Why are Tabletop RPGs popular?

[Drakeburn]

I remember when I first discovered tabletop (or pen and paper) RPGs two and a half years ago. Now that I think about it, I'm surprised that these kind of Roleplaying Games have survived for so long, especially now when technology has become a major aspect of everyday life.

How is it that Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games are still popular after thirty years ago?

[golentan]

Because they're infinitely more flexible than any technological based game yet developed, and they're more social than for example MMOs because everyone goes through them together.

[johnbragg]

I remember when I first discovered tabletop (or pen and paper) RPGs two and a half years ago. Now that I think about it, I'm surprised that these kind of Roleplaying Games have survived for so long, especially now when technology has become a major aspect of everyday life.

How is it that Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games are still popular after thirty years ago?

I would say that the reason we still play TTRPGs is because it's a collaborative storytelling game. That is what TTRPGs have that nothing else has.

If you just want to pretend to kill stuff, video games are more convenient and do it just as well or better. IF you just want to play a tactical strategy game, computer games or non-roleplaying board games or card games etc.

But if you want to create a hero who is part of a memorable story......

[kaoskonfety]

Because you cannot feast with 5 others over roast fowl, fresh bread, beer and a barley soup, huddled around a camp-fire for warmth in the dim fall light, telling great tales of your past exploits... during the dinner break, before we get back to the role playing game, where we get to telling new tales of great exploits.

I also like doing the funny voices.

[1337 b4k4]

Flexibility: TTRPGs can handle anything your mind can throw at them and dont come with a preset story.

Couch Multi-player: the fact is, getting together with your friends is fun. That so many newer technologies ignore couch multi-player is a travesty.

[Mastikator]

Is it popular? The majority of people I meet haven't ever had any experience with TTRPGs.

[Lentrax]

Most people may not have heard the term TTRPG, but I can almost guarantee they have heard the name 'Dungeons and Dragons' and know that the only people who play that game are pale friendless virgins.

But among geeks and nerds the genre is a staple because it lets us play a game that only have ever experienced, unlike thousands of people who have done the same story dozens of times in an MMO.

[Mr.Moron]

Is it popular? The majority of people I meet haven't ever had any experience with TTRPGs.

I agree. They're super-niche. The vast majority of people I know are only sort of vaguely aware Dungeons & Dragons is even still a thing. They certainly don't really get what it means that it's an RPG, or that there are a lot of those.

It's a tiny little quirky hobby for particular population of people.

[kaoskonfety]

Is it popular? The majority of people I meet haven't ever had any experience with TTRPGs.

Popular is relative - I would suspect the number of players has fairly steadily risen over the years, awareness (aside from the negative stuff) certainly has, there have been movies, books, comics.

The question "why do we still bother" is relevant, between MMO's covering the social and single player expierances covering the tactical/challange (I'm not saying MMO's lack challanges... miles from it, but thats never been what I play them FOR) and good story driven content everywhere (I'm loving what I've seen of the Star Wars MMO for this) - why do we bother?

For me its 10% habit, 40% dinner party excuse, 50% stories - I write even when I'm not preping games, random nonsense, limericks short stories whatever. Having a regular audience is bonus.

[YossarianLives]

I agree with everyone else. I am often annoyed when playing video games. Why can't I climb that wall with this rope I have? Why can't I attack these people? Why can't I act during cutscenes? I hate all the boring dialogue options.

I think another advantage is that it is much, much, easier to build a adventure for a TTRPG than spend days programming a dungeon.


EDIT: I think another attraction is that there is nothing you can do in a video game that you can't do in a TTRPG.

[LibraryOgre]

I agree with everyone else. I am often annoyed when playing video games. Why can't I climb that wall with this rope I have? Why can't I attack these people? Why can't I act during cutscenes? I hate all the boring dialogue options.

This is actually something I use to explain TTRPGs to those familiar with computer games, but not TT.

"You ever been playing a game, and know exactly how you could solve the problem, but that isn't one of the options the game gives you? In a tabletop, you just have to convince the GM that it will work."

[Duke of URRL]

Well, I guess we can say that RPG's are about as popular as they ever where. It's a very select market, after all.

The idea of creating your own adventure is very popular, to a lot of people. Some Gamemasters love creating whole worlds, some players just like creating one character. And RPG's let you do both.

And you get the storytelling aspect: anything can happen in an RPG.

And they are a great outlet for escape.

