Making Legacy Items Worth It - Homebrew Legacy Item Creation System

[Rubberband_Man]

Hello Playground,

So as you may or may not know, there's a dnd supplement book called Weapons of Legacy. Its a cool resource with a lot of neat ideas and rules for making legendary weapons that are accessible at all levels. It's a very interesting resource and a cool book in general with a bunch of items you should definitely check out.

From top left to bottom right: Durindana, Desert Wind, Crimson Ruination, Caladbolg, Caput Mortuum, Bloodcrier's Hammer

That being said, there are some parts of this book I find head-in-buttocks stupid

More specifically, I find the system for creating Legacy Items to be entirely contrived and haphazard. If you are unfamiliar with Legacy Items allow me to break it down...

Essentially a Legacy Item is a legendary item that becomes more powerful as the character using it levels up. Most Legacy Items begin granting abilities at level 5 and continue to level 20, but this is not always the case. This allows for a character of almost any level to pick up a Legacy Item. They have cool special abilities and a TON of flavor behind them. However, in order to unlock these abilities, the player must also pay a price. This price comes in three forms: Rituals, Ritual costs, and Legacy Penalties.

Special Legacy Rituals must be performed at certain levels to continue to unlock the item's potential. Rituals range widely in the actual task to be performed; they can be killing a specific enemy, swearing an oath of fealty to a certain person or cause, it can be making a donation to charity or stealing from the poor. There are three levels of ritual; least, lesser, and greater. The player typically performs the rituals at levels 5, 11, and 17, respectively, but these may vary depending on the item. Once a ritual has been performed, the player receives all the benefits of the item that his level allows. Upon reaching the level where the next ritual must be performed, the player receives no more benefits until he has performed the ritual. As sort of an addendum to the Rituals themselves, there are associated ritual costs to each ritual. Once the actual ritual has been performed, the player must then sacrifice a certain amount of wealth and perform a ritual to attune himself to the item. Each ritual has an associated cost and the player cannot receive the benefits of the item until he has payed it. Finally there are Legacy Penalties. The idea here is that in order to balance out the unbridled power of the legacy items, wielding the items is slightly detrimental to the wielder in other ways. This takes the form of penalties to BAB, HP, saving throws, caster level, and even the loss of spell slots and skill points. Depending on who the item is intended for, the penalties will be different. For instance, an axe intended for a barbarian would not have penalties to caster level.

These penalties are typically the reason that Legacy Items are seen as not worth it. The Rituals are usually flavorful and simple enough, if sometimes obtuse. The ritual costs are usually appropriate for their level, but they sometimes get a bit pricey. The biggest reason that Legacy items arent worth it is easily the penalties. There are tables in the book where a 20th level character who has performed all the rituals and payed the costs takes a -2 on all attacks, a -3 on all saves, and permanently loses 16 HP. The penalties usually far outweigh the benefits of the items.

And so we arrive at my main complaint with this book; the rules for creating custom legacy items.

This is purely speculation, but from reading the book it is pretty apparent as to what happened during its writing. Some of the developers at WotC had a bunch of cool ideas for awesome weapons with detailed backstory and awesome abilities. They began to write the book, implementing the system where items gain abilities as the player grows. They made the items they had thought up into usable items and tried to balance them so the items were each individually balanced. Near the end, however, someone realized "Oh no! We havent made a system to make custom items!" At this point, the devs copied and pasted every individual ability that each of the premade items had into the back of the book and said "pick from these abilities and quit complaining." As a result, there is a paltry selection of premade abilities with little room for experimentation. Well, after many hours of poring over this book, I believe I've extrapolated a method to the madness.

