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Thread: Sane Magic Item Prices
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2015-06-26, 08:33 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Sane Magic Item Prices
The price tables below have been compiled into an excellent pdf by Inconnunom.
Let's talk about flying items. There are a few items which give the ability to fly in the 5e DMG. Among the first I came across were the Winged Boots and the Broom of Flying. The Boots give a fly speed equal to your walking speed for 4 hours per day divisible into 1 minute chunks while the broom gives you a flat 50 foot fly speed all day long, decreasing to 30 feet if you are particularly heavy. Both are clearly very powerful, if you've got two sides in a combat one of which can fly and one of which can't the flying side has a huge advantage. If the other side also has no good ranged attacks the flying team more or less wins automatically. Yet both the Boots and the Broom are uncommon, they only cost 500 gold, pretty much any adventurer who decides they want one should be able to get their hands on one if they really want to.
Right under the Winged Boots are the Wings of Flying. The Wings give you a fly speed of 60 feet for one hour but then require a 1d12 hour cooldown period after each use before they can be activated again. Again, a pretty powerful item, but probably less useful than either the Broom or the Boots for most practical purposes. The higher move speed will occasionally pay off, but usually the ability to fly whenever you want will win out in terms of practical utility. At most, it's definitely not better than either the Broom or the Boots. The Wings of Flying are a rare item. They are worth 5,000 gold, 10 times what the boots or broom are worth.
The next item I found was the boots of levitation. These boots let you use levitate as the spell at will. Levitate moves you straight up or down only. It can never move you more than 20 feet off the ground or more than 20 feet up or down at a time. It has a similar weight limit to the Broom. It consumes your Concentration slot. You can't use it for longer than 10 minutes on end without returning to the ground. The boots of levitation are rare items. They are worth 5,000 gold, just like the Wings of Flying. 10 times more than the Winged Boots or the Broom.
The next item I found was the potion of flying. The potion of flying gives a fly speed equal to your walk speed the same as the Winged Boots do. It lasts one hour like the Wings of Flying, and can only be used once ever. The potion of flying is Very Rare. It is worth 50,000. 100 times what an item that gives precisely the same effect 4 times every single day forever does.
When the red mists had receded and I was once again able to speak in words other than the incoherent babblings of a shattered mind, I set about fixing this.
DM README
Your world need not sell the magic items for the prices given below. Your world does not even need to sell the magic items below at all. The primary purpose of the tables below is to establish the relative price of magic items so that you can have a reasonably sane economy and/or so that you can quickly eyeball how much the swag you're giving your players is worth. You are free to modify the prices as you will, just be sure to tell your players that you are doing so in advance to the game start.
The items are divided into a few different lists for your convenience. The lists are as follows:
- Consumables are items that are used some set amount of times (usually once) and then are gone.
- Combat Items are items that primarily make the user better at killing things. Some also have other killing-unrelated effects, but these are not the primary source of their utility.
- Noncombat Items are items that primarily make the user better at solving problems in a killing-unrelated manner. Some also make the user better at killing things, but this is not the primary source of their utility.
- Summoning Items are items that summon creatures to kill things or solve problems for you.
- Gamechanging Items are items that can have major effects on the way the players engage with the world or that can resculpt the campaign world in some major way all on their own. They are not necessarily overpowered, but the GM should take a look at them to make sure that the items they allow are compatible with the sort of game and world they want to create.
Each is discussed further in their own section. By adjusting the prices of the various lists, the GM can make it easier or harder to get their hands on various types of problem solving abilities.
Again, the prices below are not absolute. The GM may adjust the prices of items individually or by list, they may make any item available or not, they may say that magic items can't be sold for gold at all and that the below prices only roughly estimate value when people are trading magic items for other magic items or they may even not show these tables to their PCs at all and just use them to estimate treasure values. The below lists are intended as a tool, not an imposition on your campaign world.Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-21 at 01:02 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:34 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Consumables
Consumables represent all items that can be used up when used in their intended manner. By default, consumables are somewhere around one tenth the price of an equivalent permanent item. The scroll prices below represent a typical scroll of that level. Scrolls with significant direct value, such as scrolls of fabricate or wish, may be priced differently.
