Addressing Sex & Rape in RPG

[WalkingTheShade]

I tried to think of a less tacky title, but this one goes to the point.

I guess every DM has his limits of what he's OK to see in game, and mine is twofold.

I've always refused to describe any scene involving sex (between PCs, NPCs and PCs, etc.), either consensual or not, either dramatic or comedic... My reaction when such a situation occurs is "curtain down, some things happen off-screen, curtain comes back up with the morning sun". I give the lightest description I can, and that does frustrate some players who'd like to insert at least some limited role-play elements, without necessarily describing every detail.

The biggest problem I have is with rape.
Now, I never had a problem when other people DM and use it as an element (as long as they are mature about it, or the context is unambiguously absurd).
Neither do I have a problem with graphic torture scenes, that could IC have at least as much consequences on a character, and could be reacted to as badly OOC by players.
Last, I don't have an issue with rape used for backstory.
However, I go out of my way to avoid it's presence in game.

During my 15+ years career as a DM, I often went out of my way to avoid these situations, as they take me out of my comfort zone.
It has been problematic in the past, but not overly so, but now I feel it entails some limits. Regarding consensual sex, how a character behaves (rough or gentle, timid or confident, caring or self-absorbed, deeply loving or manipulative) is part of that character's development and personality.
Concerning rape, I feel avoiding the subject can harm the verisimilitude in some situations: soldiers sacking a city, characters being captured by enemies, etc.

Now I'm not looking for excuses for turning every game into a storm of depravity or inflicting horrible torment on PCs. It's just that I have difficulties addressing these issues, even when they're not going to happen.

Anyone has gaming experiences he'd like to share? or advice?

[oshi]

I've GM'd some Black Crusade, and I think I just had one rule for the players: No sexual violence. I brought up the same rule on the spot when they captured a female NPC in my Iron Kingdoms game.
I personally don't want to hear about it, deal with it, or think about it, so I just don't go there... Some things aren't worth the verisimilitude :). I know that's not helpful advice, I just wanted to make sure you knew there's definitely other people out there that are happy to exclude it from a roleplaying game.

[JAL_1138]

...not only are you not alone, in my experience you're in the vast majority.

[WalkingTheShade]

I've GM'd some Black Crusade, and I think I just had one rule for the players: No sexual violence. I brought up the same rule on the spot when they captured a female NPC in my Iron Kingdoms game.
I personally don't want to hear about it, deal with it, or think about it, so I just don't go there... Some things aren't worth the verisimilitude :). I know that's not helpful advice, I just wanted to make sure you knew there's definitely other people out there that are happy to exclude it from a roleplaying game.

This is helpful. How did players take to that rule? I know there's more to playing a servant of Slaanesh than jumping on everything that moves, but as a player, I could find this restrictive. Again, as a player, within limits, with mature players who know each other well, I never had an issue with sexual violence in game. Moreover, in a game like Black Crusade, I can imagine a lot of horrible horrible things happening. The ban on some kind of violence could look arbitrary to some. (I'm not judging, I'd do the same thing if I was DMing your game.)

...not only are you not alone, in my experience you're in the vast majority.

Well, in my experience, it's been more of a 50/50 thing. So, yeah, we're sharing experiences.

[Anonymouswizard]

I tend towards not allowing it to be brought up, and any sort of sexual violation moves you towards Chaotic Evil slightly faster than murdering a retirement village if I do allow it (assuming an equal rate of transgression). I also very strongly hint at stopping it before bringing out the bangammer to keep the conversation from getting aggressive (and actually only outright ban it done on PCs, I will just bring in dire consequences for doing it on NPCs, I need to finish the random STI table I'm working on).

If the PC wants to do stuff with a consenting partner they can either have it fade to black or give a one phrase description. It's never come up in game, but I seem to end up in groups that rolls a party of nerds, so it's not surprising. This is mainly why I'm writing a random STI table (because nobody I've played with is depraved enough to roleplay sexual assault).

[Lalliman]

I hope i don't come off as a sociopath, but i sincerely don't understand why rape is where people draw the line. It's a terrible act, which means it's only appropriate if you're playing in a terrible setting. As a fan of dark fantasy, rape is what i turn to when i want to make absolutely clear how evil a character is.

Banning it in a setting that's not supposed to have a dark tone makes sense, but otherwise it seems like a knee-jerk reaction. Like how people flipped out when a certain character got raped on GoT, but they didn't when another character's penis got cut off, which is undeniably an even viler act.

