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  1. - Top - End - #1171

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Maan View Post
    Sorcerer king, is that you?
    Look at my post history to ascertain that I am indeed not him.

    In fact, my build counters his build. I just keep sauce to myself since I don't want to spoil things for non PvP players. You have to learn wizard by playing wizard. And PvP is where everyone pulls out secret sauce. Do PvP with good players if you want to fast track learning secret sauce.

  2. - Top - End - #1172
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    Corran's Avatar

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by col_impact View Post
    In my build I pick Div Wizard, do sorcerors get something that competes with 8 portent dice in Tier 3-4 play?
    Spoiler: going a little off topic
    Show
    I'd probably go with bladesinger instead (assuming I had good rolled stats to justify the mc in the first place). I'd want the extra attack to start justifying smiting a bit, and bladesong would surely help with concentration (though upon reading your next posts, you seem to have something specific in mind, so maybe the paladin dip works in some way I haven't imagined; I am guessing it has to do with gear). In fact, with half decent stats for the needs of this mc, I think I would actually prefer bladesinger over sorcerer for the 2 level paladin dip. Then again, I don't think a 2 lvl paladin offers much when added to anything (though this is really a more general conversation about the value of going nova). There might be the odd fight here and there, or the odd party composition from time to time, which would make it a not so terrible idea (still inferior to multiple other dips of that magnitude IMO), but from a character optimization perspective I find it a pretty bad idea. I'd rather not go into the why, cause this conversation has been done to death.
    Last edited by Corran; 2020-04-06 at 10:25 AM.
    Hacks!

  3. - Top - End - #1173

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Corran View Post
    Spoiler: going a little off topic
    Show
    I'd probably go with bladesinger instead (assuming I had good rolled stats to justify the mc in the first place). I'd want the extra attack to start justifying smiting a bit, and bladesong would surely help with concentration (though upon reading your next posts, you seem to have something specific in mind, so maybe the paladin dip works in some way I haven't imagined; I am guessing it has to do with gear). In fact, with half decent stats for the needs of this mc, I think I would actually prefer bladesinger over sorcerer for the 2 level paladin dip. Then again, I don't think a 2 lvl paladin offers much when added to anything (though this is really a more general conversation about the value of going nova). There might be the odd fight here and there, or the odd party composition from time to time, which would make it a not so terrible idea (still inferior to multiple other dips of that magnitude IMO), but from a character optimization perspective I find it a pretty bad idea. I'd rather not go into the why, cause this conversation has been done to death.
    What feats are you running in your paladin 2/ bladesinger 18 build?

    What feats do the best sorcadin builds run?

  4. - Top - End - #1174
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hi guys,

    For the record, I'm french, so excuse my poor english.

    Amazing guide it is ! It was very pleasant to read, and amazing tactical advices here and there.

    I will soon jump in a campaign and have to build a new character. Have already played a Bladesinger, and now I juste want to throw an amazing pool of dice on my adversary's face. I just want to have some fun and kick some asses. So I choose Sorcadin. I will begin on level 5.

    There will be another paladin, so I thought it will be pretty cool to go 2/18, and stuck with my sister paladin to get her aura of protection.

    But know that I'm in the optimization phase, I would like to know if I go S&B or GWM. For 2/18, I think S&B will be better because I will not get extra attack, but I'm afraid that SCAG cantrip can't do the job. Do you have some advices ?

    Another question, 1 level of bladelock on my 6th level seems good to me for not being MAD, but SAD. Don't you ?

    Thanks to you.

  5. - Top - End - #1175
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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Fogia View Post
    Hi guys,

    For the record, I'm french, so excuse my poor english.

    Amazing guide it is ! It was very pleasant to read, and amazing tactical advices here and there.

    I will soon jump in a campaign and have to build a new character. Have already played a Bladesinger, and now I juste want to throw an amazing pool of dice on my adversary's face. I just want to have some fun and kick some asses. So I choose Sorcadin. I will begin on level 5.

    There will be another paladin, so I thought it will be pretty cool to go 2/18, and stuck with my sister paladin to get her aura of protection.

    But know that I'm in the optimization phase, I would like to know if I go S&B or GWM. For 2/18, I think S&B will be better because I will not get extra attack, but I'm afraid that SCAG cantrip can't do the job. Do you have some advices ?

    Another question, 1 level of bladelock on my 6th level seems good to me for not being MAD, but SAD. Don't you ?