The rules for creating custom items goes like this: After determining which table of penalties you are going to use and deciding upon Legacy Rituals, you then begin to choose what abilities the item has. The abilities in the book are alphabetically ranked from A to I, A being the weakest abilities and I being the strongest. A, B, and C level abilities are unlocked when the Least Ritual is performed and its cost paid. D, E, and F level abilities are associated with the Lesser Ritual, and G, H, and I are associated with the Greater Ritual. A standard, 15 level legacy item would begin with one level A ability granted at each level from 5 to 10, one D level ability at levels 11 through 16, and one G level ability at levels 17 through 20. These abilities can be swapped out as follows:

1 B = 2 A
1 C = 3 A

1 E = 2 D
1 F = 3 D

1 H = 2 G
1 I = 3 G

And so many weak abilities may be traded for a few strong ones. However, the selection of abilities is rather limited and doesn't allow for much expansion.

I have created a system based on the one in Weapons of Legacy where abilities may be implemented by mimicking spell effects. I created these lists by looking at the abilities already in the book and categorizing them based on their spell level, kind of effect and several other factors. In a sense, this is a broad translation of the tables already in place.

NOTE: There are some abilities in the book that mimic class features, feats, and there are even some completely new abilities with no precedent, but for the large majority most of the abilities are based on spells. I plan on finding a way to implement a table of such abilities, but for now they are simply addendums to the spells.

*EDIT* Moved the thread to Homebrew Forum

[Rubberband_Man]

Buff: Provides direct bonuses or penalties to attacks, abilities, skills, checks, or other such rolls (Bull’s strength, Mage armor, Haste, Bestow Curse, etc)
Heal: Directly heals hp or removes penalties. (Cure spells, heal, restoration, remove curse etc.)
Damage: More accurately, attack spells. Deal damage, drain abilities, or otherwise effect enemies in an aggressive manner. (Magic missile, Ray of Enfeeblement, Acid arrow, Enervation, etc.)
Status Effect: Creates a physical effect that does not directly influence a creature’s statistics. Can be useful in and out of combat. (Invisibility, Feather Fall, Obscuring mist, Darkness, Crushing Hand, Wall of Iron, Cause Fear etc.)
Summon: Summons a creature to either fight for you or to perform a task, willingly or unwillingly. (Summon Monster, Summon Nature’s Ally, Planar Ally, Gate, Animate Dead)
Utility: Typically not useful in combat. Used to overcome obstacles or navigate difficult situations. (Floating Disk, Detect magic, Endure Elements, Knock, Dancing Lights, Knock, etc.)

Reading the tables:
Uses/day - the number of times that ability may be used in a day. May be continuous or at will.
Spell level - the level of the spell. Many of the spells in the book are sor/wiz spells, but a good deal of them are cleric and druid spells as well. When choosing the spell, choose from any spell list whose caster has full spellcasting progression (e.g. gains the ability to cast a higher level spell at every other level. See: Wizard, Cleric, Druid)
Category - the spells basic function. See the definitions above.
Action - the action required to use the ability
Su/Sp - whether the ability is treated as a supernatural or spell-like ability

Su - supernatural ability
Sp - Spell-like ability
* - as the spell
0/0/0 - three 0-level spells

LEAST ABILITIES

A-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
At will	0/0/0	*	Utility	*	Su
Continuous	0	Self	Buff	-	Su
5/day	1	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
Continuous	1	Self	Utility	-	Su
3/day	1	*	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	1	Self	Heal	Swift	Sp
1/day	1	Self	Buff	*	Sp
3/day	1	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	2	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	2	*	Summon	*	Sp
1/day	2	Self	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	2	*	Utility	*	Sp
1/day	2	Self	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	2	Self	Status Effect	*	Su
1/day	2	*	Utility	*	Su

Armor/Shield Enhancement +1, max +2
Creature Compass - new ability, read the book
Deflection Bonus +1
Intelligent Legacy, Minor
3/day Metamagic, Lesser, +1 spell slot
Mount
Skill +5
Speed +5
Weapon Enhancement +1

