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  1. - Top - End - #361
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneStarNorth View Post
    From now on dramatic multi-page updates will be based around colloquial grammar use rather than villain reveals and character deaths. I now know what REALLY puts the readers on the edge of their seats.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anteros View Post
    It's about time really.
    Oxford Comma is obviously lawful, evil, and annoying as hell.
    I look forward to the battle.
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  2. - Top - End - #362
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    JumboWheat01's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    Oxford Comma is obviously lawful, evil, and annoying as hell.
    I look forward to the battle.
    Lawful Evil doesn't exist in that world. 4e, remember?
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  3. - Top - End - #363
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    Celestia's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by JumboWheat01 View Post
    Lawful Evil doesn't exist in that world. 4e, remember?
    I think you just proved that the Oxford Comma doesn't exist in 4e. So that explains everything wrong with it.
    Last edited by Celestia; 2017-02-01 at 10:01 PM.
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  4. - Top - End - #364
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Hamste's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Woo, I can wait until Ellie and Odivallus fight over color and colour.
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  5. - Top - End - #365
    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneStarNorth View Post
    From now on dramatic multi-page updates will be based around colloquial grammar use rather than villain reveals and character deaths. I now know what REALLY puts the readers on the edge of their seats.
    Just do me a favour and never change the "i'm almost done my sandwich" thing.

    I like to watch them squrim

    In other news i'm almost done messing with them too.
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  6. - Top - End - #366
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Draconi Redfir View Post
    Just do me a favour and never change the "i'm almost done my sandwich" thing.

    I like to watch them squrim

    In other news i'm almost done messing with them too.
    You're not "messing with us" unless you just mean you're doing it by being so very wrong.

    If that's the case, I kindly ask you to stop messing with us every time you post.

    I kid of course.

  7. - Top - End - #367
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Really, a message containing 'kidnap' and then being cut off, and any axe-wielding paladin mom is gonna be leaving scorch marks through the countryside to get there.
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  8. - Top - End - #368
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Today's page continues to prove my belief at how awesome bards are.
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  9. - Top - End - #369
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    This is the origin of the oath, 'Bye, Odie's Spear!'.

    Through time, its meaning became garbled.
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  10. - Top - End - #370
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    Celestia's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    This is the origin of the oath, 'Bye, Odie's Spear!'.

    Through time, its meaning became garbled.
    Kudos for that! XD
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  11. - Top - End - #371
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    ...That has got to be the best test for dragon blood I've seen.
    I'm a Prestige Class! Thanks Zaydos!

  12. - Top - End - #372
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Yes, Odie, he imprisoned the nightmare spirit in his mind. The same nightmare spirit that massacred the hunters on your beloved home island and would have destroyed Peanut, Ell and you.

    Do you really want to get pissy about it, you useless vomitous dragon stank?
    The Giant
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  13. - Top - End - #373
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    Yes, Odie, he imprisoned the nightmare spirit in his mind. The same nightmare spirit that massacred the hunters on your beloved home island and would have destroyed Peanut, Ell and you.

    Do you really want to get pissy about it, you useless vomitous dragon stank?
    He has every right to be pissy about the fact that Ardon hid this from the rest of the party the entire time.

  14. - Top - End - #374
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    He has every right to be pissy about the fact that Ardon hid this from the rest of the party the entire time.
    Nonsense! Have any of his party shown the least ability to get Nightmare out of his head? Krackaboom can, but can 45? Or Peanut? Ell? Dragonstank?

    If not, then they are more likely to kill Ardon, intentionaly or accidently, than help him.
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  15. - Top - End - #375
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    Draconi Redfir's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    Yes, Odie, he imprisoned the nightmare spirit in his mind. The same nightmare spirit that massacred the hunters on your beloved home island and would have destroyed Peanut, Ell and you.

    Do you really want to get pissy about it, you useless vomitous dragon stank?
    pretty sure the spirit didn't do anything to odie's tribe. think that was something else.
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  16. - Top - End - #376
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Draconi Redfir View Post
    pretty sure the spirit didn't do anything to odie's tribe. think that was something else.
    At the very least it murdered the hunters.

    I'm 50/50 on this one. On the one hand Ardon was hiding a potentially deadly nightmare abomination that could kill everyone inside of him. On the other hand he has very little reason to have any faith in the party to be understanding and helpful instead of making things worse. It's not like they haven't tried to kill him or leave him to die multiple times already without even knowing about it.

