Villainous Competition IV, or, The Truth is in the (Blood) Pudding

[atemu1234]

How are all our judges doing?

Real life sneak attacked me like a 20th level rogue. Luckily, I have a bit of time soon...

[Gwachitallemall]

Real life sneak attacked me like a 20th level rogue. Luckily, I have a bit of time soon...

Well, take your time! Those 20th level sneak attacks can be crippling.

[Telonius]

Well, take your time! Those 20th level sneak attacks can be crippling.

12th level with Savvy Rogue, even worse. ::rimshot::

[Gwachitallemall]

Well. If anyone wants to take this over, send me a message. Life has thron more at me these past few weeks, so I have to step down from Supreme Chancellor after this competition ends.

[illyahr]

That's a shame. Good luck with your future endeavors.

Working on my ratings. Should have them up later this week sometime.

[atemu1234]

I've been shirking my judging duties for the past week by accident. I'll get on this tonight while rewatching SAO.

Promise, I swear.

Edit: Nine-dammit real life.

I'm busy today and the next few days. Issues are being issues. I'll judge if I get the chance, but I'm busy between a graduation, an all-nighter and planning for an IRL D&D game. I owe a guy.

[Gwachitallemall]

Okay, well how's everyone else doing? Real life just hit me again like a sack of bricks. Definitely confirms my choice not to continue this.

[Telonius]

I owe a guy.

Hmm. That gives me an idea for another type of villain.

Unfortunately real life is hitting me pretty hard too. Always busiest when everybody else in the office is away on vacation...

[atemu1234]

Hmm. That gives me an idea for another type of villain.

Unfortunately real life is hitting me pretty hard too. Always busiest when everybody else in the office is away on vacation...

Me it's family, and setting up for an IRL game.

[Telonius]

It's family.

Yeah, definitely getting an idea for a villain.

[Morrolan]

Would want to judge if I hadn't recently gotten a fulltime job. :P

[Telonius]

You know what, I'd be willing to be temporary Supreme Chancellor for the next competition. I'm pretty sure I can fit it in. Just have to clean out the inbox of a few message that have been there since ... yikes.

[Sam K]

Considering the lack of activity recently, I would like to go back to the conversation that spawned the idea for this contest:

For those who do not remember, Scorponok was painting a scenario of a villain using magical hit and run tactics to terrorize people, and asking how playgrounders would handle this (ie how to deal with the villain). I suggested that the most likely reaction would be to teach the guy better hit and run tactics (he was using fireballs, ffs!), and then we span that into an idea of a reality TV show where the playgrounds evil experts did interventions for various villains that aren't getting the RoE (Return on Evil) they're looking for.

I think this contest was at its best when it was closest to that idea. The first conteast was (in my mind) the most fun because it had a pretty strict theme, with serious restrictions. You saw some pretty cool builds, that weren't perhaps the height of optimization, but that made for interesting villains. The bard/blackguard warlord wasn't exatcly the height of power, but it was a pretty memorable take on a warlord. We all knew that being a warlord wasn't the optimal way of being a villain, but we built for it anyway.

I think after that, focus has become too much on building the "BEST villain" instead of the "best VILLAIN"; instead of making the burninating wizard terrorizing the city better at burninating and terrorizing, we skip the burning and terrorizing completely because it's not really the best thing to use your resources on. Gwach, if you decide to run another, or if someone else decides to pick this up, I hope you will consider incorporating more of the original joke: give a villain his "schtick", be it leading armies or burning the cottages of pesants, and lets optimize that. There's enough batman wizards in the world. Lets have some kung-fu villains, some brawlers (hey, henchmen need optimizing too), some scary pirates (that aren't really wizards with pirate hats) and things like that.

[Jormengand]

Yeah, I kinda liked your idea that it would be something like "Here is a build, now fix it."

"Can the team help this aspiring overlord get back on track? Find out at 8!"

Not sure how it would work, though...

[Telonius]

So, any objections to my reign as temporary Supreme Chancellor for the next contest? Dissenters will be tolerated; stand over to the side there and I'll take down the complaints momentarily. (No, just a little more to the right...)

[sakuuya]

All hail Supreme Chancellor Telonious!

[atemu1234]

All hail Supreme Chancellor Telonious!

So this is how liberty dies...

[Telonius]

I see the new Iron Chef is up, with their due date as the 21st; I'll time it so the due dates are a week afterwards. (I know there was a lot of overlap issues this time).

