Special Material: Cold Steel. What would you set the cost as?

[dascarletm]

I'm coming up with an idea for a cyberpunk setting for pathfinder, and I want the principle theme to be magic users vs. non magic users. I want to add this special material into the game. How would you price it?

Cold Steel
Cold iron has been used since the days of knights and kings, but unlike regular iron it had a natural resistance to magic. Refining cold iron has been a process beyond mankind’s technological capabilities until recently. The result is cold steel, a material with strong anti-magic properties. Any item made of cold steel cannot be affected by magic. It cannot be enchanted, and spells that allow spell resistance, or directly modify the item automatically fail.
Weapons: Weapons made of cold steel are the bane of casters. Defenses derived from spells, such as mage armor and shield are ignored by attacks using a cold steel weapon. Displacement effects, such as blur, are unaffected. Additionally weapons made of cold steel ignore the hardness of a wall of force or similar effects.
Armor: Armor made of cold steel grant the wearer amazing resistances to magic. Armors made of cold steel grant the wearer spell resistance based on the type, and inhibit the ability for its wearer to cast spells. Those wearing armor made of cold steel may not cast spells of any type or use spell like abilities. Light armor grants immunity to spells or effects of 3rd level or lower. Medium armor grants immunity to spells or effects of 6th level or lower. Heavy armor grants immunity to spells and effects of 9th level or lower.
Bindings: Those wearing shackles constructed of cold steel lose their ability to use magic. Normal manacles cause all spells or spell like abilites to have a 50% chance of failing, and masterwork manacles impart a 75% chance of failing. Additionally these abilities cast cost double the amount of spell slots or similar resource to cast. Once a character has failed an attempt to cast they must wait one hour before attempting to cast again while the manacles remain on.

[sengmeng]

Can cold steel be enchanted? And do you know what cold iron is? It means that it was beaten into shape, not heated and tempered. Cold steel would have to be magic, as the process of alloying carbon and iron requires a lot of heat. So it's magic anti-magic material?

I'd put it on par with adamantite for cost, but I'd never call it cold steel for fluff reasons.

[dascarletm]

Can cold steel be enchanted?

No.

Any item made of cold steel cannot be affected by magic. It cannot be enchanted, and spells that allow spell resistance, or directly modify the item automatically fail.

And do you know what cold iron is?

Yes, this is based off of it completely. Hence.

Refining cold iron has been a process beyond mankind’s technological capabilities until recently. The result is cold steel...

It means that it was beaten into shape, not heated and tempered. Cold steel would have to be magic, as the process of alloying carbon and iron requires a lot of heat. So it's magic anti-magic material?

No... How did you draw that conclusion? The process would be entirely nonmagical

I'd put it on par with adamantite for cost, but I'd never call it cold steel for fluff reasons.

I'm curious what gives you that idea? Every part of its fluff is that it is just a more anti-magic version of cold iron.

[sengmeng]

I'm curious what gives you that idea? Every part of its fluff is that it is just a more anti-magic version of cold iron.

Because steel is not just refined iron. It is iron alloyed with carbon. Alloying a metal requires it to be melted, or at least malleable. I guess I don't know if you could fold carbon into room-temperature iron, but it seems improbable. It's the "steel" part I object to. I'd call it something else, like "true iron." Or refluff it as cold iron mined in dead magic zones, or perhaps just a line explaining that it isn't literally a type of steel, it just mimics its hardness while enhancing the anti-magic effects. I take it the process is secret in your setting?

[dascarletm]

Because steel is not just refined iron. It is iron alloyed with carbon. Alloying a metal requires it to be melted, or at least malleable. I guess I don't know if you could fold carbon into room-temperature iron, but it seems improbable. It's the "steel" part I object to. I'd call it something else, like "true iron." Or refluff it as cold iron mined in dead magic zones, or perhaps just a line explaining that it isn't literally a type of steel, it just mimics its hardness while enhancing the anti-magic effects. I take it the process is secret in your setting?

It's a cyberpunk setting, and the cold part of cold iron doesn't mean that it literally can't be heated. It could be worked with as regualr iron, and this is just cold iron being made into steel as though it were regular iron. Unless there is something about cold iron not allowing it to be heated or something. As far as I am aware the cold in cold iron means something akin to unresponsive in regards to magic rather than temperature.

[inuyasha]

It's a cyberpunk setting, and the cold part of cold iron doesn't mean that it literally can't be heated. It could be worked with as regualr iron, and this is just cold iron being made into steel as though it were regular iron. Unless there is something about cold iron not allowing it to be heated or something. As far as I am aware the cold in cold iron means something akin to unresponsive in regards to magic rather than temperature.

What gives cold iron it's powers is that it's specifically not heated and tempered, it's literally beaten into it's shape. To make steel the iron has to be heated, thus ruining the point (puns intended) of having something made of cold iron.

[dascarletm]

What gives cold iron it's powers is that it's specifically not heated and tempered, it's literally beaten into it's shape. To make steel the iron has to be heated, thus ruining the point (puns intended) of having something made of cold iron.

Huh, I have not read that before.

However, my point is that the setting it is going to be used in is technologically advanced. Hence why this would be a new development.

