Gestalt Aid

[Neon Knight]

I'd like aid in preparing a gestalt character. Level is 6. 15,000 Gold. Stats are rolled but the way he has it set up the lowest stat you can get is 9 and the highest 18. All core classes are available except for Paladin. Classes from Alternate sources are accepted on a case by case basis after close analysis.

I've decided on Sorcerer/X.

I need both to fill in the X and aid building my sorcerer half. I'd prefer something providing good unarmed fighting ability for the X. I've heard of an unarmed Swordsage variant that might fit the bill.

For the sorcerer, I'd prefer to take a mix of blasting and useful spells.

[Turcano]

Put cleric on the other side; the Cha for your sorcerer spellcasting synergizes with the cleric's turn undead, you get access to another spell list, and the cleric is decent (but not spectacular) for fighting, unless you cheese it up, in which case it's as good as a fighter. Fighting unarmed can be supplemented by touch attack spells (say, inflict X wounds). You do get some MAD, though, although not that much.

[Starsinger]

Or take Paladin, get full BAB, nice for ray and ranged touch attacks, Divine grace gives you your Charisma bonus to saves, you get a free horse, and the ability to do small amounts of healing, also based on your Charisma score. Perfect, especially if you play as a regular Sorcerer, with extra stuff.

[purepolarpanzer]

Sorceror swordsage is definatly good. Another good combination is sorceror monk, dealing touch spells with unarmed strikes to make some major blows.

[Turcano]

Or take Paladin, get full BAB, nice for ray and ranged touch attacks, Divine grace gives you your Charisma bonus to saves, you get a free horse, and the ability to do small amounts of healing, also based on your Charisma score. Perfect, especially if you play as a regular Sorcerer, with extra stuff.

Um, he specifically stated that paladin wasn't an option. That would have been my first suggestion otherwise.

[Starsinger]

Heh... how did I let that slip past me? Well now that I feel rather stupid... Hexblade does almost all of that, you get your Charisma bonus to saves against spells, still full BAB, but not as nice as a paladin.

[Neon Knight]

Sorceror swordsage is definatly good. Another good combination is sorceror monk, dealing touch spells with unarmed strikes to make some major blows.

I was thinking Sorcerer/Monk, but the DM warned that this campaign was gonna be tough (which is why we get Gestalt) and I felt that Monk might not be a wise decision.

[Starsinger]

Sorcerer/Monk might work, look in to Ascetic Mage feat from Complete Arcane

[Generic PC]

I would say Cleric would be nice, but it really depends on the rest of your party. Are people for sure going Fighter//Barbarian? stuff like that.

[Neon Knight]

Sorcerer/Monk might work, look in to Ascetic Mage feat from Complete Arcane

I lack Complete Arcane.

I possess ToB and Complete Warrior, however.

[Ponce]

Ascetic Mage is in Complete Adventurer, I think.

I'd go for Favored Soul from Complete Divine. It uses the Cleric spell list to cast divine spells, but it is a spontaneous, cha-based caster, like the sorcerer. Wisdom is still used for his spell DCs, however. Just stick to buffs.

[Starsinger]

Ascetic Mage is in Complete Adventurer, I think.

Probably... my brain has turned into potato salad or something. Favored soul is a good idea though. Rogue might not be bad either, charisma skills, lots of skill points, better BAB, sneak attack if you're gonna go for blasting.

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

Ascetic Mage is also on the internet.

[Callix]

If you have attributes to support this, a sorceror/spellwarp sniper (optional, Complete Scoundrel)//rogue is pretty darn awesome, with 3d6 sneak attacks off rays and Invisibility to boot. Or, if MAD's not a prob, Sorcerer//Monk has 3 good saves, awesome unarmored AC and lots of nice tricks like Touch of Fatigue/Exhaustion on a flurry, or Fireball on self + improved evasion.

[brian c]

I don't see what good Ascetic Mage is going to do, it's Gestalt, not multi-class. It wouldn't be a good idea to multi-class out of Sorcerer unless it's for a full-casting PrC.

At any rate, swordsage would be very nice. Take Desert Wind and that can replace some of your direct damage spells. Also, gestalt caster//martial adept is the easiest way into Jade Phoenix Mage, a very interesting PrC. It's only 3/5 caster levels I think, but this is gestalt.

Hm... what happens if you have Sorcerer // Monk/Jade Phoenix Mage ? Do you still get the +1 spellcasting level from JPM, or does it not overlap? I have a feeling it doesn't, in which case you should either find another PrC you like, or take a few more levels of Swordsage opposite the JPM levels that give spellcasting.

