Dreamscarred Press - Path of War Expanded! (Thread VII)

[ErrantX]

The Path of War continues onward!

Within the pages of this tome, your options for martial characters more than double! Within Path of War Expanded you will find more maneuvers, stances, and feats for your existing martial disciples as well as a host of new options! There are new classes, archetypes, martial traditions, and even the new class template that provides a way to use a single archetype for different character classes.

Within Path of War Expanded, you will find:

• Three new base classes, from the ill-omened harbinger, to the psychic zealot, and finally the arcane mystic who all mix supernatural elements into their martial combat styles.
• Nine new martial disciplines
• A host of archetypes for the three classes from Path of War and the three new classes
• Martial archetypes for core classes
• Class templates, which provides archetypes that work across multiple classes
• Martial style feats
• More martial traditions

And new and optional rules and clarifications to martial combat that will take your martial characters to a whole new level!
Come and enjoy the spoils of battle with Path of War Expanded!

Table of Contents for the project:

- The Harbinger, a melee control class that uses superior mobility and crippling status effects to command the battlefield. These warriors understand grief and anger on a personal level and translate that understanding into deadly curses and reality-warping swordplay. Harbinger also has two archetypes available in beta. The Crimson Countess emphasizes the Claim mechanic to take her rage out on her victims, while the Ravenlord creates a shadowy servant that aids him in battle. A new archetype, the Bleak Emissary, is available for beta testing. The Omen Rider archetype, a mounted warrior archetype, is available for beta testing. Harbinger introduces two new disciplines: Cursed Razor and Shattered Mirror

- The Zealot, a psionic guardian who leads his party into battle with the power of his passions and their own collective bond. These psionic initiators augment their maneuvers with power points and aid their party members with telepathy. Zealot introduces the Eternal Guardian and Sleeping Goddess disciplines. Zealot archetypes are found within this document.

- The Mystic, a melee support class that uses unstable arcane energies to unleash beneficial magic on his allies and scourge his enemies with the power of the elements. Mystics are founts of energy that they vent through martial discipline and intuition rather than through spells. Mystic will introduce the Elemental Flux and Riven Hourglass disciplines. Mystic archetypes are found at the bottom of the document.

But wait, there's more!

- Dreamscarred Press is happy to announce Class Templates, archetypes that can be applied to more than one class. Class Templates represent ideas too broad for a single-class archetype, letting you create very different versions of the same somewhat broad idea. The three introduced in Path of War Expanded are the Bushi, Privateer, and Hussar, for all of your samurai, pirate, and mounted warrior needs. At the end of the document you'll find the Mithral Current discipline as well.

Discipline List! (in no particular order)

- The Eternal Guardian discipline

-The Sleeping Goddess discipline

- The Cursed Razor discipline

- The Shattered Mirror discipline

- The Mithral Current discipline

- The Riven Hourglass discipline, available for open beta.

- The Elemental Flux discipline is available for open beta.

- Piercing Thunder is available for open beta.

- Tempest Gale, a new ranged discipline, is now in beta!

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Prestige Classes!
Animus Adept - Here! Have some glyphs!
Phoenix Champion - Silver Crane fun with bows!
The Landsknect - Einhander defender!

Other Stuff!

Path of War Expanded - Systems and Use Expanded - Favored class bonuses, new options for old classes, and more!


Path of War: Expanded Archetypes Document

All the Feats for Path of War: Expanded!

Martial Tradition

- On the agenda: Favored class and racial abilities, traits, more feats, prestige classes, monster stuff, and more!

Dreamscarred Press - FAQ! Check out the answers here!

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Thread1, Thread2, Thread3, Thread4, Thread5, Thread6

It's been an amazing ride so far, and the support from the community for this project has been overwhelming and very touching. We couldn't have gotten this far without you guys, and I hope the Path of War line can continue to be an addition to your tables. With that said, I declare this thread to be officially open!

[Kaidinah]

First for Fayelin is best girl.

[ghanjrho]

Two more releases until the big one!