Perhaps they found a non-magic way to manipulate the iron without heating it. I'll put something to that regard into the fluff on my source document.

[sengmeng]

Huh, I have not read that before.

However, my point is that the setting it is going to be used in is technologically advanced. Hence why this would be a new development.

Perhaps they found a non-magic way to manipulate the iron without heating it. I'll put something to that regard into the fluff on my source document.

It could be alchemically dissolved, then returned to solid iron with carbon mixed in. Or it could be a layman's term for a far-too-technical process. And magnets are the sci-fi version of magic: they can be used to handwave almost anything.

[MoleMage]

Electrolysis maybe? Electrolysis to bond iron onto specially-formed carbon crystals in a way that produces something similar to steel without ever actually heating the iron?

[nikkoli]

I think this would be worth two or three times adamantine. Ignoring most magic defenses and granting magic immunity and ignoring force effect hardness is much stronger than ignoring physical hardness of 20 or less and up to Dr 5/- ish.
Also what is the hardness and the hp/of cold steel or is it standard for steel like cold iron is the same add regular iron IRRC.

[dascarletm]

It could be alchemically dissolved, then returned to solid iron with carbon mixed in. Or it could be a layman's term for a far-too-technical process. And magnets are the sci-fi version of magic: they can be used to handwave almost anything.

Electrolysis maybe? Electrolysis to bond iron onto specially-formed carbon crystals in a way that produces something similar to steel without ever actually heating the iron?

Yes, it's now cannon.

I think this would be worth two or three times adamantine. Ignoring most magic defenses and granting magic immunity and ignoring force effect hardness is much stronger than ignoring physical hardness of 20 or less and up to Dr 5/- ish.
Also what is the hardness and the hp/of cold steel or is it standard for steel like cold iron is the same add regular iron IRRC.

Yes, the hardness/HP would be the same as regular steel.

Though I could make it less durable perhaps to off-set the benefits.

I'm really wondering if the lack of ability to be enchanted further helps offset the numerous benefits it gives.

[MoleMage]

I think armor should be Spell Resist, not Spell Immunity. I also think that it should apply that spell resist to beneficial spells or negate them entirely (all spells affecting the wearer with a duration longer than one round have their duration reduced to one round or something).

And make the weapons not target-able by spells such as Holy Sword or Magic Weapon (Greater Magic Weapon).

[dascarletm]

It could be alchemically dissolved, then returned to solid iron with carbon mixed in. Or it could be a layman's term for a far-too-technical process. And magnets are the sci-fi version of magic: they can be used to handwave almost anything.

I think armor should be Spell Resist, not Spell Immunity. I also think that it should apply that spell resist to beneficial spells or negate them entirely (all spells affecting the wearer with a duration longer than one round have their duration reduced to one round or something).

And make the weapons not target-able by spells such as Holy Sword or Magic Weapon (Greater Magic Weapon).

Yeah I was going for that with the "spells or effects that directly modify the item automatically fail." I suppose it could use a bit of rewording and I'll work on that.

My problem with spell resistance is that I find it hard to set a number. Too high and it is effectively spell immunity. Too low and it is trivial. Even if you hit the sweet spot, it doesn't scale so it will only be useful for a few levels at best.

I could have the spell resistance scale, but fluff reasons for that may be tough.

[gooddragon1]

I don't think wall of force has hit points.

Also, do you mean immunity to spells that allow spell resistance of X level or lower? I'm kinda seeing that from the wording but I'm not sure.

[dascarletm]

Yes, spells that are subject to spell resistance. I'll need to also be more specific on that as well.

Also, in pathfinder Wall of Force has hit-points and hardness.

[MoleMage]

Yeah I was going for that with the "spells or effects that directly modify the item automatically fail." I suppose it could use a bit of rewording and I'll work on that.

My problem with spell resistance is that I find it hard to set a number. Too high and it is effectively spell immunity. Too low and it is trivial. Even if you hit the sweet spot, it doesn't scale so it will only be useful for a few levels at best.

I could have the spell resistance scale, but fluff reasons for that may be tough.

You could make non-magical "magic" weapon and armor effects that improve Cold Steel. Like, say a basic Cold Steel item has a cost equivalent to Adamantine. It gives SR blank (maybe different for light, medium, heavy) Then, for every +1 equivalent cost, the SR improves by blank. This way you can scale it to the party's level. Just fluff it as more difficult to manufacture and correspondingly expensive crystal structures or something.

For weapons, you could do something similar.

When the weapon touches a target who is under the benefits of one or more magical effects (including enchanted arms or armor), the weapon attempts to dispel magic on that target as an extraordinary effect with a caster level of blank. Purchasing higher-quality weapons allows you to add blank to the caster level for this check. If the caster level would be greater than 10, this effect is as greater dispel magic but is still extraordinary.

Additionally weapons made of Cold Steel overcome any hardness or damage reduction possessed by magical effects or granted through magic, and count as Cold Iron for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.

EDIT: The advantage of both is that they allow counterplay. Heavy Cold Steel armor as it is now is "You are immune to magic". Certain effects that are immune to dispel magic also exist and are now able to be used to counter juggernauts with Cold Steel greataxes.