[sakuuya]

We need some judgement on this round before overlapping with IC next time becomes a concern. How's it coming, atemu? (And anyone else...)

[Telonius]

Spoiler

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We're not quite at the judging deadline yet.

[atemu1234]

We need some judgement on this round before overlapping with IC next time becomes a concern. How's it coming, atemu? (And anyone else...)

It's coming like this.

Spoiler: Geroldt Brand

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Originality: 4. I don't think I've ever seen anyone try to fit Bone Knight and Dirgesinger and the same character in my time playing this game. I do like that.
Power: 2. It loses far too many caster levels for me to find it powerful enough to be to my liking. However, maybe it could handle melee better than it suggests.
Elegance: 3. I like that it possesses two classes that can be considered Charisma-based, though, if I am not mistaken, a Crusader may have worked better than a paladin in this case.
Concept: 4. This sticks to the Gravekeeper concept very well. I applaud you on this fact.
Total: 13.

Spoiler: Razlyn'susselsathra

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Originality: Again, 4. It seems both a fairly unique concept and interesting to see on paper.
Power: 4. It's a dragon, both capable of inflicting negative levels and with really quite wonderful casting.
Elegance: 2. I like the concept, but DWoC on an Ur-Priest? While it is legal, it is strange.
Concept: 3. It doesn't stick to the concept all that well, in my opinion, because it's not specific enough. One day this creature could pick spells to be a gravekeeper, sure, but it could also pick the right spells to utterly destroy its own horde of dead and undead.
Total: 13.

Spoiler: Annabelle

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Originality: 5. I absolutely love the originality of this creation and its backstory. Tres creepy.
Power: 4. It's a wizard, which I absolutely cannot fault you for. Pick the right spells and this can destroy about anything.
Elegance: 2: Undead Necromancers are nice, and the backstory is interesting, but the redundant abilities are simply just there.
Concept: 4. The concept on this is incredibly solid, and it proves an interesting villain. In a darker campaign, it may be used to kill and raise children, as opposed to parents, in order to "protect" them.
Total: 15.

Spoiler: Atalia, the Wight Queen

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Originality: 1. A straight-classed Spellscale Sorcerer. Not original, but can still be interesting.
Power: 4. A sorcerer can have much the same power as a wizard, but the traits are slightly more set in stone.
Elegance: 4. Straight-classed sorcerer, while not original, is something I cannot fault for elegance.
Concept: 2. It doesn't seem to care for undead, as you have written it, and thus does not particularly fit the concept put forth by this competition. Creating lots of them doesn't make them loyal to her, and why they don't devour her while she's still weak is a little beyond me.
Total: 11.

Spoiler: Mal

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Originality: 4. Having the +5 Brass Cajones to put a Blighter in this competition, I respect you for.
Power: 3. Wild Shape is always potent, so this in particular was a given. The blighter's spells aren't all that useful, but they're something. Mother Cyst is always fun.
Elegance: 3. It's definitely fitting with itself, an insane blighter who hunts humans.
Concept: 3. It fits the concept alright. Undead are all well and good, but as a Blighter...? Eh, I'll give it a 3.
Total: 13.

[sakuuya]

Aw yeah, judgement! Thanks, atemu!

Build	Score	Rank
Annabelle	15	1st
Geroldt Brand	13	2nd
Razlyn'susselsathra, the Shadow of Death	13	2nd
Malcanth Woodrue	13	2nd
Atalia, the Wight Queen	11	5th

Now if the 2nd-placers could just have a couple disputes so the scores spread out more...

[illyahr]

Real life is killing my online life. My personal computer kicked out so I'm trying to finish up at my local library. Hopefully, will have mine up in the next few days.

[sakuuya]

Real life is killing my online life. My personal computer kicked out so I'm trying to finish up at my local library. Hopefully, will have mine up in the next few days.

As always, real life is the true villain.

[Gwachitallemall]

Two Disputes!

Spoiler: Razlyn

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Well, a dispute was requested, so, here we go. First off, thank you atemu for being our only judge. These things wouldn't be much fun without any judges. So, without further ado, the judging in question:

Spoiler: Razlyn'susselsathra

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Originality: Again, 4. It seems both a fairly unique concept and interesting to see on paper.
Power: 4. It's a dragon, both capable of inflicting negative levels and with really quite wonderful casting.
Elegance: 2. I like the concept, but DWoC on an Ur-Priest? While it is legal, it is strange.
Concept: 3. It doesn't stick to the concept all that well, in my opinion, because it's not specific enough. One day this creature could pick spells to be a gravekeeper, sure, but it could also pick the right spells to utterly destroy its own horde of dead and undead.
Total: 13.

