Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Page 4 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 91 to 120 of 168
  1. - Top - End - #91
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Where did everybody go..?

    I started writing up Leraje, but encountered a few difficulties recreating his ricochet ability... was hoping I could get a little help.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  2. - Top - End - #92
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2014

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Where did everybody go..?
    Sorry, been a little busy over the last week. Started working on writing up Ronove, though, and I'm drafting Otiax ideas.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    I started writing up Leraje, but encountered a few difficulties recreating his ricochet ability... was hoping I could get a little help.
    What do you have for her so far? I think there's a Battlemaster maneuver that may be applicable, but I'm AFB right now.

  3. - Top - End - #93
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Scarce's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2013

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Where did everybody go..?

    I started writing up Leraje, but encountered a few difficulties recreating his ricochet ability... was hoping I could get a little help.
    What kind of trouble? I would probably just be using the Ranger's volley feature with slight modifications. That's an 11th level feature though, so if you need you could reduce the power by limiting it to 2 creatures using the same attack roll, rather than rolling separately.

  4. - Top - End - #94
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarce View Post
    What kind of trouble? I would probably just be using the Ranger's volley feature with slight modifications. That's an 11th level feature though, so if you need you could reduce the power by limiting it to 2 creatures using the same attack roll, rather than rolling separately.
    I have qualms about that, too, Even if you're just striking 2 targets at once. Unless it takes an action, striking 2 enemies with one action can be some serious leverage at 1st level, but quickly becomes weak once everyone else gets extra attacks.
    I was thinking in the direction of Volley too, tbh. Perhaps for a high level upgrade?

    Also, I'm thinking of making Leraje a 2nd level vestige (instead of a 1st). This way I would might have a little more wiggle room to give Binders better archery tools. This would also mean that there's room for another vestige to be 1st level, for whoever dares to downgrade a vestige
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  5. - Top - End - #95
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    I'm back!

    Sorry for the extended absence, guys - in short, there was a death in the family, followed by a couple of the curveballs life likes to throw sometimes, and I've been spending a lot of time either getting life straightened out or thoroughly exhausted and unable to work on homebrew. Anyways, that should all be sorted now, and I'm working on the Binder again.

    In other news, my group played the other day, and gave the Binder its first field test! Not much to report; most of the session was social and skills stuff - great fun, good plot progression, but not really a test of a character build. Next week's session looks like it'll be combat-heavy, though, so I'll see how the Binder fares and report back.

    So, on with the homebrew! I'm starting to flesh out the Binder's Fates, so that our Binder can make an informed choice on which one to pick - it's hard to decide if you don't know what abilities they get past 7th level. First up is the Unfettered:

    Spoiler: Unfettered Binder
    Show

    Unfettered
    In their work with vestiges, binders study magics that pierce the planes and transcend the natural laws of the universe. Some even learn to leave behind their physical form and experience the world as a vestige would.

    Intangible Presence
    At 3rd level, you learn to manipulate the fabric of the planes so that your presence makes less of a mark in the physical world. Once per short rest, you can make yourself indistinct and harder to detect. For one minute, or as long as you maintain concentration (whichever is shortest), you appear as a blurred and partly transparent shape. While this effect lasts, you gain a +10 bonus to Dexterity (Stealth) checks, and you can't be tracked by non-magical means. In addition, when standing on a surface, hanging, or being lifted, you appear to weigh half your normal weight, and you are not affected by non-magical wind and air currents. Once you use this ability, you can't use it again until you complete a long or short rest.

    Otherworldly Escape
    At 7th level, your knowledge of the nature of existence allows you to alter your reality to avoid harm. When you take damage, you can use your reaction to turn invisible and teleport up to 60 feet to an unoccupied space you can see. You remain invisible until the start of your next turn or until you attack or cast a spell. Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a short or long rest.

    Warp The Mind
    At 13th level, you gain a vestige's ability to alter the personality of a mortal mind. Once per short rest, you may choose any creature that you can see within 120 feet that is not a celestial, fiend, or fey. This creature must make a Wisdom save against your Binder spell DC. On a failed save, you may choose one effect from the following list:

    • Amnesia: the creature cannot learn new information. It will continue to act and react as they would normally, but at the start of each turn they choose their actions as they would have when the spell effect began. For example, if a creature that it previously considered friendly attacks, they will instinctively defend themselves, but on their next turn they will still consider the creature to be friendly. similarly, if an item is moved, they will still look for it in its old location first, and begin searching from there.
    • Recklessness: the creature acts without thought for its own safety. The creature takes a -2 penalty to AC and has disadvantage on all saving throws. The creature will not act counter to its interests or take actions that are purely self-harming, but it will not attempt to avoid taking damage from environmental effects, traps, etc. while carrying out its actions.
    • Unconfidence: the creature acts without assertiveness or belief. The creature has disadvantage on all skill checks and Charisma saves. In addition, if the creature has any ability or spellcasting that can be resisted with a Charisma save, the DC for that save is reduced by 2.
    • Fury: the creature cannot control its temper, becoming aggressive and volatile. The creature is quick to anger, even towards friends. In combat, the creature will attack whichever creature last dealt it damage. It cannot maintain concentration for more than one round.


    The effect lasts for 5 rounds, or until you lose concentration, whichever is sooner.

    Unreality
    At 17th level, [limited short-range Etherealness-type ability]



    The effects of Warp The Mind are new; I'd appreciate some feedback there. I'd like a selection of effects: amnesia, recklessness, unconfidence, fury, and perhaps one other. The exact mechanical impact of those is very much up for discussion.

    I'd also like input on Unreality. Basically the idea is that they phase out of the plane they're on, becoming invisible, untouchable, able to walk through walls and see through minor illusions (so, kinda like Etherealness with a much shorter duration, with a hint of True Seeing) but I'm having trouble with the wording.

    Some work on the Awakened will follow later.
    Last edited by anaximander19; 2015-06-24 at 08:34 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #96
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2012

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    wow, that sucks, I hope things are better now emotionally
    I would really like some input on this 5e Homebrew
    http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...mebrew-on-GitP

    Help Rebuild my Friend's Shop Goblin Games!
    https://www.gofundme.com/rebuild-goblin-games

  7. - Top - End - #97
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Welcome back, Anaxi! You had me worried for quite a while. Sorry to hear about the family tragedy, I hope things will get better for you from here.

    I'm diggin' the unfettered Binder :D it looks really for a stealth and intrigue campaign, my advice: effects you impose with warp the mind would be ideal if useful out of combat too - Amnesia is a great example of this.

    Looking forward to the awakened Binder, I started rewriting some of my vestiges to read "You know the ____ spell", to make it compatible with this particular Binder Fate.