Special Costs:Item Price(gp) Spell Scroll Level 0 10 Ammunition +1(each) 25 Potion of Healing 50 Quaal's Feather Token Anchor 50 Spell Scroll Level 1 60 Philter of Love 90 Ammunition +2(ea) 100 Potion of Poison 100 Dust of Dryness(1 pellet) 120 Elixir of Health 120 Keoghtom's Ointment(Per dose) 120 Spell Scroll Level 2 120 Potion of Fire Breath 150 Potion of Greater Healing 150 Potion of Climbing 180 Potion of Heroism 180 Potion of Invisibility 180 Potion of Mind Reading 180 Potion of Water Breathing 180 Scroll of Protection 180 Nolzur's Marvelous Pigments 200 Potion of Animal Friendship 200 Spell Scroll Level 3 200 Quaal's Feather Token Fan 250 Quaal's Feather Token Whip 250 Potion of Diminution 270 Potion of Growth 270 Dust of Disappearance 300 Necklace of Fireballs(One bead) 300 Potion of Gaseous Form 300 Potion of Resistance 300 Universal Solvent 300 Spell Scroll Level 4 320 Ammunition +3(ea) 400 Potion of Speed 400 Sovereign Glue 400 Horn of Blasting 450 Potion of Superior Healing 450 Dust of Sneezing and Choking 480 Necklace of Fireballs(Two beads) 480 Oil of Slipperiness 480 Potion of Flying 500 Arrow of Slaying(ea) 600 Spell Scroll Level 5 640 Bead of Force 960 Elemental Gem 960 Necklace of Fireballs(Three beads) 960 Potion of Clairvoyance 960 Potion of Vitality 960 Spell Scroll Level 6 1280 Potion of Supreme Healing 1350 Chime of Opening 1500 Necklace of Fireballs(Four beads) 1600 Oil of Etherealness 1920 Ioun Stone Absorption 2400 Spell Scroll Level 7 2560 Quaal's Feather Token Bird 3000 Quaal's Feather Token Swan Boat 3000 Oil of Sharpness 3200 Necklace of Fireballs(Five beads) 3840 Potion of Invulnerability 3840 Gem of Brightness 5000 Spell Scroll Level 8 5120 Deck of Illusions 6120 Necklace of Fireballs(Six beads) 7680 Spell Scroll Level 9 10240 Ioun Stone Greater Absorption 31000 Rod of Absorption 50000 Talisman of Ultimate Evil 61440 Talisman of Pure Good 71680
Robe of Useful items - Cost of contained items multiplied by 5Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-12 at 01:14 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:35 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Combat items
Combat items are primarily good for killing things. A few have other uses as well, like the luckstone or the Ioun Stone Mastery, but their biggest effect is making their owner better at killing or not getting killed. Increase the price of these items if you want your players mostly getting oddball magic items that don't interact much at all with combat. All items which are weapons or armor add the cost of the base weapon or armor that makes them up to their price.
Item Price(gp) Vicious Weapon 350 Adamantine Armor 500 Mithral Armor 800 +1 Weapon 1000 Sword of Life-Stealing 1000 Ioun Stone Protection 1200 Wand of the War Mage +1 1200 Bracers of Archery 1500 Circlet of Blasting 1500 Javelin of Lightning 1500 Prayer Bead - Smiting 1500 Wind Fan 1500 Sword of Sharpness 1700 Staff of the Adder 1800 Dancing Sword 2000 Glamoured Studded Leather 2000 Pipes of the Sewers 2000 Prayer Bead - Bless 2000 Saddle of the Cavalier 2000 Sword of Wounding 2000 Frost Brand 2200 Dagger of Venom 2500 Gloves of Missile Snaring 3000 Ioun Stone Agility 3000 Ioun Stone Fortitude 3000 Ioun Stone Insight 3000 Ioun Stone Intellect 3000 Ioun Stone Leadership 3000 Ioun Stone Strength 3000 Staff of Withering 3000 Cloak of Protection 3500 Oathbow 3500 Ring of Protection 3500 +2 Weapon 4000 Boots of Speed 4000 Dragon Scale Mail 4000 Elven Chain 4000 Ioun Stone Regeneration 4000 Iron Bands of Bilarro 4000 Prayer Bead - Curing 4000 Rope of Entanglement 4000 Wand of Enemy Detection 4000 Luckstone 4200 Wand of the War Mage +2 4800 Flame Tongue 5000 Periapt of Wound Closure 5000 Ring of Evasion 5000 Ring of the Ram 5000 Tentacle Rod 5000 Animated Shield 6000 Armor of Resistance 6000 Arrow-Catching Shield 6000 Belt of Dwarvenkind 6000 Bracers of Defense 6000 Ioun Stone Reserve 6000 Pearl of Power 6000 Pipes of Haunting 6000 Ring of Resistance 6000 Robe of Scintillating Colors 6000 Scimitar of Speed 6000 Shield of Missile Attraction 6000 Giant Slayer 7000 Mace of Smiting 7000 Brooch of Shielding 7500 Amulet of Health 8000 Dragon Slayer 8000 Gauntlets of Ogre Power 8000 Headband of Intellect 8000 Mace of Disruption 8000 Mace of Terror 8000 Nine Lives Stealer(Fully Charged) 8000 Wand of Magic Missiles 8000 Wand of Web 8000 Staff of Thunder and Lightning 10000 Wand of Binding 10000 Wand of Fear 10000 Ioun Stone Awareness 12000 Rod of the Pact Keeper +1 12000 Staff of Charming 12000 Sunblade 12000 Staff of Healing 13000 Ring of Shooting Stars 14000 Ioun Stone Mastery 15000 +3 Weapon 16000 Hammer of Thunderbolts 16000 Rod of the Pact Keeper +2 16000 Staff of Fire 16000 Staff of Swarming Insects 16000 Wand of Paralysis 16000 Ring of Fire Elemental Command 17000 Dwarven Thrower 18000 Wand of the War Mage +3 19200 Efreeti Chain 20000 Ring of Free Action 20000 Sentinel Shield 20000 Staff of Striking 21000 Ring of Spell Storing 24000 Vorpal Sword 24000 Ring of Water Elemental Command 25000 Rod of Alertness 25000 Staff of Frost 26000 Instrument of the Bards - Fochulan Bandlore 26500 Instrument of the Bards - Mac-Fuirmidh Cittern 27000 Rod of Lordly Might 28000 Rod of the Pact Keeper +2 28000 Instrument of the Bards - Doss Lute 28500 Instrument of the Bards - Canaith Mandolin 30000 Mantle of Spell Resistance 30000 Ring of Spell Turning 30000 Prayer Bead - Favor 32000 Wand of Fireballs 32000 Wand of Lightning Bolts 32000 Wand of Polymorph 32000 Instrument of the Bards - Cli Lyre 35000 Scarab of Protection 36000 Sword of Answering 36000 Staff of the Woodlands 44000 Spellguard Shield 50000 Cloak of Displacement 60000 Robe of Stars 60000 Weapon of Warning 60000 Prayer Bead - Wind Walking 96000 Instrument of the Bards - Anstruth Harp 109000 Instrument of the Bards - Ollamh Harp 125000 Prayer Bead - Summons 128000 Holy Avenger 165000 Spoiler: Discount NotesA few items could be useful for lower level characters in theory, but have high prices due to their usefulness to high level characters. Alternate versions are presented here for the GM who wants to use them.
