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    Default Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Hi GiantITP,

    Here comes some more homebrew material i made! This time with a Celestial theme: the Celestial Bloodline and Celestial Patron. I tried to make them protection and healing archetypes for those that prefer classes other than the usual 'healer' classes (like me).

    Spoiler: Sorcerous Origin: Celestial Bloodline
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    Celestial Spellcasting (lvl1):
    Starting at 1st level, whenever you may learn a spell or cantrip from the Sorcerer spell list, you may instead learn a spell or cantrip from the Cleric spell list. These spells count as Sorcerer spells for you, and all your Sorcerer spells count as divine spells. You cannot cast any spells that deal necrotic damage.

    Divine Protection (lvl1):
    Also starting at 1st level, whenever you cast a spell that deals radiant damage, you gain THP equal to twice the spell slot expended.

    Healing Touch (lvl6):
    Beginning at 6th level, your divine touch can magically heal others. As an action, you may touch a creature and spend one or more sorcery points (maximum 5), restoring 10 hit points per Sorcery Point spend. If you spend 3 or more sorcery points on a single touch, target is also freed from any curse, disease, poison, blindness, or deafness it suffers.

    Angel Wings (lvl14):
    At 14th level, you gain the ability to sprout a pair of angel wings from your back, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create these wings as a bonus action on your turn. They last until you dismiss them as a bonus action on your turn.
    You can’t manifest your wings while wearing armor unless the armor is made to accommodate them, and clothing not made to accommodate your wings might be destroyed when you manifest them.

    Divine Aura (lvl18):
    Starting at 18th level, whenever you or a friendly creature within 30ft of you regains hit points from a magical source (such as spells), it regains additional hit points equal to your Charisma modifier.

    Spoiler: Warlock Patron: Celestial
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    Expanded Spell List
    Spell Level Spells
    1st Bless, Detect Good and Evil
    2nd Prayer of Healing, Spiritual Weapon
    3rd Aura of Vitality, Spirit Guardians
    4th Guardian of Faith, Death Ward
    5th Mass Cure Wounds, Dispel Good and Evil
    Celestial Ward (lvl1):
    Starting at 1st level, your patron grants you the ability to ward creatures from death. When a creature within 30ft of you is reduced to 0 hit points, you may use your reaction to instead reduce it to 1 hit point. You may use this feature once per long rest.

    Healing Touch (lvl6):
    Beginning at 6th level, you can channel the divine healing powers of your patron through your touch. You have a pool of healing points equal to 1/3 your Warlock level. As an action, you may spend one or more healing points to heal a creature you touch for an amount of d8’s equal to the amount of healing points you spend. All expended healing points are regained upon finishing a short or long rest.

    Devine Sanctuary (lvl10):
    Starting at 10th level, you patron grants you the ability to grant sanctuary to you and those around you. You may meditate for one hour, which can be done during a short or long rest, and select an amount of creatures within 30ft of you (including you). Those creatures gain the effects of the Sanctuary spell for one hour, or when it ends early as stated by the Sanctuary spell.

    Celestial Aid (lvl14):
    At 14th level, you have learned how to call Celestials to your aid. You learn the Planar Ally and Conjure Celestial spells, and may use your Mystic Arcanum spell slots to cast these spells at their lowest levels. Planar Ally is directed at your patron, and your patron only sends Celestials to aid you.

    As always, any comments are welcome. Especially the Celestial Patron expanded spell list might need some tweeking, so suggestions are welcome (please do explain why it fits in your opinion)

    EDIT (29-2-2016): Made some minor changes as pointed out in the comments. Changed how the Sorcerer's Healing Touch works with SP, and added the remove condition part.
    EDIT (1-3-2016): Changed the name of Divine Intervention to Celestial Intervention, and changed the fluff a tiny bit.
    EDIT (5-4-2016): Changed Celestial Intervention to Celestial Aid for the 14th lvl feature of the Celestial Patron.
    Last edited by RakiReborn; 2016-04-05 at 07:29 AM.
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    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    No problems with these ones, all balanced? :)
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Under the Warlock expanded spell list, I would change Banishment to Death Ward, since Banishment is already a Warlock spell, and Death Ward seems to fit with the theme you are going for here.
    Jesus saves, everyone else takes 4d6.