    I'm actually most curious to see what you will do with the warped binder, whatever it is, I just hope it would be compatible with the vestige's combatant signs (I.e. Having Amon's Sign only empowers your warped Binder Horns, etc.)

    Finally, I'm thrilled that you got to playtesting! I hope you and your buddies tried Naberius for the role play session :3

    Battery low, chat you guys later, reply quick though so much left to say!
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  8. - Top - End - #98
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    A slightly updated Warp The Mind:

    Spoiler: Warp The Mind
    Show
    Warp The Mind
    At 13th level, you gain a vestige's ability to alter the personality of a mortal mind. Once per short rest, you may choose any creature that you can see within 120 feet that is not a celestial, fiend, or fey. This creature must make a Wisdom save against your Binder spell DC. On a failed save, you may choose one effect from the following list:
    • Amnesia: the creature cannot learn new information. It will continue to act and react as it would normally, but at the start of each turn it chooses its actions as it would have when the spell effect began. For example, if a creature that it previously considered friendly attacks, this creature will instinctively defend itself, but on their next turn they will still consider the creature to be friendly. Similarly, if an item is moved, they will still look for it in its old location first, and begin searching from there.
    • Recklessness: the creature acts without thought for its own safety. The creature takes a -2 penalty to AC and has disadvantage on all saving throws. The creature will not act counter to its interests or take actions that are purely self-harming, but it will not attempt to avoid taking damage from environmental effects, traps, etc. while carrying out its actions. A creature under this effect does not make long-term plans or think tactically, either in combat, or in other actions such as negotiations or business deals. The creature has disadvantage on all Wisdom (Persuasion) checks to make advantageous deals, and all Wisdom (Insight) checks to detect when it is being conned.
    • Unconfidence: the creature acts without assertiveness or belief. The creature has disadvantage on all skill checks and Charisma saves. In addition, if the creature has any ability or spellcasting that can be resisted with a Charisma save, the DC for that save is reduced by 2. The creature has disadvantage on all Charisma (Performance) and Charisma (Intimidation) checks.
    • Fury: the creature cannot control its temper, becoming aggressive and volatile. The creature is quick to anger, even towards friends. In combat, the creature will attack whichever creature last dealt it damage. It cannot maintain concentration for more than one round. The creature has disadvantage on Charisma (Persuasion) checks.


    The effect lasts for 5 rounds, or until you lose concentration; whichever is sooner.

    As well as clarifying the wording in places, I've also added some effects that help outside of combat, as suggested - I did want these to have social uses as well as combat ones, so I've attempted to make that happen. No idea if this is balanced, so if anyone has suggestions then feel free to poke holes in it.

    I'm trying to think of something that makes sense for Binders to get that augments their spellcasting. Arcane Trickster Rogues get a load of fun uses for mage hand, and I like that. For a Binder, though, I can't think of a cantrip that stands out as being thematically appropriate, except perhaps friends for how they make deals and convince vestiges to aid them. As for how that could be augmented... not sure. Any suggestions?

    Finally, our Binder did actually take Naberius - it's working ok so far, but like I said, we didn't get far enough for a thorough test. Noble Bloodhound allowed us to work out which of the yuan-ti we'd been captured by was in charge, and I can think of some ways that some of his other abilities might be helpful given our predicament. The other vestige bound was my hasty conversion of Andras, who has ended up dropping from a 4th level to a 3rd, unless I can think of something to boost him back up. I'll post that conversion soon - I left the sheet with the guy who plays the Binder, so I'll have to remember what I wrote.
    Last edited by anaximander19; 2015-06-24 at 05:19 PM.

  9. - Top - End - #99
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Sorry for my absence; I haven't been browsing the forums much lately. Anyway, time to do a partial conversion! (I say partial because Zahn & Friends are better at the new form of Influence than I am).

    Spoiler: Dahlver-Nar
    Show

    Dahvler-Nar
    The Tortured One
    1st Level vestige
    DC: 13
    Sign: Several teeth grow from your scalp. Though they are small enough to be hidden by a large quantity of hair or a hat, a touch reveals them immediately.
    Manifestation: Dahlver-Nar’s frightful apparition floats in the air above his seal, with arms and legs hanging limply. Teeth and fangs of all kinds stud his entire body, replacing even his eyes. What skin is visible between the teeth appears to be the moist, pink flesh of gums. Dahlver-Nar’s mouth is a bloody ruin that clearly lacks teeth, and when he opens it to speak, only a moan issues forth. Some binders believe that his vestige form is a punishment inflicted by the other vestiges, but others insist that he appears as he does because of his everlasting obsession with the teeth that bear his name.
    Granted Abilities:
    PROFICIENCIES
    You gain no proficiencies from binding Dahlver-Nar.

    Mad Soul: You have advantage on saving throws against effects that would deal psychic damage.

    Maddening Moan: Once per short rest you can, as an action, emit a moan that causes all creatures within 30 feet to make a Wisdom saving throw or be stunned for 1 round and take 1d6 thunder and psychic damage.

    Natural Armor: You gain a bonus to your base AC equal to half your Constitution modifier.

    Shield Self: As an action on your turn, you can designate one target within 30 feet to recieve half the damage that you take. Therefore you only take half damage from attacks, and the target takes the other half. If you designate a different creature, the first creature is released from this power's effects. An unwilling target can make a Charisma saving throw to negate the effect.

    PACT INFORMATION:
    Bards tell two stories of Dahlver-Nar, both linked to the magic items that carry his name—the teeth of Dahlver-Nar. Some say that because Dahlver-Nar was antiquity’s most powerful cleric, his followers treated his teeth as holy relics after his death and they somehow gained magical powers through this veneration. Others insist that Dahlver-Nar was a cleric of little consequence who discovered some magic dragon teeth in the ruins of a red dragon’s lair. In this version of the story, the teeth were named after Dahlver-Nar because he became a terror in the region where he acquired them. Binder scholars know a different story—that Dahlver-Nar was a powerful cleric who forsook his deity to pursue the power of pact magic. The fabled teeth of Dahlver-Nar, to which all the legends attribute miraculous powers, were neither his own nor those of the dragon he battled. They were the teeth of beings that became vestiges after death, and they could grant abilities similar to those that the vestiges themselves imparted. Pact magic treatises relate that Dahlver-Nar pulled out his own teeth and replaced them with those of the vestiges, but that using them all drove him mad. What happened thereafter is a matter of debate, but the texts maintain that Dahlver-Nar eventually died, and the teeth were lost, divided up among the squabbling followers he had managed to gain and then spread across the world. Today, Dahlver-Nar exists as a vestige in his own right—perhaps brought to that state through his close association with so many others.
    Last edited by The_Doctor; 2015-06-25 at 02:39 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  10. - Top - End - #100
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Post Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Here's Leraje, very tentative right now, but I hope she looks cool enough:
    Spoiler: Leraje
    Show
    LERAJE
    The Green Herald
    2nd Level vestige:
    DC: 13
    Seal:
    Sign: Your skin appears sickly and Pockmarked.
    Manifestation:

    PROFICIENCIES
    Tools: Shortbow, Longbow

    PRECISE SHOT
    Leraje guides your arrows through harsh conditions. Treat wind conditions as one step more favorable when determining how it affects your ranged weapon attacks (If desired: Strong wind is treated as Light, Light wind is treated as none. Destructive windstorms, such as tornados where archery would normally be near impossible, are treated as strong winds for the purposes of firing a shot). in addition, firing a bow underwater does not impose disadvantage to your attack roll while you are bound to Leraje.