I'd never feature on-screen rape in a game if i'm not absolutely sure the other players are fine with it, but that's only for their sake. Me, i feel like, if i'm getting dark, i might as well commit to it.

[WalkingTheShade]

I tend towards not allowing it to be brought up, and any sort of sexual violation moves you towards Chaotic Evil slightly faster than murdering a retirement village if I do allow it (assuming an equal rate of transgression). I also very strongly hint at stopping it before bringing out the bangammer to keep the conversation from getting aggressive (and actually only outright ban it done on PCs, I will just bring in dire consequences for doing it on NPCs, I need to finish the random STI table I'm working on).

I've never brought up STI in my games... that's not a tool I'd use to make players more responsible. Also, in a setting where magic is able to cure mostly anything, it might not really be a deterrent.

I hope i don't come off as a sociopath, but i sincerely don't understand why rape is where people draw the line. It's a terrible act, which means it's only appropriate if you're playing in a terrible setting. As a fan of dark fantasy, rape is what i turn to when i want to make absolutely clear how evil a character is.
Banning it in a setting that's not supposed to have a dark tone makes sense, but otherwise it seems like a knee-jerk reaction.

I mostly agree with you on this level. Let's however note that some would argue there are more subtle ways to mark some character as Evil instead of rape. Let's also note that your last sentence seems to imply rape is morally more wrong than other acts.

Like how people flipped out when a certain character got raped on GoT, but they didn't when another character's penis got cut off, which is undeniably an even viler act.

What you are doing now is using a moral scale to compare two different acts. Before anyone takes that as a flame bait, I'd just want to take a moment to tell you that, to some people, rape is a worse kind of evil than torture or dismemberment.
On my side, even if I refuse to compare one to the other, I realise that I have a lot of unease playing one but not the other in a pen & paper RPG where I am DM.

I'd never feature on-screen rape in a game if i'm not absolutely sure the other players are fine with it, but that's only for their sake. Me, i feel like, if i'm getting dark, i might as well commit to it.

Yup, I agree again. The question now is how you make sure of that?

[Anonymouswizard]

I hope i don't come off as a sociopath, but i sincerely don't understand why rape is where people draw the line. It's a terrible act, which means it's only appropriate if you're playing in a terrible setting. As a fan of dark fantasy, rape is what i turn to when i want to make absolutely clear how evil a character is.

Banning it in a setting that's not supposed to have a dark tone makes sense, but otherwise it seems like a knee-jerk reaction. Like how people flipped out when a certain character got raped on GoT, but they didn't when another character's penis got cut off, which is undeniably an even viler act.

I'd never feature on-screen rape in a game if i'm not absolutely sure the other players are fine with it, but that's only for their sake. Me, i feel like, if i'm getting dark, i might as well commit to it.

I'm fine with off screen rape, but if a PC tries to commit it in game, no matter how dark the world, they have to be careful or get the same level of walloping that being a serial killer would get their characters, which is to say they likely have police chasing them.

I've never brought up STI in my games... that's not a tool I'd use to make players more responsible. Also, in a setting where magic is able to cure mostly anything, it might not really be a deterrent.

I tend to either run relatively low magic, or I make messing with biology difficult, but I can see why it isn't a problem in D&D.

[WalkingTheShade]

I'm fine with off screen rape, but if a PC tries to commit it in game, no matter how dark the world, they have to be careful or get the same level of walloping that being a serial killer would get their characters, which is to say they likely have police chasing them.

Yeap, but we're again discussing in-game deterents. My main issue is actually OOC, in the way I run my games.

I tend to either run relatively low magic, or I make messing with biology difficult, but I can see why it isn't a problem in D&D.

D&D, or any other game with sufficiently advanced magic or technology, which covers a lot, if not most, of published settings I can think of.

[Lalliman]

Let's also note that your last sentence seems to imply rape is morally more wrong than other acts.

What you are doing now is using a moral scale to compare two different acts. Before anyone takes that as a flame bait, I'd just want to take a moment to tell you that, to some people, rape is a worse kind of evil than torture or dismemberment.

I don't wanna make a statement about rape vs torture, because i've never experienced either, so it's hard to say. But since the majority of people seem to view rape as a greater evil to almost anything else, that's what i play into.