    He should have told them, but I can understand why he didn't. I can also understand why Odie would be upset.

  17. - Top - End - #377
    Troll in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    Nonsense! Have any of his party shown the least ability to get Nightmare out of his head? Krackaboom can, but can 45? Or Peanut? Ell? Dragonstank?

    If not, then they are more likely to kill Ardon, intentionaly or accidently, than help him.
    Why would they intentionally kill him? That would only release the nightmare spirit and I can't see Ell allowing it anyways. Also the whole "if he dies the nighmare spirit gets released and kills them all" is kind of why the whole thing is an important piece of tactical information.

  18. - Top - End - #378
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    Why would they intentionally kill him? That would only release the nightmare spirit and I can't see Ell allowing it anyways. Also the whole "if he dies the nighmare spirit gets released and kills them all" is kind of why the whole thing is an important piece of tactical information.
    They've tried to kill him or leave him with enemies at least 3 times since that arc that I can remember. Granted Ardon deserved most of them, but you can't blame him for not trusting them.

  19. - Top - End - #379
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    Why would they intentionally kill him? That would only release the nightmare spirit and I can't see Ell allowing it anyways. Also the whole "if he dies the nighmare spirit gets released and kills them all" is kind of why the whole thing is an important piece of tactical information.
    Is there any practical reason to tell them? It's not like they are going to win any encounters without Ardon and telling them might increase their fear, Nightmare's fuel.
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  20. - Top - End - #380
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    Is there any practical reason to tell them? It's not like they are going to win any encounters without Ardon and telling them might increase their fear, Nightmare's fuel.
    I mean, morally there's definitely reason to tell them. Plus, the sons of solemnity probably know a way to remove the thing, so there's that.

    Ardon doesn't care about morals though, and I doubt he'd trust the SoS very much.

  21. - Top - End - #381
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    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Anteros View Post
    They've tried to kill him or leave him with enemies at least 3 times since that arc that I can remember. Granted Ardon deserved most of them, but you can't blame him for not trusting them.
    A demon coming out of their corpse that will then possess and/or murder you is a very good reason to not kill someone. Besides Ardon has given them just as many, if not more, reasons for the others not to trust him. The actions they took that made him not trust them are a direct result of actions he took.

  22. - Top - End - #382
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    A demon coming out of their corpse that will then possess and/or murder you is a very good reason to not kill someone. Besides Ardon has given them just as many, if not more, reasons for the others not to trust him. The actions they took that made him not trust them are a direct result of actions he took.
    I'm not sure that's true. From our perspective it is, but I don't think they are actually aware of most of the awful things Ardon has done. They know he's not a good person, but they don't know the extent of it. Ironically enough, he's never actively betrayed them like they've repeatedly done to him.

  23. - Top - End - #383
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anteros View Post
    I'm not sure that's true. From our perspective it is, but I don't think they are actually aware of most of the awful things Ardon has done. They know he's not a good person, but they don't know the extent of it. Ironically enough, he's never actively betrayed them like they've repeatedly done to him.
    Let me just ask this then and we can agree to disagree: Would you trust Ardon if you were in one of their places?

  24. - Top - End - #384
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    Celestia's Avatar

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    Let me just ask this then and we can agree to disagree: Would you trust Ardon if you were in one of their places?
    Yes I would because he's smart enough to know that he can't survive by himself. As long as I prove myself a worthwhile and trustworthy party member, he would have no reason to betray me. Being evil does not automatically mean lacking loyalty.
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  25. - Top - End - #385
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    Let me just ask this then and we can agree to disagree: Would you trust Ardon if you were in one of their places?
    I would have left that party a long time ago if I was in one of their places. Begrudged loyalty and blackmailed loyalty only goes so far with me.
    Avatar by linklele.

  26. - Top - End - #386
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    I mean, Ardon was hiding it from them even before the relationship really started going downhill. Plus, they should have known because if they ever end up in the situation where they have to knock Ardon unconscious for any reason they should know the consequences. What if they need to include him in an AoE attack?

  27. - Top - End - #387
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lizard Lord View Post
    Let me just ask this then and we can agree to disagree: Would you trust Ardon if you were in one of their places?
    I think the issue is should Ardon trust them to stand with him, had he revealed the presence of Nightmare?
    No. Ell still blamed him for 'genocide' after Odie was the one who boiled a whole generation of kidney-pincher children. Ell and Odie still have not accepted that they are contract killers, being too busy being self righteous about Ardon wiping out a murderous army of orcs.