    MASK OF THE WILD
    You can attempt to hide even when you are only lightly obscured by foliage, heavy rain, falling snow, mist, and other natural phenomena. if you are a wood elf, you instead gain advantage on hiding checks when lightly (or heavily) obscured by natural phenomena.

    GUST
    You learn the Gust Cantrip, mentioned in the Elemental Evil Player's Companion, page 19. Starting at 9th level, you can cast this Cantrip as a Bonus Action.

    LERAJE'S ARROW
    As part of your attack action, When you make an ranged weapon attack roll against a creature within range, You can choose for Leraje to simultaneously fire an ethereal, parallel arrow at a creature of your choosing within 5 feet of the creature you struck (or the same creature, if it is large or larger) roll a separate attack roll using the same attack bonus as your arrow, On a success, the attack deals force damage equal to 1d6 + your dexterity modifier + your Charisma Modifier. Once you have used this ability, you can not do so again until you complete a long rest. Starting at 8th level, this feature can instead deal force damage equal the damage delt by the ranged weapon attack it replicates, or 1d8 + your Dexterity Modifer + your charisma modifier (your choice), and you can use this feature twice before needing a long rest. Starting at 13th level, you can instead use Leraje's arrow to conjure your own volley of arrows. You can use Leraje's Arrow three times before needing a long rest, And can use this feature to make an attack roll against any number of creatures within 10 feet of a point within your weapon's range. You must make a separate attack roll for each creature, and each attack deals force damage equal to the ranged weapon's damage, or 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your Charisma modifier (your choice) to each creature you hit.
    Regardless of the version chosen, or how many times you can use Leraje's arrow, you can use this feature up to once per turn, and you still require ammunition for the original attack, as normal.

    LIGHT OF THE MOONSTRUCK
    You know the spell Moonbeam and can cast in once without expending a spell slot, nor needing somatic or material components. Once you have used Moonbeam in this fashion, you can not do so again until you complete a short or long rest.

    PACT INFORMATION:
    Spoiler: Legend
    Show
    Tales of Leraje's prowess with the bow and arrow exist to this day, although other great heroes and deities are now praised her deeds, turning her tale into words of heresy among elvenkind. Though pact magic treatises maintain that a great elven god called upon Leraje to be his first herald among mortals. She taught the elves how to make and use bows, though none could come close to matching her talents. Legend holds that she slain Thessala, the goddess of hydras, by shooting a single Arrow through all one thousand of her heads, thereby causing her children, the hydras, to be dull and crude for the rest of eternity.
    One night, When Leraje saved the Elf deity's lover from an bloodthirsty weretiger, before the woman fell to corruption and rose to divinity herself, the woman praised Leraje for her skills, claiming that not one elf, nor even their deity could shoot an arrow as fast and as precise as the valiant herald. Leraje beamed under the compliment, and the bemused lord of the Elves challenged Leraje to an archery duel to settle the matter once and for all. When his herald agreed to the challenge, the deity declared their target: her heart.
    The elven god expected his servant to realize the error of her pride and yield the contest, but she instead brought up her bow, and aimed it at her master, and pulled back the string. Though surprised, the deity raised his own bow and fired at her at the same moment she released her bowstring. Leraje aimed not at the god but at the arrow heading that sped toward her heart. The two Arrows met point to point midair as Leraje's Arrow ricocheted back, piercing Leraje's heart before her master's arrowhead even touched her chest. As punishment for wasting her life for the sake of her stubborn pride, the Elven Deity banished Leraje's soul from the heavens and the earth.

    Leraje has had countless generations in isolation to reflect upon her mistakes, and expects her binders to use her powers with humility. Leraje can impose disadvantage on any Charisma check to bind her if she suspects you will use her powers for the sake of winning honor or prestige. On the same token, she is a significantly more submissive and guilt-ridden when binding with elves, granting advantage to binders who exploit it. You can may also gain advantage on the pact if you can convince Leraje that her powers will be used to atone for a misdeed or mistake.

    If you make a poor pact with Leraje, she influences your personality in one of the following ways:

    Influence Description
    Personality Trait As of late, I am too timid to speak my mind, nor to jump to conclusions.
    Personality Trait I feel an unshakable guilt when around elves, and other elven blooded creatures.

    I wanted to add the archery fighting style, but I feared it might be too much your thoughts?
    Last edited by Prince Zahn; 2015-07-03 at 02:05 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  11. - Top - End - #101
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    And a vestige based on a book I am reading:

    Spoiler: Open at your own peril
    Show

    BIGGER
    The Native Son
    3rd Level vestige
    DC: 15
    Sign: Your skin takes on a dark tone, and you always smell faintly of smoke.
    Manifestation: Fog covers the seal, and the smell of burning wood is overpowering. A strange machine rumbles out of the smoke, made of metal, with four wheels. A door on the machine opens, and Bigger steps out. He is a 20-year old man with dark skin, and he talks in friendly terms with the binder if he is male. If it is a female binder then he talks nervously.
    Granted Abilities:

    PROFICIENCIES
    You gain proficiency in Undercommon while bound to bigger. You are also proficient in improvised weapons.

    Bigger's Bluff: You gain advantage on Charisma (Deception) and Charisma (Persuade) checks made on anyone of a higher social standing than you.

    Mark of a Murderer: You have advantage on Wisdom (Insight) and Wisdom (Perception) checks against singular creatures.. In addition once per long rest you can add the sneak attack damage of a rogue of half your binder level to an attack you just made.

    Shocking Revalation: Once per short rest, you can force on your foe a horrible revelation about the world. You must succeed on a ranged spell attack. If you hit, the target takes 2d6 psychic damage and is stunned for 1 round. The damage increases to 5d6 and the stun 2 rounds at level 10, 7d6 and 3 round stun at level 15, and 10d6 and 4 round stun at level 20.

