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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Uncle Pine's Avatar

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    Default [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Greetings Playgrounders,

    I was toying with the idea of a kobold tribe using quadrupedal* Colossal venerable dragonwrought kobolds Warriors as mounts and troop carriers, but I soon realized that these things would be too intelligent to serve as simple pack mules: assuming a standard array, they'd have an Int score of 13 or 14! Using the nonelite array (base 8 Int score) and the Pathetic (Int) flaw I can get the kobolds down to 9 Int, but it doesn't feel quite right yet.

    Is there a way to get a 4th level Colossal venerable dragonwrought kobold Warrior's Int score down to 2 or 4? Without pumping its CR too much, if possible. (EDIT: And readily available to a bunch of low level scaled freaks, like a kobold tribe.)

    *Quadrupedal is a +0 CR template from Advanced Bestiary (a 3rd party splatbook) without any ability adjustment.
    Last edited by Uncle Pine; 2015-12-05 at 10:23 AM.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Bestow greater curse from the Book of Vile Darkness takes an ability score of your choice down to 1, and has a duration of permanent.

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    d20 Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Likewise feeblemind will drop Intelligence and Charisma down to "1" and has an instantaneous duration; though it does have a catch:
    The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence- or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently. Still, it knows who its friends are and can follow them and even protect them.
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kraken View Post
    Bestow greater curse from the Book of Vile Darkness takes an ability score of your choice down to 1, and has a duration of permanent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Âmesang View Post
    Likewise feeblemind will drop Intelligence and Charisma down to "1" and has an instantaneous duration; though it does have a catch:
    I thought about Feeblemind and Bestow Curse, but none of them is readily available to a bunch of low level scaled freaks so I decided to avoid them. I'll edit the first post since I forgot to mention it.
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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Apply the DM's Homebrew Monster Template.

    Effects: whatever the DM wants.

    Problem solved.

    Seriously, just house rule that there is special breed of whateverthehellyouweremaking that has the traits you want.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    One interesting template for you is arachnoid creature, from Underdark. It's -4 int, with the stipulation that you can turn int to a nonability if you get all the way to zero. Edit: there's also the savage vampire template in Libra Mortis, -2 int, doesn't add CR. You could also do half-golem from Monster Manual 2, that's either -6 int or int becoming a nonability, depending on whether the process turns them into a construct.
    Last edited by Kraken; 2015-12-05 at 10:57 AM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Feral template from Savage Species has -6 Int, with lots of goodies for "warrior/pack-mule" types.

    +1 LA, if that's a factor.

    Edit: Sorry, you wanted CR...1-2, IIRC.
    Last edited by Rijan_Sai; 2015-12-05 at 12:07 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rijan_Sai View Post
    Feral template from Savage Species has -6 Int, with lots of goodies for "warrior/pack-mule" types.

    +1 LA, if that's a factor.

    Edit: Sorry, you wanted CR...1-2, IIRC.
    -4 Int actually, but hey I forgot about feral. It fits exactly what I had in mind! Thank you!
    Bonus points since it's an inherited template that can only be added to Humanoids and Monstrous humanoids so it works on kobolds even though Dragonwrought later changes their type to another one (Dragon), which is the kind of shenanigan that grinds people's gears.
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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Another templates with Int penalty:
    Corrupted -2
    Gheden -2
    Half-Minotaur -2
    Half-Ogre -2
    Half-Scrag -2
    Half-Troll -2

    How is he Colossal?

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    Default Re: [3.5] How to get low Int?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShurikVch View Post
    How is he Colossal?
    Kobolds with levels in NPC classes have a CR equal to their character level -3. Dragonwrought Kobolds, true or not, are Dragons and use true dragon's age categories per RotD. Thus, a Venerable Dragonwrought Kobold is a great wyrm dragon. ELH, under "Dragon, Advanced", states that dragons gain a "virtual age category" for every 3 HDs they gain beyond the great wyrm stage. As it's impossible to be a great wyrm Dragonwrought Kobold before 1st level (you need the Dragonwrought feat to qualify as a Dragon), a Venerable Dragonwrought Kobold gains a "virtual age category" at 4th, 7th, 10th, etc. levels. ELH also divides dragons in lesser (Tiny as a wyrmling), ordinary (Small as a wyrmling, never reaches Colossal), greater (Small to Large as a wyrmling, reaches Colossal by the great wyrm stage), or epic (force, prismatic). Clearly Dragonwrought Kobolds are in the ordinary group, as a wyrmling Dragonwrought Kobold is Small and it never reaches Colossal size. In the same paragraph, it's stated that an ordinary dragon becomes Colossal when it gains one age category (3 Hit Dice) beyond great wyrm. Thus, a Dragonwrought Kobold that reached the great wyrm stage (Venerable) at 1st level becomes Colossal at 4th level.
    Moreover, since "kobolds with levels in NPC classes have a CR equal to their character level -3", it's also a CR 1 creature (or more if templates like feral are added).

    Also, thank you for the list of templates.
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