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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    Default Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Spoiler: What exactly is this whole "specific warlock patron" thing all about?
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    I love the themes the warlock class bring to the table. Any character who wound up pledging himself to some sort of mysterious (Great old one), downright weird (Archfey), or devil (Fiend) will almost always have some sort of interesting backstory which is fun to explore in game.

    However, the warlock subclasses in of themselves are pretty limited. Playing a warlock of Dagon, a demon lord of the abyss who resides in water, gives you the same classic "kill them all with fire" benefits as playing a warlock of Asmodeus. This is my attempt to change this.

    I plan on designing specific warlock subclasses for the lords of the Nine Hells before moving on to other patrons (both fiendish or otherwise).



    Dispater, Lord of Dis


    You will not pass. Go directly to Hell. Do not pass go, do not collect 200 dollars.

    Expanded Spell list:

    Spell Level Spells
    1st Absorb Elements (ee), Shield of Faith
    2nd Protection From Poison, See Invisibility
    3rd Protection From Energy, Crusader's Mantle*
    4th Death Ward, Stoneskin
    5th Wall of Stone, Antilife Shell

    Pact features:

    Infernal Bulwark:
    Starting at first level, you gain proficiency with medium and heavy armor, as well as proficiency with shields. You do not gain proficiency in any weapons.

    Aura of Fortitude:
    Starting at level 6, any ally within 20 feet of you gains a +2 bonus to AC or saving throws (their choice). You do not gain this benefit. At level 14, the radius of this aura extends to 35 feet around you.

    Hellish Warding:
    Starting at level 10, you can concentrate on up to two abjuration spells at the same time. However, while you are concentrating on both of these spells, you may cast no additional spells, with the exception of cantrips. If you fail a concentration check, you loose both spells.

    Iron Flesh:
    Starting at level 14, you gain invulnerability to one of the following damage types: piercing, slashing, or bludgeoning. Once you make this choice, it cannot be changed. This invulnerability can only be overcome by a weapon that is both magic and silver.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    * Instead of granting allies additional radiant damage, it grants allies extra necrotic damage instead. Call the spell "Blackguard's Mantle".
    Last edited by Michael7123; 2015-09-05 at 09:27 AM.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    "Yo Dawg, I heard you liked concentrating, so I gave you Hellish Warding, so you can concentrate while you concentrate."
    I'm sorry.

    Dispater is one of the Archdukes who has never been deposed at any time, and is very, very cautious. He rules from the iron citadel, which resides in the iron city of Dis. Considering all of this talk about fortresses, it makes sense that any warlock dedicated to him would gain a bunch of defense related abilities. This class is sort of a cross between cleric and the abjurant champion prc from 3.5.

    Ultimately, I designed this class with one specific goal in mind: your character isn't going to die easily. What you potentially lack in damage dealing, you gain in defensive abilities. This class is the embodiment of "the best offense is a good defense." If enemies can never kill you, you can take however long you want/need to kill them.
    Last edited by Michael7123; 2015-07-18 at 02:05 PM.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    I'd make the 14th level ability to cast Flesh to Stone, except it turns its victim to pure iron, once per long rest, in addition to everything else it does. If a foe can't hurt you, it'll just move on to hurting someone else. Make your foes want to hurt you.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurai View Post
    I'd make the 14th level ability to cast Flesh to Stone, except it turns its victim to pure iron, once per long rest, in addition to everything else it does. If a foe can't hurt you, it'll just move on to hurting someone else. Make your foes want to hurt you.
    While this is a cool idea, it wouldn't work for a few reasons.

    1. I had already planned that that the Mammon's patron class would get a much better flesh to stone refluff (flesh to gold). The abilities are too similar, and I want to try and make these classes unique.

    2. My general guide for designing the abilities of these classes is "would this patron want to have these abilities (or more powerful versions at least). For Dispater, a foe moving on to attack another target is nothing but a plus. It keeps an enemy distracted from the real thread and most important being in existence (himself). He's a fiend. Abilities should have a selfish bent. Even if they can be used for unselfish purposes (Someone could run through a barrage of arrows to save a friends life if they have piercing damage immunity, for example.)