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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    My only issue with what is being presented is this line in the sorcerer's celestial spellcasting.

    These spells count as Sorcerer spells for you, and all your Sorcerer spells count as divine spells
    Issue being that this is mostly meaningless. Arcane and Divine spells are not system terms as they were in 3.5, so this line is essentially clutter. Even the "count as sorcerer spells for you" bit doesn't really mean anything either.
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    The Sorcerer's Healing Touch could do with a boost, given that it's not really a better option than spending 2+ sorcery points to cast Cure Wounds. I'd suggest either making it a bonus action and usable arbitrarily often, or making it like the Life Cleric's channel divinity (you spend so many sorcery points, get so much HP per point spent, and distribute it among nearby creatures as you like).

    The Warlock's version is more reasonable because it adds a new resource, rather than competing for sorcery points. You need to say how often it recharges, though.
    Last edited by weaseldust; 2016-02-28 at 09:11 AM.

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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Divine Aura should specify 'friendly creature', otherwise you'll be healing all the monsters you come across.

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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by CartmanTuttle View Post
    Under the Warlock expanded spell list, I would change Banishment to Death Ward, since Banishment is already a Warlock spell, and Death Ward seems to fit with the theme you are going for here.
    Well spotted! Not much expansion if it is there already right? :P Totally overlooked that one while checking the spell list. Although Death Ward is fitting for the theme, the 1st level feature is sort of alike (powered down a lot though), and i dont want to make that one redundant... Do you think it steps on the features toes? Or wouldn't it be a problem to add it to the expanded list?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draken View Post
    My only issue with what is being presented is this line in the sorcerer's celestial spellcasting.
    Issue being that this is mostly meaningless. Arcane and Divine spells are not system terms as they were in 3.5, so this line is essentially clutter. Even the "count as sorcerer spells for you" bit doesn't really mean anything either.
    For most campains it won't matter, and it would just be a little fluff. In my campain it will matter though, as i will have some 'godless' places where divine magic wont work, and the same for arcane.

    Quote Originally Posted by weaseldust View Post
    The Sorcerer's Healing Touch could do with a boost, given that it's not really a better option than spending 2+ sorcery points to cast Cure Wounds. I'd suggest either making it a bonus action and usable arbitrarily often, or making it like the Life Cleric's channel divinity (you spend so many sorcery points, get so much HP per point spent, and distribute it among nearby creatures as you like).

    The Warlock's version is more reasonable because it adds a new resource, rather than competing for sorcery points. You need to say how often it recharges, though.
    Glad the Warlock one is good. I think i will make it once per short or long rest. What do you think is a good recharge?
    The sorcerer one i fully agree on. I am thinking of making it a touch that heals either 5 or 10 per sorcery point, and when you spend 3 or more SP the target is also freed from any curse, disease, poison, blindness, or deafness (like the angels do standard with their healing touch). I'm not sure whether that would make it too powerful though. And i am not sure on the exact amount of HP per SP - 5 seems too few, 10 seems too much. And not sure whether i should cap it or not (thinking of maybe capping it at 50hp per touch).

    Quote Originally Posted by GanonBoar View Post
    Divine Aura should specify 'friendly creature', otherwise you'll be healing all the monsters you come across.
    Good point, will edit it in the OP! ^^
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Isn't Divine Intervention (the name, not the ability) already the name of a cleric class feature? Not sure you'd want to duplicate.
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Made the changes in the OP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Composer99 View Post
    Isn't Divine Intervention (the name, not the ability) already the name of a cleric class feature? Not sure you'd want to duplicate.
    I missed that completely. I have no clue how to name it though. Any ideas? The fluff is pretty much that you call for a divine entity, which your patron sends you as a way of helping you.
    And is the balance of the feature OK? It is essentially casting a 7th lvl spell through a 5th level slot once a day. Not sure if that is under- or overpowered, or balanced... The slot burn for the feature is mostly because i really wanted the ability, but granting a free lvl7 spell once a day at 14th was waaaaay overpowered... :P
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Expanding the sorcerer's list to include all cleric spells seems a tad too much. UA's Favored Soul was on the right track, though maybe a bit too powerful. Choosing a domain should be alright. But in such way, that a Celestial sorcerer would only expand their list of spells (very much like warlocks) to those granted by the domain, instead of gaining bonus spells known.
    Likewise they shouldn't gain any actual domain features like clerics, just the spell access.