[Desril]

Hey, I've got a question and the guy I usually go to for DSP stuff is sleeping so I thought I'd try here;


Is there a good Brawler equivalent initiator class/archetype?

Steelfist Commando is close enough for most circumstances, but the game I'm building this for already has 2 Warlords so I don't want to use it, also I like the Brawler's Martial Flexibility and full unarmed strike progression more than Greater Unarmed Strike's.

[Lord_Gareth]

As a reminder to folks, Anthony & I have written some fiction, and you can look forward to some other Path of War related short stories as well.

[Taveena]

Hey, I've got a question and the guy I usually go to for DSP stuff is sleeping so I thought I'd try here;


Is there a good Brawler equivalent initiator class/archetype?

Steelfist Commando is close enough for most circumstances, but the game I'm building this for already has 2 Warlords so I don't want to use it, also I like the Brawler's Martial Flexibility and full unarmed strike progression more than Greater Unarmed Strike's.

Currently the Steelfist Commando is the only real option. Stalker can get IUS and SUS with an Art, but they're not really built to be quite as tanky. Aurora Soul is probably a bit too magical.

My personal suggestion - if the flexibility is what you're after - is to go for an Aegis with Initiator's Soul, letting you change your maneuvers known every day. If it's the thematics you're hoping for, Myrmidon can be VERY effective and has access to Broken Blade for maximum punching. And is compatible with pretty much every Fighter archetype.

[Milo v3]

Is there a good Brawler equivalent initiator class/archetype?

Steelfist Commando is close enough for most circumstances, but the game I'm building this for already has 2 Warlords so I don't want to use it, also I like the Brawler's Martial Flexibility and full unarmed strike progression more than Greater Unarmed Strike's.

Unfortunately no.

Currently the Steelfist Commando is the only real option. Stalker can get IUS and SUS with an Art, but they're not really built to be quite as tanky. Aurora Soul is probably a bit too magical.

My personal suggestion - if the flexibility is what you're after - is to go for an Aegis with Initiator's Soul, letting you change your maneuvers known every day. If it's the thematics you're hoping for, Myrmidon can be VERY effective and has access to Broken Blade for maximum punching. And is compatible with pretty much every Fighter archetype.

None of those options have full-unarmed progression though.

[Taveena]

No. No, they do not. I guess DSP didn't want to get rid of the one niche Monks had - abusing large weapon dice with real and virtual size increases.

[ghanjrho]

Greater unarmed Strike helps.

[Nyaa]

Animus Adept:

Magical Aptitude?
Animus Pool: "At the end of any round in which the mystic initiates a maneuver"
Mystical Prowess: does it grant access to new tiers of glyphs?
I can't decide if AA gets too much glyphs or if there are too few on the list. 5th level AA knows all basic glyphs, and doesn't know two advanced and master.

[EldritchWeaver]

No. No, they do not. I guess DSP didn't want to get rid of the one niche Monks had - abusing large weapon dice with real and virtual size increases.

I wouldn't mind. With my houserules (using SoP and PoW classes, not using core classes, where possible) I've thrown out 4 of the core classes completely. So another one would be just a step towards the final solution!

[amberlink]

Can't seem to find an answer anywhere else, so for the first Path of War, Pugilist's stance, the short version mentions it scaling while the long one doesn't. Which is correct?

[Elricaltovilla]

Can't seem to find an answer anywhere else, so for the first Path of War, Pugilist's stance, the short version mentions it scaling while the long one doesn't. Which is correct?

It should scale. Although it's important to note that after PoW:E is complete we'll be reviewing the old disciplines for errata, so the rate of scaling may change.

[Dragonus45]

So I had more of a general PoW question. If I get to level 14 or so then dip a level into an initiator class can I use the maneuvers I get that level to qualify for higher level maneuvers? I remember this being answered in the old DSP forums but those are gone now and I had some people wanting it clarified.