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    I really like this one. I don't know how balanced being able to concentrate on three abujuration spells really is. Also, Dispater is known for striking deals with mortals and his receiving of a cut for each contract made in Dis. It would be nice to see something reflective of that, even if it also serves as a defensive ability. Not that I have any suggestions how how to implement something like that at the moment.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Concentrating on THREE abjuration spells is hilariously overpowered. Just no. Notice that Abjuration Wizards, the ONLY class that really should even be considered for, "can concentrate on multiple spells of my spellcasting focus," does not get the ability to break concentration rules. IF you could concentrate on a single abjuration spell and also any one other non-abjuration spell, it would still be REALLY powerful, but probably too powerful. No, nope, no way.

    By the way, I love what you're doing with specific Warlock patrons. I've been planning to do them for Binder vestiges myself, so more power to you. Just make sure you're balancing them against existing ones and against the rules set as a whole.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziegander View Post
    Concentrating on THREE abjuration spells is hilariously overpowered. Just no. Notice that Abjuration Wizards, the ONLY class that really should even be considered for, "can concentrate on multiple spells of my spellcasting focus," does not get the ability to break concentration rules. IF you could concentrate on a single abjuration spell and also any one other non-abjuration spell, it would still be REALLY powerful, but probably too powerful. No, nope, no way.

    By the way, I love what you're doing with specific Warlock patrons. I've been planning to do them for Binder vestiges myself, so more power to you. Just make sure you're balancing them against existing ones and against the rules set as a whole.
    Yeah, I was kinda worried about that ability. Playing devil's advocate though (pun very much intended) though, Warlocks don't have access to any high level abjurations that require concentration at all, unlike a wizard or sorcerer or cleric. While three at once might be overpowered, I'd like to see how it transitions into an actual game before giving it a final judgement. Having said that, I probably will nerf that ability in the near future.

    Other than your beef with Hellish Warding, do you have any other issues with the class? Any feedback would be appreciated.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael7123 View Post
    Yeah, I was kinda worried about that ability. Playing devil's advocate though (pun very much intended) though, Warlocks don't have access to any high level abjurations that require concentration at all, unlike a wizard or sorcerer or cleric. While three at once might be overpowered, I'd like to see how it transitions into an actual game before giving it a final judgement. Having said that, I probably will nerf that ability in the near future.

    Other than your beef with Hellish Warding, do you have any other issues with the class? Any feedback would be appreciated.
    That's true, except that the patron list reads like a best of list for the low level abjurations. Stoneskin + Protection from Energy + Shield of Faith is pretty nuts. Even if it wasn't overpowered though, it's pretty contrary to the design intent for the edition. As Ziegander said, there is no better candidate for that kind of ability than the wizard, and the wizard doesn't have it. Concentration spells should never be made stackable, period.

    I do really like the patron apart from that though.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurai View Post
    I'd make the 14th level ability to cast Flesh to Stone, except it turns its victim to pure iron, once per long rest, in addition to everything else it does. If a foe can't hurt you, it'll just move on to hurting someone else. Make your foes want to hurt you.
    I strongly advice against this. Why? Iron has a set value. You really don't want the PC's by buying elephants at 200 GP, turning them into iron, then selling said iron for several thousand gold pieces.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Dire_Stirge View Post
    I strongly advice against this. Why? Iron has a set value. You really don't want the PC's by buying elephants at 200 GP, turning them into iron, then selling said iron for several thousand gold pieces.
    Why would that be a problem? If they want to amass gold, let them amass gold.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tyler View Post
    Why would that be a problem? If they want to amass gold, let them amass gold.
    That's the job of the warlock of Mammon . Take a look at his final ability.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Okay, so I gave hellish warding a major nerf. You can now only focus on two abjuration spells at once, and can't even cast non concentration spells while doing so.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    That seems more appropriate, though I think it would be fine to allow cantrips.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziegander View Post
    That seems more appropriate, though I think it would be fine to allow cantrips.
    Eltrich Blast with all of the invocations to power it up. Hello 4d10+20 force damage per round at level 17.
    Last edited by Michael7123; 2015-07-19 at 04:52 PM.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Which is what you would be doing without that feature anyway. It's powerful, but it's not as though it makes Hellish Warding any more powerful or vice versa.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziegander View Post
    Which is what you would be doing without that feature anyway. It's powerful, but it's not as though it makes Hellish Warding any more powerful or vice versa.
    True, but I was initially limiting it so you can't take advantage of hellish warding and eltrich blast at the same time.