That being said, i feel like this specific example has to trump the average rape case. Not only are you permanently maiming the person, the psychological effects must be... inconceivable. I don't think, and 'think' is keyword here, that a single case of rape could do psychological damage of nearly the same intensity. Repeated sexual assault, that could be a different matter.
Then again, this is an extreme, so might not be particularly relevant.

[Lapsed Pacifist]

Remember: any element in a game is only a problem if you or your players have a problem with it. The corollary to this is that you don't know the history of your players, and they shouldn't have to tell you about everything that would be a dealbreaker for them. So the answer is, if you want to introduce these elements, do so with good faith. Ask your players whether they would have a problem with particular content, and if they would, don't bring it up. (I would do this by anonymous ballot to avoid potential awkwardness). I can't think of single instance where springing a rape scene on players without prior warning would be a good idea, so don't do that. The same applies if players bring this stuff up; the safety and comfort of the group is more important than the individual player's authorial control.

[WalkingTheShade]

I don't wanna make a statement about rape vs torture, because i've never experienced either, so it's hard to say. But since the majority of people seem to view rape as a greater evil to almost anything else, that's what i play into.

I understand this. Now, my first reaction would be to attempt to subvert expectations, but thinking more about it, I can't imagine a way of doing it that wouldn't give a wrong message.

That being said, i feel like this specific example has to trump the average rape case. Not only are you permanently maiming the person, the psychological effects must be... inconceivable. I don't think, and 'think' is keyword here, that a single case of rape could do psychological damage of nearly the same intensity. Repeated sexual assault, that could be a different matter.
Then again, this is an extreme, so might not be particularly relevant.

Somehow, I was also thinking of A Song of Ice and Fire while writing the first post. I don't like much how the TV show treats rape and torture as that treatment, to me, stinks of voyeurism and exploitation for shock value and ratings.
(Psychological issues are much more prevalent and explored in the books, but then, it might be a medium Book-vs-TV issue. I can't think of a movie or TV show employing on screen rape as a dramatic tool in a smart way.)

The books are however the first source of fiction that made me question my "ban" on rape (as a dramatic tool, again) during my games.

[Nifft]

I hope i don't come off as a sociopath, but i sincerely don't understand why rape is where people draw the line. It's a terrible act, which means it's only appropriate if you're playing in a terrible setting. As a fan of dark fantasy, rape is what i turn to when i want to make absolutely clear how evil a character is.

Can't speak for anyone else, but rape is something I'd never allow in a game, specifically because I don't want my game to cater to the sexual fantasies of any hypothetical creepy player who might want to indulge in that sort of thing. Nor do I want to make anyone uncomfortable about sex in general, or about rape in specific.

This is, of course, not specific to rape -- all sorts of sexy things happen off-screen and don't get narration, because I don't really want to cater to anyone's sexual fantasy, even the non-rape-fantasy people, and again I don't want to make anyone uncomfortable, which sex has a disproportionate and unpredictable ability to do, and which rape has an even more disproportionately huge ability to do.

- - -

Thinking about it, the only way rape would make it into my game would be:
- A player who wanted to play a former rapist who wanted to atone -- all consequences, none of the (yuck) "fun" (yuck).
- A player who wanted to play a rape victim, either seeking revenge or seeking to overcome the trauma.

Neither of those has ever come up, and I don't really expect them to, but it's nice to know where my line is.

[WalkingTheShade]

Remember: any element in a game is only a problem if you or your players have a problem with it. The corollary to this is that you don't know the history of your players, and they shouldn't have to tell you about everything that would be a dealbreaker for them. So the answer is, if you want to introduce these elements, do so with good faith. Ask your players whether they would have a problem with particular content, and if they would, don't bring it up. (I would do this by anonymous ballot to avoid potential awkwardness). I can't think of single instance where springing a rape scene on players without prior warning would be a good idea, so don't do that. The same applies if players bring this stuff up; the safety and comfort of the group is more important than the individual player's authorial control.

Thank you. I had put that into the equation. But it's good to precise clearly for the sake of the thread.
In my specific situation, I usually play with players I've known for years, if not decades. I know them well enough outside the game that I think rape in itself wouldn't be a problem. (I might be wrong, but if a problem does arise, I'm confident it could be handled simply.)

Can't speak for anyone else, but rape is something I'd never allow in a game, specifically because I don't want my game to cater to the sexual fantasies of any hypothetical creepy player who might want to indulge in that sort of thing. Nor do I want to make anyone uncomfortable about sex in general, or about rape in specific.