All level A abilities are cast at CL 5

B-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
5/day	1	*	Buff	swift	Sp
At will	1	*	Utility	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	2	Self	Heal	Swift	Sp
3/day	2	*	Attack	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Utility	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Heal	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Utility	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Summon	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Buff	*	Sp

Ability Enhancement +2
Armor/Shield Enhancement +1, max +3
Deflection +1, max +2
Energy Resistance, least
Intelligent Legacy
Resistance +1, max +3
Speed +10
Weapon Enhancement +1, max +2

All level B abilities are cast at CL 7

C-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
At will	2	*	Utility	*	Su
At will	2	*	Attack	*	Sp
2/day	3	*	Utility	*	Su
2/day	3	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	3	Self	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	3	Self	Buff	*	Su
2/day	3	*	Buff	*	Sp
2/day	3	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
Continuous	3	Self	Utility	*	Su

Armor/Shield enhancement bonus

Current	Increase
+2 or less	+2
+3 to +5	+1

Constant Companion, Least
Deflection +1, max +3
3/day Metamagic, lesser +2 spell slots

All level C abilities are cast at CL 10

[Rubberband_Man]

LESSER ABILITIES

D-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
At will	1	*	Attack	*	Sp
Continuous	1	-	Utility	-	Su
3/day	1	*	Attack	*	Sp
3/day	2	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
Continuous	2	-	Buff	-	Su
At will	2	*	Status Effect	*	Su
At will	2	*	Utility	*	Su
At will	2	*	Status Effect	*	Su
Continuous	2	Self	Utility	-	Su
5/day	2	*	Summon	*	Sp
5/day	2	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
At will	3	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	3	*	Utility	*	Su
1/day	3	*	Status Effect	*	Su
5/day	3	Self	Buff	*	Su
3/day	3	*	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	4	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	4	*	Summon	*	Sp

Cunning
Intelligent Legacy, Major
3/day Metamagic, +1 spell slot
Weapon Enhancement +1, max +3

All level D abilities are cast at CL 10

E-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
At will	2	*	Status Effect	*	Su
Continuous	2	-	Status Effect	-	Su
3/day	3	*	Buff	*	Sp
3/day	3	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	4	*	Status Effect	*	Su
1/day	5	*	Summon	*	Su
1/day	5	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	5	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	5	Self	Heal	Swift	Sp

Ability Enhancement +4

Armor/Shield Enhancement

Current	Increase
+2 or less	3
+3 to +4	2
+5 to +9	1

Deflection +1, max +5
Energy Resistance, Lesser
3/day Metamagic lesser, +3 spell slots
Skill Enhancement +10
Spell Storing, Minor

Weapon Enhancement

Current	Increase
+1 or less	2
+2 to +4	1

All level E abilities are cast at CL 11

F-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
Continuous	2	Self	Buff	-	Su
Continuous	3	-	Summon	-	Su
3/day	4	*	Heal	*	Sp
2/day	4	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
2/day	4	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	5	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Utility	*	Su
1/day	6	*	Summon	*	Su

Armor/shield enhancement

Current	Increase
+1 or less	4
+2 to +3	3
+4 to +6	2
+7 to +9	1

Evasion
1/day metamagic +3 spell level
3/day metamagic, greater, +1 spell level
Poison immunity

Weapon enhancement

+3 or less	2
+4 to +6	1

All level F abilities are cast at CL 13
1 time wish
Wizardry I (as ring of Wizardry I)
X-ray vision (as ring of X-ray vision)

[Rubberband_Man]

GREATER ABILITIES

G-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
3/day	4	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
3/day	4	*	Utility	*	Sp
3/day	4	*	Attack	*	Sp
2/day	4	Self	Status Effect	*	Su
2/day	5	*	Utility	*	Sp
2/day	5	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	5	Self	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	6	Self	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Summon	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Utility	*	Sp
1/day	7	*	Status Effect	*	Sp

Armor/shield enhancement

Current	Increase
+2 or less	5
+3	4
+4 to +5	3
+6 or higher	2 (max +10)