    Thanks to you.
    2/18 is basically just a Sorcerer build. S&B has a higher AC but depending on how high that actually is in practice, you might not benefit from the +2 AC enough to warrant it. GWM isn't something I've experimented with, but you will definitely be throwing more dice that way.

  6. - Top - End - #1176
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Fogia View Post
    But know that I'm in the optimization phase, I would like to know if I go S&B or GWM. For 2/18, I think S&B will be better because I will not get extra attack,
    Sword and Board is not an option unless you're using your spell slots exclusively for smiting.

    You need a hand free for spellcasting. Before any one claims "but that's what War Caster fixes". Nope, no it doesn't. War Caster let's you ignore Somatic components. You still need a free hand to access Material components, or if you're using some kind of implement, a free hand for that implement.

    You can only cast V, S spells if both your hands are holding weapons.

  7. - Top - End - #1177
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by DarknessEternal View Post
    Sword and Board is not an option unless you're using your spell slots exclusively for smiting.

    You need a hand free for spellcasting. Before any one claims "but that's what War Caster fixes". Nope, no it doesn't. War Caster let's you ignore Somatic components. You still need a free hand to access Material components, or if you're using some kind of implement, a free hand for that implement.

    You can only cast V, S spells if both your hands are holding weapons.
    You can just put your holy symbol/arcane focus on your shield/weapon and material components are taken care of. War Caster it's useful specifically for when a spell needs somatic components but not material ones.

  8. - Top - End - #1178
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by DarknessEternal View Post
    Sword and Board is not an option unless you're using your spell slots exclusively for smiting.

    You need a hand free for spellcasting. Before any one claims "but that's what War Caster fixes". Nope, no it doesn't. War Caster let's you ignore Somatic components. You still need a free hand to access Material components, or if you're using some kind of implement, a free hand for that implement.

    You can only cast V, S spells if both your hands are holding weapons.
    Depends on the table, but even if your table is picky about material components there is no issue with casting your concentration spell at the start of combat (Haste for example), and then drawing your weapon. After that V/S spells include Shield, Absorb Elements, Healing Word, Misty Step, Counterspell, and effectively Booming Blade. What else do you want? If you really need to cast an M spell for some reason, it just means stowing your weapon until your next turn, and if you have Haste going you won't even need to do that.

    Sword and board plus casting can be fiddly, but it works. Whether you think it's worthwhile also depends on the table. A +2 to AC might not be worth it, but if you can get a magic shield then +3-5 AC might well be worth it.

  9. - Top - End - #1179
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    Daemon

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Howdy. Incredible guide with references to an incredible series. Apologies if this has already been addressed, but if I WERE to go PAM Oathbreaker 11/ Sorcerer 9, what origin would you all recommend? Shadow seems like the go to, but I was hoping not to abuse the "Darkness cheese" while still getting that sweet, sweet quickened Hold Person. Or would I be better off going pure Pally because of those awesome resistances at 15th level?

    Looking for a fair bit of optimisation but I'm not against going all in with it. Playing a vhuman with my current party being a Life Cleric, Banneret and Scout.

  10. - Top - End - #1180
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Xephur View Post
    Howdy. Incredible guide with references to an incredible series. Apologies if this has already been addressed, but if I WERE to go PAM Oathbreaker 11/ Sorcerer 9, what origin would you all recommend? Shadow seems like the go to, but I was hoping not to abuse the "Darkness cheese" while still getting that sweet, sweet quickened Hold Person. Or would I be better off going pure Pally because of those awesome resistances at 15th level?

    Looking for a fair bit of optimisation but I'm not against going all in with it. Playing a vhuman with my current party being a Life Cleric, Banneret and Scout.
    Divine Soul Sorcerer is a solid choice for the expanded spell list and Favored by the Gods (once per short rest you can roll 2d4 and add it to a failed save or attack roll).
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  11. - Top - End - #1181
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hi, we are going to start the Odyssey of the Dragonlords campaign, and looking at the Player's Guide, there are a couple of interesting choices for the Sorcadin:

    Races:
    Nymph: +2 Cha, +1 Wis, selecting a subrace gives you darkvision or swimming speed and underwater breathing, 2 spells, one at level 3rd and another at level 7th.
    Siren: +2 CHa, +1 Dex, Advantage on Performance and persuasion checks made with voice, and every short or long rest you choose between having 30' fly speed or the hability to cast enthrall at lvl 3 and hold person at lvl 5th, recharging with short rest.