    Or, if you're adamant about the cleric list, just change the sorcerer's list to cleric's list, and leave it there. without access to any domains, of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by RakiReborn View Post
    I missed that completely. I have no clue how to name it though. Any ideas? The fluff is pretty much that you call for a divine entity, which your patron sends you as a way of helping you.
    Maybe Celestial Intervention? :P doesn't change much of the intended effect, but is different enough, imho.
    Last edited by Arkhios; 2016-03-01 at 12:45 AM.

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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    Expanding the sorcerer's list to include all cleric spells seems a tad too much. UA's Favored Soul was on the right track, though maybe a bit too powerful. Choosing a domain should be alright. But in such way, that a Celestial sorcerer would only expand their list of spells (very much like warlocks) to those granted by the domain, instead of gaining bonus spells known.
    Likewise they shouldn't gain any actual domain features like clerics, just the spell access.

    Or, if you're adamant about the cleric list, just change the sorcerer's list to cleric's list, and leave it there. without access to any domains, of course.
    I did make some restrictions to come with it - no necromancy spells. Thats 9 sorcerer spells and 15 cleric spells (some are on both lists, but most aren't, and they include some more than decent spells like finger of death and resurecction spells). You do still have a point that is may be too potent, but i dont really like restricting it to the domain spells, as that takes a lot of versatility away that i was going for. I do want to say that i dont think it is that strong - you have extra options, but still only 15 spells total to take, which is not much at all. Choosing your spells is already a hard call as a sorcerer, and this makes it even harder. I dont really know how to go with the additional spell list yet, but am thinking about it. I might just make a list out of the cleric list with 1-3 spells of each level. Or go with your idea of completely changing it. Hard call, so it need to sleep over it for a bit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    Maybe Celestial Intervention? :P doesn't change much of the intended effect, but is different enough, imho.
    Sounds good enough right now. Will change the OP.
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by RakiReborn View Post
    Glad the Warlock one is good. I think i will make it once per short or long rest. What do you think is a good recharge?
    Per short rest sounds fine.


    Quote Originally Posted by RakiReborn View Post
    The sorcerer one i fully agree on. I am thinking of making it a touch that heals either 5 or 10 per sorcery point, and when you spend 3 or more SP the target is also freed from any curse, disease, poison, blindness, or deafness (like the angels do standard with their healing touch). I'm not sure whether that would make it too powerful though. And i am not sure on the exact amount of HP per SP - 5 seems too few, 10 seems too much. And not sure whether i should cap it or not (thinking of maybe capping it at 50hp per touch).
    The Life Cleric gets 5*level every short rest, and twice per short rest from level 6 on, on top of their spellcasting. So 10 HP per sorcery point seems tame by comparison. But 5+cha would also make sense. That puts it about on a level with Cure Wounds. Given that you can twin it, you could already get 2*Cure Wounds for the equivalent of 3 sorcery points, so a 1:1 ratio between Cure Wounds and sorcery points sounds like a reasonable ratio for an ability that should improve on what the Sorcerer can already do.

    I don't see the point in capping the amount they can heal. If they want to blow all their sorcery points on that, why stop them? It won't be a very efficient use of them. I do like the idea of mimicking Lesser Restoration/the celestial ability, though.


    I meant to comment on Divine Intervention (now Celestial Intervention) and forgot. I'd suggest Planar Ally instead of Conjure Celestial because it is a lower level spell, comes with roleplay potential, and allows for more varied summons. I also think casting it should require expending one of your mystic arcana. It doesn't seem right to allow the Warlock to expend a 5th-level slot to cast a higher-level spell.