3/day Metamagic, +2 spell slots
Mindarmor - as the item enhancement except +3 and continuous
3/day Metamagic, lesser, +4 spell slots
Skill +15

Weapon enhancement

Current	Increase
+2 or less	3
+3 to +5	2
+6 to +9	1

All level G abilities are cast at CL 15
Wizardry II (as ring of wizardry II)

H-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
10/day	3	Self	Buff	Swift	Su
3/day	6	*	Heal	*	Sp
1/day	6	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	6	Self	Heal	Swift	Sp
2/day	7	*	Attack	*	Sp
2/day	7	*	Summon	*	Sp
1/day	7	Self	Utility	*	Su
1/day	7	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	8	*	Attack	*	Sp
1/day	8	self	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	8	Self	Buff	*	Su
1/day	8	*	Status	*	Sp

Armor/Shield Enhancement

Current	Increase
+4 or less	5
+5 or more	4 (max +10)

Energy resistance 30
3/day metamagic, +3 spell slots
Spell storing - as ring of spell storing
Weapon enhancement

Current	Increase
+1 or less	5
+2	4
+3 to +5	3
+6 to +8	2
+9	1

Two wishes
Wizardry III (as ring of wizardry III)

All level H abilities are cast at CL 17

I-LEVEL ABILITIES

Spoiler: Show

Show

Uses/day	Spell Level	Target	Category	Action	Su/Sp
Continuous	5	*	Summon	-	Su
3/day	6	*	Heal	*	Sp
2/day	8	*	Attack	*	Sp
2/day	8	*	Buff	*	Sp
1/day	9	*	Summon	*	Sp
1/day	9	*	Utility	*	Sp
1/day	9	*	Status Effect	*	Sp
1/day	9	*	Attack	*	Sp

3/day metamagic, greater, +2 spell slots
3/day metamagic, +4 spell slots
Regeneration - as ring of regeneration
Three wishes
Wizardry IV - as ring of Wizardry IV
Weapon enhancement

Current	Increase
+1 or less	6
+2 to +3	5
+4 to +5	4
+6 to +7	3
+8	2
+9	1

All level I abilities are cast at CL 20

[Rubberband_Man]

Here is a sample item I created using the above system:

WOGGLEBOB

Crafted from sturdy dwarven steel, this +1 Greataxe has seen a good amount of use. The haft is carved of a dark strong wood and sturdy leather cord. The goosewing blade is embossed with depictions of an orc lifting a mountain, fighting a kraken, and other similarly impossible tasks. The pommel is set with a single large blood-red ruby.

Wogglebob was made many decades ago for a lone orc barbarian named Foobob Flamebroiled. As a young child, Foobob had been part of a clan of cannibalistic orcs. On his 10th birthday he failed his tribe’s initiation into manhood for receiving outside help. As a result he was to be roasted alive and eaten by his fellow clansmen. However, as he was roasting on the spit a band of adventurers under the employ of a nearby town interrupted the ceremony and began to do battle with the tribe. During the commotion, Foobob’s spit was knocked over and he was able to escape, although horribly charred. From then on, Foobob became a Barbarian. He took up a life of adventuring but refused any sort of assistance, leading him to attempt and conquer foes normally reserved for a whole party of adventurers. As Foobob grew in power, he became more desperate to prove himself, and so had a greataxe forged for him by a dwarven smith he had saved from a terrible red dragon. The dwarf was so grateful to Foobob that he forged for him the greatest weapon he had ever made. Foobob took his weapon and named it a traditional orcish name; Wogglebob. In orcish this name means “Tool of Manhood”, named for Foobob’s obsessive desire to prove himself a man. Foobob and Wogglebob went on to defeat many great opponents far beyond the capabilities of a single adventurer, and Foobob’s barbaric spirit was forever infused into the axe.

