Otherworldly Patron: The Tarrasque

[DracoKnight]

So, the idea of making a pact with the Tarrasque came up in the 5e forum, and I said that I would homebrew it as an actual patron.

Here's the final draft of the Tarrasquelock PDF.

Designer's Notes
The spells were all chosen to reflect certain abilities of the tarrasque

1st level
- Absorb Elements: This spell was chosen to reflect the tarrasque's immunity to almost all damage types. Immunity to almost every damage type is way too powerful to hand out to any player, however resistance to an incoming damage type, with a slight damage bump? That's a nice substitute.
- Earth Tremor: the tarrasque's description says that it's 50ft tall and 70ft long. Something that big feels like it should have the ability to cast earthquake at will. This, however, is a nice way to represent the same effect for a PC.

2nd level
- Alter Self: the tarrasque has a myriad of natural attacks. Rather than list them all out in a class feature, I figured the better option is to add this to their spell list, since it gives the player natural weapons - in any form that they so desire.
- Enlarge/Reduce: the tarrasque is HUGE (gargantuan actually). Enough said.

3rd level
- Haste: the tarrasque is a physical terror, and its warlock seek to emulate that, and this spell aids in their quest.
- Slow: how do you make yourself even more terrifying? Punish your enemies for pissing you off. Slow is an awesome debuff, and can allow the player to feel like they're channeling the awesome might of their patron to foil their foes.

4th level
- Death Ward: warlocks of the tarrasque utilize this spell to annoy their foes in a rather childish manner: "You can't even hope to kill my patron, so why should you be able to kill me?"
- Freedom of Movement: there is no way in the Nine Hells that you're restraining the tarrasque, and this spell allows its warlocks to emulate that.

5th level
- Destructive Wave: some believe that the tarrasque is unleashed upon the world when the gods are angry (no, really, pg. 286 of the MM), and its warlocks are sure as hell going to convince you of that.
- Planar Binding: the warlocks of the tarrasque want even their extraplanar enemies to know and fear them. This spell allows them to make sure of it.

[McNinja]

I think it's pretty good, and actually something I would take. I think the 6th level ability is a bit strong, maybe simply resistance to spells, or perhaps allowing the current magic resistance as an activated ability once per short rest since the rest of the 6th level warlock abilities seem to be once per rest abilities. The 14th level ability is fine, especially since the Fiend ability takes an enemy out of the fight and deals 10d10 damage.

[Markoff Chainey]

Hi there! I really like you spell selection and the fluff! That's why I read carefully through the rest..

Siege Caster is the most OP stuff I saw in a long time... come on! A single dip and you double your damage output forever.. You must be specially careful with the first option because Warlock is such a good 2 lvl dip already with only EB + AB.

The lvl 14 ability is also way over the top. - That's not powercreep but haste-power-lunge-forward.

You should look at the other warlock options and come up with something that is comparable, both in power but also in gameplay-dynmamic. There is no other option where a result depends on a d6 throw like that and the power itself is always on.

Cheers and keep up the good work!

[DracoKnight]

Hi there! I really like you spell selection and the fluff!

I'm glad you like it Fluff is honestly something I usually struggle with.

That's why I read carefully through the rest..

Thank you for taking the time to

Siege Caster is the most OP stuff I saw in a long time... come on! A single dip and you double your damage output forever.. You must be specially careful with the first option because Warlock is such a good 2 lvl dip already with only EB + AB.

I thought it was somewhat balanced, since (in my experience at least) it's highly unlikely for players to be attacking objects or structures. I guess it does make it a really good dip for a fighter, or another martial...Maybe restrict it to attacks made with EB? That way Barbarians can't abuse it via rage, and Paladins can't abuse it via Divine Smite?

The lvl 14 ability is also way over the top. - That's not powercreep but haste-power-lunge-forward.

Maybe CHA mod per rest?

You should look at the other warlock options and come up with something that is comparable, both in power but also in gameplay-dynmamic. There is no other option where a result depends on a d6 throw like that and the power itself is always on.

I tried to, while keeping in line with the abilities of the tarrasque. The warlock is one of my favorite classes to homebrew for, because they have so much going on: offensive abilities, defensive abilities, an expanded spell list, invocations, etc., and I tried to keep the abilities of this somewhat in line (though, my first drafts are usually off).

1st Level: Warlocks usually get a flavorful at will feature here, with the exception of the Feylock, who gets a 1/rest feature. The other patrons get:

Temp HP on kill or crit (Dark One's Blessing; Fiend)
Telepathy (Awakened Mind; Great Old One)
Permanent sanctuary against undead (Among the Dead; Undying)

I felt that increased damage against objects/structures fit best here. Although, I do get your point. I will probably restrict it to damage dealt with EB.