[Drakeburn]

I guess "popular" wasn't the right word I was looking for. What I mean to ask is how have Pen and Paper RPGs lasted for so long. While video cassettes and VCRs have become a thing of the past, Pen and Paper RPGs are still around.

[VincentTakeda]

All of the above plus the fact that hour per hour, ttrpgs are the most entertainment for my entertainment dollar. I have maybe dropped $2000 on all my game books ever and with them I have gamed for 3 decades. A gift that keeps on giving for only 18 cents per day. Compared to my internet bill (between 1 and 2 dollars per day) or a cable bill (I actually dont have cable) or bowling or amusement parks or movies (14 bucks for 2 hours maybe)...

Granted a rubics cube or a deck of poker cards can do kinda the same thing for cheaper, but these tools of 'statistically large possible outcomes' doesnt always produce any 'distinct memorable events' the way ttrpgs can.

[Asmayus]

Because they offer the one thing digital media cannot: dynamic stories.

[Benthesquid]

I guess "popular" wasn't the right word I was looking for. What I mean to ask is how have Pen and Paper RPGs lasted for so long. While video cassettes and VCRs have become a thing of the past, Pen and Paper RPGs are still around.

The analogy doesn't really work- video cassttes and VCRs have become a thing of the past, largely, but that's because of the rise of other ways to do the same thing- watch videos in your home. To a certain extent, this has happened with Pen and Paper RPGs- this very forum has a sizable play by post section.

Video games aren't another way of doing the same thing as tabletop gaming. They're a way to do a similar but distinct thing, that's also not really that similar. It's not like saying "Why didn't DVDs replace VCRs," but like saying "Why didn't IMAX replace improv?" or "Why didn't FIFA replace foosball?" The answer is, in some cases it did, but they're ultimately different experiences, and some people prefer the latter, or simply enjoy both.

[Mr.Moron]

Because they offer the one thing digital media cannot: dynamic stories.

I don't buy this. If the main motivator for RPGs was story involvement beyond what a computer game could, half the topics & posters I see on this forum wouldn't be here. The "murderhobo" stereotype certainly wouldn't exist, as such creatures can't feature centrally in anything resembling a "coherent story featuring people".

Certainly dynamic stories are one thing RPGs can offer, but it's hardly the only compelling thing they offer.

[LibraryOgre]

Well, I guess we can say that RPG's are about as popular as they ever where. It's a very select market, after all.

I put them on something of a downswing, compared to the early days (before the Satanic Panic), or the certainly-larger-in-numbers surge when the OGL came out.

I guess "popular" wasn't the right word I was looking for. What I mean to ask is how have Pen and Paper RPGs lasted for so long. While video cassettes and VCRs have become a thing of the past, Pen and Paper RPGs are still around.

Because the basic technology remains available. VHS is out, but its successor technology, DVDs, is still available and simply better in many ways (less degradation over time, more convenient moving through scenes, better image quality, etc.). BluRay is slowly gaining on DVD, but DVD remains back compatible, so it's still around.

TTRPGs? Books are still around, and TT has adapted to other formats, as well (PDFs for books, on-line tools like roll20 for actual playing), to say nothing of incorporating other tools into a real game (we're playing a post-apocalyptic game intermittently, using Google Maps to show the real local we're at). Add in that the necessary devices are durable, and that there's a sizable group of the older generation teaching it to their kids, and you have a degree of enduring popularity.

[Knaight]

Putting aside how they aren't popular, there has yet to be an actual replacement. Video games simply can't do a lot of what RPGs can, and this is beyond the social interaction aspect - which is what keeps board games afloat, which are themselves a pretty substantial industry.

As for technology being a major aspect of everyday life, it's worth noting that the way it has become a major aspect of everyday life includes some degree of isolation for a lot of people. A lot more jobs involve sitting in front of a computer all day not talking to people face to face than ever existed when the equivalent was some sort of writing, changes in the structures of populations have led to more people living alone than used to, so on and so forth. Beyond that, there's the shift towards computers becoming part of every day life when they were formally coded as geeky, there's emergence of the internet as a common part of society which is also friendly to generally nerdy stuff, there's video games becoming extremely common in a lot of places when they were formally all sorts of nerdy. This drastically lowers the barrier to entry for nerd-stuff in general.

The social aspects of board games and RPGs are thus more valuable than they used to be, and it's easier to get into nerd stuff. This is probably at least some of what's behind the recent change in board game production involving a lot more good games coming out, and is almost certainly a good part of what keeps RPGs alive. RPGs are actually even having an issue where they are growing surprisingly slowly compared to the rest of the nerd-industry stuff, largely because D&D has a history of being designed in such a way that getting in with an entire group that has never played before is needlessly difficult.