This is, of course, not specific to rape -- all sorts of sexy things happen off-screen and don't get narration, because I don't really want to cater to anyone's sexual fantasy, even the non-rape-fantasy people, and again I don't want to make anyone uncomfortable, which sex has a disproportionate and unpredictable ability to do, and which rape has an even more disproportionately huge ability to do.

Yes, I think my issues are on the same level, actually.

Thinking about it, the only way rape would make it into my game would be:
- A player who wanted to play a former rapist who wanted to atone -- all consequences, none of the (yuck) "fun" (yuck).
- A player who wanted to play a rape victim, either seeking revenge or seeking to overcome the trauma.

Neither of those has ever come up, and I don't really expect them to, but it's nice to know where my line is.

As I said, I'm OK with rape as backstory (for NPCs until now, since no PC using this elements, yet).

[Talyn]

I absolutely would not allow a PC in any of my games to commit a rape. Any player that suggested such an act would be told "no," and if they suggested it a second time would be asked to leave my table and not come back. (And yes, this did happen, and the rape-advocate is no longer gaming with us.)

I'm not interested in arguments about the historical validity of prisoner rape, or the ultimate refuge of jackass players, "well, that's what my character would do." The fact of the matter is that we are sitting around a table indulging in a power fantasy - and I will not facilitate my players engaging in rape as part of their power fantasy.

Rape-as-backstory and even rape-as-setting-element can be okay (in small doses), but I would caution against fellow DMs making it a major part of your game, even as a backstory and NPC-only element. Unfortunately, in many situations, tabletop RPGs are still a boys' club, and female players have been made to feel unwelcome and uncomfortable around many tables. A bunch of teenage boys (or young adult men) sitting in a group and blithely talking or joking about rape is not a group that is going to welcome female peers.

[tgva8889]

One important element of rape to understand is that most survivors of rape don't want to talk about it. It's extremely difficult to talk about it or mention it, even to the people closest to them. So you sort of never know if introducing it into your game would be a problem. Thus I would strongly suggest to anyone planning to use it to bring it up OoC beforehand, in a way that safely allows anyone with objections to voice them privately out of respect for survivors.

It can be a powerful and useful tool for storytelling, but you must be very sure that your players will take it seriously. If people start joking about it, it becomes a destructive topic.

[Berenger]

I hope i don't come off as a sociopath, but i sincerely don't understand why rape is where people draw the line.

I believe that's because rape is an astonishingly frequent crime even in otherwise "safe" environments (statistics for most western countries can be found easily enough online). In an ordinary group of gamers, it's highly likely that at least one of them or someone close and dear to them has been affected by sexual violence in a traumatizing fashion at some point of their lives. Thus, you might inadvertently ruin someones mood or, worse, pull his or her trauma trigger (edit: this risk is further amplified by the circumstances explained by tgva8889).

Now, other really bad things that happen in games may or may not make for equally horrifying experiences. But most of them are not a part of most gamers personal lives (or, if involving magic and fantasy creatures, even outright impossible in reality). Conversely, if someone had such unusual experiences in real life, you should avoid other potential triggers just as much as the depiction of rape. For example, you wouldn't do a plot revolving around a cult distributing magic zombie drugs with a player who lost her brother to crystal meth and you wouldn't do a stereotypical "at night, howling orcs torch your hut and chop down your family right in front of you" scene when one of your players is a refugee and lost part of his family in the rwandan genocide.

The difference is that the latter two cases are rare while bad experiences with sexual crimes are much more common.

[some guy]

I once ran a campaign with a focus on the horrors of war. When I selected my players I told there could be a possibility of rape in the case of capture. It never came up, because they kicked enough butts not to be captured.

For sex as a dm, I usually say "sex happens, you have fun".

I also don't describe torture as a dm.


As a player, I'm a bit more descriptive in the case of sex and torture, but only in groups I know it's accepted. I also feel that as a player I have more freedom in descriptions because I'm on the same level as the other players and don't impede on anyone's agency.

[WalkingTheShade]

I'm not interested in arguments about the historical validity of prisoner rape, or the ultimate refuge of jackass players, "well, that's what my character would do." The fact of the matter is that we are sitting around a table indulging in a power fantasy - and I will not facilitate my players engaging in rape as part of their power fantasy.