Wielder Requirements:
Strength 16
Barbarian's Rage or similar frenzy ability
BAB +3

Wielder Level	Attack Penalty	Will Save Penalty	HP Loss	Abilities
5				Survivor, Least Ritual
6	-1		4
7		-1		Sturdy
8
9		-2	2	Fiery Anger
10				Great Stature
11				Face to Face, Lesser Ritual
12	-2		2	+1 Brash Greataxe
13
14				+2 Brash
15		-3	2
16				+3 Brash Keen Greataxe
17				Fires of Desire, Greater Ritual
18	-3		2	+4 Brash Keen Berserker Greataxe
19			2
20		-4	2	Earthshaking Strength

Least Ritual (2,500gp) – Trial by Fire: You must feel the pain that Foobob felt when his tribe roasted him alive. You must be set on fire (willingly or unwillingly) and remain ablaze for at least three rounds. After three rounds, you may extinguish yourself, either by making a DC 15 Reflex save or through other means, such as jumping in a pool of water. You may not have any magical protection from fire during this time.

Lesser Ritual (12,500gp) – Stand Alone: You must channel Foobob’s courage to make Wogglebob obey your will. You must face an enemy with a CR equal to your level or greater in single combat. Wogglebob must be your only weapon, but you may use any other magic items or special abilities available to you.

Greater Ritual(40,500gp) Do the Impossible: Foobob and Wogglebob accomplished many impossible feats through sheer will. You must also perform an impossible task to prove your worth. You must succeed on a single Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution based skill check with a DC of 35 or greater, a single Fortitude or Reflex save with a DC of 30 or greater, or a single Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution check with a DC of 25 or greater. The task may be anything: leap across a 35 foot chasm (Jump DC 35), survive the effects of an attack poisoned with gargantuan spider venom (Fortitude DC 31), or break out of a set of masterwork manacles (Strength DC 28). The task must be accomplished without help, so you may not receive benefits from spells cast by other spellcasters or through another person using an Aid Another action.


Survivor: A – At will, 0/0/0 create water, know direction, light
Fiery Anger: A – 3/day level 1 attack spell, Burning Hands
Sturdy: B – Resistance +1
Great Stature: B – 5/day 1st lvl buff spell, enlarge person
Face to Face: D – At will 3rd lvl status effect, Invisibility purge
+1 enhancement: D - +1 Brash
+1 enhancement: D - +2 Brash
+2 Enhancement: F - +3 Brash Keen
Fires of Desire: G – 1/day 6th lvl attack spell, Disintegrate
+2 Enhancement: G - +4 Brash Keen Berserker
Earthshaking Strength: H– 1/day 8th lvl status effect - Earthquake

[qazzquimby]

Could you post whatever items you create, and perhaps fixes for the existing material if you make any?

[Rubberband_Man]

Could you post whatever items you create, and perhaps fixes for the existing material if you make any?

I hadn't considered attempting to rewrite the existing items. I don't think that will be on the agenda, considering they are already complete in their own right. I may work on fixing the penalty system in the future, considering that is the biggest complaint with WoL. Perhaps applying a less terrible penalty system to the existing items would make them worth it.

Also on the agenda is creating a system to incorporate feats, class features, and existing magical items into the ability system to allow for even more customization.

[Threadnaught]

Yes, that looks so much better and you don't have to worry about running out of space.

Feats are about 3000-15000gp a piece, so that's a good place to start.


Edit: Perhaps you could link to future posts in an earlier post, since it's possible that you may be on the receiving end of other user made content before the week is out and it'll be more convenient than trawling through the thread.

[janusmaxwell]

I made a separate thread about a semi-related subject, along with a few new Special Quality's for weapons. But I'll ask here anyway since this is a much more specific thread.

What about Legacy Items? Which don't require a ritual and instead will simply level up with a character at specific intervals?