    Sorcerer Demigod Origin:
    Lvl 1
    2 Spells selected from your godly ancestor, recharging after a short rest.
    Proficent in strenght saving throws
    You may choose to add your Charisma to melee attack and damage rolls instead of Strength

    Lvl 6
    Spend 1 sorcery point to increase a spell level by 1, max 1 level

    Lvl 14
    When you fail a save, you may choose to succeed it instead. Recharges agter a long rest

    Lvl 18
    Spend 1 sorcery point to increase a spell level by 1, without limit

    ¿What do you think about going Pal6/Sor 14 with this origin? I'm tempted to dip a couple levels on warlock too, to get EB and a couple invocations, (Eldritch Smite).
    Last edited by Garis Hallorand; 2020-09-29 at 05:32 AM.

  12. - Top - End - #1182
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Eldritch Smite requires 5 levels of Warlock, that's not a dip - that's a fairly significant investment.

    Demigod power source- I would absolutely take that. If only for the novelty of a new subclass of Sorcerer I haven't played with.

    Races - Either would be fine, but I particularly like the idea of a siren who draws power from having a literally heavenly voice, using that power in service of what her godly parent stands for.
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  13. - Top - End - #1183
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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Nothing obviously broken stands out to be about that Demigod origin.


    Siren looks fantastic. +2 CHA, +1 DEX, and an early fly speed is everything you could ask for in a race. The fact that there's more makes it look like a better Aarakocra.

  14. - Top - End - #1184
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hello guys

    Im about to start a 3-man campaign and im looking for some feedback on my gameplan.

    My co-players are a Bard and a Warlock as such ill be going for a more frontline utility build rather than just focusing on dmg.

    We rolled for stats and i ended up with : 16 8 15 10 14 16
    picked Half-Elf because i like the flavor more than Vumans

    Final Stats:
    Str: 17(+1)
    Dex: 8
    Con: 16(+1)
    Int: 10
    Wis: 14
    Charisma: 18(+2)

    Ill be going Oath of the Ancients for the flavor but also because Warding aura is great and Divine Soul as my origin.

    So im allready looking at 7/13 and my Questions are mainly wether going Hexblade for Sad is worth it or not and what to do with my ASIs.

    Warcaster is a given ill be picking up +2 Cha somewhere along however with an 18 base i wouldn't mind delaying till higher levels
    inspiring Leader seems great as well, Armor master nets me a +1 to hit/dmg with some damage reduction, shield master helps with my shoddy reflex saves.
    For flavor i really like the idea of mounted combatant to make the find steed useful even at higher levels.

    Just dont know when to take what. Warcaster is either at 4 or 11/12 not sure how much value i would be getting from it during sorc 1-3 vs not having it.
    i dont mind delaying +2 Cha till later levels for something like Mounted combat for fun and flavor but if i take a hexblade dip taking it at 4 seems just too good.
    the others are less defining and i would just take them depending on how the rest of the group develops.

    So im really hoping for some input from someone with a bit more experience than me, thanks in advance.
    Last edited by alteil; 2020-10-02 at 11:33 AM.

  15. - Top - End - #1185
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by alteil View Post
    Armor master nets me a +1 to hit/dmg
    How does it give you any hit/dmg with your even Str?

  16. - Top - End - #1186
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by DarknessEternal View Post
    How does it give you any hit/dmg with your even Str?
    oh whoops forgot to actually add the +1 from race my str is 17 currently ill edit it

  17. - Top - End - #1187
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    HalflingRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    With such a high STR, Hexblade offers very little to you. Assuming you start Paladin for the armor proficency, you wouldn't get much benefit from swapping to high DEX and medium armor, so I'd say just keep Warlock out of the equation. As far as ASIs, I highly recommend maxing CHA with the first ASI from Paladin, so that your aura grants the full +5 to saves from the moment you get it. I'd pick up Warcaster with the first Sorceror ASI, then possibly take Resilient (CON) with the second (if you go this route, it may be worth it to swap CON to an odd score). Then for the last ASI I'd just pick up either more STR (and CON as a split increase if you left CON at 16) or Alert for higher initiative.
    Last edited by Hellpyre; 2020-10-02 at 02:21 PM.

  18. - Top - End - #1188
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    I'm currently playing a ranged paladin in a homebrewed campaign. The oath lets me smite from range, and the aura is sufficiently good that I want to hit at least Paladin 7. My stats are such that Paladin 8 is also very appealing for the ASI.

    My question is, for a ranged paladin, is pally 8 / sorcerer 12 still worth it?