6th level: Warlocks get a defensive 1/rest ability here. The ability I gave them here is too strong, or that's how I feel about it. I will alter it in some way, but I'm not sure how.

10th level: Warlocks get another defensive feature here. The ability I gave them is the Feylock's ability except against fear instead of charm.

14th level: Here's where the warlock gets something ridiculously good. Now, Reflective Carapace is better than the other options, and so I am going to alter it to make it CHA mod/long rest.

Cheers and keep up the good work!

Thanks! I will

[GandalfTheWhite]

Okay, admittedly, I didn't see this before you went through and made the changes you talked about, but it seems pretty decent now. I would allow players in my game to make a pact with a Tarrasque (provided they find one, and trust me, they don't want to - they're level 1).

Siege Caster is not OP. And honestly, it's the only thing that relates to the Tarrasque that you could possibly feel good about giving out at level 1.

[McNinja]

Hi there! I really like you spell selection and the fluff! That's why I read carefully through the rest..

Siege Caster is the most OP stuff I saw in a long time... come on! A single dip and you double your damage output forever.. You must be specially careful with the first option because Warlock is such a good 2 lvl dip already with only EB + AB.

Explain in detail how attacking objects and structures is OP, because I'm having a really hard time trying to wrap my mind around that statement.

[Corran]

Siege Caster is not OP. And honestly, it's the only thing that relates to the Tarrasque that you could possibly feel good about giving out at level 1.

I agree very much with this. I too think that the first creature should be expanded again to include melee attacks. It is very appropriate regarding the theme of this subclass. Sure, let people stack smites, and whatever else that can think of. Does anyone really think that expending resources in attacking (inanimate) objects and structures is op? Situationaly it could be extremelly useful, but then again that feels like a character with such a connection to the tarrasque should really be able to do. Definitely expend to include melee attacks (perhaps not ranged attacks or spells that dont deal force damage, EB and other force spells, and melee attacks seem good). And maybe restrict to inanimate objects. Maybe not. The way to answe this, is bu asking yourself, should a character with a connection to the tarrasque be able to kill a lot more easily animated objects? (perhaps in the case of animated objects give some benefit other than double damage).


Very good job Draconknight, I enjoyed reading throught it, I dont think any of the features are overpowered, especially the level 6 one that requires you to spend an action. I believe they are properly balanced. Maybe you could play a bot with the numbers for the lvl 14 ability, making it do nothing for 1-3, not affect you for 4-5, and send back for 6. Oh, and make that use your reaction!!!!

Really like the flavour of the lvl 10 feature, just imagine how awesome it will be in play. This feature should replace the aura of courage for oathbreakers.

[Markoff Chainey]

Sorry! I totally missed the "inanimate objects" part!! Yup... that makes it not OP at all.

I also think lvl 6 is fine, just the lvl 14 should be limited somehow and I am personally not a fan of the d6 mechanic, but not for the reason that it is too strong.

[DracoKnight]

Sorry! I totally missed the "inanimate objects" part!! Yup... that makes it not OP at all.

I also think lvl 6 is fine, just the lvl 14 should be limited somehow and I am personally not a fan of the d6 mechanic, but not for the reason that it is too strong.

Yup, it's just against inanimate objects.

I can understand not liking the d6 mechanic, but it's literally the mechanic they used in the ability I got this from.

[Requiemforlust]

Not gonna lie, this is pretty badass!

[MoleMage]

On reflective carapace, do you decide to use it when you are targeted and it counts as a use even if it does not succeed? Is it used every spell and counts as a use only if you succeed? Does it take a reaction?

Other than that this looks pretty balanced to me. I find it hard to imagine the tarrasque giving powers to mere mortals, but mechanically it is sound.

[ZenBear]

Great stuff Draco!

On the fluff, I think every Patron needs a reason to give power, a price they exact upon their beneficiaries. For the Tarrasque, perhaps the power gained by their Warlock drains it until it needs to feed and awakens, and now the Warlock is its primary target.

[DracoKnight]

Great stuff Draco!

On the fluff, I think every Patron needs a reason to give power, a price they exact upon their beneficiaries. For the Tarrasque, perhaps the power gained by their Warlock drains it until it needs to feed and awakens, and now the Warlock is its primary target.

That's actually really entertaining. But I think I would leave that up to the DM, or at least, not make the player aware of that... Since the current fluff is that you're looking for a pact with no repercussions. *tucks your suggestion into my bag of DM tricks* That's definitely gonna happen now

[theMycon]

Hi there!

So, I gotta ask- Robert Wilson fan, math nerd, or both?

[Wartex1]

Honestly, I think that Seige Caster needs a buff. It feels too much like a ribbon, since it really depends on DM allowance. Maybe have it affect monster constructs like Golems, even if it might be ineffectual in most situations?

[JNAProductions]

Siege Caster is basically a ribbon. I'd keep it, and just add something else-maybe some form of Tarrasque-esque resilience feature? An extra hit point per level alone might be good.