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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by weaseldust View Post
    Per short rest sounds fine.
    Great, done! :)

    Quote Originally Posted by weaseldust View Post
    The Life Cleric gets 5*level every short rest, and twice per short rest from level 6 on, on top of their spellcasting. So 10 HP per sorcery point seems tame by comparison. But 5+cha would also make sense. That puts it about on a level with Cure Wounds. Given that you can twin it, you could already get 2*Cure Wounds for the equivalent of 3 sorcery points, so a 1:1 ratio between Cure Wounds and sorcery points sounds like a reasonable ratio for an ability that should improve on what the Sorcerer can already do.

    I don't see the point in capping the amount they can heal. If they want to blow all their sorcery points on that, why stop them? It won't be a very efficient use of them. I do like the idea of mimicking Lesser Restoration/the celestial ability, though.
    So 10 should be fine. It is already stronger than Cure Wounds (even with twinning) with spending 2SP (lvl1slot), and gets exponentially stronger, but i think that that is fine, as it takes your precious SP. Although i still have a slight thought in the back of my head that it is still too strong. But looking at the strenght of the life cleric feature and the paladin lay on hands, it should be about the same strenght. And the cap is so it isn't that extremely potent in combat, but more of an out of combat thing, but i could remove the cap (doesnt matter to me that much either way, just dont want it to become too strong). Do others feel the same about the cap? And glad you like the remove status part :)

    Quote Originally Posted by weaseldust View Post
    I meant to comment on Divine Intervention (now Celestial Intervention) and forgot. I'd suggest Planar Ally instead of Conjure Celestial because it is a lower level spell, comes with roleplay potential, and allows for more varied summons. I also think casting it should require expending one of your mystic arcana. It doesn't seem right to allow the Warlock to expend a 5th-level slot to cast a higher-level spell.
    I do like Planar Ally now that i have read it, but it seems weak to just give that option. In comparison, you can get Conjure Minor Elementals as an invocation, which gives about the same effect you discribe, but it is the strenght of about half a level feature. Here's an idea:
    How about i make it so you learn the Planar Ally and Conjure Celestial spells, and you may use your Mystic Arcanum spell slots to cast them at their lowest level? It feels more balanced to give both the spells if it takes the spell slot of its level. This way it works somehow like Magical Secrets (Bard), but a little weaker as you cant choose the spells, but that is fine imo since the 6+ spells of a Warlock work differently anyway. I could call it 'Celestial Aid' (covers both spells better imo).
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Made the change to the Warlock Celestial Patron as said in my post above. How do you guys and gals feel about it now? Is it strong enough as a capstone, or perhaps too strong?
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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by RakiReborn View Post
    Made the change to the Warlock Celestial Patron as said in my post above. How do you guys and gals feel about it now? Is it strong enough as a capstone, or perhaps too strong?
    I think these are pretty cool and in general balanced

    Only Angel Wings should be something more unique. Now it's kinda as the Dragonic and the Storm can fly too
    Last edited by PoeticDwarf; 2016-04-05 at 01:55 PM.

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    Default Re: Celestial Sub-Classes: Sorcerer & Warlock [PEACH]

    Quote Originally Posted by EnderDwarf View Post
    I think these are pretty cool and in general balanced

    Only Angel Wings should be something more unique. Now it's kinda as the Dragonic and the Storm can fly too
    For the Celestial subclasses i mostly looked at the angels in the MM, and those all had nice wings. I do agree that it is anóther flying thing, so i thought about it for the last two days. A friend of mine came with a nice idea: Divine Punishment - which ups the minimum damage you do at a creature you use it on for an x amount of time. I made this of it:

    Divine Punishment (lvl14):
    Starting at 14th level, you may call divine punishment upon a creature. As an action you may point at a creature calling divine punishment upon it. For one minute, whenever a damage die is rolled against that creature, if the damage of the die is less than half your Charisma modifier (rounded up), it instead deals damage equal to half your charisma modifier (rounded up). You can use this feature once per long rest. If you use this feature against a good alligned creature, you lose your spellcasting feature and all features from the Celestial sub-class for 24 hours.

    I think it still needs some balancing, but its a first draft. I am thinking of making it cost 5 sorcery points and changing the Healing Touch to be as the warlock celestial patron feature, and add to both that you remove all the extra stuff if you use three or more points at once. This because it feels off to make two features use SP, which is limited already...

    So, how do you think about all this? Other people have any comments, feedback or suggestions? Anything is welcome :)
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