Extra Heavy Armor...

[Assassinfox]

Are the extra heavy armors from Races of Stone worth the money and feats to get them?

[Tweekinator]

I've only looked them over a few times, but I'd say no. You'd be much better off if you really want to spend a feat or 2 on heavy armor, to go with Heavy Armor Optimization, and then the greater version. Increases AC and decreases armor check.

[Assassinfox]

That bad, huh?

[JackMage666]

They seem to be more for flavor, cause, while it's not fuctional, it would be pretty cool to see a Dwarf attacking things wearing huge rocks.

[Tweekinator]

The only one that I can see maybe being worth it is the mountain plate. For the feat it will cost you, you'll get one more AC than fullplate with heavy armor optimization if you have no Dex modifier. But it won't let you run and has a ginormous armor check penalty. If it were me, I would go with the fullplate.

[OzymandiasVolt]

It really becomes something of a flavor thing, like Monkey Grip. Sure, there are more efficient options. But if the character calls for ridiculously heavy armor, go for it.

[Person_Man]

Optimizing AC is pretty simple. Wear Mithral Full Plate, and have 16 Dex. If your Dex is lower then 16, buy magic items to boost it to 16. +2 and +4 items are relatively inexpensive. But really any meatshield should just set their Dex to 16 during character creation if at all possible.

Start adding on other small, cheap AC bonuses from amulets, cloaks, boots, etc. Buy an animated shield. Buy a Cloak of Lesser Displacement. Invest ranks in Tumble (even if its cross class).

You really shouldn't waste a feat on exotic armor. You usually only get a very small bump out of it, and there are much, much better feats out there that scale with levels.

[aaron_the_cow]

person man, is right, but not if you low level....

[Assassinfox]

person man, is right, but not if you low level....

If you're low level, you wouldn't be able to afford Battle Plate and Mountain Plate armor.

What if you're playing a low-magic setting without magic items?

[Armads]

Mithral Full Plate is still fine, even if you are in a low-magic setting.

[Assassinfox]

Mithral Full Plate is still fine, even if you are in a low-magic setting.

A low magic setting where mithril doesn't grow on trees.

[Person_Man]

A Duelist can get pretty insanely high AC.

So can a Monk/Deepwarden/Kensai

A Druid can Wildshape into forms with very high AC

An arcane spellcaster can Polymorph into forms with very high AC

Any spellcaster can use spells to get their AC bonus and concealment quite high.

There are a bunch of options in the Tome of Battle as well.

Its also worth mentioning that while respectable AC is important, its much more important to have high Hit Points and Saves.

It’s been my experience over hundreds of combats that I rarely get killed in melee. I’m a very experienced and tactical player. If I'm playing a melee character, I use a reach weapon, Combat Reflexes, Knock-Down, etc. And regardless of my class, if it looks like I’m about to die I retreat (Tumble/Dimension Door) or drink a potion of Invisibility and walk away. Then I heal myself if possible, or just wait for combat to be over.

So if I do get killed, its because of magic. The primary defenses against magic are hit points, Saves, and other magic. So if I’m a non-caster, I always max out my Con and buy items to boost my Saves before I try to get my AC to some sort of insane level.

[Roderick_BR]

Using Battle Plate over Full Plate is pretty much like using a Bastard Sword over a Long Sword. Good only if you have feats to spend.
Mountain plate is terrible. AC 10, alright, but not be able to run (or charge) ruins it, plus, the speed penalty is bigger than a normal heaby armor (15 ft instead of 20 ft for a character with a base speed of 20).
Dwarve's special ability to ignore speed penalty with heavier armor doesn't work with it (says in the armor description), and making it mithrall just lowers the check penalties and rise de maximun dexterity to +2 (the base being +0) It doesn't affect size or speed.
Myself, I'd house rule that making it mithral would at least make it similar to a normal full plate.
Heavy plate (normal heavy armor, not exotic) is good if you have no dex bonus, or a maximum of +2 if you get it in mithral.

I'm thinking, however, to make a cleric dwarf with that, plus reach metamagic, to become a real "healing cannon."
If I add some Dwarf Defenders levels, I don't lose much from it. I could add a flying carpet to move from a place to another when not fighing, but I need to see the max weight first.
Still debating the idea, though.

[Assassinfox]

So... bottom line:

Extremely Heavy Armor = Bad.

Oh, well.

[Annarrkkii]

I would absolutely love to see these implemented in a low-magic setting. They would definitely be cool there. Or in a game world with no mithral. Which I really, really want to see made.

Hordes of dwarven Knights wearing Mountain Plate, led by deepstone sentinels... bracing themselves in a line, with longspear's set against charging foes...

It would be awesome. Especially when you add in the pure awesomeness that would be using Tactical Strike and White Raven Tactics to sneak the line forward on the commanders turns...

It would be like Mech Wars!

But yeah. In a normal or high magic campaign, with lots of special materials and magic items available, burning a feat on big, penalty-rich armor is just not worth it.

[OzymandiasVolt]

Know what's fun? THORIUM mountain plate. Unless you're a caster. I'm sure the 120% ASF would do bad things.

[Annarrkkii]

Why not go ahead and make it Osmium.

120% would be rough. How exactly would that extra 20% manifest itself, I wonder? Every turn, you have a 20% chance to just lose a spell, as if you had tried and failed to cast it?