Ring of shooting stars: A version of this item where the areas of the shooting stars cannot be overlapped would cost only 4000 gold.
Wands of Magic Missiles/Lightning Bolts/Fireballs: A version of one of these items that can't use multiple charges to cast at higher levels would cost 3000 for magic missiles and 8000 for lightning bolts or fireballs.
Instruments of the bards: Cost 20,000 gold less without the ability to grant disadvantage on saves against charm effects.
Rod of the pact Keeper: Rods which grant a warlock spell slot of a fixed level rather than whatever level you happen to have cost less.
Rods limited to 1st level cost 3000/7000/19000 for +1/+2/+3
Rods limited to 2nd level cost 4000/8000/20000 for +1/+2/+3
Rods limited to 3rd level cost 6000/10000/22000 for +1/+2/+3
Rods limited to 4th level cost 9000/13000/24000 for +1/+2/+3Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-20 at 05:32 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:37 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Noncombat Items
Noncomat items give some sort of problem-solving ability not directly related to combat. Some, like the Eversmoking Bottle and the Boots of Levitation are also useful in combat, but that isn't where the bulk of their utility comes from. Increase the price of these items if you'd rather have your players resort to combat more predictably instead of coming up with complicated schemes that avoid direct fighting.
Item Price(gp) Helm of Comprehend Languages 500 Driftglobe 750 Trident of Fish Command 800 Cap of Water Breathing 1000 Eversmoking Bottle 1000 Quiver of Ehlonna 1000 Ioun Stone Sustenance 1000 Ring of Warmth 1000 Goggles of Night 1500 Horseshoes of the Zephyr 1500 Mariner's Armor 1500 Necklace of Adaption 1500 Ring of Water Walking 1500 Wand of Magic Detection 1500 Wand of Secrets 1500 Gloves of Swimming and Climbing 2000 Heward's Handy Haversack 2000 Rope of Climbing 2000 Ring of Feather Falling 2000 Boots of Elvenkind 2500 Eyes of Minute Seeing 2500 Eyes of the Eagle 2500 Ring of Jumping 2500 Dimensional Shackles 3000 Eyes of Charming 3000 Medallion of Thoughts 3000 Ring of Swimming 3000 Bag of Holding 4000 Boots of Levitation 4000 Ring of Animal Influence 4000 Boots of Striding and Springing 5000 Cloak of Arachnida 5000 Cloak of Elvenkind 5000 Gloves of Thievery 5000 Hat of Disguise 5000 Horseshoes of Speed 5000 Immovable Rod 5000 Lantern of Revealing 5000 Periapt of Health 5000 Periapt of Proof Against Poison 5000 Slippers of Spider Climbing 5000 Cloak of the Bat 6000 Cloak of the Manta Ray 6000 Ring of X-Ray Vision 6000 Cape of the Mountebank 8000 Portable Hole 8000 Apparatus of Kwalish 10000 Boots of the Winterlands 10000 Folding Boat 10000 Ring of Invisibility 10000 Helm of Telepathy 12000 Cube of Force 16000 Ring of Mind Shielding 16000 Rod of Rulership 16000 Mirror of Life Trapping 18000 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 20000 Robe of Eyes 30000 Gem of Seeing 32000 Plate Armor of Etherealness 48000 Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-12 at 01:02 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:38 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Summoning Items
Summoning items give their users shiny new friends to help them destroy their enemies or solve problems. With the exception of the Onyx dog, the Silver Raven and the Ivory Goat of Terror, the value of these items is heavily dependent on how expensive mercenaries are in your campaign world. The basic rules makes hiring even quite competent allies startlingly cheap, and while these items aren't based on the ridiculous 2 gp/day rule, they do assume that hiring combat ready minions is a relatively cheap activity that most players will be doing a little bit of if the situation warrants it. Adjust the below prices accordingly if this is not true in your campaign world.
Item Price(gp) Ivory Goat(Travail) 400 Golden Lion(ea) 600 Ivory Goat(Traveling) 1000 Staff of the Python 2000 Onyx Dog 3000 Silver Raven 5000 Silver Horn of Valhalla 5600 Marble Elephant 6000 Bowl of Commanding Water Elementals 8000 Brazier of Commanding Fire Elementals 8000 Censer of Controlling Air Elementals 8000 Stone of Controlling Earth Elementals 8000 Brass Horn of Valhalla 8400 Bronze Horn of Valhalla 11200 Iron Horn of Valhalla 14000 Ivory Goat(Terror) 20000
Gamechanging Items
Gamechanging items significantly impact either the gameworld as a whole or the sort of things that are capable of challenging their holders. I don't really see either of these as a problem, but they may not fit with some campaigns or some settings, so the DM should take a careful look at the items on this list and decide whether or not they are allowed.