    Chauffeur: You have advantage on Wisdom (Animal Handling) checks against beasts of burden or riding animals and on Wisdom (Survival) checks to avoid getting lost.

    Lung Smoke: As an action, you can force a target within 30 feet to make a Constitution saving throw or become poisoned for 1 round.

    PACT INFORMATION: Bigger lived in a world that was ruled by those with "pure" skin tone, and Bigger was a chauffeur for one of the more rich "pure" households. He accidentally killed their daughter in a moment of panic and burned the body. Eventually he redeemed himself, but the gods could not get over their horror (for the gods of this world were different than the ones of ours). They banished his soul from the cosmos.
    Last edited by The_Doctor; 2015-07-04 at 12:32 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  12. - Top - End - #102
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    I think also adding an intelligence requirement for warp the mind might be in order, I can imagine quite a few creatures that are either too stupid to be affected, or have questionable sentience besides killing/eating people out of instinct/direct orders from a wizard.
    Perhaps adding the potential for friendly fire under fury might make things a little interesting, such as attacking the nearest creature if it wasn't attacked in the previous turn. :3

    If the unfettered Binder gets trackless step, I might need to consider giving something else to Malphas...

    @Doctor: a few lingo notes:
    1. avoid flat numerical bonuses to anything but damage in 5e like the plague,with very few exceptions (I.e. fighting styles)
    2. 5e natural armor doesn't add an AC bonus. Instead, you get a higher base AC, like: While not wearing armor, your AC equals 12+ your Dexterity Modifier.
    3. What are everyone's thoughts about the shield self ability demanding a Charisma saving throw?


    @influence: all I do is make a miniature table based on the traits, ideals, bonds and flaws in the basic rules/players handbook, and tell DM and player to just pick one of these two options when you make a poor pact with __________. It's not as hard as it looks
    Last edited by Prince Zahn; 2015-06-25 at 02:07 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  13. - Top - End - #103
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Changed Mad Soul, fixed Natural Armor, and edit-ed Shield Self to require a Charisma saving throw.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  14. - Top - End - #104
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Doctor View Post
    And a vestige based on a book I am reading:

    Spoiler
    Show

    PACT INFORMATION: Bigger lived in a world that was ruled by those with "pure" skin tone, and Bigger was a chauffeur for one of the more rich "pure" households. He accidentally killed their daughter in a moment of panic and burned the body. Eventually he redeemed himself, but the gods could not get over their horror (for the gods of this world were different than the ones of ours). They banished his soul from the cosmos.
    What book is this? I don't recognize it it sounds like historical fiction, but then again, I don't read as many novels as I'd like to.

    Also:

    Quote Originally Posted by vestige template
    PACT INFORMATION:

    (retelling of the legend in a spoiler, followed by notable factors when binding with the vestige, like things a binder might do to try to gain advantage of disadvantage on binding the vestige.)

    If you make a poor pact with ___________, s/he influences your personality in one of the following ways:
    Influence Description
    (Personality Trait/Ideal/Bond/Flaw) (Influence A)
    (Personality Trait/Ideal/Bond/Flaw) (Influence B)
    This is the basic template I use. You can copy it if you want. The important thing to remember in this here template is that the vestige no longer demands you to do things, but rather incentivizes certain behavior with the prospect of gaining inspiration, a binder essentially embraces on 1 out of 2 additional traits, ideals, bonds or Flaws from every vestige he makes a poor pact with. It's not too difficult, but I would reserve giving flaws as an influence for 4th level vestiges and up.
    Last edited by Prince Zahn; 2015-06-26 at 02:01 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  15. - Top - End - #105
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    I finally had some ideas for what to give the Awakened Binder. Basically, a vestige chooses its manifestations and appearance to manipulate mortals. Everything about them is based on getting mortals to bind them and let them act as they wish. So, it makes sense that an Awakened Binder is good at that sort of stuff too. (The other direction that makes thematic sense is to go with reality-warping stuff, but Unfettered already has that covered).

    So, here's what I have so far. It's very rough, so feel free to tear it to bits

    First, a recap of the spellcasting part:
    Spoiler: Awakened Binder Spellcasting
    Show

    Awakened
    The energies of the void outside the planes are potent and varied, and at each summoning these energies seep from the portal that a binder opens to the beyond. Over time, an Awakened Binder finds that they have gained a residual pool of energy that they can call upon.

    Spellcasting
    When you reach 3rd level, you gain the ability to cast spells. See PHB chapter 10 for the general rules of spellcasting and PHB chapter 11 for the sorcerer spell list.

    Cantrips. You learn the cantrip minor illusion and one other cantrip of your choice from the sorcerer spell list. You learn another sorcerer cantrip of your choice at 8th, 13th and 19th level.

    Spell Slots. The Awakened Binder Spellcasting table shows how many spell slots you have to cast your spells of 1st level and higher. To cast one of these spells, you must expend a slot of the spell's level or higher. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a long rest. For example, if you know the 1st-level spell charm person and have a 1st-level and a 2nd-level spell slot available, you can cast charm person using either slot.

    Spells Known of 1st-Level and Higher. You know two 1st-level sorcerer spells of your choice, two of which you must choose from the conjuration and illusion spells on the sorcerer spell list.

    The Spells Known column of the Awakened Binder Spellcasting table shows when you learn more sorcerer spells of 1st level or higher. Each of these spells must be a conjuration or illusion spell of your choice, and must be of a level for which you have spell slots. For instance, when you reach 8th level in this class, you can learn one new spell of 1st or 2nd level. The spells you learn at 7th, 13th, 17th and 20th level can come from any school of magic.

    Whenever you gain a level in this class, you can replace one of the sorcerer spells you know with another spell of your choice from the sorcerer spell list. The new spell must be of a level for which you have spell slots, and it must be a conjuration or illusion spell, unless you’re replacing the spell you gained at 7th, 13th, 17th or 20th level.

    Spellcasting Ability. Charisma is your spellcasting ability for your sorcerer spells, since the power of your magic relies on your ability to project your will into the world. You use your Charisma whenever a spell refers to your spellcasting ability. In addition, you use your Charisma modifier when setting the saving throw DC for a sorcerer spell you cast and when making an attack roll with one.