Magic Resistance seems fine. I actually might make it a bonus action-competes with Hex, then, not Eldritch Blast.

Monstrous Mind is all good.

Reflective Carapace also seems good.

Overall, nothing pops out as over or underpowered. I'd just say it needs some playtesting to be sure.

[Markoff Chainey]

So, I gotta ask- Robert Wilson fan, math nerd, or both?

both =)

rarely that one knows good ol' RAW these days..

[Waffle_Iron]

both =)

rarely that one knows good ol' RAW these days..

"under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being."

- R.A.W.


We're around. :)

[eastmabl]

For the 6th level ability, I'd change it from "rounds = cha modifier" to a flat one minute. It makes it stronger, but it falls more in line with 5e game design.

Likewise, with the Reflective Carapace ability, I'd suggest that you set a flat amount. For example, twice per short rest or something of that ilk.

But it's tight.

[DracoKnight]

For the 6th level ability, I'd change it from "rounds = cha modifier" to a flat one minute. It makes it stronger, but it falls more in line with 5e game design.

Okay, I made this change. Will playtest. It seemed fine in its previous incarnation, but we'll see how it fares this way.

Likewise, with the Reflective Carapace ability, I'd suggest that you set a flat amount. For example, twice per short rest or something of that ilk.

I think I'll leave that as CHA mod per long rest. Just because it's such a powerful ability. 2/rest = 6 times a day. CHA mod per long rest = 5 times a day MAX. Depending on how you're playing, you may never *need* above a +3 CHA. So, this one I am going to leave as written.

But it's tight.

I'm glad you like it

[GandalfTheWhite]

Personally, I believe it's fine now.

[DracoKnight]

Here's my PDF of the final draft of the Tarrasquelock

EDIT: Updated the link. I'll also put it in the OP.

[Logosloki]

I saw this earlier on my phone at work and wanted to read about the subclass before I said anything but I think there is one more spell you need to add to the expanded spell list. That spell would be Meld into Stone (3rd level, transmutation). One of the coolest thing about the tarrasque is that when it enters torpor it moves through stone to find itself a nice pozzy before going to sleep.

AMEND: I saw your final draft, I wish more people took as much care in presentation as you did :(

[Markoff Chainey]

I saw this earlier on my phone at work and wanted to read about the subclass before I said anything but I think there is one more spell you need to add to the expanded spell list. That spell would be Meld into Stone (3rd level, transmutation). One of the coolest thing about the tarrasque is that when it enters torpor it moves through stone to find itself a nice pozzy before going to sleep.

I think that would be awesome instead of "slow", because as a Warlock, you do not have many spell slots anyways and casting Haste is superior to Slow and there is hardly a situation when you want to cast both..

[JackPhoenix]

Just a note for Siege Caster: by RAW, Eldritch Blast can target only creatures, not objects

[DracoKnight]

Just a note for Siege Caster: by RAW, Eldritch Blast can target only creatures, not objects

Doesn't the wording of the feature change that? Specific beats General?

[MoleMage]

Doesn't the wording of the feature change that? Specific beats General?

You'll want to add a clause that says you can use Eldritch Blast to attack structures or objects (right now it only says when you do, making the usage implicitly allowed instead of explicitly allowed), but then yes it would.

(It's like how Monks in 3.5 aren't technically proficient in unarmed strikes, but no DM in their right mind would treat them as being non-proficient).

[DracoKnight]

You'll want to add a clause that says you can use Eldritch Blast to attack structures or objects (right now it only says when you do, making the usage implicitly allowed instead of explicitly allowed), but then yes it would.

Right. I will fix that.

(It's like how Monks in 3.5 aren't technically proficient in unarmed strikes, but no DM in their right mind would treat them as being non-proficient).

Oh. Yes. That sucks. I started in 5e, but over Christmas, I played in a 3.5 game. The DM was really dickish and didn't count my Monk character as proficient with his unarmed strikes. -_-

[MoleMage]

Oh. Yes. That sucks. I started in 5e, but over Christmas, I played in a 3.5 game. The DM was really dickish and didn't count my Monk character as proficient with his unarmed strikes. -_-

I didn't think anyone actually did that! I thought that was just a joke we made on nerdy forums such as this one. It's not like the monks are super overpowered even with unarmed strike proficiency being assumed.

[DracoKnight]

I didn't think anyone actually did that! I thought that was just a joke we made on nerdy forums such as this one. It's not like the monks are super overpowered even with unarmed strike proficiency being assumed.

She was really rude about it too. I wasn't proficient with my unarmed strikes, but the Wizard was getting away with all sorts of sh!t. It was annoying.

I didn't even realize that it was a joke on forums...maybe she was punking the new guy, but I don't know. She seemed like she was being legit.