I disagree with you. I try to prevent and discourage as much as I can the "power fantasy" aspect from my games. I tend more towards deconstruction and character development (when the players are up for it). In this framework, my medfan games are more Sword & Sorcery or Dark Fantasy than High Fantasy, and the sci-fi ones more Cyberpunk. I believe tragedy, in its essence, has much more to say about our lives, than escapism from the tragedy of human condition can bring us. Or to misquote someone else, RPG is ONLY worthwhile for what it can tell us about the real world; everything else is petty escapism.

Inside the framework you describe, I would certainly take your position. I just disagree with the framework.

A bunch of teenage boys (or young adult men) sitting in a group and blithely talking or joking about rape is not a group that is going to welcome female peers.

Now, the purpose of this thread is to explore if (and how) it can be done without devolving into what you describe.

One important element of rape to understand is that most survivors of rape don't want to talk about it. It's extremely difficult to talk about it or mention it, even to the people closest to them. So you sort of never know if introducing it into your game would be a problem. Thus I would strongly suggest to anyone planning to use it to bring it up OoC beforehand, in a way that safely allows anyone with objections to voice them privately out of respect for survivors.

It can be a powerful and useful tool for storytelling, but you must be very sure that your players will take it seriously. If people start joking about it, it becomes a destructive topic.

I definitively and totally agree. See my comments above about Talyn's post.
Do you have any ideas about how it can be done "right"? What pitfalls to watch for?

[Amphetryon]

It's just never a good way to increase the enjoyment of anyone at the table. I've had it come up as a Player, in a group where none at the table were under 30 or themselves victims of sexual violence, and it still ended the session an hour and a half early because the Player involved (male, playing female, if it matters) was genuinely bothered and the rest of us were genuinely ticked off and yelling at the DM. As a DM, the only reference I've made to it was in noting it as background for one of the "PCs rescue the damsel-in-distress" trope encounters; the damsel in this case was a dragon, to deliberately distance and subvert the trope from anyone's experience. This apparently made the Players a little happier about their decision to enter into a fracas between a kraken and a dragon, after the fact.

[WalkingTheShade]

I believe that's because rape is an astonishingly frequent crime even in otherwise "safe" environments (statistics for most western countries can be found easily enough online).

Now, other really bad things that happen in games may or may not make for equally horrifying experiences.

The difference is that the latter two cases are rare while bad experiences with sexual crimes are much more common.

Thank you. I hadn't taken this argument this argument into account yet.

I also don't describe torture as a dm.

My first time was not so long ago. I actually did a good job about it. At first, all the players were taking it lightly. At the end, a few of them looked disgusted and others wanted it to stop, just stop. That might seem too much, but I think I managed to transmit the horror of the situation without overplaying it.

As a player, I'm a bit more descriptive in the case of sex and torture, but only in groups I know it's accepted. I also feel that as a player I have more freedom in descriptions because I'm on the same level as the other players and don't impede on anyone's agency.

The same with me.

It's just never a good way to increase the enjoyment of anyone at the table. I've had it come up as a Player, in a group where none at the table were under 30 or themselves victims of sexual violence, and it still ended the session an hour and a half early because the Player involved (male, playing female, if it matters) was genuinely bothered and the rest of us were genuinely ticked off and yelling at the DM.

Seems you can post your story there.

As a DM, the only reference I've made to it was in noting it as background for one of the "PCs rescue the damsel-in-distress" trope encounters; the damsel in this case was a dragon, to deliberately distance and subvert the trope from anyone's experience. This apparently made the Players a little happier about their decision to enter into a fracas between a kraken and a dragon, after the fact.

Nice subversion!

[Reltzik]

Some basic guidelines I follow.

1) The players are supposed to be heroes, and the Hollywood style hero, not the Greek Myth style hero. This prevents them from being rapists. Even if it's an evil campaign, they're anti-heroes, and need to remain sympathetic.

2) Loss of character control is not fun for the players. Therefore, the PCs don't get raped. (This is probably extra not-fun for the player, much less the PC, but rather than going through the extra work of quantifying how extra not-fun I decide that this is justification enough.)

3) In terms of setting, backstory, villains, etc, if I think it's likely to come up in a game I'm running, I will quietly take straw polls of the players one-on-one, saying it might be on the horizon. I specifically tell them that if they have any triggers, or boundaries that they don't want crossed, I will respect that, because I'm trying to keep the game from being not-fun for anyone. If even one of them has a problem, I will inform the group that there is an OOC line there for the comfort of one of the players, but not name the player. Other players who will not respect the comfort boundaries of group members will be shown the door.