    Hmmmmm.....

    For now, I'll make the change to allow cantrips. But I might change it back depending on how the class as a whole performs in game.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael7123 View Post
    True, but I was initially limiting it so you can't take advantage of hellish warding and eltrich blast at the same time.

    Hmmmmm.....

    For now, I'll make the change to allow cantrips. But I might change it back depending on how the class as a whole performs in game.
    Prudent. You're a good designer that has cropped up out of nowhere. Kudos.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael7123 View Post
    Expanded Spell list:

    Spell Level Spells
    1st Bane, Shield of Faith
    2nd Protection From Poison, See Invisibility
    3rd Protection From Energy, Crusader's Mantle*
    4th Death Ward, Stoneskin
    5th Wall of Stone, Antilife Shell
    All good here, like usual.

    Infernal Bulwark:
    Starting at first level, you gain proficiency with medium and heavy armor, as well as proficiency with shields. You do not gain proficiency in any weapons.
    Nitpicky, but the bit about weapons isn't needed. Gaining armor proficiency does not, on it's own, have anything to do wit

    Aura of Fortitude:
    Starting at level 6, any ally within 20 feet of you gains a +2 bonus to AC or saving throws (their choice). You do not gain this benefit. At level 14, the radius of this aura extends to 35 feet around you.
    THIS is a cool ability. To keep it in line with the Paladin Auras, i'd set the initial radius at 10 ft., but you can do what you'd like.

    Hellish Warding:
    Starting at level 10, you can concentrate on up to two abjuration spells at the same time. However, while you are concentrating on both of these spells, you may cast no additional spells, with the exception of cantrips.
    This is so far the only time ive seen someone do the "I can concentrate on two spells" thing and not have it be horribly broken. Kudos.

    Iron Flesh:
    Starting at level 14, you gain invulnerability to one of the following damage types: piercing, slashing, or bludgeoning. Once you make this choice, it cannot be changed. This invulnerability can only be overcome by a weapon that is both magic and silver.
    I'm a fan. Screw arrows, those things totally suck.

    All in all, really well done. Very simple, yet interesting. I want to play this as a Oathbreaker paladin/bladelock and be everyone's best friend: +cha to damage, +cha to saves, +2 ac for EVERYONE.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Submortimer View Post
    All good here, like usual.



    Nitpicky, but the bit about weapons isn't needed. Gaining armor proficiency does not, on it's own, have anything to do wit



    THIS is a cool ability. To keep it in line with the Paladin Auras, i'd set the initial radius at 10 ft., but you can do what you'd like.



    This is so far the only time ive seen someone do the "I can concentrate on two spells" thing and not have it be horribly broken. Kudos.



    I'm a fan. Screw arrows, those things totally suck.

    All in all, really well done. Very simple, yet interesting. I want to play this as a Oathbreaker paladin/bladelock and be everyone's best friend: +cha to damage, +cha to saves, +2 ac for EVERYONE.
    Thanks!

    If you ever do get around to playing that oathbreaker/bladelock, let me know so I can watch the game. This is my favorite subclass I've developed, so I'd like to see it in action.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    An idea that could help (or just inflame) the concentration scenario, 1/long rest they can ignore the concentration of an abjuration spell and are able to dismiss on their own.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Gr7mm Bobb View Post
    An idea that could help (or just inflame) the concentration scenario, 1/long rest they can ignore the concentration of an abjuration spell and are able to dismiss on their own.
    Eh, I think that would ultimately make this feature less powerful and ultimately less versatile. For now, I'll keep it the way it is. Regardless, thank you for your input. If I get reports of this being a bit too powerful, I'll make changes.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael7123 View Post
    B]Expanded Spell list:[/B]