[Elricaltovilla]

So I had more of a general PoW question. If I get to level 14 or so then dip a level into an initiator class can I use the maneuvers I get that level to qualify for higher level maneuvers? I remember this being answered in the old DSP forums but those are gone now and I had some people wanting it clarified.

What do you mean "qualify for higher level maneuvers"? If you meet the prerequisites of a maneuver you can take that maneuver. That includes meeting the IL and number of maneuvers prerequisites. If you went say Fighter 14/Stalker 1, your stalker IL would be 8, qualifying you for 4th level maneuvers. You could take any maneuver of up to 4th level that you meet the prerequisites for. Now, 3rd and 4th level maneuvers have a prerequisite of "1 other maneuver from this discipline" which means you'd need at least 1 maneuver/stance of 1st or 2nd level from that discipline before you could take any 3rd or 4th level maneuvers, but once you have that you can use your other maneuvers known to learn 3rd and 4th level maneuvers.

[Dragonus45]

What do you mean "qualify for higher level maneuvers"? If you meet the prerequisites of a maneuver you can take that maneuver. That includes meeting the IL and number of maneuvers prerequisites. If you went say Fighter 14/Stalker 1, your stalker IL would be 8, qualifying you for 4th level maneuvers. You could take any maneuver of up to 4th level that you meet the prerequisites for. Now, 3rd and 4th level maneuvers have a prerequisite of "1 other maneuver from this discipline" which means you'd need at least 1 maneuver/stance of 1st or 2nd level from that discipline before you could take any 3rd or 4th level maneuvers, but once you have that you can use your other maneuvers known to learn 3rd and 4th level maneuvers.

My question was about the second bit, the minimum known maneuvers. Specifically can I count a maneuver learned that level towards the prerequisite to take the 4th level one. I swear I remember a post on the old forums where they mentioned you couldn't, you had to take at least a second level in the class to get to them, but those are gone now and I wanted some clarification.

[Elricaltovilla]

My question was about the second bit, the minimum known maneuvers. Specifically can I count a maneuver learned that level towards the prerequisite to take the 4th level one. I swear I remember a post on the old forums where they mentioned you couldn't, you had to take at least a second level in the class to get to them, but those are gone now and I wanted some clarification.

Ah. To clarify that point then: You need at least 1 maneuver or stance from the discipline before you can take that 4th level maneuver. Once you have that 4th level maneuver though, you can swap out that 2nd level maneuver later though and still keep your 4th level maneuver because it counts as its own prerequisite.

Yeah, it's pretty confusing. Let me know if this helps any.

[Dragonus45]

Ah. To clarify that point then: You need at least 1 maneuver or stance from the discipline before you can take that 4th level maneuver. Once you have that 4th level maneuver though, you can swap out that 2nd level maneuver later though and still keep your 4th level maneuver because it counts as its own prerequisite.

Yeah, it's pretty confusing. Let me know if this helps any.

Not really, I know that I need at least one from the same discipline, I'm just wondering if during this high level dip I can count a maneuver I gain that level as the prerequisite maneuver or if I have to wait till I take a second level of the class.

[Elricaltovilla]

Not really, I know that I need at least one from the same discipline, I'm just wondering if during this high level dip I can count a maneuver I gain that level as the prerequisite maneuver or if I have to wait till I take a second level of the class.

No, you do not need a second level of the class in order to take that 4th level maneuver, provided you also take at least one other maneuver from the same discipline that does not have a prerequisite.

[Dragonus45]

No, you do not need a second level of the class in order to take that 4th level maneuver, provided you also take at least one other maneuver from the same discipline that does not have a prerequisite.

Huh, thats weird, I could have sword that there was a post on the old DSP forums that said otherwise. Now to try and convince a GM that half initiator level on non itiating classes isn't over powered.

[Taveena]

So at present in PoW it's really hard to be a TWF Ranged character, what with the only disciplines and feats supporting that being explicitly restricted to melee. Any chance of a Thrashing Dragon Pounce-alike for ranged characters at some point? Presumably, y'know, not soon. Just... I really like dual pistol/crossbow wielders, and... also the arguably more feasible double-thrower builds.