Item Price(gp) +1 Armor 1500 +1 Shield 1500 Sending Stones 2000 Wings of Flying 5000 Alchemy Jug 6000 +2 Armor 6000 +2 Shield 6000 Ebony Fly 6000 Bronze Griffon 8000 Broom of Flying 8000 Serpentine Owl 8000 Winged Boots 8000 Dwarven Plate 9000 Potion of Longevity 9000 Carpet of Flying 12000 Ring of Regeneration 12000 Sphere of Annihilation 15000 Armor of Invulnerability 18000 Talisman of the Sphere 20000 +3 Armor 24000 +3 Shield 24000 Defender 24000 Ring of Earth Elemental Command 31000 Robe of the Archmagi 34000 Ring of Air Elemental Command 35000 Cubic Gate 40000 Crystal Ball 50000 Helm of Teleportation 64000 Daern's Instant Fortress 75000 Ring of Telekinesis 80000 Cloak of Invisibility 80000 Rod of Security 90000 Staff of Power 95500 Obsidian Steed 128000 Decanter of Endless Water 135000 Amulet of the Planes 160000 Spoiler: Why Items are on this List
The +X armors and shields, dwarven plate, defender, staff of power and robe of the archmagi all allow the user to boost their AC out of the range of bounded accuracy. Enough AC and a character becomes functionally immune to low level checks on their ability to run rampant, like the town guard or small armies. This sort of thing is possible using items not on this list, but it requires significantly more investment in terms of the player's attunement slots. Characters eventually growing up to the point where they don't care about low level NPCs isn't a bad thing, but it doesn't fit all campaigns.
The armor of invulnerability is on this list for about the same reason.
All items that grant either flying or a flying mount are on the list for a similar reason, though they obsolete enemies without flying or a strong ranged attack rather than low level nonmagical enemies.
The Cloak of invisibility likewise obsoletes enemies that can't see invisible things.
The Helm of Teleportation, Amulet of Planes and Cubic Gate are here because they essentially obsolete any quest involving travel times, and in the later cases many quests involving things being on another plane. Additionally, they give an almost absurdly strong panic button to the holder.
Sending Stones and the Crystal ball are here because of their impact on the world, both massively change the rate of travel of information, and the latter doubles as an extremely potent knowledge gathering tool in PC hands, which bears looking into for that reason alone.
The Alchemy Jug, Decanter of Endless Water, Sphere of Annihilation and Ring of Telekinesis are here for their massive effect on the economy. All three can potentially make a profit that dwarfs their listed price if used in a clever enough manner over a long timespan.
The Potion of Longevity are here for medical reasons which should be fairly clear.
Daern's Instant Fortress potentially has a huge impact on grand military strategy.Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-08-28 at 06:39 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:39 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
The exact process of crafting magic items varies widely from campaign to campaign and sometimes from item to item. It's up to the GM to determine whether crafting of magic items is allowed at all, and if it is allowed, the process by which it is performed. Some standard options are listed below, which the GM may choose to use or not. The options below are divided into two categories, initial requirements which must be met to craft the items at all and the actual process of crafting the item. The GM may apply any number of requirements, including adding new ones if they would like to and may set any process they prefer. However, these decisions should typically be made prior to game start and only changed if the options selected are presenting a major problem for the group or the setting.
Tool Requirement - In order to craft a magic item,the character must be proficient in a tool relevant to the construction of the magic item's base form. For example, a fighter wanting to create a Scimitar of Speed would need proficiency in Smith's tools, while a cleric wanting to make some Boots of Striding and Springing would need proficiency in cobbler's tools or leather worker's tools.
Feat Requirement - In order to craft a magic item, the character must select the ability to do so as a feat. At the GM's discretion, some other expenditure of resources could be allowed, such as trading out a background benefit.
Spellcasting Requirement - In order to craft a magic item, the character must be able to cast spells, including all spells that the item itself is capable of casting.
Recipe Requirement - In order to craft a magic item, the character must possess some sort of recipe. Typically, recipes will cost ten times what the item itself does, though this can vary widely from setting to setting. In some, researching recipes may be hugely expensive with a price on the final product to match, in others it may be so cheap as to be nearly free with the system mainly being there to prevent the desert dwelling druid who's never seen a river in their entire life randomly knowing how to make caps of water breathing.
Level Requirement - In order to craft a magic item, the character must be of a certain level or spellcasting level. A reasonably conservative set of recommended levels are included in the spoiler below(These will likely need to be adjusted if you adjust item prices). Alternately, the items could each be priced individually rather than by price range.
SpoilerFor consumables:
Level required|Cost of item
1|0-90
3|91-180
5|181-300
7|301-500
9|501-1000
11|1001-2000
13|2001-5000
15|5001-9000
17|9001+
For permanent items:
Level required|Cost of item
3|0-1500
5|1501-3000
7|3001-5000
9|5000-9000
11|9001-18000
13|18001-30000
15|30001-79999
17|80000+
Gold per Day - The character, through various complicated and arcane means, creates a certain value in magic items per day of downtime spent crafting. Items which cost more than the player can craft in a day can be crafted across many days, with the amounts crafted adding up linearly, though the GM may rule that diminishing returns decrease the production of particularly massive groups. Typically, they will also have to pay some amount of gold per day while doing so. Multiple crafters increase the amount crafted per day linearly. Some options for this are listed below.