Originality - Thanks for the 4, I'm happy with that!

Power - I've seen Ur-Priest 10's get 5's in the past, same as Wizard 20's (or at least full casting progression casters), but hey, it's your judging, so I'm not gonna fault you. A 4 is still a solid score for power!

Elegance - While I would have liked to have seen higher than a 2 here, it honestly doesn't surprise me. I thought I was being cheeky getting away with Loredrake (from Eberron) on a Shadow Dragon (predominately Faerun), which is why I included the note about Shadow Dragons' origins. And yeah, DWoC on an Ur-Priest is strange, and I don't think I really explained it very well in my lore.

Concept - Here is where I have a little bit of beef. The competition asks for a "Gravekeeper". It specifically says

Clarification on Concept: This can be any sort of Necromancer, or the like, even an undead. Let your mind roam on this one.

Now, I went with a Tomb-Tainted Soul Shadow Dragon, who deals negative levels with his breath attack, and utilizes metamagic feats to raise his victims as undead minions. After reaching the capstone for this competitions, he is able to do all of this in a Desecrated area, and beefs up his undead minionmancy with the divine side of the house. On top of all of that, the Divine Watchers of Chronepsis, as an organization, live in/around and sometimes guard/tend to graveyards. While a 3 may be a somewhat middle-of-the-road score, I think it deserves to be a little higher.

And if you want to talk about the specifics of being a "Gravekeeper", look no further than my Background section, where I talk about living in a graveyard (two of them, actually) or my Level Breakdown section, which is almost wholly devoted to talking about my necromancer tactics.

Once again, thank you for your time spent judging, even with all the goings on in real life!

Spoiler: Wightapocalypse

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For Atemu:

I'd dispute handing out a 1 on originality based entirely on "What class is this thing", not "What does this thing do". The point of her was entirely to do with being original by creating undead in a new, different way - who would have thought that level draining spells were the way forth? And who would have thought that the best necromancer would have been near enough an evoker? If that doesn't qualify as original, what does?

They don't eat her because she lies to them and tells them it's a bad idea, with her obscenely good bluff modifier. Failing which, check out Command Undead on the second-level spells (of which she gets quite a few). That, ignoring the fact that she doesn't need to control them all any more than she needs to control all humans nearby.

[atemu1234]

Two Disputes!

To the first- I gave you a three. You invested in the concept, but not enough to receive more. Though perhaps Tomb-tainted soul can maybe boost it up by one.

As to the second, that would take lots of consistent bluff checks for a long time. 2 is as high as I'll go on that.

[sakuuya]

To the first- I gave you a three. You invested in the concept, but not enough to receive more. Though perhaps Tomb-tainted soul can maybe boost it up by one.

As to the second, that would take lots of consistent bluff checks for a long time. 2 is as high as I'll go on that.

So did you increase either of these scores based on the disputes? I can't quite tell.

[Telonius]

Looking ahead to the next contest ... I really did like the slight rules change in Contest #3, where Power was changed to Subtlety. What would you all think if we returned to something similar next time, substituting some other attribute for Power? Did "Subtlety" infringe too heavily on "Concept," or did you think it made sense?

[sakuuya]

Looking ahead to the next contest ... I really did like the slight rules change in Contest #3, where Power was changed to Subtlety. What would you all think if we returned to something similar next time, substituting some other attribute for Power? Did "Subtlety" infringe too heavily on "Concept," or did you think it made sense?

I personally enjoyed the change of focus, but it scared judges away. I think it might have been too nebulous a category. If you changed the power score, I would want it to be to something more concrete that can be easily explained.

That said, what I'd really like next round is a concept that favors martial characters. With looser guidelines than the other build competitions, this one has been getting pretty darn caster-heavy.

[Telonius]

Yeah, caster-heavy is always going to be a problem if Power is a component of the scoring. On the other hand I don't want to ban casters altogether, since it might be a really interesting twist on the next concept.

How about:
Originality - is it unexpected?
Build Elegance - is it mechanically pretty?
Competence - can it do what the concept asks of it?
Villainy - is this a villain with style?