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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    So I was working on some npcs and junk for my game to torment my PCs (typical dm fun) when I noticed that not only is the spell Aid *not* on the Paladin's spell list (weird given it suits a protective type warrior of light or dark if using the variants) but there is no spell of a higher level with a similar effect. By that I mean a sort of 'mana shield' type effect or a spell that provides a lump sum of temporary Hit Points to the target, likely with some morale bonuses to fight with as well.

    Now my questions are, has it been houseruled for Paladin's to get Aid before? And if I made a Greater Aid spell, let's say level 4 (so a paladin can get this version as well) How much would be too much at that point? Temporary Hit Points that are lost first are better than healing spells due to the safety in battle and save on actions.

    Proposed effects: target gains a +1 Morale bonus to attack rolls and saves against fear for every 4 caster levels (to a max of +5) and gains 5 temporary hit points per caster level (max 50) as well until they are lost or the spell ends.
    For clerics and Paladin's as a 4th level spell.

    I don't feel as bad about it being that strong when its half the hp restored from Heal (gained one level after) and at a lower cap based on caster level multiples.

    Duration would be 1 min/2 caster levels in this example.

    Also do any arcane variants exist for a sort of 'spell shield' magic?
    The only thing I've found is the actual Spell Shield Variant for Sorcerer's from Dungeon Scape (they lose a familiar and can make concentration checks to lose a slot, reducing damage they take by slot level x5)
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  2. - Top - End - #2
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    AmberVael's Avatar

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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    You need to make this a 3rd level spell so you can make potions out of it. If you can't make Greateraid potions then I will be incredibly disappointed.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by AmberVael View Post
    You need to make this a 3rd level spell so you can make potions out of it. If you can't make Greateraid potions then I will be incredibly disappointed.
    Um...Aid itself is level 2. Making a greater anything should always be at least 2 levels above the normal/lesser version to make it actually be that much better. Besides as written, this thing sure as hell does not need to be a potion xD;
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    Ninja_Prawn's Avatar

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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryunosuke View Post
    Um...Aid itself is level 2. Making a greater anything should always be at least 2 levels above the normal/lesser version to make it actually be that much better. Besides as written, this thing sure as hell does not need to be a potion xD;
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  5. - Top - End - #5
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    ehhhh
    -doesn't really care for Gatorade anyways-
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  6. - Top - End - #6
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    Zaydos's Avatar

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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    I'd make it 5th level for clerics/4th for Paladins (also note that Heal is a 6th level spell so is currently 2 spell levels later). Also 3.5 or PF? Because 3.5 Paladin misses out on a lot of the power of the spell with CL 10 at 20th level, though I'm not sure on the best way to fix that.
    Peanut Half-Dragon Necromancer by Kurien.

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  7. - Top - End - #7
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydos View Post
    I'd make it 5th level for clerics/4th for Paladins (also note that Heal is a 6th level spell so is currently 2 spell levels later). Also 3.5 or PF? Because 3.5 Paladin misses out on a lot of the power of the spell with CL 10 at 20th level, though I'm not sure on the best way to fix that.
    ah crap, was afraid I remembered Heal wrong and I did consider making it cleric 5, paladin 4 because paladin's deserve good **** at their 4th level spells (draconic might is pretty nice too)

    and the intention is 3.5 rules.

    But also, an arcane spell for a temporary hit piont supply would also be nice if one exists anywhere.
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    Zaydos's Avatar

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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryunosuke View Post
    ah crap, was afraid I remembered Heal wrong and I did consider making it cleric 5, paladin 4 because paladin's deserve good **** at their 4th level spells (draconic might is pretty nice too)

    and the intention is 3.5 rules.

    But also, an arcane spell for a temporary hit piont supply would also be nice if one exists anywhere.
    3.5 you might want to do something so that paladins don't cap out at +2 morale bonus, just not sure what (best I'm thinking of is a clause doubling a paladin's CL for the spell which is... inelegant at best).

    As for the other only one that comes to mind is Personal range (False Life in case you were wondering).
    Peanut Half-Dragon Necromancer by Kurien.

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    Personal Silliness: Vote what Soulknife "Fix"/Inspired Class Should I make??? Past Work Expansion Caricatures.

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    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydos View Post
    3.5 you might want to do something so that paladins don't cap out at +2 morale bonus, just not sure what (best I'm thinking of is a clause doubling a paladin's CL for the spell which is... inelegant at best).

    As for the other only one that comes to mind is Personal range (False Life in case you were wondering).
    Hm...good point...could say that the morale bonus is +1 per 2 caster levels when used by a paladin instead?

    also False Life! that's it. though it replaces the +1 morale on attacks/saves vs fear for a d10 instead of d8. is there a stronger version yet officially or no?
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  10. - Top - End - #10
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    Zaydos's Avatar

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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryunosuke View Post
    Hm...good point...could say that the morale bonus is +1 per 2 caster levels when used by a paladin instead?

    also False Life! that's it. though it replaces the +1 morale on attacks/saves vs fear for a d10 instead of d8. is there a stronger version yet officially or no?
    Same elegance issue, but slightly reduced maybe. As for the other... Ruin Delver's Fortune is a 4th level spell in the Spell Comp which has 4 possible effects one of which is 4d8+Cha modifier temp hp for 1d4 rounds as an Immediate action, but other than that... not that I am immediately aware of.
    Peanut Half-Dragon Necromancer by Kurien.

    Current Projects:

    Group: The Harrowing Halloween Harvest of Horror Part 2

    Personal Silliness: Vote what Soulknife "Fix"/Inspired Class Should I make??? Past Work Expansion Caricatures.

    Old: My homebrew (updated 9/9)

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydos View Post
    Same elegance issue, but slightly reduced maybe. As for the other... Ruin Delver's Fortune is a 4th level spell in the Spell Comp which has 4 possible effects one of which is 4d8+Cha modifier temp hp for 1d4 rounds as an Immediate action, but other than that... not that I am immediately aware of.
    Hm, I can cool something up when I'm done eating then. I mostly need an arcane one for this dragon obsessed sorcerer im making that will spam draconic polymorph. The issue being d4 hit die aren't really hood behind a dragon's body xD

    also, thoughts on aid, greater?
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  12. - Top - End - #12
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Aid, Greater? Or somethiing similar?

    Here's the rough drafts of each. Though given the sheer power of the Draconic Might spell (one of the strongest combat buffs a paladin can get) I kind of feel like this is too weak...

    Aid, Greater
    Enchantment (Compulsion) [Mind-Affecting]
    Level: Clr 5, Pld 4
    Components: V, S, DF
    Casting time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Living creature touched
    Duration: 1 min./2 levels
    Saving Throw: None
    Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

    Aid, Greater grants the target a +1 morale bonus on attack rolls and saves against fear effects for every 4 caster levels (capping at +5; this occurs every 2 caster levels when cast by a Paladin), plus temporary hit points equal to caster level x5 (to a maximum of 50 temporary hit points at caster level 10th).



    Mana Shield
    Abjuration
    Level: Sor/Wiz 5
    Components: V, S, DF
    Casting time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Living creature touched
    Duration: 1 min./2 levels
    Saving Throw: None
    Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

    Mana Shield blesses the target with an invisible layer of protection made of raw magical energy that will take damage in their stead during battle. While this spell is in effect, you gain temporary hit points equal to caster level x10 (to a maximum of 100 temporary hit points at caster level 10th).
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