I've come up with something like that, basically a piece of one of the Planes of Existence (I'm calling them "Shards" and there will be the basic Elements plus the 4 Alignment planes) which bond with the body/soul of a PC. So far all I've got is passive benefits to caster level, access to once-a-day (or more) magic related to the given Plane, and on command special qualities that can be activated on equipped weapons. The magic and passive benefits are standard SRD though the special qualities past the "Bursts" (Flaming, Shocking, etc) are all homebrew (yes more homebrew), and I'm still RAWing them out.

For the RAW shenanigans, I've got it so that any PC can grab these things and their increasing powers are based on ECL, with <ECL:5 giving +1 Enhancement bonus to weapons on command and caster levels for all magic are +1 (cleric, wizard, druid, bard, etc). At from 5-8, the command is for +1 special quality and has a charge that can be spent on a spell, but will lose the special quality for a day. Later the special quality's will increase, as will the spells available and charges, with less powerful magics using less charges and simply knocking the special qualities down a peg instead of outright gone for a day.

Now, I've got problems with balance regarding the Raw and want to throw this stuff out here.

1: First off, I'm doing a lot of this with wanting to favor Melee classes, and I will admit that. However I don't want the spell-casting classes to be left completely out in the cold, and I don't know if a class that is both (Duskblade, Paladin, Sword-Sage) will end up too OP with this...or this will close a serious power gap in such classes that I am unaware of?
2: What to add as passive magical benefits for the shard to "make up" for the consistency of the increasing special qualities? I'm thinking of (Increasing CL) or Lowering the spell level for magic related to that plane by 1 (maybe 2 at the highest rank...then again a wizard who casts fireballs as a first level spell...) or access to certain Metamagics for the related spells (Empowered, Maximized, Enlarge, etc). Is this a good idea? Should I make the spell stuff different for types of casters? (Spontaneous versus prepared)
3. Should I make the +1 enhancement and Special qualities available as protection, if a PC wills it? On Command they can switch from a weapon bonus to an armor bonus, (being a move-action, this does theoretically mean they could switch back-and-forth between rounds) or the armor bonus is always considered active?
4. Should I make the shards Class level based instead of ECL based? With the weapon (and armor) abilities unavailable to Caster classes, and the spell bonuses unavailable to Melee classes? Would this encourage or discourage players from multi-classing? For Classes that qualify as both casters and Melee, should they get both? Or have to choose when the shard bonds with them which type of bonus they get? (Clarification: the charges and spells available on a per day basis would remain ECL, and available to any class. This is just for the +1's and Special quality stuff)
5. My first leveling system was 3, 6, 9, 12, and 15 with 15 being the maximum rank/level. But I changed it to 5-8-11-14-17 because the first shard I'm working with is Fire and thought that the first 'notch' would give access to a once a day Fireball and the +1 Flaming Special Quality on command for any weapon, and I thought that giving ECL 3 characters access to Fireball would be game-breaking. What would be a good leveling system, using the rough layout of the Elemental Shards being sorted by 5 ranks, and the Alignment sorted by 3? (technically 6/4 with weak characters all getting the +1's)

So, am I in the wrong thread for this?

[Amechra]

I think I like this.

I think I will combine this with this. Here's the table in full, fixed glory:

Spoiler

Show

Legacy Rank	Least Ritual	Lesser Ritual	Greater Ritual
1	Least	Least	Least
2	-	Least	Least
3	-	-	Least
4	Least	Least	-
5	-	-	Least
6	-	Least	Least
7	-	-	Least
8	Least	Least	-
9	-	-	Lesser
10	-	Least	Lesser
11	-	Lesser	Lesser
12	Least	Lesser	-
13	-	-	Lesser
14	-	Lesser	Lesser
15	-	-	Lesser
16	Least	Lesser	-
17	-	-	Greater
18	-	Lesser	Greater
19	-	-	Greater
20	Least	Lesser	Greater

To summarize the other thread:

A, B, C are Least abilities.
D, E, F are Lesser abilities.
G, H, I are Greater abilities.