  19. - Top - End - #1189
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Tempist View Post
    I'm currently playing a ranged paladin in a homebrewed campaign. The oath lets me smite from range, and the aura is sufficiently good that I want to hit at least Paladin 7. My stats are such that Paladin 8 is also very appealing for the ASI.

    My question is, for a ranged paladin, is pally 8 / sorcerer 12 still worth it?
    If you can smite at range, definitely.

    Your smites just get better with sorcerer levels.

    Also, if you’re really looking to optimize, look at a fighter 1 dip (archery fighting style) and the crossbow master/sharpshooter feat combo.

  20. - Top - End - #1190

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    So, last post here was in October, meaning I'm rather sure that this won't count as Thread Necromancy... not sure how many people are going to be still paying attention to this thread at all, but I want to put this down, anyway.

    Tasha's Cauldron of Everything has brought a lot of new content from the UA right to our doorstep, including several new spells. One of Which I wish to speak about today:

    SPIRIT SHROUD
    3rd-level necromancy
    Casting Time: 1 bonus action
    Range: Self
    Components: V, S
    Duration: Concentration, up to 1 minute
    You call forth spirits of the dead, which flit around you for the spell's duration. The spirits are intangible and invulnerable.

    Until the spell ends, any attack you make deals 1d8 extra damage when you hit a creature within 10 feet of you. This damage is radiant, necrotic, or cold (your choice when you cast the spell). Any creature that takes this damage can't regain hit points until the start of your next turn.

    In addition, any creature of your choice that you can see that starts its turn within 10 feet of you has its speed reduced by 10 feet until the start of your next turn.
    At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage increases by 1d8 for every two slot levels above 3rd
    Available to Clerics, Paladins, Wizards, and Warlocks (and 100% should be allowed to Sorcerer's as well), I think this spell can compete with Haste and Spirit Guardians as the Sorcardin's 3rd Level Buff stat. It might not have the defence and mobility of Haste, nor does it have the same AoE and lockdown potential of Spirit Guardians, it can easily match both of them in terms of raw damage, especially if you are playing a build that is packing Polearm Master in order to gain a 3rd attack each turn. 3 attacks each doing 1d8 extra damage is equal to the Spirit Guardians damage to a single target, and doesn't have the same issue as them getting a saving throw to reduce the damage. As long as you hit, you deal the extra damage.

    That being said, however. The real power of this spell comes from its damage types. Specifically, the fact that it allows us to deal cold damage with the spell. Triggering Elemental Affinity. This is a tremendous boon of damage, as it means even if you aren't getting a third attack, you're doing 2d8+2x Charisma damage with each attack, which is likely more than the 3d8 damage of Spirit Guardians. Gaining a 3rd attack by other means would just further make the damage even higher... and, I'm pretty sure that, as this is extra damage on attack, the damage is multiplied by a critical hit as well. Further increasing the Sorcadin's almighty nova damage whenever we get that lucky crit. Or if an ally uses Hold Person/Hold Monster on them for us to burst down. Combined with the fact that it still has some of the Spirit Guardians slow-field, and it is a potent spell for sure.

    What do people think?

  21. - Top - End - #1191
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Storyteller_Arc View Post
    -snip-
    The combo with Elemental Affinity is cool, but it's not a Sorcerer spell :\
    I'm an optimizer, so when I say something is good, that means I think that it's powerful relative to the strongest options the system offers from a mechanical standpoint.
    When I say something is bad, I do not mean that is not viable or that you shouldn't play it, only that it isn't satisfactory for high optimization tables.

    I use LudicSavant's and AureusFulgen's DPR Calculator to calculate DPR.
    My builds can be found at BendKing's Baffling Builds Bundle.

  22. - Top - End - #1192

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by bendking View Post
    The combo with Elemental Affinity is cool, but it's not a Sorcerer spell :\
    And? Its a Paladin Spell. Just go Paladin 9 and you got yourself a Spirit Shroud. Means it'll take a while to get the combo online, but its a strong one.

    Plus, I think considering the fact that Clerics, Paladins, Warlocks and Wizards have access to it, makes it rather easy to persuade a DM that a Sorcerer should be able to pick it up as well. Why should the Wizard have it, and the Sorcerer should not?

  23. - Top - End - #1193
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Storyteller_Arc View Post
    Why should the Wizard have it, and the Sorcerer should not?
    Because the sorcerer has a less expansive spell list. As it should be.

