 AC (without negating my Unarmored Defence) and since I will have only one one-handed weapon I will get the +2 damage which combined to the +2 from the rage is not bad.
However I think personally I will go with Heavy Weapon Mastery, its more barbarianny! :D

Yes Thats it.The +2AC comes from shield AC.
Its a very good setup because you WILL hit more often and wont be geting hit often.
Also your attacking/defensive capabilities can change and adapt the fight like a chameleon.
Need defence?Dont use anything other than rage.
Need some more damage?Attack recklessly.
Need even more damage?Drop the shield and attack recklessly with both hands using that axe, for D10 damage.
That +2 to the attack roll is like attacking with 5 level higher proficiency.Its a BIG bonus.

[NeoSeraphi]

Yes Thats it.The +2AC comes from shield AC.
Its a very good setup because you WILL hit more often and wont be geting hit often.
Also your attacking/defensive capabilities can change and adapt the fight like a chameleon.
Need defence?Dont use anything other than rage.
Need some more damage?Attack recklessly.
Need even more damage?Drop the shield and attack recklessly with both hands using that axe, for D10 damage.
That +2 to the attack roll is like attacking with 5 level higher proficiency.Its a BIG bonus.

As stated, the duelist style does not give you +2 to attack rolls. The only fighting style that grants bonuses to attack rolls is archery. Duelist gives +2 to damage. I don't know what you're talking about.