    Answering your question, though, for the long term, I would get out of the business if I was Ell or Odie. If I was Peanut, Ardon tried to leave me content digging and came back for me when things went sideways. As Toaster, there has never been any loyalty asked or offered on either side.

    If a situation forced me to rely upon the someone, Ardon would be my choice, followed by Chandea or paying Groffnar enough to overlook his PTSD for a one-shot. The leadership competence of any of the others? I'm running away...
    The Giant
    There are no mistakes, because there are no rules. NONE. No, not even that one.

  28. - Top - End - #388
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    I think the issue is should Ardon trust them to stand with him, had he revealed the presence of Nightmare?
    No. Ell still blamed him for 'genocide' after Odie was the one who boiled a whole generation of kidney-pincher children. Ell and Odie still have not accepted that they are contract killers, being too busy being self righteous about Ardon wiping out a murderous army of orcs.

    Answering your question, though, for the long term, I would get out of the business if I was Ell or Odie. If I was Peanut, Ardon tried to leave me content digging and came back for me when things went sideways. As Toaster, there has never been any loyalty asked or offered on either side.

    If a situation forced me to rely upon the someone, Ardon would be my choice, followed by Chandea or paying Groffnar enough to overlook his PTSD for a one-shot. The leadership competence of any of the others? I'm running away...
    As far as I am concerned there's a difference between slaughtering orcs and a species that can only reach ist adult state by basically killing someone.
    At least with the former there is a chance to negotiate.

    And I can't fault Ell and Odie for not viewing their job as "paid murderer".
    That is one thing a adventurer can be, but far from the only option. Explorers, protectors, simple travellers...
    Just because Ardon chooses to be a monster they don't have to be.

    But since they view this differently maybe they shouldn't work with him. Especially if they can't change him or keep him in line anyway.
    I know I wouldn't work with him given a reasonable choice.

    That he kept the Nightmare Spirit a secret... Well, I can't blame him for keeping secrets with so little trust on both sides, but that tendency certainly doesn't help.
    Why should the others trust him when he doesn't tell them anything and acts like a borderline villain for good measure?
    "If it lives it can be killed.
    If it is dead it can be eaten."

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  29. - Top - End - #389
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Will Save World for Gold

    Well if we are going to be completely logical they shouldn't stay together at all, but that wouldn't be a very entertaining comic.

  30. - Top - End - #390
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by stsasser View Post
    I think the issue is should Ardon trust them to stand with him, had he revealed the presence of Nightmare?
    No. Ell still blamed him for 'genocide' after Odie was the one who boiled a whole generation of kidney-pincher children. Ell and Odie still have not accepted that they are contract killers, being too busy being self righteous about Ardon wiping out a murderous army of orcs.

    Answering your question, though, for the long term, I would get out of the business if I was Ell or Odie. If I was Peanut, Ardon tried to leave me content digging and came back for me when things went sideways. As Toaster, there has never been any loyalty asked or offered on either side.

    If a situation forced me to rely upon the someone, Ardon would be my choice, followed by Chandea or paying Groffnar enough to overlook his PTSD for a one-shot. The leadership competence of any of the others? I'm running away...
    Odie destroyed an army of parasites. Ardon wiped out a group that while dangerous, they could have easily negotiated with, eliminated a genuinely remorseful man and killed two innocents while doing it in a completely unnecessary fashion. Plus while he is a good tactician, half the time he gets extremely lucky and relies on other people bailing him out (such as Peanut responding to his commands). Also, he has absolutely no right to complain about their disloyalty when he treats them like garbage all the time - and Ell actively was risking her life to save him regardless - even though she knew about the crimes he had been banished for all along.

    Ardon is smart *in the moment*. But he has no self-control and is constantly kneecapping his party's long term prospects. Plus, keeping the nightmare demon thing a secret was hugely self-interested - he only needs to go unconscious, so if any of the party members thought "the situation calls for me knocking Ardon temporarily unconscious with an AoE attack to hit a bunch of enemies at the same time" - then they will have unknowingly doomed all of them. It's massively stupid to just keep that thing inside himself. He should go to Ell, ask for her family's help in removing it, and be done with it. But because his pride prevents him from relying on anyone else, he'd never go for that.

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