    Awakened Binder Spellcasting
    Code:
    |Level|Cantrips Known|Spells Known|1st |2nd |3rd |4th |
    |-----|:------------:|:----------:|:--:|:--:|:--:|:--:|
    |3rd  | 2            | 2          | 2  | -  | -  | -  |
    |4th  | 2            | 3          | 3  | -  | -  | -  |
    |5th  | 2            | 3          | 3  | -  | -  | -  |
    |6th  | 2            | 3          | 3  | -  | -  | -  |
    |7th  | 2            | 4          | 4  | 1  | -  | -  |
    |8th  | 3            | 4          | 4  | 1  | -  | -  |
    |9th  | 3            | 4          | 4  | 1  | -  | -  |
    |10th | 3            | 5          | 5  | 2  | -  | -  |
    |11th | 3            | 5          | 5  | 2  | -  | -  |
    |12th | 3            | 5          | 5  | 2  | -  | -  |
    |13th | 4            | 6          | 5  | 2  | -  | -  |
    |14th | 4            | 6          | 5  | 2  | 1  | -  |
    |15th | 4            | 6          | 5  | 2  | 1  | -  |
    |16th | 4            | 6          | 5  | 3  | 2  | -  |
    |17th | 4            | 7          | 5  | 3  | 2  | -  |
    |18th | 4            | 7          | 5  | 3  | 3  | -  |
    |19th | 5            | 7          | 5  | 3  | 3  | 1  |
    |20th | 5            | 8          | 5  | 3  | 3  | 1  |
    Table in raw Markdown format because converting it is a hassle

    Now, how's this for an ability?

    Spoiler: Emotive Illusion
    Show

    Emotive Illusion
    At 7th level, you learn to emulate a vestige's ability to choose its manifestations to evoke an emotional response. At any time during the duration of an illusion spell cast by you, you may choose one creature currently under the effect of the illusion, and use your action to force the chosen creature to make to make an Intelligence (Investigation) check against your spell save DC. If they fail, the creature is frightened or charmed by you (your choice) as long as they remain under the effect of the illusion.


    One other thought I had but haven't written out as an ability yet: I'd like to give the Awakened Binder something like the gnome's device, or the transmutation wizard's transmuter's stone: a small item that provides some minor benefit to either the Binder or an ally they chose to bestow it on. In keeping with the vestige theme, I was thinking it could be a small physical manifestation - for example, a magical mark that looks like a brand or tattoo, or perhaps a small physical change that's thematically appropriate for the effect chosen (related body part, etc). The effect might be something like darkvision, or advantage on a certain save. At higher levels, I'd consider allowing them to store a spell in it that the bearer could cast, like a ring of spell storing (or the psionic tattoos in 3.5). Alternatively, they could chose to expend the Mark to achieve an effect, just like the transmutation stone's 14th-level use (but with different options).

    Thoughts?

  16. - Top - End - #106
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    @Zahn: Google is your friend.


    Any comments on the vestige itself?

    I'll add the table to all of my vestiges later today, I think.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  17. - Top - End - #107
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2014

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    So yeah, final(ish?) version of Focalor here:
    Spoiler
    Show
    FOCALOR
    Prince of Tears
    3rd Level Vestige


    Special Requirement: Focalor’s seal must be drawn with a liquid medium.

    Manifestation: Focalor manifests slowly, appearing first as a single tear that drops from thin air to strike the ground. Next his weeping eyes appear, and gradually his whole body becomes visible. Focalor looks like a handsome human male whose face is twisted by grief. He wears no clothes, but he cloaks his body in the griffon wings that grow from his back and shudder with each of his wracking sobs.

    Sign: While you serve as host to Focalor, your eyes constantly weep, regardless of your mood or thoughts.

    Influence: While influenced by Focalor, you feel some of his immense sadness and act morose, rarely smiling or finding cause to laugh. Whenever you kill a creature, Focalor demands that as soon as you have a peaceful moment, you take a round to say a few words of sorrow and regret for the life cut short by your actions.

    Abilities:

    Focalor's Breath: As a standard action, you can exhale towards a living target within 30 feet. The target must make a Constitution save or be blinded as if by the Blindness/Deafness spell. You can use this ability once per short rest.

    Water Breathing: For as long as you are bound to Focalor, you can breathe as though you werere under the effects of the Water Breathing spell.

    Electrifying Touch: You gain the Shocking Grasp cantrip.

    Inestimable Grief: While you display Focalor's sign, the sorrow that paints your visage makes you difficult to read. Insight or Perception checks attempting to discern your emotions or intentions have disadvantage, and you have advantage on saves against Detect Thoughts or similar effects that would read your mind.

    Lightning Strike: Once per round as a standard action, you can call down a bolt of lightning that strikes any target you designate, as long as it is within 60 feet. This range increases to 120 feet at 11th level. The lightning bolt deals 1d6 points of electricity damage per vestige level of the highest-level vestige you are able to bind. A successful Dexterity save halves this damage. This ability functions outdoors, indoors, underground, and even underwater.

    Aura of Sadness:You emit an aura of depression and sadness that can overtake even the most strong-willed of creatures. When a creature within 5 feet of you hits with an attack roll, you can use your reaction to sap its fighting spirit with feelings of guilt and misery. Until the end of your next turn, you can choose to impose disadvantage on one attack roll, ability check, or saving throw it makes. A creature with an Intelligence score of 4 or less isn’t affected.

    Influence:
    Personality Trait: You feel morose, and rarely smile or find cause to laugh.
    Personality Trait: Whenever you kill a creature, as soon as you have a peaceful moment, you take a round to says a few words of sorrow and regret for the life you cut short.



    And here's a draft of Ronove. Some rough ideas, at least.
    Spoiler
    Show
    RONOVE
    The Iron Maiden
    1st Level Vestige


    Special Requirement: Ronove’s seal must be drawn in the soil under the sky.

    Legend: In life, Ronove was a charismatic guru who taught that enlightenment comes from denial—first of the needs of the flesh, then of the perceived limits of reality, and lastly of the rules of reality. Her frequent demonstrations of power served to illustrate the validity of her ideas to others. She leapt from cliffs without harm, lifted boulders with her thoughts, and lived for months without eating or drinking. Although Ronove gathered many followers, not one of her disciples could manage her great feats. Some began to question her methods.

    To prove the veracity of her teachings, Ronove entombed herself underground in an iron coffin, telling her students to dig her up only when they received a sign from her. However, years passed without a sign, and her followers dwindled, leaving only one. Disillusioned, he dug up the coffin. Finding it empty, he told the other former disciples of what had happened, but none believed him, and Ronove and her nameless follower faded into obscurity.

    Sign: Your face settles into a frown if you succeeded on your binding check, or a smile if you failed.

    Manifestation: The ground quakes, and a rusted iron sarcophagus erupts from the earth within her seal, shedding dirt and flakes of rust as it grates upward. The metal visage of a human woman is discernible on the lid. The metal bindings holding the lid closed burst in clouds of corroded metal, and the sarcophagus creaks open, releasing a tumble of human bones and noisome black liquid. Ronove does not speak to her summoner, but the visage on the lid smiles or frowns during the pact-making process.