4) Even if everyone is okay with it, incidents will not be gratuitous. It must be significant to plot, or character development, or emphasizing how evil someone is, or SOMETHING. Simply putting it in there to have it there is pointless.

[tgva8889]

I definitively and totally agree. See my comments above about Talyn's post.
Do you have any ideas about how it can be done "right"? What pitfalls to watch for?

What follows is my opinion on using rape in storytelling. I'm not an expert in this sort of thing, and I wouldn't suggest using rape as a storytelling tool in every sort of game or even most sorts of games because of my aforementioned risks.

The most important pitfalls to watch out for are that you treat it with respect for what it is. Rape is violence. The thing about roleplaying games is that, oftentimes, the actions players take don't really reflect the weight they have in reality. Most people are deeply affected when put into a life-threatening situation, especially if they are forced to end another life because of it, but in roleplaying games the average character does this all the time. You can't treat rape like that. Rape has deeply scarring effects on people that experience it, even people who have done things that most of us would consider scarring. You have to respect all of these things, and your players have to respect the seriousness of it.

It's hard for me to describe pitfalls of using it, partially because I would never use it because I've been affected by it. But if you are going to use it, I think you have to ask the questions 1) Why am I using rape to tell this story? and 2) Is there another way for me to tell the story I'm trying to tell, or is this actually the most effective way? There's lots of ways to show, for example, that a situation is horrible. You have to be doing something specific to want to show rape. Rape is emblematic of a specifically sexual representation of power, and to use it is to say things about that power structure. In a roleplaying game scenario, you also have to ask 3) Will my players see this the way I am telling it? and 4) Am I being respectful to my player's feelings and desires for the game we're playing together? Anyone trying this, I believe, will make mistakes the first few times; so long as you are respectful to the severity of what you are showing, however, I believe it can be done.

For example, I would strongly suggest that you not have a character rape someone to show that they are capital E Evil. There are many ways to show this, and rape probably isn't even the best way to show this. Rape expresses something different than a lot of kinds of violence.

[WalkingTheShade]

1) The players are supposed to be heroes, and the Hollywood style hero, not the Greek Myth style hero. This prevents them from being rapists. Even if it's an evil campaign, they're anti-heroes, and need to remain sympathetic.

Well, one of my problems is that I tend to prefer the Greek Myth style one.

2) Loss of character control is not fun for the players. Therefore, the PCs don't get raped. (This is probably extra not-fun for the player, much less the PC, but rather than going through the extra work of quantifying how extra not-fun I decide that this is justification enough.)

That's one of the reasons I've avoided it yet. However, in my current campaign, PCs have been cursed, maimed and tortured (not often, and not more than once by PC) as a result of bad choices, not railroading. All these events imply a loss of character control. However, there is an implicit contract that things happen for a reason, a dramatic reason, and not just for the lulz. Coldly, analytically, it has lead me to wonder why I have much more problems with rape than other horrible horrible things.

4) Even if everyone is okay with it, incidents will not be gratuitous. It must be significant to plot, or character development, or emphasizing how evil someone is, or SOMETHING. Simply putting it in there to have it there is pointless.

I agree with the significance to plot part. However, on the "emphasizing evil", I now tend towards tgva8889's opinion.

What follows is my opinion on using rape in storytelling. I'm not an expert in this sort of thing, and I wouldn't suggest using rape as a storytelling tool in every sort of game or even most sorts of games because of my aforementioned risks.

For example, I would strongly suggest that you not have a character rape someone to show that they are capital E Evil. There are many ways to show this, and rape probably isn't even the best way to show this. Rape expresses something different than a lot of kinds of violence.

Thank you for sharing. I agree and will consider the points you have raised.

[goto124]

Not only do I find it rather uncomfortable (despite being fortunate enough to not be a victim, touch wood), I don't really see why it should be included. Sure, verisimilitude, but it sounds rather like a 'For The Evulz' thing to me. Why not stop at, say, torture (which doesn't have to be described blow-by-blow)?

Why does it have to be sexual?

[Broken Twin]

I cover my opinion on rape under my rules on sexual violence in games.

1. Not around new players. It's a sensitive subject for certain people (myself included), so it's banned when playing with people whose limits I don't know.

