[Historical-ish] Anyone playing games set during the wars of 17th century?

[Kiero]

Admittedly, I'm reading Daniel Defoe's lesser-known Memoirs of a Cavalier, which is about a young English gentleman who fights first in the Thirty Years War, then is embroiled in the civil wars back home.

It would seem, to me, to be a ripe time for the usual sort of adventuring type behaviours, not least because there were mercenary companies around and about which make an idea PC organisation. There were also lots of local associations organised to fight and irregular warfare away from the standing armies too. The PCs as a troop of dragoons seems a pretty viable means of them getting involved in lots of things and having mobility too.

Anyone done something like this? Are there any games (besides pastiche like WFRP) that are set in this era?

[Comet]

Lamentations of the Flame Princess includes rules for firearms and other early modern equipment. Most of the adventures published for it (Better Than Any Man, for instance, which is free to download) are set in our world in the 17th century. The history is usually well researched and works as a good framework for LoTFP's brand of dungeon delving and graphic horror stories.

[Frozen_Feet]

My home county still celebrates the 30 year war each year, with people dressing up and playing parts of the soldiers and nobility in the draft event. My mom sold period stuff at the market place and I played a shepherd boy as a kid. I suppose it would be about damn time to join the actual soldiers.

[Zyzzyva]

Lamentations of the Flame Princess includes rules for firearms and other early modern equipment. Most of the adventures published for it (Better Than Any Man, for instance, which is free to download) are set in our world in the 17th century. The history is usually well researched and works as a good framework for LoTFP's brand of dungeon delving and graphic horror stories.

Yeah! Never played or head of it before seeing the below poster, but those are definitely lobster-tail helmets. ;)

Spoiler: Giant image

Show

[Frozen_Feet]

I own that module, but haven't had yet had the chance to play it. The thought makes me giddy. Ditty for Better than Any Man. The cover alone makes it worth it.

[aspekt]

There's always 7th Sea based mostly around 17th and 18th century age of sail stuff.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7th_Sea_%28role-playing_game%29

[Marlowe]

The Thirty Years War is, if you'll pardon the expression; Bloody Grim. It's still arguably the worst war in European history. The First World War might have wiped out a generation of young men but at least it didn't turn the heart of Europe into a smoking desert.

Two hundred years later, when the brothers Grimm were collecting folktales for their collection, it was noticed that some areas were essentially devoid for such folklore because the 30YW had wiped out the population. It and the various wars of French expansion later in the century were sufficiently vicious that they led to an entire century (the 18th) of nations "playing nice" at war to prevent such a cataclysm happening again.

So it may not be the setting for everyone. The 17th century has pretty uniforms and outfits but it's an era of blood and fire at the core. Of course, this is an English-speaking forum. And England and its colonies generally had a decent time during this period, so that might change the perspective a little.

One reason the 30YW was so destructive incidentally, was that no side had enough soldiers. So chasing the enemy forces down and occupying their territory was generally quite difficult. Which led to a standard strategy by everyone of simply burning and wasting the countryside to deny the enemy places they could use as bases. So a TYW campaign might involve relatively little fights against the enemy (whoever that is) and lots of burning, looting, and massacring peasants.

[BootStrapTommy]

The Thirty Year War was also primarily a religious conflict. Historical religious conflict gets e'erone's pantaloons in a bunch.

But I agree. The aethetic of the age, as traditional armors and weapon begin to make way for gunpowder, is kinda cool.

3.5 and 5e D&D have gunpowder rules in their respective DMGs. Including canons. So even D&D can be used for this kind of setting, assuming you are simply adopting the conceptional setting, rather than the historical context.

[fusilier]

Anyone done something like this? Are there any games (besides pastiche like WFRP) that are set in this era?

I did run a couple of campaigns set during the TYW, but the war was more of a background setting. Although at one point, the characters did have to sneak into a besieged city (and the players were surprised to discover it was an actual historical siege).

I used GURPS (the Swashbucklers sourcebook is useful), for background I used an old AD&D historical sourcebook "A Mighty Fortress" -- I highly recommend it, even if you don't use 2nd edition AD&D. ;-)

[Admiral Squish]

Well, it's not quite the time period you're looking for, but I'm homebrewing a setting set in colonial north america in the year 1750. There's a similar tech level and a lot of similar power groups involved, so even if you don't want to use the setting you might be able to put some of the material to use. Plus, there's mammoth-riders, which makes everything cooler.
[/shameless plug]

[Maglubiyet]

I read most of Simplicius Simplicissimus (yes, I had to look up the spelling for this post) last December and it was damn grim. I would maybe run a fantasy version based on that setting, but for some reason the thought of doing a historically-accurate campaign would seem like basing a game on Japanese POW camp life in WW2 Pacific theater. Or maybe ISIS in modern-day Syria.