  24. - Top - End - #1194
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Storyteller_Arc View Post
    And? Its a Paladin Spell. Just go Paladin 9 and you got yourself a Spirit Shroud. Means it'll take a while to get the combo online, but its a strong one.

    Plus, I think considering the fact that Clerics, Paladins, Warlocks and Wizards have access to it, makes it rather easy to persuade a DM that a Sorcerer should be able to pick it up as well. Why should the Wizard have it, and the Sorcerer should not?
    The combo coming online at level 15 isn't great.

    And I agree that it should be a Sorcerer spell, but WotC hates Sorcerers and arbitrarily leaves spells out of their spell list to make some sort of weird quota about them having fewer spells in their list for some reason.
    I'm an optimizer, so when I say something is good, that means I think that it's powerful relative to the strongest options the system offers from a mechanical standpoint.
    When I say something is bad, I do not mean that is not viable or that you shouldn't play it, only that it isn't satisfactory for high optimization tables.

    I use LudicSavant's and AureusFulgen's DPR Calculator to calculate DPR.
    My builds can be found at BendKing's Baffling Builds Bundle.

  25. - Top - End - #1195

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by CMCC View Post
    Because the sorcerer has a less expansive spell list. As it should be.
    Right, because having the least amount of spells known, a rather weak method of recharging their spell slots, and having the weakest spell list out there, makes the Sorcerer entirety balanced, doesn't it?

    Quote Originally Posted by bendking View Post
    The combo coming online at level 15 isn't great.And I agree that it should be a Sorcerer spell, but WotC hates Sorcerers and arbitrarily leaves spells out of their spell list to make some sort of weird quota about them having fewer spells in their list for some reason.
    Tell me about it... The WotC Wizard Boner is so strong and obvious it's ridiculous. Admittedly, the combo would still only come online at level 12 even if it was a Sorcerer spell, but the same could be said for Spirit Guardians.

  26. - Top - End - #1196
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hi All

    New member here looking for unusual Sorcadin build advice

    I have a 7th level Vengeance Paladin. Str 18, Int 8, Wis 12, Con 14, Dex 10, Cha 14. Variant Human with Great Weapon Master as a feat and Great Weapon Fighting as a fighting style.

    Having read this guide, I am looking to multi-class him as a Sorcerer, but never planned for this, so he probably isn't best optimised for it. C'est la Vie. I can only work with what I have got.

    I am thinking of going Pal 8 next for the ASI/Feat. If I do, would you recommend War Caster, Resilient Con or a Stat increase ?

    Missing out on the ASI seems harsh, but if anyone thinks Pal 8 is a bad idea, let me know please. I have no idea what character level I will get to, but 15+ is unlikely I think. Never say never though (I already have a 17th level Wizard, who would have thought when I started him off).

    When I eventually start as a Sorcerer at Character level 9, I am torn between Shadow or Divine Soul. The former suits the Vengeance theme (a little), especially with the hound. The latter has more flavour synergy with the class though. I will never get to 14th level as a Sorcerer, so it is not worth worrying about the higher level powers.

    All thoughts welcome.
    Last edited by FrankinLondon; 2020-12-08 at 06:44 AM.

  27. - Top - End - #1197
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by FrankinLondon View Post
    Hi All

    New member here looking for unusual Sorcadin build advice

    I have a 7th level Vengeance Paladin. Str 18, Int 8, Wis 12, Con 14, Dex 10, Cha 14. Variant Human with Great Weapon Master as a feat and Great Weapon Fighting as a fighting style.

    Having read this guide, I am looking to multi-class him as a Sorcerer, but never planned for this, so he probably isn't best optimised for it. C'est la Vie. I can only work with what I have got.

    I am thinking of going Pal 8 next for the ASI/Feat. If I do, would you recommend War Caster, Resilient Con or a Stat increase ?

    Missing out on the ASI seems harsh, but if anyone thinks Pal 8 is a bad idea, let me know please. I have no idea what character level I will get to, but 15+ is unlikely I think. Never say never though (I already have a 17th level Wizard, who would have thought when I started him off).

    When I eventually start as a Sorcerer at Character level 9, I am torn between Shadow or Favoured Soul. The former suits the Vengeance theme (a little), especially with the hound. The latter has more flavour synergy with the class though. I will never get to 14th level as a Sorcerer, so it is not worth worrying about the higher level powers.

    All thoughts welcome.
    Given your ability scores and the fact you are using a two hander I’d recommend +2 cha.