[CASTLEMIKE]

There are so many options available now.

A UA or Hypertext Spellcaster variant is sort of a sorcerer class fix and will give you access to all arcane and divine spells and your choice of primary ability Int, Wis or Char for your spellcasting ability plus a bonus feat at level 1 instead of a familiar (or a familiar if desired) plus more at levels 5, 10 and 15 and 20 if not PRCing on that side. Minor bonus is getting to choose two skills for knowing fewer than a standard sorcerer and fueling a reserve feat for general unlimited close range spell blasting. That is great for gestalt particularly with a Battle spellcaster variant granting D8 and average BAB base for other builds.

I saw the note regarding the paladin but a few levels (3 - 5) in a PRC "Alignment" Paladin from UA and the Hypertext might be useful since you would not be limited to LG although you lose a casting level at levels 2 and 4 for all the extra bennies like Divine Grace and you could add it on either side of the build.

Gestalt is a UA/Hypertext concept just like the spellcaster so it isn't to far out there and a wisdom based spellcaster monk would work hypertext corewise.

Going Druid/Spellcaster with Wisdom bonus is Super Tough and could be even more Killer and exactly what you are looking for particularly with a single level of monk and throw in a level of rogue and another in ninja take a feat to mix it up so it stacks for attacking. Don't forget the KILLER PLANAR SHEPHERD PRC ABUSE POTENTIAL in this PC.

Daily choice of Druid spells with Wildshaping and your animal companion plus now you can cherry pick the most interesting arcane and divine spells to meet your needs and offset your druidic spellcasting with D8, Average BAB, 4SPs plus the choice of Two Skills from the Spellcaster side.

There are neat feats with spelllike abilities like Godsight in Lost Empires of Faerun or Fey or Fiendish Presence and more powerful feats like Fey Legacy and Fiendish Legacy introduced in Complete Mage.

For spellcasting you can keep it simple by being one of the party healing batteries if you don't want to do a lot of messing around with spells. A single level in monk on one side gets you that killer Wisdom AC bonus that synergizes with Mage Armor and Natural armor. With all the feat options now you can cast spells while wild shaped in one of your forms protected by Mage Armor stacking with your Natural Armor and Wisdom bonus making you very hard to hit.

Wisdom - 18, the +0 Plane touched template grants you a +2 to Wisdom and Charisma equal to (+6 points in point buy for Wisdom alone), market price a Periapt of Wisdom +2 is 4,000 GP, a +4 is 16,000 GP and a +6 is 36,000 GP with Craft Wonderous item for your character or someone in the party you can have the +4 periapt now for half cost.

Otherwise buy the +2 periapt for 4,000 GP now your base wisdom is 18, +2 for planetouched, +1 for leveling and +2 for your periapt.

Get a Heward's Handy Haversack for 2,000 GP to hold your gear and treasure, a wand or two of cure light wounds at 750 GP each and a Tan Bag of Tricks for 6,300 GP (Perfect magic item for a Druid or Ranger) or Two if you have the Craft wonderous item in your party with other permanent and temporary magic items to taste a Gray or Rust Bag of Tricks is also nice for checking for traps and things. Lots of level one pearls of power usable by any party spellcaster and increases spellcasting options. 500 - 1,500 GP in assorted potions and scrolls hopefully consulting with other party members works really nice if you all contibute to a general party temporary magic item pool.

Consider mixing it up a bit on one side a level or two or even three in rogue for skill points and sneak attack plus evasion at level 2, a level in monk for wisdom bonus to AC and going Druid or Spellcaster for the rest.

An educated Wilder (Get 4 extra powers than a comparable Wilder over 20 levels Wizards did a Web article on it recently) with a level or two in Anarchic Initiate with Sorcerer/Spellcaster could work as a super blaster type and going with one of the King of Smack builds would fill all your criteria plus Inertial Armor scales up with power points as you level up which is nice.

An alt rogue changeling gets 10 SPs a level and some interesting abilities instead of trapsense at levels 1 and 3 along with sneak attack which would synergize nice using some of the monk and rogue variants to combine the damage with unarmed strike.

Consider Archivist and spellcaster using intelligence particularly if delaying a level or two and taking a level or two in rogue for skill points.........

One to Seven or Eight levels in MotAO or Guild Wizard of Waterdeep or other campaign PRC that provides some limited spell pool access for emergency situation spellcasting options would be helpful for limited known spells. Little things like casting the single daily Mage Armor spell.