[Kiero]

The Thirty Years War is, if you'll pardon the expression; Bloody Grim. It's still arguably the worst war in European history. The First World War might have wiped out a generation of young men but at least it didn't turn the heart of Europe into a smoking desert.

Two hundred years later, when the brothers Grimm were collecting folktales for their collection, it was noticed that some areas were essentially devoid for such folklore because the 30YW had wiped out the population. It and the various wars of French expansion later in the century were sufficiently vicious that they led to an entire century (the 18th) of nations "playing nice" at war to prevent such a cataclysm happening again.

So it may not be the setting for everyone. The 17th century has pretty uniforms and outfits but it's an era of blood and fire at the core. Of course, this is an English-speaking forum. And England and its colonies generally had a decent time during this period, so that might change the perspective a little.

One reason the 30YW was so destructive incidentally, was that no side had enough soldiers. So chasing the enemy forces down and occupying their territory was generally quite difficult. Which led to a standard strategy by everyone of simply burning and wasting the countryside to deny the enemy places they could use as bases. So a TYW campaign might involve relatively little fights against the enemy (whoever that is) and lots of burning, looting, and massacring peasants.

Indeed, there's no getting around the fact that it was a nasty conflict. However, one means of avoiding some of the worst excesses, or at least putting the PCs less in the wrong than the foreign invaders, is to make them "home defense" partisans. They're the people protecting their homes from brigands and marauding soldiers and keeping the invaders out.

The Thirty Year War was also primarily a religious conflict. Historical religious conflict gets e'erone's pantaloons in a bunch.

But I agree. The aethetic of the age, as traditional armors and weapon begin to make way for gunpowder, is kinda cool.

3.5 and 5e D&D have gunpowder rules in their respective DMGs. Including canons. So even D&D can be used for this kind of setting, assuming you are simply adopting the conceptional setting, rather than the historical context.

I'm not sure I'd agree it was primarily a religious conflict; while there were certainly true believers motivated by faith, the myriad German princes were far more often motivated by the prospect of taking land and treasure off their neighbours. For the Protestant princes in particular it was looting church lands. Religion made a convenient screen for greed, but look at the way they fell to scheming over who would get what after Gustavus Adolphus' death.

[Zyzzyva]

Indeed, there's no getting around the fact that it was a nasty conflict. However, one means of avoiding some of the worst excesses, or at least putting the PCs less in the wrong than the foreign invaders, is to make them "home defense" partisans. They're the people protecting their homes from brigands and marauding soldiers and keeping the invaders out.

Although it's hardly the first or worst of those; it's the "30 years" part that's the big problem. If you're going to set a game in a war it's either going to be unpleasant, or you tone it down deliberately. That's how war works.

I'm not sure I'd agree it was primarily a religious conflict; while there were certainly true believers motivated by faith, the myriad German princes were far more often motivated by the prospect of taking land and treasure off their neighbours. For the Protestant princes in particular it was looting church lands. Religion made a convenient screen for greed, but look at the way they fell to scheming over who would get what after Gustavus Adolphus' death.

"Look at whose side Catholic France was on" is my go-to argument for that. It definitely was a religious war; it's just that, like most religious conflicts, religion was neither the first nor last factor involved.

[MrConsideration]

A lot of mercenary groups in the Thirty Years War changed sides an awful lot. If you players are amoral glory-hounds (in character, of course:)) it's a fantastic opportunity for quite a lot of shenanigans and politicking. I'd sanitise the looting though, as player's aren't going to feel terribly heroic and picaresque if they're robbing peasant folk to pay for bread for the troops. Instead, maybe the war gave the opportunity to loot the castle of a corrupt noble or assassinate the tyrannical ruler of a city-state.

There's an really interesting blog that re-interprets Keep on the Borderlands as an adventure where the Keep is the dungeon! http://bxblackrazor.blogspot.com/201...rderlands.html

You could easily re-skin the nations involved into something suitably fantasyish to hide your inspirations and avoid offending anyone. Have the Swedes be marauding Dwarves or something and the Holy Roman Princes ancient, decadent Elves.

The big risk with setting your setting during an on-going conflict is ensuring the players have agency and are important. If the New Model Army is going to fight the Royalists, how are your players going to be involved?