    You are planning to go sorcerer so the +2 cha will increase your sorcerer spells save dcs and attack rolls. It also increases your saves including concentration saves by +1 due to your aura. You don’t need warcaster in order to cast because you can always take a hand off of your weapon to do so.

    Between shadow or divine soul, it depends on what you really want to get out of the sorcerer levels. Since you’re human do you need darkvision? Do you plan to use shadow darkness as another way to get easy advantage? Or do you have cleric spells that you are aching to get that’s not on the Paladin list?

    Personally I think shadow might be better for you because you will gain darkvision and with great weapon master another way to get easy advantage to attacks is probably very welcomed.

  28. - Top - End - #1198
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by FrankinLondon View Post
    Hi All

    New member here looking for unusual Sorcadin build advice

    I have a 7th level Vengeance Paladin. Str 18, Int 8, Wis 12, Con 14, Dex 10, Cha 14. Variant Human with Great Weapon Master as a feat and Great Weapon Fighting as a fighting style.

    Having read this guide, I am looking to multi-class him as a Sorcerer, but never planned for this, so he probably isn't best optimised for it. C'est la Vie. I can only work with what I have got.

    I am thinking of going Pal 8 next for the ASI/Feat. If I do, would you recommend War Caster, Resilient Con or a Stat increase ?

    Missing out on the ASI seems harsh, but if anyone thinks Pal 8 is a bad idea, let me know please. I have no idea what character level I will get to, but 15+ is unlikely I think. Never say never though (I already have a 17th level Wizard, who would have thought when I started him off).

    When I eventually start as a Sorcerer at Character level 9, I am torn between Shadow or Divine Soul. The former suits the Vengeance theme (a little), especially with the hound. The latter has more flavour synergy with the class though. I will never get to 14th level as a Sorcerer, so it is not worth worrying about the higher level powers.

    All thoughts welcome.
    I would actually ask my DM to revert a level of Paladin so you could be Paladin 6/Sorcerer 2. Oath of Vengeance level 7 feature isn't amazing, and I would much rather start my Sorcerer career at that point.
    In regards to subclass, in my opinion, Divine Soul works better, because Spirit Guardians and Spiritual Weapon are just incredible spells which fill out two things for you:
    1. Good AoE. Something Paladins rarely have.
    2. Bonus Action usage.
    I'm an optimizer, so when I say something is good, that means I think that it's powerful relative to the strongest options the system offers from a mechanical standpoint.
    When I say something is bad, I do not mean that is not viable or that you shouldn't play it, only that it isn't satisfactory for high optimization tables.

    I use LudicSavant's and AureusFulgen's DPR Calculator to calculate DPR.
    My builds can be found at BendKing's Baffling Builds Bundle.

  29. - Top - End - #1199
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2020

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Gignere View Post
    Given your ability scores and the fact you are using a two hander I’d recommend +2 cha.

    You are planning to go sorcerer so the +2 cha will increase your sorcerer spells save dcs and attack rolls. It also increases your saves including concentration saves by +1 due to your aura. You don’t need warcaster in order to cast because you can always take a hand off of your weapon to do so.

    Between shadow or divine soul, it depends on what you really want to get out of the sorcerer levels. Since you’re human do you need darkvision? Do you plan to use shadow darkness as another way to get easy advantage? Or do you have cleric spells that you are aching to get that’s not on the Paladin list?

    Personally I think shadow might be better for you because you will gain darkvision and with great weapon master another way to get easy advantage to attacks is probably very welcomed.
    Thanks for the input. I was planning on using my Sorcerer spells to either increase my chances to hit (Darkness, Invisibility etc) or reduce my chances of being hit (Shield, Prot vs Evil, Blur etc).It will be nice to have a ranged cantrip to do damage with, but the character is pretty much a toe to toe melee sort. I was thinking of the feats (or possibly a Con stat increase) to minimise the chances of failing concentration. I won't really be looking for damaging Sorc spells. Its a shame my Con is even lol.

  30. - Top - End - #1200
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2020

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by bendking View Post
    I would actually ask my DM to revert a level of Paladin so you could be Paladin 6/Sorcerer 2. Oath of Vengeance level 7 feature isn't amazing, and I would much rather start my Sorcerer career at that point.
    In regards to subclass, in my opinion, Divine Soul works better, because Spirit Guardians and Spiritual Weapon are just incredible spells which fill out two things for you:
    1. Good AoE. Something Paladins rarely have.
    2. Bonus Action usage.
    My DM isn't that flexible tbh (and I am not sure I would be in his position). Thanks for the advice on Divine Soul.

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