SpoilerTraditional: Each day spent crafting, the character creates 25 gold worth of magic items and pays 25 gold in costs.
Standard: Each day spent crafting, the character creates magic items worth 25 gold multiplied by their proficiency bonus. They must expend the same amount in materials per day. At their option, the character may instead craft 5 gold worth of magic items per day by paying only 2.5 gold per day in materials.
Fast: Each day spent crafting, the character creates 50 gold worth of magic items and pays 50 gold in costs. Both the amount crafted per day and the amount payed in costs is doubled at levels 5, 9, 13 and 17.
Special Ingredients - Magic items require some special ingredient to be created which is held in common between them, such as magic gems, elemental essences, pure hope or dragonshards. Unlike gold, multiple smaller ingredients can't be combined to form larger ingredients, nor can larger ingredients be broken down into multiple smaller ingredients. This is a good option for DMs who want the players to be able to do some basic item crafting, but would prefer for big ticket items to be entirely off the table unless specifically placed in the world. Generally, ingredients will have a "value" which determines the maximum price of item they may be used to craft on the above tables, though this value is not necessarily the same as what that shard or an item made using it will sell for on an open market. Ingredients may also have some further restrictions on what sorts of items they may be used to construct. At the GM's discretion, crafters may be able to disassemble items to recover their ingredients. The exact amount of time it takes to craft an item using an ingredient is up to the GM, typically it will take either however long it would take to craft that magic item using the gold per days rule or however long it would take to craft a mundane version of that item using the mundane crafting rules. An example for the world of Eberron is shown below.
Spoiler
Permanent magic items are made using Dragonshards. Dragonshards come in three types, Eberron, Siberys and Khyber. All permanent items require at least one dragonshard of a specific type with a value equal to or greater than the value of the item. Generally, only lower valued shards and the items made using them are available for a price in gold pieces equal to their value. Higher valued shards do exist in the economy, but they have major industrial applications which generally put them out of the reach of all but the wealthiest of individual buyers. Dragonshards may come in any value and they may be recovered from items unless the GM rules otherwise. Dragonshards of any type can be used to create magic items with very simple effects, like +1 weapons or circlets of blasting.
Consumables are created using the Gold per Day rules.
Players Choose Loot - A character can craft magic items by informing their GM that they wish to do so and going on some sort of quest to gather the materials needed to do so(The exact nature of these ingredients does not actually matter). The rate and frequency at which these items may be created is controlled by the GM. This is a good option for players and GMs who mutually trust one another not to abuse the system even in the absence of well defined rules for how the process works and who have common standards about what rate of magic item acquisition is reasonable. If you are not certain that this is true, avoid this system. An example is shown below.
SpoilerThe Barbarian Bronor wants to make a Flame Tongue Sword. Bronor's player talks to the GM about this and the GM, thinking that that is a reasonable sort of item for Bronor to have given how long it has been since he has last gotten a magic item, designs an adventure for the party. Next Session, Bronor and his party delve deep into the underdark to forge a sword of solid iron in a forge heated with the molten stone of the earth below, fighting off drow and giant spiders as they do so. The session ends as the party hunts down a Fire Elemental so that Bronor might plunge the sword into the Elemental's heart, stealing its fires.
Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-02 at 12:42 PM.
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2015-06-26, 08:41 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Changes
7/14/2015 - Potion of Longevity price increased to 9000
Spoiler: Items that Won't be pricedCandle of Invocation: Because we've learned a thing or two from 3.5
Deck of Many Things: Because lolrandom
Efreeti Bottle: Because Wishes
Iron flask: Because wishes
Ring of Three Wishes: Because Wishes
Luck Blade: Because Wishes
Well of Many Worlds: Because if the GM wants you to have a TARDIS you'll have one and if they don't you won't
Wand of Wonder: Because lolrandom
Ring of Djinni Summoning: It's pretty much everything from the gamechanging list in a single item. I can't see anyone selling these.
Bag of Tricks: Creating permanent living creatures does absolutley silly things to the economy.
Tome of the Stilled Tongue: No wizard would ever sell this.
Manuals and tomes +2: If these come up, the GM is probably giving them to the whole party as a "level up" type thing
Belt of giant Strength: breaks bounded Accuracy
Potion of Giant Strength:breaks bounded accuracy
Rod of Resurrection: Plot device
Helm of Brilliance: Lolrandom
Bag of Beans: Lolrandom (Seriously, it summons mummy lords with treasure filled crypts)
Staff of the Magi: Too much power
Manual of Golems: This is a blueprint, not an item. Use whatever rules go into pricing blueprints for your campaign and adjust the golem crafting prices as needed.
Cursed items
The lists in handy-dandy .ods format for those who want it(Last updated 7/19/2015)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3t18dm2eeu...tems2.ods?dl=0
That should be all I need, tables will be posted as I convert them from my ODS sheet to forum tables. Have at it. And do tell me if you think something is priced wrong, some of these are very much eyeballed.Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-20 at 12:15 AM.