    Spell Level Spells
    1st Bane, Shield of Faith
    2nd Protection From Poison, See Invisibility
    3rd Protection From Energy, Crusader's Mantle*
    4th Death Ward, Stoneskin
    5th Wall of Stone, Antilife Shell

    Pact features:
    Bane and shield of faith are fine, but see invisibility is, as they say, way the niche. I'd suggest replacing it with something like augury, which evokes cautious planning, or even just arcane lock. Protection from poison is also meh, but less so. The other spells seem fine to me.

    Infernal Bulwark:
    Starting at first level, you gain proficiency with medium and heavy armor, as well as proficiency with shields. You do not gain proficiency in any weapons.
    Pardon me, did you say I can cover the (evil) Favored Soul character concept better than WotC's version? Cool. Heavy armor is probably excessive though.

    Aura of Fortitude:
    Starting at level 6, any ally within 20 feet of you gains a +2 bonus to AC or saving throws (their choice). You do not gain this benefit. At level 14, the radius of this aura extends to 35 feet around you.
    What is up with the funky radius on that aura? why not just let it go to 30 feet, or 40? I think there should be some way for this to be unstackable, though. Maybe the AC boost doesn't stack with a shield?

    Hellish Warding:
    Starting at level 10, you can concentrate on up to two abjuration spells at the same time. However, while you are concentrating on both of these spells, you may cast no additional spells, with the exception of cantrips.
    Concentrate on two defensive spells at once in return for being limitted to EB all over the place. Ok, I guess. A little underwhelming, though. What happens if you blow your concentration, do you just lose both? Do you lose one first? Is it harder to concentrate on two spells?

    Iron Flesh:
    Starting at level 14, you gain invulnerability to one of the following damage types: piercing, slashing, or bludgeoning. Once you make this choice, it cannot be changed. This invulnerability can only be overcome by a weapon that is both magic and silver.
    This is probably too strong and too narrow. Most enemies don't silver their weapons; those that do are going to be ones specifically sent to punch this guy. I suggest you just grant resistance to all damage of one type, nonmagical or otherwise.
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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Quote Originally Posted by unbeliever536 View Post
    Bane and shield of faith are fine, but see invisibility is, as they say, way the niche. I'd suggest replacing it with something like augury, which evokes cautious planning, or even just arcane lock. Protection from poison is also meh, but less so. The other spells seem fine to me.

    Pardon me, did you say I can cover the (evil) Favored Soul character concept better than WotC's version? Cool. Heavy armor is probably excessive though.

    What is up with the funky radius on that aura? why not just let it go to 30 feet, or 40? I think there should be some way for this to be unstackable, though. Maybe the AC boost doesn't stack with a shield?

    Concentrate on two defensive spells at once in return for being limitted to EB all over the place. Ok, I guess. A little underwhelming, though. What happens if you blow your concentration, do you just lose both? Do you lose one first? Is it harder to concentrate on two spells?

    This is probably too strong and too narrow. Most enemies don't silver their weapons; those that do are going to be ones specifically sent to punch this guy. I suggest you just grant resistance to all damage of one type, nonmagical or otherwise.
    Sorry to leave these unanswered for so long.

    1. I might change the spell list, Augary does fit, but it's hard to use as a DM. I'll consider it. I was mainly focusing on adding abjuration spells.

    2. Plate mail fits this character too much to not allow it.

    3. Simply increasing it to 30 feet might be good. I'll think on it.

    4. I'm gonna say if you fail the consentration check, you loose both. I'll edit the discription to reflect that.

    5. The fiend warlock already has an ability better than that, he can change it from day to day. I'm keeping mine the same.

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    Default Re: Michael's Specific Warlock Patron #2: Archduke Dispater, Lord of the Second

    Removed the spell Bane and replaced it with the spell Absorb Elements.

    If you don't have the elemental evil handbook, don't worry! There's a perfectly legal pdf on the wizards of the coast website containing all the races and spells that came with that book.

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