When you select a B, E, or H ability, it takes up two slots; the first one is empty, and the second one has the actual ability in it.
When you select a C, F, or I ability, it takes up three slots; the first two are empty, and the third one has the actual ability in it.

Of the stuff in that thread, I'd personally prefer to ignore the whole "Legacy" skill thing (just scale it by level!) and would probably just use the Greater Ritual column, "gating" the Lesser and Greater abilities behind the Lesser and Greater rituals as normal.

---

For janusmaxwell, I advise using the Renowned or Mythblooded Bloodlines. Here's a guide on how you'd use them.

[janusmaxwell]

For janusmaxwell, I advise using the Renowned or Mythblooded Bloodlines. Here's a guide on how you'd use them.

Appreciate those! Not what I was looking for with this stuff, but still very handy! Makes my mood a bit brighter. Plus, I FINALLY got a chance to sit done IRL with some buddies, and brainstorm on my Shards idea, and I think I've got the elemental versions of the shards hammered out. (Fire, Cold, Electricity, Acid for the stereotypical 4)

Elemental shards grant benefits based on ECL, which scales by 3 and makes 6 effective "ranks" for a person wielding the weapon. (Levels 1-3 is First Rank, 4-6 is 2nd, 7-9 is third, etc)

At first rank, the wielder gains a +1 to CL, and has a +1 enchantment bonus on any weapon wielded. These effects are constant, and add +1 to both at Ranks 3, 5, and 6. (levels 16+ the PC always has a +4 weapon on hand and has +4 CL to any type of spells they can cast)
From 2nd Rank onwards, the Shards begin to accumulate daily charges, with the maximum being set by Rank (Rank 2 has 1 charge available that is restored by the end of a day, and Rank 6 has 5 charges available) The number of charges restored is 1 per day, and the charges are used for Passive weapon Special Qualities OR Active Metamagic Feats. The passive weapon qualities are all based on the same/similar qualities in the SRD: On command, which is a standard action, the ability activates. At Ranks 4+ limitations come into effect and certain weapons will not be able to carry the more powerful qualities. The qualities are dependent on how many charges are left in the weapon, with each charge spent knocking the quality down on a "Rank per Charge" basis and if all the Shard's charges are expended then the bonuses of the Shard become Rank 1 until the next day. The Active Metamagic Feats are only available for spells that cause the type of damage from the plane the Shard comes from (Fire Shard Metamagic only effects spells that cause Fire Damage for example) and at each rank past 1, new feats become available for use. All feats are considered free uses of the feat, available for use on any qualifying spell, at the spell level it is available at, without needing to prepare the spell at a higher level. (You are spontaneously using Metamagic without having to prepare it.)

The Available Metamagics:
Rank 2: Energy Substitution: Fire (cost 1 charge)
Rank 3: (Searing/Arctic/Polarized/Melting) Spell (Cost 2/charges: Creatures normally immune to a damage type take half damage from spells under this metamagic)
Rank 4: Empowered (Fire/Cold/Electric/Acid) Spells (cost 3 charges)
Rank 5: Maximized (Fire/Cold/Electric/Acid) Spells (cost 4 charges)
Rank 6: Quickened (Fire/Cold/Electric/Acid) Spells (cost 5 charges)

Passive Weapon Special Qualities (Pulled from Fire Shard)
Rank 2: Flaming
Rank 3: Flaming Burst
Rank 4: Searing (Homebrew quality: 2d6 Fire Damage and ignores 5 Points of Fire Resistance on Target, Limitation is that it's only available for Metal Weapons)
Rank 5: Searing Blast (Homebrew, same stats as Searing, with 2d10 on a confirmed critical)
Rank 6: Dragon's Kiss (3d6 Fire, 2d10 on Crit, ignores 10 Fire resist OR Fire Immune creatures have effectively Fire Resistance 20. Limitation is that it's ONLY available for 'sword' weapons, Effectively a +6 Weapon enhancement)