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2015-06-27, 12:03 AM (ISO 8601)Dwarf in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
You may want to come up with some random treasure tables as well. In building my campaigns, the rolls that the group have gotten (every one random) has led to some of the players hording over 150 platinum pieces, all before level five. That might not be the case for everyone, however, because my players have the most amazing luck for treasure rolls (and we love randomness).
First thing I notice is your are definitely correct about the flying items--why the heck is a potion of flying 100 times more expensive than the broom of flying.
The setting I'm running is the Pathfinder setting, so I've been considering lowering the magic item costs to better fit the lore of the setting, but I also think the crafting rules need to be changed. I'd say that creating of any kind requires more proficiencies--not just the tools, but also the type of crafting you know how to do.
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2015-06-27, 12:26 AM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Yes! These all make sense!!!!!!!!! Thank you :D
Last edited by DracoKnight; 2015-06-27 at 12:41 AM.
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2015-06-27, 09:16 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I'll put random tables on my to-do list. They're not really my thing, but I'll see what I can come up with.
Originally Posted by Inchoroi
The prices here were actually calibrated for Eberron, they should work fine for a high-magic setting like Golarion. I actually plan to offer a few different options for the magic items system, soy you should have some variety to pick from when I get there. What do you mean by more proficiencies, exactly? Do you want something like a blueprint system?
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2015-06-27, 12:38 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Your spell scrolls are lower than 3.X at lower levels. I don't think they should go lower than 3.X.
My prices: 50,150,350,850,1800,4500, 7400, 14000, 25000. I got these numbers by averaging 3.X and 5e's magic items prices and then dividing by 2 for consumables.
I do like your higher end numbers, but I think your lower end numbers are too low. I'd also suggest putting them in their own table for easier comprehension.Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-27 at 01:26 PM.
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2015-06-27, 01:00 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I had been considering tweaking the lower end scroll prices up a bit. Not for any reason having to do with either 3.X or 4e(neither of which is really that relevant), but just because they seemed a bit cheap compared to things like vials of acid. I'll think about it and maybe update them in a bit.
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2015-06-27, 01:01 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Keoghtom's Ointment: You've priced it at 100. It heals for 2d8+2 (11 avg) and cures poison and disease. A potion of Healing (4d4+4 - average 14) sells for 150. That doesn't make sense.
Also you should label your potions of healing per DMG 187-188.Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-27 at 01:03 PM.
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2015-06-27, 01:09 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I find all of your prices incredibly low in comparison to the 3.X scale and more importantly Deconstructing 5e: Typical wealth by level.
You should be basing your prices on the expected gold based on 5e tables. What you have is much too low on nearly everything imo. It should nearly all be doubled or trippled to match the calculations done.
One thing you'll notice: If you were to make that 5e table linear its very close to both the 3.5 and PF WBL tables.Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-27 at 01:25 PM.
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2015-06-27, 01:49 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I actually did see those tables and use them. One thing you'll notice if you look at the tables in detail is that prior to level 18, the 5e characters have less wealth than the Pathfinder characters by a factor of 3 or 4. At level 18 this does start to change, but honestly I'm perfectly fine with level 18+ characters having pretty much whatever magic items they want, the system isn't balanced towards that level range in particular, it's balanced towards the other 17 levels. Originally Posted by Kryx
Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-06-27 at 01:50 PM.
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2015-06-27, 01:58 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Potion of Animal Friendship: You've priced this at 100. Scroll users can pay 40gp for it. It should be double the cost for non magic users to use spells imo. I'd argue for 150-200% more, depending on spell.
You should do the same for Gaseous form - I suggest 150% more.
Potion of Diminution - I suggest 200% more due to the lack of concentration requirement.Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-27 at 02:07 PM.
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2015-06-27, 02:57 PM (ISO 8601)Barbarian in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Agree with Kryx that the costs are too low, especially for low level stuff - you should never dip below PF and 3.5e Prices, as magic is massively rarer in 5e.
Also try not to forget that an item that allows you to reproduce a spell should always be more expensive (2x the price in 35/pf) than the scroll for that spell, since it allows you to ignore the requirements of a scroll. depending on how nice you want to be towards non-casters, 150-200% of the scroll price should be appropriate.
There's also a good argument to be made that items involving 6+level spells should be significantly (but not massively) more expensive due to how restricted spell slots for those spells are.
(You already do this to an extent)Last edited by kkplx; 2015-06-27 at 02:59 PM.
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2015-06-27, 05:12 PM (ISO 8601)Dwarf in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
For Pathfinder's system, they use feats to gain the ability to craft certain items; what I thought of first was requiring a character to become proficient in a specific type of crafting--for example, you have to be proficient in, say, enchanting tools and Craft: Wands in order to craft a wand, or proficiency in calligrapher's tools and Craft: Scrolls to make a scroll (along with being able to cast the spell, of course). Originally Posted by Saidoro
I'd also say that having the crafting rules state that not necessarily the crafter himself has to be able to cast the spell, but someone has to be casting it, meaning another party member, or, possibly, hiring someone to do so while you craft it. Makes it a bit more interesting, and hopefully tries to prevent the "Craft Slave" character concept from becoming a thing (which I hate).
One thing that I've just started wondering...
How does 5e's magic item costs compare to earlier editions, especially 2e--one thing my group has noticed (and I have as well) is the similarities to 2e, so it makes me wonder if they're a throw back to those prices, rather than the Christmas Tree Effect of 3.5/PF/4e.