2. Not instigated by the PCs. If that's the type of character you want to play, then I don't want to play with you.

Beyond that, it's inferred at most in play, but I'm okay with it in back stories (within the bounds of good taste). Sex in general I'm perfectly fine with (I tend to favor a one-roll fade-to-black method).

[Ralanr]

Not only do I find it rather uncomfortable (despite being fortunate enough to not be a victim, touch wood), I don't really see why it should be included. Sure, verisimilitude, but it sounds rather like a 'For The Evulz' thing to me. Why not stop at, say, torture (which doesn't have to be described blow-by-blow)?

Why does it have to be sexual?

The question of the day.

Personally I don't like using rape as a tool to show how horrible and irredeemable a person is. Why? Cause it's up there with Nazi's. That and I believe we can do better at showcasing a horrifying person.

On the table I'd say it should be an offscreen thing if you must put it in there. But if a player attempted it in character, then I'd break character to stop it and leave the game if I was a player. Or just leave.

If I was a DM, I'd pause the game. I don't DM often so I don't know a good move other than talking it out with the group.

[YossarianLives]

I honestly cannot ever imagine using rape as a plot tool in any of my games and I am at a loss as to why anybody would do so.

[WalkingTheShade]

Not only do I find it rather uncomfortable (despite being fortunate enough to not be a victim, touch wood), I don't really see why it should be included. Sure, verisimilitude, but it sounds rather like a 'For The Evulz' thing to me. Why not stop at, say, torture (which doesn't have to be described blow-by-blow)?

Why does it have to be sexual?

The whole premise of this thread is "why not". There are good arguments for and against above. Excerpt:

Rape is emblematic of a specifically sexual representation of power, and to use it is to say things about that power structure.

Regarding sexuality in general, I would add that it is a central part of human condition. Leaving it out not only seems arbitrary, but might be viewed as an incapacity to address an interesting question.

I honestly cannot ever imagine using rape as a plot tool in any of my games and I am at a loss as to why anybody would do so.

The same general reasons authors, of various works of fiction, of differing quality, use it as a plot tool.

[Red Fel]

Anyone has gaming experiences he'd like to share? or advice?

I happen to agree with those who say you're in the majority. As a rule, as DM I drop the curtain on any sex scene; as a player, I request the same.

I'll share a story that further illustrates my position. I had a DM once. He was a rather good DM, but a rather shoddy person. (This is the one who tried to choke me once, for the record.) He DMed a lot of games in a lot of settings. I once asked him to run a Big Eyes, Small Mouth game (TriStat, not d20), which he refused. He explained to me that he had played an earlier edition of BESM, and had taken an Attractiveness stat, which resulted in his (male) PC being sexually assaulted one night by every female soldier, and several male soldiers, in their platoon. As a result, he had sworn off the system.

I told you that story so that I might tell you this story. This same DM was running an Evil campaign in D&D, which turned into an Evil one-shot, in part because only two of our players were any good at playing Evil. (I was one of them.) My PC was an Incubus, and while I made him a bit racy (his character introduction did not involve pants), I didn't over-sex the character. The DM took umbrage with my character (in the PC's introduction, the DM required him to roll for his "attributes," and I rolled quite well, much to the DM's frustration), so the DM took out his anger in-character. When our party checked into an inn, my character chastised the innkeeper for the condition of the place.

The innkeeper, a private business owner in Thay, responded to the heavily-armed adventurer traveling under Thay's banner by hiring a trio of burly orcs to go to my PC's room at night, sexually assault the PC, and then place the PC in a chastity belt. No rolls, no saves, just the DM informing me of what happened. The other PCs also stopped my PC from exacting bloody vengeance, and my PC snuffed it shortly thereafter, but that's beside the point.

And here's the point: The sole purpose of including rape in that game was to exercise dominance over a player. I'm not saying that's true 100% of the time, but I find that it's fairly accurate. I won't address rape by PCs, because that's a very disturbing thought on its own, but when an NPC rapes a PC, I find that the purpose is to disempower or degrade the PC or the player. There's just no reason, otherwise; an enemy could just as easily kill, knock out, or imprison a PC. Rape is a way of literally adding insult to injury. There is nothing accomplished, in the narrative sense, aside from (1) showing just how evil an NPC is, (2) disgusting the players, or (3) showing just how much power you can exercise over the PCs. None of these are wonderful things.