    Abilities:

    Magic Attacks: Your melee attacks count as magic for purposes of overcoming resistance or immunity to weapon damage.

    Far Hand: You can manipulate distant objects using invisible force. As an action, you can summon an invisible force, which you can use to move objects as a bonus action on your turn. This ability has a range of 30 feet, which increases to 60 feet at 5th level, and works similarly to Telekinesis, but with the following differences:
    You can only move unattended objects, up to a weight of 10 pounds per Binder level you possess.
    You cannot try to move creatures, but can instead use an action to push them with the force. This deals 1d6 Bludgeoning damage, and the target must make a Strength save against your Binder save DC. If it fails, you push it 10 feet in a direction you choose and knock it prone. Afterwards, the force dissipates, and you must use an action to summon it again.

    Feather Fall: You automatically fall as though under the influence of a Feather Fall spell. You can suppress or activate this ability as a standard action.

    Ronove’s Fists: You can use Dexterity instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of your unarmed strikes, and you can deal Martial Arts damage with your unarmed strikes as though you were a Monk of your Binder level.

    Sprint: You gain +10ft to your base speed.

    Ronove’s Endurance: While bound to Ronove, you only need to eat, drink, and sleep one-third as often as normal, and you treat your level of exhaustion as being one less than it actually is, and thus suffer no penalties until you have received two levels of exhaustion.

    Influence:
    Personality Trait: Despite what anyone says, you feel the need to prove your worth.
    Personality Trait: You cannot eat or drink (including potions) while you remain bound to Ronove.

  18. - Top - End - #108
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    I'm in a bit of a twitter mood, please forgive the silliness but I think it sped up my posting
    @Awakened Binder. perhaps a streamlined, simplified version of Dahlver-Nar's teeth, which would offer some kind of utilitarian purpose? Perhaps mimic a swappable utilitarian ability from any vestige of up to, say, 3rd/4th/5th level? Food for thought.

    @Bigger. As a rule of thumb, I'd rather get answers and opinions from people so I don't have to read about it from Wikipedia. I don't respond to "Google it". *shrugs*
    ...The car is a little weird an idea, at least for a conventional D&D game, and Naberius already offers vicious mockery, I doubt the two would interact well together. Those details notwithstanding, I can see him as a 1st of 2nd level vestige, but he needs something that would improve at higher levels.

    @Focalor. dealing 9d6 per round seems a bit much for an at-will ability, even at really high levels. Perhaps Lightning bolt won't be an unreasonable spell to offer instead. Adding "You know the lightning bolt spell..." would give an awakened binder a sparkling new toy to use, as well. See also above on having an ability that improves at key levels. On a personal level, I want early level vestiges to be relevant options for as long as possible. (#Lightning Strike)
    @Ronove. she's looking quite nice for an initial draft :3 hats off.
    My thoughts:
    • To go with the monk theme, I'd only make the binder's unarmed strike count as magical. Lest this would quickly be exploitable by greatsword wielding binder/fighter builds or somefin.
    • Feather fall is a reaction to use, I'm not really sure about making it constant, though since it is only on yourself I don't think it could do much harm.
    • Far hand is essentially a slightly more offensive Mage hand, I take it? I think that's fine for now, and would be easier to phrase as "Mage hand+". Perhaps even upgrade it to a full-fledged telekinesis at a level you think is just.

    Carry on. Any feedback/thoughts about #Leraje, who somehow swapped places with Dahlver-Nar?
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  19. - Top - End - #109
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Oh, I like the idea of emulating the Teeth... although that's potentially a lot of bookkeeping. How's this:
    Occult Mark
    At 13th level, you learn the means by which a vestige is able to bestow abilities on its host. In a ritual lasting one hour, you may place a magical mark resembling a brand or tattoo on a willing creature that you can touch. Once you perform the ritual, you cannot perform it again until you have completed a long rest, and only one creature may bear your Mark at any one time. The Mark lasts until dismissed or expended, after which it fades away; it cannot be erased or dispelled by dispel magic. The Mark disappears if you die, or if the creature bearing it dies.

    As long as the creature bearing your Mark is on the same plane as you and within one mile, you know which direction the creature is in. If the creature dies, you are instantly aware of it.

    When you perform the ritual, you select one ability granted by any vestige you have previously bound for a continuous period of at least 24 hours. The ability chosen must allow you to use it more than once without requiring a long rest. The creature who bears your Mark may use their action to activate this ability, after which it functions exactly as if they had the relevant vestige bound and were using the ability normally. Any spells granted are cast at your caster level, regardless of whether the creature bearing the Mark has spellcasting abilities of its own. When the ability contained within it is activated, the Mark's energy is expended, and the Mark fades.
    So basically, you can pick anything a vestige lets you do (provided it's not their Big Thing) and either gain it or bestow it on an ally, as a daily ability. The restriction on not getting once-per-long-rest abilities is so that you can't use it to circumvent the balancing - imagine taking the strongest ability of a 9th-level vestige, and then binding two more... the possibility of getting two 9th-level-spell-equivalent powers is already a bit crazy, balanced only by the lack of much else spellcasting (even with Awakened, you're missing out on levels 5-8) but three 9th-level-spell-equivalent powers is too much. At any rate, this lets you choose anything from 1st-level stuff like darkvision or advantage on a particular skill, right up to a single casting of a 4th-level spell, or something of roughly equivalent power. I might look at rewording it a little to account for the different styles and durations - for example, I'm not sure how this interacts with things worded as "you know [spell]". It should be a single casting, I think, but I'm not sure how to handle that.

    I'm also toying with the idea of the Mark granting you a small passive benefit (darkvision, one type of resistance, advantage on one save, something like that) but I might save that for later by having the 17th-level ability boost the Mark's power - adding the passive buff, maybe letting them use the ability contained it it two or three times, or maybe let them have two active at once.
    Last edited by anaximander19; 2015-06-30 at 07:13 AM.

  20. - Top - End - #110
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2014

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    @Focalor. dealing 9d6 per round seems a bit much for an at-will ability, even at really high levels. Perhaps Lightning bolt won't be an unreasonable spell to offer instead. Adding "You know the lightning bolt spell..." would give an awakened binder a sparkling new toy to use, as well. See also above on having an ability that improves at key levels. On a personal level, I want early level vestiges to be relevant options for as long as possible. (#Lightning Strike)
    True. I do really want Focalor to keep the 1/round lightning strike like in 3.5. Maybe it scales up a d6 per every 2-3 vestige levels above 3rd? Would leave it at 6d6 or 5d6, respectively. The latter averages out to half a point less damage than Sacred Flame (Which also is an at-will power requiring a Dex save, but doesn't require you to bind a specific vestige. Granted, it's a dex save for none rather than half...), while the former averages to 3 points more. Alternatively, have it scale at the same levels cantrips scale at?