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2015-06-27, 08:17 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
One thing I noticed is that most--if not all--of the mundane equipment weights and prices are exactly the same as the 3.x equipment. Not sure what that implies, but I found it interesting.
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2015-06-28, 02:41 AM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Several items from the PHB are missing: Oil, Healer's Kit, Ball bearings, Caltrops, Hunting Trap, Acid, Holy Water, Alchemist's Fire, Antitoxin, etc.
Also poisons from the DMG (those have a price listed already and give a great baseline - which is much closer to 3.X than your numbers are).
Items based on spells which should be between 150-200% of the appropriate level spell:
Potion of Animal Friendship 150%
Potion of Resistance 150%
Potion of Mind Reading 150%
Potion of Invisibility 150%
Potion of Diminution 220% (duration and no concentration)
Potion of Growth 220% (duration and no concentration)
Potion of Water Breathing 150%
Potion of Clairvoyance 150%
Potion of Gaseous Form 150%
Potion of Flying 150%
Necklace of Fireballs (One bead) 160% for scaling aspect
Potion of Speed 200% (no concentration)
Oil of Slipperiness 150%
Elemental Gem 150%
Oil of Etherealness 150%
In case anyone wants to see my version:
My prices for consumables
(though I made a few alterations - removed ammo. Removed bless from potion of heroism)Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-28 at 03:34 AM.
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2015-06-28, 10:45 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Allright, I've tweaked the low level consumable prices a bit, they now deviate somewhat from the formula used by the higher level items but should be a bit less cheap.
I'll put that down as an option. Originally Posted by Inchoroi
I don't really know anything about 2e's system, I've never played a 2e game. That being said, the main thing working against the christmas tree effect is the attunement rule.
Okay, I'm going to have to disagree with some of these. Originally Posted by Kryx
Potion of flying demands a higher price both for its greater duration and its lack of concentration.
Necklace of fireballs absolutely does not have a price which works like that. A necklace with a number of beads that can make a fireball of a certain level costs as much as a potion of that level. That's it.
Oil of etherealness is discounted significantly because its long application time takes away a key application of the etherealness spell: its use as an escape route.
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2015-06-28, 04:51 PM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
100% agreed. I had it higher earlier, must've made a mistake. I'll switch to 250% based on my scroll prices is 875g. Originally Posted by Saidoro
I don't understand. My percentage suggestion was for 1 bead. 160% of the price of a scroll of fireball for 1 bead. Originally Posted by Saidoro
I missed that. Ya, the price should be lower, but the item seems to be less about escape and more about bypassing encounters/plot. I would say 125% of a scroll price, personally. Originally Posted by Saidoro
I actually think the default pricing shouldn't be significantly more than scrolls. Maybe 120% would be better for options for martials.Last edited by Kryx; 2015-06-28 at 05:12 PM.
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2015-06-28, 06:27 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
There's no reason to charge them extra for a functionality that the single bead all on its own doesn't actually have. Originally Posted by Kryx
Yeah, I'm not putting the oil equal to or greater than the price of a scroll of etherealness. While it does maintain a significant amount of its utility, it easily loses enough that scroll for potion is a bad trade in most groups.I missed that. Ya, the price should be lower, but the item seems to be less about escape and more about bypassing encounters/plot. I would say 125% of a scroll price, personally.
They were at 125 % when I started and you called for an increase. They are currently at 150%.I actually think the default pricing shouldn't be significantly more than scrolls. Maybe 120% would be better for options for martials.
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2015-06-29, 09:48 AM (ISO 8601)Ogre in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I called for an increase in pricing in general, but then later suggested the higher amount because it was the standard before. Originally Posted by Saidoro
I now think the standard should be lower so martials can have fun utility items as well. It's only a set amount of them, so no biggie.
BTW thanks for doing this. I've split mine off from your lower price choices, but I am very appreciative that you started it and motivated me to do it as well. :)
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2015-07-01, 06:54 PM (ISO 8601)Barbarian in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Oh, how long have I been searching for something like this!
Question though, how did you come up with these prices? What sort of math or logic did you implement?
I ask because a vorpal sword is legendary and its 24,000gp. Considering the crap ton of gold the tables start giving out around the teens, it seems like it would be super easy to come up with this much to grab a couple of vorps, which seems off.
I just want to know how you did it so I can understand it so I can use it properly.
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2015-07-01, 07:27 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
I used this table to set the upper end prices.
If you're using magic item shops, the assumption is that around levels 15 to 17 you should pretty much hit the peak of raw power with three or four really good items, and then more or less ascend into godhood and get whatever items you want over the last three with the bulk of the growth being in the ability to trade swap in new stuff as needed. At lower levels people have more of a choice between investing in single awesome items and handfuls of merely useful ones.
In unrelated news, crafting stuff is now up.Last edited by Saidoro; 2015-07-01 at 07:35 PM.
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2015-07-03, 12:41 AM (ISO 8601)Barbarian in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
This will be quite useful. Thanks for making it.
I figure I should help some if I can, so I'll try to suggest some prices for items on your to-do list.
Wand of Fireballs/Lightning Bolts: ~26000
Reasoning: This is in between the Staff of Fire, and the Wand of Polymorph, which are less powerful and more powerful, respectively. I would put these at about the same power level as the Staff of Frost, which is why I suggest the same price.