[Darth Ultron]

I put them on something of a downswing, compared to the early days (before the Satanic Panic), or the certainly-larger-in-numbers surge when the OGL came out.

I'm always surprised how popular RPG's have stayed over the years. There always seems to be plenty of new players.

I meet a lot of ex-video game players, for example. I grew up with lots of RP type video games.....and they were fun.....to a point. After all a video game limits your actions and things you can do: you can only do what someone programed the game to do. And play the game through once...and it's not so much fun to play the game again. And that is a big point for pen and paper games...it's all ways different.

[Knaight]

IAnd that is a big point for pen and paper games...it's all ways different.

It also covers a wide range of material. If I decide that I want a steampunk-cyberpunk hybrid wherein industrial espionage and sabotage performed by the press ganged crew of a zeppelin is a thing, I can make that happen, for free, with a system I already have, without putting any real work in it. If I'm in the mood for exactly that and looking for a video game, it's not happening. I could theoretically make a game of some sort, but it goes from whipping up a setting and helping people make characters in half an hour to years of learning and work.

[johnbragg]

Putting aside how they aren't popular, there has yet to be an actual replacement.

Yes and no. If digital music is a replacement for records, then PDFs and the SRD are absolutely a replacement for our shelves full of books.

Thirty years ago, the introductory product for pre-adolescents? The Red Box BECMI Basic Set. Today? The Red Box BECMI Basic Set PDFs, available for $10 from DriveThruRPG's D&D site.

[Knaight]

Yes and no. If digital music is a replacement for records, then PDFs and the SRD are absolutely a replacement for our shelves full of books.

That's not a replacement for RPGs. The RPGs aren't the records or the .mp3 file in this analogy, they're the music encoded. PDFs, SRDs, wikis, and the various other formats RPGs can be released in are still tabletop RPGs.

[Anonymouswizard]

Is it popular? The majority of people I meet haven't ever had any experience with TTRPGs.

No, if it was popular my Uni gaming society would offer more support for it than 'we'll let you look for a group' (not that they actually support any tabletop games, the entire society is a bunch of computer gamer elitists in denial). It's why I'm so bitter when people insist that the geeks have won, yes they have if you mean a handful of things, but whenever I mention roleplaying I have to follow it up with 'not that kind!'

Couch Multi-player: the fact is, getting together with your friends is fun. That so many newer technologies ignore couch multi-player is a travesty.

this is basically it. I might want to craft a great story with my fellow gamers, but that isn't why I play. I play because I enjoy it when five of us sit down in a kitchen after a hard week of university stuff, break out the dice and character sheets, and then spend 50 minutes joking around before actually getting to the game. I like that conversations spawn from the game, such that we might occasionally get only half an hour of actual play in every hour, but nobody is ever bored. I enjoy getting into conversations with the GM over game design, I love the fact that our group has developed it's own quirks and in-jokes (one joke is my inability to act with any sort of intelligence while planning).

I've seen the latest computer game consoles brag about the fact they can hook you up to play with someone from China, but so many miss the fact that if I want to play with someone, I want to be able to laugh at their jokes, know that they've put the controller down if I get a bite to eat, and then go and grab a cuppa when the game is over. I've never played the multiplayer on any of the latest shooters, because I still remember the fun me and my brothers had sitting around a TV playing split screen deathmatch in Fire Warrior.

I've seen games with as many as twelve players in a single campaign because the group likes socialising together. TTRPGs are half games, and half an excuse for friends to hang out.

[johnbragg]

That's not a replacement for RPGs. The RPGs aren't the records or the .mp3 file in this analogy, they're the music encoded. PDFs, SRDs, wikis, and the various other formats RPGs can be released in are still tabletop RPGs.

Just pointing out that there has been change and replacement in the hobby. Agreed that the White Album is still the White Album, whether on vinyl or CD or a dozen itunes downloads, just as the REd Box set is still the same whether it's in the box or a printed PDF, or a PDF on a tablet.

But the existence of SRDs and wikis changes the in-game experience, and the existence of char-op forums between sessions also changes things.

Not to mention improvements in games over time--no matter how nostalgic the Old School Renaissance grognards (and hipsters) are, most of the OSR retroclones seem to have fixed things from AD&D. The d20 mechanic practically sweeping all others aside in the early 2000s may not have been the best thing, but it encouraged everyone to update their game.

