Help implementing or even bettering a rule idea I had.

[ngilop]

So, i have had this idea for a long while.

My campaign world has Fate and Destiny be very important forces. Its how in universe the PCs are the ones who do things not random cobbler #123. Also why not everybody is resurrected via resurrection magic.

Anyways; the rule is Fate Points. Where I deal each player 5 cards from a deck at character creation. The player then uses those throughout the campaign for narrative consequences whether good or bad. Those are all one gets, but a player can do things to get one back or take a 1st level feat to get an extra. The DM gets 3 cards, but they 'refresh' each session. the players or DM are able to trump cards, So a 5 of hearts that I used to, for example, make the dwarf fighter say something offensive to get everybody in a fight, the halfling wizard can play the 8 of clubs to cancel it. Aces count as high or low, with low being more powerful, but almost certain to be countered.

I am thinking of having each suite govern a certain aspect, like Hearts would deal with emotions or spades with items. But, I am not sure about that or if anything other than heart=emotion even makes sense.

Also having the higher face of the card being capable or greater things is again something I am not quite sure of, or how to implement exactly.

Example uses of the Fate point system:

You use a 10 of clubs to have a random small animal (like a rat or weasel) run of the little cave you were hiding in, to trick the owlbear into thinking that was the noise it had heard

Using a 3 of diamonds to happen to have a lighter for the guard who lost his, thereby bypassing the guards curiosity on why you are even there at that time anyways.


Just hoping some people could give me a few suggestions or any assistance on how to better incorporate this idea into my games.

[Yakk]

I'd advise against giving someone resources they can't get back.

It is very easy to never use them, or waste them in ways that aren't fun.

And if nobody uses them nobody remembers they exist.

If you are going to add mechanics, add mechanics that are going to be used.

[Ionathus]

I'm only guessing from the content of your post, but is this 5e ruleset?

I don't think the DM should get any of these Fate points - they should be a solely PC resource. I can't tell you how upset and frustrated I would be if I played one of my 5 nonrenewable Have A Big Moment cards and the DM just said "nope." Allowing the DM to get three vetoes per session while the PCs never refresh theirs is just salt in the wound, and a ton of it.

What you're talking about here (a nonrenewable "auto succeed" card) reminds me a lot of Luck in Monster of the Week. But that's a more abstracted system, and there's a whole mechanic around how using up all your luck is extremely bad for a hunter -- they become "doomed." But basically, the Luck mechanics are baked into the game, and using them feels fun, but you know the cost of the decision. Character death and retirement has a different philosophy in MotW too, one that doesn't map perfectly to the assumptions players have about sword-and-board RPGs. Using it makes the game more interesting in both positive and negative ways. I don't feel like your mechanic here is well thought out, it just feels tacked on to the game without that careful balance necessary to make it a nuanced and fun choice.

In general I think you can accomplish what you want by just adding to (and flavoring) the Inspiration mechanic. Find more excuses to give Inspiration to the PCs and give them more opportunities to use it. And when they do use it, really lean into the roleplaying flavor of Fate or Chance or Destiny being on their side. When the Ranger turns a clutch roll from a failure to a success, make them feel a tangible force at play, like they've fulfilled a minor prophecy.

That's what I've been doing in my campaign, for whenever my high-level players use Inspiration. I sometimes even tell them that the original roll is them seeing into the immediate future and getting a nudge from Destiny to change the course of what might have been. There's so much you can do with flavor I don't think you need anything more than that.

[MoiMagnus]

So a 5 of hearts that I used to, for example, make the dwarf fighter say something offensive to get everybody in a fight, the halfling wizard can play the 8 of clubs to cancel it. Aces count as high or low, with low being more powerful, but almost certain to be countered.

I think this is a very bad example, and by that I mean something that shouldn't be possible in your system.

Generally speaking, you have two levels of thinking when you play a RPG:
(1) The Meta level where everyone is friend to one another, and everyone should aim at having the best possible gaming session together
(2) The In-Character level where characters act according to their motivations, and conflicts might arise

It's a very bad idea to introduce a game mechanics that would create conflict at the Meta level, and having the opportunities to "counter" each other Meta actions definitely goes in that direction. And generally, when players use meta currency, it's best if they avoid going against the other player's will. (But they can go against the other character's will, or even against their own's character will)

Additionally, having per-campaign resources that can be countered is the worse possible thing. Like you waited for the whole campaign to use this resource given at the character creation and when you use it it doesn't work... What an immense disappointment.

Just hoping some people could give me a few suggestions or any assistance on how to better incorporate this idea into my games.

Something I had in one campaign that worked reasonably well were "divine favour" obtained through some of our actions (like building a temple to a deity or something). They could be used only once, and an effect depending on the deity we helped:
+ Cancel one attack
+ Get a critical hit 20 to one attack
+ Go back in the past 6s (so the previous round)
+ Get teleported back "home"

The reason they worked as "once in a campaign resources" is that it was always clear when to use them: we always used them at a moment where the whole team would have been wiped out otherwise, so having them was kind of an "insurance", but that we wanted to avoid using them as much as possible since we only got a handful of them (and that was a group decision to use them).

Those are all one gets, but a player can do things to get one back or take a 1st level feat to get an extra.

I'd avoid making them comparable to feats. But "doing thing to get them back" is fair enough.

I am thinking of having each suite govern a certain aspect, like Hearts would deal with emotions or spades with items. But, I am not sure about that or if anything other than heart=emotion even makes sense.

My suggestion if you really want to use card's suits:
Heart = "Relation" = A NPC becomes a reliable and useful ally to the team.
Diamond = "Treasure" = A PC learn about an artefact linked to their past or something, which create the possibility for a side quest to retrieve it. Alternatively, the cool item they found has some additional properties, or some unexpected magical interaction.
Club = "Luck" = Get out of a problem by some Deus Ex Machina or another insane luck
Spades = "Event" = An event occur that cause significant issues to enemy faction

Alternatively, you could buy a divination Tarot, remove all the normal cards without much meaning, and let the player Google the meaning of the Tarot cards they have and argue why it can do what they want it to do.

[ngilop]

OK, thanks for the feedback and constructive criticism.

WHile Fate works is finicky ways, I can see the concept of the DM getting trump cards would not be good. Maybe just have some very important NPCs have 1 card only. (by very important I mean.. like the Ghostlord, Azarr Kul, and the Avatar of Tiamat if you run Red Hand of Doom)

Thansk for the suggesstion of what the make the card suites about.

I have settled on them as follows:
Hearts=Emotions/Relations between PC and NPC, or NPC and NPC
Diamond=Artefacts items the PCs might have on hand to assist them
Club=Luck the good ol' deus ex machina (this is also the only suite that allows modifying combat i.e negating an attack, forcing a save re-roll)
Spade=Event random and at times, crazy event that can help or hinder.

[Breccia]

Where I deal each player 5 cards from a deck at character creation.

So, it's random? Because if the cards a player gets and the character concept/class they went with don't mesh, I'm guessing you'll get understandably irate players.

[ngilop]

Yes. It is random. This is wholly independent of a character concept. Not sure how you think narrative manipulation/OOC abilities are somehow dependent in a character concept.

[ahyangyi]

I like the idea of "fate points, but with types". I wonder what does each rank do though: what's the difference between, say, 3 of diamonds and 10 of diamonds?