A Spell Thief or a Psi warrior could be interesting on one side since you could choose your primary char or wis as a spellcaster.

Going the Ultimate Magus route on your sorcerer side with Beguiler could be nice also with an Intelligence based spellcaster would be nice for fueling a few daily quickened meta spells and give you a lot of options for the other side.

Taking an Elemental "arcane disciple" with turning like Air or Fire and if your DM will let you use that turning ability that accompanies the domain to fuel the divine spell feat (and choose persist spell) could be pretty sweet.

A UA hypertext spellcaster can learn the Anyspell at level 3 and the level Anyspell greater which grant the class a few more spell options with a spell book and 15 minutes.

Magic items are really dependent on your class levels for the best synergy.

The craft wonderous item feat or leadership feat in your build can increase your magic items for you and your party.

[Starsinger]

Charisma to Armor Class still applies, which is the only part of Ascetic Mage I was thinking of.

[Toliudar]

I'd echo Favoured Soul on the other side. Depending on your spell selections, it could provide good buffing to go with the sorcerer's offense, and the MAD is not as bad.

[Douglas]

Swordsage. The major limit for gestalt optimization is actions per round, so the greatest benefits from the second side are usually passive. Swordsage gives wisdom to AC, which can be converted to charisma to AC by Ascetic Mage, and also gets you (improved) evasion eventually, an initiative bonus, and a stance. The active maneuvers are just gravy.

[Bagera]

For good unarmed fighting consider going druid.

[Draz74]

If you're going to use a Tome of Battle class, maybe Crusader would be better than Swordsage? Seems like it would be more Charisma synergy. Plus, you know, full BAB and stuff.

[Ponce]

Swordsage is a martial class. Gestalting that with sorcerer results in having a melee gestalt character who does not have full BAB. Bad idea, in my opinion.

Full-blown divine spellcasting that uses the same stat as your sorcerer will provide better ways to defend yourself than to add your charisma to your AC. If you really want the AC bonus, take a level of Monk. The Swordsage route requires two levels of a class that won't really service you (as opposed to one level of a class that won't really service you), and you need to blow a feat on Improved Unarmed Strike (pretty useless, but at least the monk gets it for free), unless I am mistaken. You might also get the flat AC bonus from Monk (as a result of your sorc levels stacking), depending on how your DM wants to play the feat.

Taking the Archmage PrC would work well with Favored Soul, as the spellcasting bonuses are general, and not necessarily limited to the arcane spellcasting (such as Arcane Reach).

Amusingly enough, if you really want to run around with some barbaric weapon and smack things around for direct damage, use the Favored Soul levels to cast Divine Power and other such fun things. Toss around Greater Mighty Wallop and any other buffs that strike your fancy and go get em, tiger. You could also cast it on your bare fists if you take the Monk level. Yar.

[TheOOB]

There arn't all that many classes that gestalt well with sorcerer. Paladin and Blackguard do well, as does the favored soul(and other CHA based casters). Thing is, you need a class that has some CHA synergy, and also covers some of your weaknesses. It shold also be noted that in getsalt, playing a combat character without a full BAB is rather pointless. Gestalt characters tend to fight higher level opponents then their non-gestalt counterparts, so low BABs, Hit Die, and Saves hurt a lot.

[Tor the Fallen]

Cleric//Druid for the ultimate in casting and melee.

[Ponce]

Cleric//Druid for the ultimate in casting and melee.

I've decided on Sorcerer/X.

Wouldn't Cleric//Wizard be better at casting and making melee redundant anyway?

[Random NPC]

Sorcerer//Cleric 3 levels. then go Mystic Theurge//Monk with the ascetic mage feat for the remaining 3 levels.

Nice spellcasting while having +1 AC Bonus

[Callix]

need at least Sor4 to qualify for theurge, and it's strongly reccomended to disallow theurge in UA section on gestalt.

[Ninja Chocobo]

Sorcerer//Cleric 3 levels. then go Mystic Theurge//Monk with the ascetic mage feat for the remaining 3 levels.

Nice spellcasting while having +1 AC Bonus

Where's Morbo when you need him to say "Gestalt does not work that way!"?
Can't take hybrid classes.

[Turcano]

Where's Morbo when you need him to say "Gestalt does not work that way!"?
Can't take hybrid classes.

I aim to please:


GESTALT DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY!

[Dhavaer]

Ranger. You will have all good saves, 6 + Int skill points, full BAB and d8 hit die. The class abilities aren't a brilliant match, but Hide in Plain Sight combines very well with a spellcaster. Evasion's pretty handy, as well.