[Anonymouswizard]

Just pointing out that there has been change and replacement in the hobby. Agreed that the White Album is still the White Album, whether on vinyl or CD or a dozen itunes downloads, just as the REd Box set is still the same whether it's in the box or a printed PDF, or a PDF on a tablet.

I have a different experience, I've never seen a gaming group without a copy of the game rules (generally owned by the GM) in that ever-useful dead-tree format for easy reference during play. This is less a case of 'mp3s are better than CDs so I no longer use CDs', this is a case of 'CDs are easier to use but take up a lot of storage space, so I use mp3s for easier transport'. Have you ever tried running a game without a physical book? I have, and I can tell you that without the ability to get to roughly the right page in seconds (which is much quicker than searching a pdf) adjudicating rules takes much longer. I've seen it done okay in Mutants and Masterminds, but that might have only worked because of how railroad the campaign was.

[russdm]

RPGs are actually even having an issue where they are growing surprisingly slowly compared to the rest of the nerd-industry stuff, largely because D&D has a history of being designed in such a way that getting in with an entire group that has never played before is needlessly difficult.

It doesn't actually have to be though. It could be made slightly simpler but some might not like that. The game also tends to have long combats in real life compared to in-game, something like a few hours of real life for what is something like a minute tops in game. That certainly doesn't help, especially at higher levels with so much to be able to do.

Not to mention improvements in games over time--no matter how nostalgic the Old School Renaissance grognards (and hipsters) are, most of the OSR retroclones seem to have fixed things from AD&D. The d20 mechanic practically sweeping all others aside in the early 2000s may not have been the best thing, but it encouraged everyone to update their game.

It also resulted in there simply being more available systems that didn't have to rely on the d20 either. There are more ways to play heroic fantasy available now than just using D&D or Pathfinder. Some of which can be more fun, I have heard.

[johnbragg]

I have a different experience, I've never seen a gaming group without a copy of the game rules (generally owned by the GM) in that ever-useful dead-tree format for easy reference during play. This is less a case of 'mp3s are better than CDs so I no longer use CDs', this is a case of 'CDs are easier to use but take up a lot of storage space, so I use mp3s for easier transport'. Have you ever tried running a game without a physical book? I have, and I can tell you that without the ability to get to roughly the right page in seconds (which is much quicker than searching a pdf) adjudicating rules takes much longer. I've seen it done okay in Mutants and Masterminds, but that might have only worked because of how railroad the campaign was.

I guess I'm talking more about the SRDs, I can look something up on the SRD a lot quicker than I ever could in a Player's Handbook or DM. Books are faster than PDFs, but SRDs and wikis are faster than books, in my experience. When my summoned Celestial Dog was trying to determine whether the chanting we heard was from an invisible caster, or simply a distant caster using Ghost Sound, getting his Spot, Listen and Search check modifiers to the DM was way faster with the SRD on my phone than it ever was with a Monster MAnual. (I have updated my printed Powerpoint slides for my favorite Summoned Monsters to include their relevant skill checks.)

[Knaight]

Just pointing out that there has been change and replacement in the hobby. Agreed that the White Album is still the White Album, whether on vinyl or CD or a dozen itunes downloads, just as the REd Box set is still the same whether it's in the box or a printed PDF, or a PDF on a tablet.

Well yeah, there's been change in the hobby. That's besides the point, what I said was that tabletop RPGs - as in, the genre - don't have any real replacement. That individual RPGs within the genre get partially displaced by other individual RPGs is irrelevant, as are changes in how those RPGs are communicated.

[BrokenChord]

Hello? Because they're friggin awesome is why.

Even if your group isn't a fan of collaborative storytelling (I don't understand it, but groups like that do exist) there's still something to be said for the freedom to act and create as you please without being limited by what the video game is programmed to handle.

There's the social aspect, of course. Also, for those interested in it, there are a lot of mechanical options to toy with. This is a stylistic coincidence more than an actual RPG>video game example, but RPGs tend to do much better at having a wide variety of character options, unlike many video games which tend to give you a few preset mechanical options that only give options vertically instead of providing the hundreds of horizontal advancement options characters have in many RPGs.

Plus, it's a way to let out your creativity that doesn't have quite so many restrictions or standards as writing a book or drawing an action scene (or designing a video game).

And of course, there's people like me, for whom that whole "collaborative, open-ended storytelling" thing is just cake and ice cream to the fun receptors.