    Lightning Bolt could be cool, but Focalor already has a short rest ability. Maybe have Awakened binder gain specific spells based on vestiges bound?

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    @Ronove. she's looking quite nice for an initial draft :3 hats off.
    My thoughts:
    • To go with the monk theme, I'd only make the binder's unarmed strike count as magical. Lest this would quickly be exploitable by greatsword wielding binder/fighter builds or somefin.
    • Feather fall is a reaction to use, I'm not really sure about making it constant, though since it is only on yourself I don't think it could do much harm.
    • Far hand is essentially a slightly more offensive Mage hand, I take it? I think that's fine for now, and would be easier to phrase as "Mage hand+". Perhaps even upgrade it to a full-fledged telekinesis at a level you think is just.

    Carry on. Any feedback/thoughts about #Leraje, who somehow swapped places with Dahlver-Nar?
    • Good idea. The 3.5 one doesn't specify unarmed (and makes them Cold Iron as well) but this would make sense.
    • Reaction sounds fine. Can't think of any cases where reaction versus constant feather fall would really matter besides either getting knocked off a cliff mid-combat after taking an AoO, or getting tossed off a ledge while asleep (In which case your vestiges are probably unbound anyway, and you could've been killed a multitude of other ways).
    • I thought about using Mage Hand, especially given the "Hand" in the name, but it doesn't create a spectral hand to lift things, it just lifts them TK style. Maybe do the same invisible hand thing the Trickster has?

    Leraje looks pretty good! I like Precise Shot especially. Leraje's Arrow strikes me as a little underpowered, though. A slightly lower-damage extra attack against a different target, recharging on a long rest? The 13th level upgrade gets stronger, but I think that changing the cooldown to short rests could work. Dunno if you'd keep the number of uses the same, but it seems fine, especially at that high a level.

  21. - Top - End - #111
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    To Clarify, saying "you know the X Spell" only really matters if A:the class offers built-in spellcasting, and B: the character has the lowest level spell slot required to cast the aforementioned spell. Both of which the Awakened Binder is capable of doing (at least up to 4th-level spells. Meaning by design we should avoid writing "You know this 5th+level spell" on our vestige entries. This only gives the awakened Binder the option to spend a precious spell slot to use a spell offered by a vestige.

    @Mark: pretty similar to what I was thinking with the teeth, only less gruesome whether teeth or mark, it only needs to replicate a vestige power, not necessarily augment it
    Try this sentence instead of the caster level part, since that term doesn't exist in this edition :X
    The creature bearing your mark uses your binder level, and it's own ability modifiers to determine the effects of any vestige feature it possesses through your mark.
    To avoid abuse, consider putting a hardcap on the level vestige you can use this way.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  22. - Top - End - #112
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    @Focalor: here's an idea: how about the Call Lightning spell from the Druid list?
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  23. - Top - End - #113
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    @Mark: pretty similar to what I was thinking with the teeth, only less gruesome whether teeth or mark, it only needs to replicate a vestige power, not necessarily augment it
    Try this sentence instead of the caster level part, since that term doesn't exist in this edition :X
    The creature bearing your mark uses your binder level, and it's own ability modifiers to determine the effects of any vestige feature it possesses through your mark.
    To avoid abuse, consider putting a hardcap on the level vestige you can use this way.
    Ah, I forgot that caster level is a thing of the past... What I was aiming for was to resolve the question of what spell slot level is used for spells that scale. So, if the Mark is allowing the bearer to cast a spell that has the "at higher levels" bit, the idea was that they cast them at whatever level the Binder would - in other words, you can't give a full-caster one of your spells and have them cast it at a higher level than you could yourself; they cast it at your power level. I also don't want to say that they can cast it at any level you could, because then you can place the Mark on yourself and get an extra spell slot at your highest level, which interferes with the balancing. So, perhaps it should say something like
    Any spells granted are cast at their lowest level
    which is a lot clearer. It also opens the possibility of saying at 17th level that the Mark now allows them to cast spells using a slot one level higher, or something.

    I'm still not sure how to handle "You know [spell]" abilities though... do we say that the Mark just lets the target creature learn that spell? What if they pick a cantrip? Does the target creature get to cast the cantrip all day, or just once? It does say if functions exactly as it would if they'd bound the vestige, which implies that they get it all day, but I'm not sure that's a great idea.

    As for the vestiges:

    • Leraje is looking good; good flavour, and some nice abilities. Leraje's Arrow might need the curve adjusting; it starts a little weak and scales to become quite strong, but otherwise I like it.
    • Focalor is very cool, but I second the idea that Lightning Strike might be a little strong.
    • Ronove is a really nice start - I'd make the following adjustments: First, as already stated, the magical weapon should only apply to natural weapons, to avoid combos with things like greatswords. Second, Far Hand might benefit from being phrased as a variant on mage hand, telekinesis, or Bigby's Hand. Third, the trait of not being able to eat of drink is really a flaw, I think, and giving them drawbacks whenever they eat or drink might be a slightly harsh one for a 1st-level.

  24. - Top - End - #114
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quote Originally Posted by anaximander19 View Post
    Ah, I forgot that caster level is a thing of the past... What I was aiming for was to resolve the question of what spell slot level is used for spells that scale. So, if the Mark is allowing the bearer to cast a spell that has the "at higher levels" bit, the idea was that they cast them at whatever level the Binder would - in other words, you can't give a full-caster one of your spells and have them cast it at a higher level than you could yourself; they cast it at your power level.
    I'm not sure if that's really a big issue. After all, WotC Clarified that a spells cast without a spell slot function at minimum level anyway (as do rituals), so a full caster is paying a higher level spell slot to cast it in a way that stays relevant to the game level from a full caster, and what's the problem with that, anyway?
    I also want to remind you that, to make matters harder, most casters need to prepare the spell as well as know it, which takes an hour at least. The only detail that needs a workaround is the wizard and Pact of the Tome Warlock, who should not be able to inscribe the new spell into their books.
    I also don't want to say that they can cast it at any level you could, because then you can place the Mark on yourself and get an extra spell slot at your highestLowest level, which interferes with the balancing...
    FTFY. Aside from doubling the uses of the spell per rest, I don't see the awakened Binder receiving any substantial benefit from using this ability on binding, since he Knows the spell anyway, he can use it as the vestige describes with the vestige's benefits and limitations, or as the spell describes by spending a spell slot even without the mark. That's about it. Granted, it is a little complex, but that's normal for Vancian spellcasting.
    If you really want to prevent the loophole anyway, you can rule that the binder can not imbue the mark upon himself, C'est Tout.