Wand of Magic Missiles: 8000
Reasoning: The Wand of Web costs 8000, and it's a 2nd level spell. A wand of a first level spell (which can be cast at higher levels for more charges) seems to be about equivalent in value to me. If anything, 8000 might be a little high of a price.
Manual of Golems: >31000
Reasoning: Elementals are CR 5, so having the ability to create Golems of CR 5 or higher needs to be the same price or higher than Rings of Elemental Command.
I have listed the suggested prices for the items I did not see on your list below. This assumes that the Robe of Useful Items is too random for pricing, which is why I did not price it.
Dragon Slayer: 7000
Reasoning: It's similar in function to a Giant Slayer, and you've got that priced at 7000. It might warrent being bumped up to 8000, however, because it is especially good against some of the most dangerous monsters in the game.
Mace of Terror: 8000-10000
Reasoning: It has nearly the same effect as the Wand of fear, but in a radius. I lacks the wand's other option, so a lesser price may make sense.
Once again, thank you. This will be very helpful.
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2015-07-03, 02:13 AM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Yeah, I'm still thinking about the evocation wands. The problem with the lot of them is that you get quite radically different prices assuming they'll be spent one charge at a time than by assuming they'll always be used with every charge but one at once. The first honestly seems like the sort of item that I'd want to see existing in the game more, it's more interesting than the nova stick, but it's getting hedged out by how spell-like items scale. The manual isn't quite comparable to the rings, dominate monster only lasts for 1 minute, which makes it almost unusable outside of direct combat. And while the spell is terribly useful in combat in its pure form, the version the rings give which only works on one specific monster is absurdly situational. Those are mostly priced for the abilities you get when you defeat an elemental. Originally Posted by Twelvetrees
I have listed the suggested prices for the items I did not see on your list below. This assumes that the Robe of Useful Items is too random for pricing, which is why I did not price it.
Dragon Slayer: 7000
Reasoning: It's similar in function to a Giant Slayer, and you've got that priced at 7000. It might warrent being bumped up to 8000, however, because it is especially good against some of the most dangerous monsters in the game.
Mace of Terror: 8000-10000
Reasoning: It has nearly the same effect as the Wand of fear, but in a radius. I lacks the wand's other option, so a lesser price may make sense.
Once again, thank you. This will be very helpful.
Oh wow, I had those in the ods, just must have missed them transferring things over. Thanks for the catch.
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2015-07-03, 09:39 AM (ISO 8601)Barbarian in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Ah. Thanks for the explanation.
In that case, I'd probably put the Wand of Fireballs/Lightning Bolts somewhere between 32000 and 44000. 32000 would be about a third of a character's total wealth at level 15, and 44000 would be about a third at level 17. Spending a third of one's cash for the ability to cast a level 9 spell seems fine to me, especially when each wand does 50 or so damage in an area. That's not particularly good for a 9th level spell.
I think 8000 is still an appropriate price for the Wand of Magic Missiles. If anything, it could be lower. A Ring of the Ram (5000), used at full power, does 1.5 times the amount of damage that spending all of the charges of the wand would. It also pushes the target. Requiring an attack roll does make it less powerful, but even if we halve its damage output because it misses about half the time, it's not far behind. Being able to target multiple creatures with the missiles would be a reason to have the wand be just a bit more expensive than the ring.
Looking through the items to try to find comparable ones to the Wand of Fireballs/Lightning Bolts caused me to find the Ring of Shooting Stars at 3000. I might suggest making this more expensive, but only if the following use is viable: Using all three charges of the ring to create mini fireballs in the same area could result in damage comparable to a 6th level casting of Fireball.
I'm not sure if the mini fireballs can be stacked, but if they can, the ring should likely have a much higher price.
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2015-07-03, 12:42 PM (ISO 8601)Bugbear in the Playground
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Re: Sane Magic Item Prices
Hm, doing a bit more in depth comparison to other spells around that level, 8th level Fireballs(the highest you can safely cast) barely deal more damage than delayed blast fireballs, which are 7th level. Yeah, 32000 should be fine. (Evocations scale really badly) Originally Posted by Twelvetrees
Alright, I suppose I can see that. The main concern is that the wand of magic missiles doesn't require attunement, so a higher level character could stockpile a bunch of them and nova all the time. Though I suppose 8000 is probably enough to push the problem off until the 18-20 range.I think 8000 is still an appropriate price for the Wand of Magic Missiles. If anything, it could be lower. A Ring of the Ram (5000), used at full power, does 1.5 times the amount of damage that spending all of the charges of the wand would. It also pushes the target. Requiring an attack roll does make it less powerful, but even if we halve its damage output because it misses about half the time, it's not far behind. Being able to target multiple creatures with the missiles would be a reason to have the wand be just a bit more expensive than the ring.
Hm, I'd been thinking they couldn't overlap, but rereading it I don't think that's actually the case. I'll figure out a new price for that.Looking through the items to try to find comparable ones to the Wand of Fireballs/Lightning Bolts caused me to find the Ring of Shooting Stars at 3000. I might suggest making this more expensive, but only if the following use is viable: Using all three charges of the ring to create mini fireballs in the same area could result in damage comparable to a 6th level casting of Fireball.
I'm not sure if the mini fireballs can be stacked, but if they can, the ring should likely have a much higher price.
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