I dunno. Just something for the future, maybe.

[twas_Brillig]

So at present in PoW it's really hard to be a TWF Ranged character, what with the only disciplines and feats supporting that being explicitly restricted to melee. Any chance of a Thrashing Dragon Pounce-alike for ranged characters at some point? Presumably, y'know, not soon. Just... I really like dual pistol/crossbow wielders, and... also the arguably more feasible double-thrower builds.

I dunno. Just something for the future, maybe.

Actually, would people homebrewing things like this (i.e. maneuvers that have demand but aren't slated for immediate, official development), testing them in their own games, and reporting back be helpful? Or would that be a licensing mess?

[Taveena]

Actually, would people homebrewing things like this (i.e. maneuvers that have demand but aren't slated for immediate, official development), testing them in their own games, and reporting back be helpful? Or would that be a licensing mess?

I mean DSP does have a submission forum exactly for this kinda thing, but I'm a little leery of this SPECIFIC instance because it can't really work as a discipline-based Style feat (what with all of them being taken), so it's hard to homebrew up an exact analogue - plus they're mostly wrapping up now.

I mean, one possibility is just to change Thrashing Dragon Pounce to function with ranged attacks. Maybe even Thrashing Dragon Whirlwind, but I'm less certain about that - if it was 'within one range increment' then it's just a much wider radius. I guess 'all adjacent enemies' could also work but it feels like a weird restriction when you can hit someone further away with a spear than you can with a pistol.

[Dusk Eclipse]

It could work as a combination feat ala Elemental Current or Electrum Manticore, something like "When you are in a Solar Wond/Tempest Gale stance and using the Thrashing Dragon Style you may intiate melee strikes with thrown weapons within the first two range increments".

Wording definitely can use a lot of polishing, buy you get the idea (hopefully)

[Taveena]

It could work as a combination feat ala Elemental Current or Electrum Manticore, something like "When you are in a Solar Wond/Tempest Gale stance and using the Thrashing Dragon Style you may intiate melee strikes with thrown weapons within the first two range increments".

Wording definitely can use a lot of polishing, buy you get the idea (hopefully)

Ooh, that's a pretty sweet solution. "When you are in a Solar Wind or Tempest Gale stance, you may initiate Thrashing Dragon maneuvers that require a melee attack using ranged attacks instead. This does not allow you to make a ranged attack with a weapon not normally capable of it."

Unfortunately I can't think of a word relating to both sun and storms. Meteoric?

EDIT: Added in a line to clarify it doesn't change whether a weapon is melee or ranged.

[Jurai]

Solar Typhoon
Primeval Bolt
Primordial Storm
Raging Tempest
Furious Gust
Blazing Wrath
Angered Sun

[Taveena]

I think the main focus is on the ranged discipline plus thrashing dragon, so SOME kind of beast of legend should be involved in the name.

STORMYWORD Wyvern, or something.

EDIT: Maybe also "Whenever you initiate a Tempest Gale or Solar Wind strike that allows you to make a only single ranged attack, you can make an extra attack with your offhand weapon at your highest base attack bonus as a free action. If you do so, your attacks take two weapon fighting penalties as normal for fighting with two weapons."

I dunno. Is that too wordy?

[Jurai]

Squalling Wyvern.

[Taveena]

It's been brought to my attention that TWF Ranged is probably one of the strongest styles in PoW despite having no support, simply because standing back and full attacking is such a ridiculously strong option. Thrashing Dragon is also one of the Problem disciplines, so...

I dunno. It might be better to simply have it be "Whenever you initiate a strike that allows you to make a only single ranged attack, you can make an extra attack with your offhand weapon at your highest base attack bonus as a free action. If you do so, your attacks take two weapon fighting penalties as normal for fighting with two weapons." Exactly like TDP.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Perhaps a feat in the vein of Elemental Current/Electrum Manticores that allows to initiate Thrashing Dragon strikes with thrown weapons (within one or two range increments) while you are in a Tempest Gale stance?