    I'm still not sure how to handle "You know [spell]" abilities though... do we say that the Mark just lets the target creature learn that spell?
    And what would the problem with that be?
    See above, besides, in this design, the awakened binder won't be have mention know the ____ spell for spells higher than 4th level anyway, and can't do much with knowing it if it's not a ritual (?) or if she's not an awakened binder anyway, and she likewise he won't be passing any spellcasting of 5th level or higher to anyone else for the sand reason, unless it's a binder ability or something.
    What if they pick a cantrip? *snip*
    Again, what would the problem with that be?
    There are no game breaking cantrips AFAIK, nor do you have to be a spellcaster to know and use cantrips. You can use them at-will and there is no fault to that, as that is the point of cantrips in 5e.

    With all the talk about the binder it's easy to forget we're doing this for D&D 5e games, not 3.5 some things are a little more lenient.

    As for the vestiges:

    • Leraje is looking good; good flavour, and some nice abilities. Leraje's Arrow might need the curve adjusting; it starts a little weak and scales to become quite strong, but otherwise I like it.
    • Focalor is very cool, but I second the idea that Lightning Strike might be a little strong.
    • Ronove is a really nice start - I'd make the following adjustments: First, as already stated, the magical weapon should only apply to natural weapons, to avoid combos with things like greatswords. Second, Far Hand might benefit from being phrased as a variant on mage hand, telekinesis, or Bigby's Hand. Third, the trait of not being able to eat of drink is really a flaw, I think, and giving them drawbacks whenever they eat or drink might be a slightly harsh one for a 1st-level.
    • thank you guys for the feedback on Leraje, the way I intended for Leraje's Arrow to work at high levels is nearly identical to Volley, except rest powered, and dealing a little force damage. That being said, she gives the Volley attack 2 levels after the ranger gets them. Ideally, Leraje's Arrow is also extra damage against a large or larger creature.
      What do you guys purpose I could do with Leraje's Arrow to make sure it connects properly at lower levels? More damage? More arrows? Less limits? Other? All ears!
    • inb4: what do you guys think of call Lightning for Lightning strike? It generally would be X uses between short rests ability, though each casting could last you the whole combat. :3
    • most likely mage hand, as we are still talking about a 1st level vestige, whether you nerf the spell or not



    WOW THAT WAS A MOUTHFUL!
    Last edited by Prince Zahn; 2015-06-30 at 09:42 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  25. - Top - End - #115
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    @Zahn: The reason I posted the Wikipedia link was that I haven't read the whole book yet. That said, what I HAVE read is very interesting, and it conveys a powerful feeling.

    Editing Bigger.... Removed Summon Car, fixed wording on Bigger's Bluff, edited Chauffeur, and changed Vicious Mockery to Shocking Revelation and added Mark of a Murderer. And upped the level to 3.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  26. - Top - End - #116
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Scarce's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2013

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Quick (and probably quite rough) attempt at Acererak:

    Spoiler: Acererak, the Devourer
    Show

    Acererak
    The Devourer
    7th level Vestige

    Vestige of Unlife. Acererak grants you a semblance of lichood while he is bound. You have resistance to cold, lightning, and poison damage.
    Additionally, the undead see you as a friend while bound to Acererak. Before making an attack against you, an undead creature must make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature loses the attack. If a creature's saving throw is successful, the creature is immune to this feature for the next 24 hours.

    Undead Healing. Whenever you take necrotic damage from a spell of 1st level or higher, you instead regain a number of hit points equal to the necrotic damage dealt, up to your hit point maximum.

    False Life
    You can cast the spell false life as if using a spell slot of 4th level. After casting this spell, you must take a short or long rest before casting it again.

    Finger of Death. You can cast the spell finger of death without expending a spell slot



    I'll add the flavor text in once I'm convinced I have the mechanics right. Finger of Death might be raising the level that this vestige needs to be at, but I'm unsure of where it needs to be otherwise. Lemme know what you think.

    EDIT: Added a couple new features.
    Last edited by Scarce; 2015-12-10 at 12:16 AM.

  27. - Top - End - #117
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Prince Zahn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    my fireball can reach you
    Gender
    Male

    d20 Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)


    @Doctor: You didn't have to remove key features completely just because I said it's a little odd. Sure, automobiles in D&D feel pretty wacky but some people like that! The "Misc. Vestiges" are for anything and everything beyond the standard Binder - unconventional and Genre-changing stuff can certainly find it's place there!

    Also, you guys should know I keep the "Vestiges list" Post up to date. Acererak will be added shortly. speaking of which:

    @Acererak. A very good start :) the only thing that stands out funny IMO is Paralyzing Touch, which I'm not sure how powerful it is by 13th+ level. Though don't take it as WoG since I have neither my books nor much reference on me right now to support it.

    Overall I think it's pretty good, but I think you should be able to sense a more distinct difference in power when you wield a 7th/8th level Vestige, (not to mention 9th level, that's a whole other league ) :3 feel free to give Acererak another power or something ^_^
    Last edited by Prince Zahn; 2015-07-01 at 06:00 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jette View Post
    If you write gibberish in common, even comprehend languages won't turn it into a sonnet.
    P.Z. - gamer; friend; royalty. 'Tis a pleasure.
    <<Cynthia the Witch by me. she's a nice gal, I promise!

    My player Resume, for potential DMs to read over.


    My Extended Signature

  28. - Top - End - #118
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    I removed Summon Car because while Bigger was a chauffeur, that wasn't the main point of the book; the point is he killed someone.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince Zahn View Post
    Sometimes it's easy to forget this isn't for 3.5 anymore #Shocking revelation.
    Binders are fun!
    My 5e Vestiges: Amon, Dahlver-Nar, Focalor, Primus, Marchosias, Halphax, and some other non-canon ones.

  29. - Top - End - #119
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Scarce's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2013

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    @Acererak: I added a couple of things, specifically the Disrput Life ability from the Monster Manual's Lich, and one ability to protect yourself from undead. Let me know if this brings it up to 7th level vestige status, or bumps it into 8th.

    Also, it might be prudent to embed a vestige save DC formula into the class itself, rather than specifying it in each vestige description. For example:

    Saving Throws. Some vestiges have features that require your target to make a saving throw to resist some effects. The saving throw DC is calculated as follows:
    Vestige save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Charisma modifier.
    Last edited by Scarce; 2015-07-01 at 11:54 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #120
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: [PEACH] Binder class (WIP)

    Agreed - my plan was to give the Binder a save DC just like a spellcaster (8 + CHA + proficiency) and then just have vestiges say "using your Binder save DC" in the same way that spells say "using your spell save DC". Apologies if that wasn't clear from the start.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •