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  1. - Top - End - #301
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    About Wish. Doesn't it have a chance to become never usable again after you've used it? I'd much rather have some more consistent abilities than potentially once in a life-time Wish.
    The 33% chance to never cast it again is if you use it for anything other than duplicating a spell.

  2. - Top - End - #302
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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    About Wish. Doesn't it have a chance to become never usable again after you've used it? I'd much rather have some more consistent abilities than potentially once in a life-time Wish.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathtongue View Post
    If you use it just for duplicating lower-level spells (which is more than powerful enough!) you won't suffer a chance of stress backlash.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosRonin View Post
    The 33% chance to never cast it again is if you use it for anything other than duplicating a spell.
    And if you do indeed fall victim to that 33% chance, then all you have to do is swap it out upon level up and you never have to worry about it again, assuming it wasn't your level 20 choice. And if it was, then there isn't enough time left in the campaign to worry about it.
    So either way, don't worry about it.
    Last edited by DivisibleByZero; 2017-02-27 at 09:37 AM.
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by DivisibleByZero View Post
    And if you do indeed fall victim to that 33% chance, then all you have to do is swap it out upon level up and you never have to worry about it again, assuming it wasn't your level 20 choice. And if it was, then there isn't enough time left in the campaign to worry about it.
    Never say never, some hardcore players might want to continue with 20th level characters to the infinity!
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  4. - Top - End - #304
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    hey, I would like to ask some advice here. Im playing with an oath of the ancients paladin, 7th level as of now. Im almost certain to take one more level in Paladin for the ASI, then decide whether to multiclass sorcerer or keep going with the Paladin Character is a half orc, shield and board, S18, D13, C16, I 12, W10, Ch 20. Rest of the party is a life cleric and a bladesinger. Last session, with my friends help, I achieved AC27 (plate armor, shield, defense fighting style, ring of protection +1, haste, warding bond, shield of faith) while they kept attacking the BBEG from a distance. Great fun, but still too slow in killing him. The battle lasted for 8 rounds.

  5. - Top - End - #305
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by diplomancer View Post
    hey, I would like to ask some advice here. Im playing with an oath of the ancients paladin, 7th level as of now. Im almost certain to take one more level in Paladin for the ASI, then decide whether to multiclass sorcerer or keep going with the Paladin Character is a half orc, shield and board, S18, D13, C16, I 12, W10, Ch 20. Rest of the party is a life cleric and a bladesinger. Last session, with my friends help, I achieved AC27 (plate armor, shield, defense fighting style, ring of protection +1, haste, warding bond, shield of faith) while they kept attacking the BBEG from a distance. Great fun, but still too slow in killing him. The battle lasted for 8 rounds.
    It depends on how high level you think your campaign is going to go. If you're likely to see less than level 13, there's very little point in taking sorcerer levels. Even if you will, your delayed access to sorcerer spells is going to be grueling. Don't get me wrong, you get some fantastic stuff in the interim (the shield spell alone makes this worthwhile and the better spell slot progression is delicious), but your limited sorcerer spells and sorcery points will feel limiting early.

    If that doesn't bother you, stop taking paladin levels effective immediately. You're already at the perfect maximum for paladin levels as an OoA- an ASI is relatively meaningless compared to any further delay in spell levels, and it will have a negative effect on the final spell level you can eventually achieve (right now, you will one day learn level 7 spells. If you take an eighth level in paladin, that drops to level 6).

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    I'm not sure I agree with the idea that TWF is bad. Dipping 1 level in fighter isn't a deal breaker. Anyways, I discovered this guide after I made my character, and due to my unique situation my DM allowed me to take TWF style as a paladin, since my character dual wields and doesn't wear armor(draconic resilience). I started as sorc level 1, and picked up Warcaster. An interesting side effect of TWF that is overlooked, is that you can make an attack action using your haste action, and allows you to two weapon fight even though your "real" action is spent elsewhere.

    For example, first round of combat you haste yourself, then run 60 feet and get 2 attacks. Next round you booming blade, then get 2 attacks. TWF builds are just amazing for only going 2 levels into paladin, but still getting 3 attacks. Or you can fireball then get 2 attacks. The synergy with Haste is outright insane, and opening with sorc at level 1 gets you the con prof you need, so all you need is warcaster. I'm only level 7 with a 2/5 split, ans I may go deep paladin later, but the combination of Haste, Shield, and Counterspell means that even though I'm a bit more vulnerable than a deep paladin build, I wind up being insanely slippery and hard to pin down, while also being tanky as hell.

    If we need frontline, I haste myself and take the dodge action every turn while STILL getting 2 attacks. So they have to hit 20 AC with disadvantage, I can shield to boost to 25, and I can still put out 17 dpr, and if I don't shield I can booming blade with reactions to keep them pinned.

    TWF is a good middle ground for sorcadins that only take 2 levels of paladin and want to have good DPR and melee.

  7. - Top - End - #307
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Haste + TWF is a an accept style for Bladesingers, for a reason I'll get into a bit. However, for Sorceradins it's lacking.

    1.) You will not always be wanting to cast Haste, such as if you're going up against a high-damage monster like dragons or if you want to concentrate on something else. You, as a Sorceradin, also have a lot of competition for your bonus action. But if you don't have both pieces of the puzzle, your DPR tanks.

    2.) Sorceradins don't get static damage bonuses to their regular attacks. Their damage engine is reliant on Quicken Spell and Smite. Smiting more than twice in a round is unnecessary. Getting an extra 1d6 + stat mod damage is sorely lacking, especially considering that you'll get an extra 2d6 just by swinging twice with a greatsword. This gets worse when we throw magic weapons into the mix.

    3.) The other reason is that TWFing just plain falls behind compared to Great Weapon Master. People have complained bitterly on this board about that feat and for good reason. It's really dominating for DPR. The only reason you'd use something else is if you're forced to, like with the bladesinger.

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    That is very true, but TWF performs better against high AC enemies and can nova harder due to smites. I'm not arguing that TWF is the most optimal choice, only that it should be rated viable/average, rather than subpar. For most classes TWF is meh, but for sorcadins with only 2 levels in pally with a larger pool of high octane smite fuel, it comes out to being pretty good. Still outclassed, but good.

  9. - Top - End - #309
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    TWFing Sorceradins (or anything, but it's most noticeable with them) don't perform better against high-AC targets. Remember, the Achilles' Heel of that style is its absolute reliance on having Haste as a buff. Meaning you can't concentrate on other spells. Or more specifically:

    1.) If you want to super-nova, you want to prep Hold Person or Monster for guaranteed critical hits. Sure, more chances to burn smite sounds okay, but remember that you're already out 1d6 of damage per hit just from switching to a Maul/Greatsword to Shortsword/Scimitars. For comparison:

    Level 11, 18 STR, 18 CHA Maul-Wielder, 2 attacks, 1st-level smite on only one. Uses Quicken Spell to quicken a Booming Blade:
    6d6 (weapon) + 2d8 (smite) + 12 (STR) + 2d8 (Thunder) = 51 DPR.

    Level 11, 18 DEX, 18 CHA Scimitar-Wielder, 3 Attacks, TWFer style from Fighter level, 1st-level smite on three hits:
    3d6 (weapon) + 6d8 (smite) + 12 (dex) = 49.5 DPR.

    You have to start dipping into 2nd and 3rd level smites to have any kind of advantage -- and unless you're regularly doing 1 or 2-encounter workdays, it's a battle for resource attrition you're not going to keep up with.

    Haste just makes the picture look bleaker for the TWFer. They dip behind even more in DPR, even if they go GFB/BB + Haste + TWFing. And the GWF's potential damage per round can go way up from just popping down a haste: they've still got a concentration spell to burn, which could be used on Hold Person/Monster. Imagine Quickened Hold Person + Two Attacks with a Maul + GWFing damage bonus + Two 1st-level smites. That's 8d6 (weapon) + 8d8 (smite) + 20 (GWF) + 8 (str) = 85 DPR!

    2.) If you just want to smash high-AC targets, you want to use Web, Hold Person/Monster, or Greater Invisibility. Against a high-AC target, advantage for two or three of your attacks is better than getting three/four attacks without advantage.

    Haste is a good spell, but it works best against low-AC targets that don't warrant a Greater Invis or something stronger. It's a 'stretch out your resources' effect, not a pinch-hitter effect. This is helpful for Bladesingers, since they already have better ways to drop the mic when something NEEDS to die but don't have many good options to maintain round-to-round DPR outside of Simulacrulum or summoning abuse. But for a class that has better options for melee nova and round-to-round sustainability, it's just a drop in damage.

  10. - Top - End - #310
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    I dont know if this has been brought up yet (but it hasnt been changed in the op), but I think the math is wrong when comparing the spell slots of the different specfic builds. I.e. a paladin 11/sorc 9 will be able to caster higher than 5th level spells (7th I believe).

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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    The build isn't reliant on haste. You're forgetting I'm talking specifically about builds that DON'T have extra attack, which means builds that only take 2 levels in paladin. Assuming you max out your melee stats, you're looking at 3.5+5 damage per swing, twice, or 17 DPR at base. Kinda low, but without extra attack, it makes sense. For a GWF build, you're looking at 7+5, or 12 DPR, with spikes of 22 DPR. This means that, yes, you're doing less damage against higher AC targets due to the accuracy penalty. Once you factor haste, the GWF lead against low AC targets explodes, but against higher AC targets it stays closer.

    Let's run the numbers for haste(we'll assume level 12 so we can have maxed damage stat).

    Haste TWF: 1 hit of GFB, 2 regular hits. 3d6+2d8+15+3(cha) = 37.5/49.5 if quicken GFB

    Haste GWF: 1 Hit of GFB, 1 regular hit. Can quicken a 3rd hit to nova harder. 4d6+2d8+10+3+20(GWM) = 36 DPR/56 DPR(power attack)/90 DPR(Max nova with quicken GFB)

    Basically, GWM is still going to be the best build, if only because of nova potential, but in cases where you don't get extra attack, TWF is *slightly* more efficient overall, and doesn't need to expend as many resources, allowing it to run at a slow burn, while also having the ability to nova a bit more sustainably with smites due to only 2 levels in Paladin.

    I'm not saying that the build is better, as we can see by the math that the advantage to TWF is basically limited to "high AC targets when you're out of spell slots" and "Haste attacks where you're not expending resources", and even in that second case it's less than a 2 point lead.

    What I AM saying, is that TWF should not be rated purple tier. GWM is the king of DPR, and there is no doubt about that. TWF can, if you go for the feat for a little extra damage and AC, function as a surprisingly competent build if you use your buffs intelligently, and only take 2 levels in paladin. I find that it's best, however, to consider TWF as compared to Sword and Board build, as in that case you see it puts out much better sustained damage while only losing 1 AC, and can nova just as hard as a 1H+Shield build. Of course it won't rival GWM, but when you take it alongside other options considered to be blue within the guide, the math shows it should at LEAST be black, if not blue as well.

    Edit: Actually, that raises the question of why the original guide places GWM below Sword and Board, anyways? GWM should be top, with Polearm and 1H+shield at second tier, and TWF at second tier or mid tier(not purple tier). Anyways, I stand by my statement that TWF is VIABLE, but not OPTIMAL, if you focus on heavy caster with only 2-3 levels in paladin.
    Last edited by Garresh; 2017-03-02 at 06:50 PM.

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Oh, and there is one other reason I'm a huge fan of TWF for sorcadins that only take 2 levels of paladin. That Haste strat I mentioned, you can instead opt to use your primary action to dodge every turn, while still putting out reasonable damage. Having 20/25(shield) AC and dodging every turn makes you just incredibly hard to hit, and means you can hold the line without necessarily needing to drop Shields every turn, and still performing adequate damage. It's a nice balance, and something that other builds cannot do without sinking 2 sorcery points every turn to quicken a GFB/BB.

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    Question Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hi,
    can you recommend me the optimalized level progression for Oathbreaker/Undying Light warlock/Draconic Sorcerer Sorcadin?
    Currently as Paladin 2/Undying Light warlock 1, planning to go to Oathbreaker 7/Undying Light warlock 2/Draconic Sorcerer 6 at Lvl 15.
    Warlock 2 is for Invocations to have solid ranged blast multi attack (Agonizing EB) probably at Lvl 5.

    thanks
    Last edited by . Shadowblade .; 2017-03-03 at 04:37 AM.

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by . Shadowblade . View Post
    Hi,
    can you recommend me the optimalized level progression for Oathbreaker/Undying Light warlock/Draconic Sorcerer Sorcadin?
    Currently as Paladin 2/Undying Light warlock 1, planning to go to Oathbreaker 7/Undying Light warlock 2/Draconic Sorcerer 6 at Lvl 15.
    Warlock 2 is for Invocations to have solid ranged blast attack (Agonizing EB).

    thanks
    I would say that from your current build, continue to Paladin 7 straight (needless to say, but Extra Attack and Aura of Protection are just THAT good). Since Pact Magic doesn't affect your spellcasting from Paladin, Warlock level doesn't affect the pace you get more "normal" spell slots from Paladin levels. And since you probably want that 7th level Oathbreaker aura anyway, I see no point changing direction from Paladin until you have it. I assume you already have Eldritch Blast from Warlock 1, which is by itself already quite good cantrip, with 1d10 force damage. And it continues to improve while you level up paladin. Once you get to 9th character level, you can take the 2nd Warlock level for invocations you want (Agonizing Blast and then some). Once you have that, go pure Draconic Sorcerer until lvl 15. Elemental Affinity is kinda like the icing on a cake - a capstone of your build which already benefits from your charisma to radiant and fire based spell's damage. It's nice to get it twice with fire spells, but it's not necessary.
    Last edited by Arkhios; 2017-03-03 at 05:01 AM.
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    NinjaGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Apologies, haven't read the whole thread. Just want to share my experience playing a dex-based build.

    It was a one-off with characters starting at lvl 12, three or four encounters. I made a dex-based human (started as a sorc so I could have war caster as my 1st level feat, plus con saves. Since I was dex-based anyway, the lack of heavy armor wasn't an issue). Overall, I found the character to be tough to play. Maybe due to party composition, I found myself often playing the wizard role (battlefield control, nullifying enemy advantages) but when I did unload, I did some serious damage. For a character who's going to play through a few combat encounters, I wish I had gone Str based (needing a 13 in what would otherwise be a dump stat hurts) but for a guy in a full campaign, going dex-based with the right background adds another layer of out of combat utility to an already versatile character.

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    In general - and note: in my honest opinion - I find the idea of a dex-based paladin multiclassing dumb, especially if played by the book (= requiring str 13, cha 13). While I don't see a problem with playing a single-classed dex-based paladin, going multiclass with the requirements is like literally shooting yourself in the foot in various different ways.

    No offense meant in any direction.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anon von Zilch View Post
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    In general - and note: in my honest opinion - I find the idea of a dex-based paladin multiclassing dumb, especially if played by the book (= requiring str 13, cha 13). While I don't see a problem with playing a single-classed dex-based paladin, going multiclass with the requirements is like literally shooting yourself in the foot in various different ways.

    No offense meant in any direction.
    The only way it isn't shooting yourself in the foot is if you roll well for stats or are given a higher standard array (18,16,14,12,10,8 may be doable).

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Master O'Laughs View Post
    The only way it isn't shooting yourself in the foot is if you roll well for stats or are given a higher standard array (18,16,14,12,10,8 may be doable).
    Which kinda speaks for itself already. With normal 27 point buy, I would never even try it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anon von Zilch View Post
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    I see no point changing direction from Paladin until you have it. I assume you already have Eldritch Blast from Warlock 1, which is by itself already quite good cantrip, with 1d10 force damage. And it continues to improve while you level up paladin.
    I suggested Lvl 5, because on this character level I could shoot two beams with 1d10+4 or +5 dmg - that would be difference +8/+10 dmg per EB salvo.

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkhios View Post
    Which kinda speaks for itself already. With normal 27 point buy, I would never even try it.
    With 27pt buy, Half-elf is doable.

    Str 13(5pts)
    Dex 15(9pts)+1(race)
    Con 13(5pts)+1(race)
    Int 8
    Wis 9(1pts)
    Cha 14(7pts)+2(race)

    Leaving a starting stat array level 1 of:
    Str 13
    Dex 16
    Con 14
    Int 8
    Wis 9
    Cha 16
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hi! So I've recently been able to get more into 5e DnD. I slowly began to realize I really love the Paladin class, polearm build is great, but I'm also a fan of being a spell knight, which Paladins are, in a sense, the closest to what I like to do spell knight-wise.

    Anyway to the point, I'm playing in a campaign soon starting at level 4. And I'm struggling to decide how to build this spell knight. We have permission to use Unearthed Arcana stuff so here is what I've been thinking:

    I wanna make it reminiscent of a Magic knight from a game I've played. So I'm going the Protector Aasimar for +2 Cha as well as having incorporeal wings. (Kratos Aurion from Tales of Symphonia is the influence)

    The hard part is class/multiclass selection. I'm positive I will eventually go Sword and Board with this build. I'm also positive on getting at least 6 Paladin and probably stopping there for it.

    My options and what I've been juggling are Paladin 6/ Sorcerer(Favored Soul) 14 or Paladin 6/ Sorc(FS) 13/ Warlock(Hexblade) 1

    So would it be worth it for the Warlock Hexblade lvl dip to get cha to longsword atk and dmg, as well as hexblade's curse?

    We did a roll 4d6 drop the lowest and here are the stats I got. 17,17,16, 12, 11, 8.

    So far I assigned them as such:
    16 str
    12 dex
    17 con
    8 int
    12 wis(racial +1)
    19 cha(racial +2)

    Another thing is since I'm starting at 4th lvl should I just go straight Paladin 4 for my Warcaster feat? Or would it be wise to Paladin 3/Sorc 1 or even Paladin 2/Sorc 1/ lock 1?

    Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks!

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Daion515 View Post
    Hi! So I've recently been able to get more into 5e DnD. I slowly began to realize I really love the Paladin class, polearm build is great, but I'm also a fan of being a spell knight, which Paladins are, in a sense, the closest to what I like to do spell knight-wise.

    Anyway to the point, I'm playing in a campaign soon starting at level 4. And I'm struggling to decide how to build this spell knight. We have permission to use Unearthed Arcana stuff so here is what I've been thinking:

    I wanna make it reminiscent of a Magic knight from a game I've played. So I'm going the Protector Aasimar for +2 Cha as well as having incorporeal wings. (Kratos Aurion from Tales of Symphonia is the influence)

    The hard part is class/multiclass selection. I'm positive I will eventually go Sword and Board with this build. I'm also positive on getting at least 6 Paladin and probably stopping there for it.

    My options and what I've been juggling are Paladin 6/ Sorcerer(Favored Soul) 14 or Paladin 6/ Sorc(FS) 13/ Warlock(Hexblade) 1

    So would it be worth it for the Warlock Hexblade lvl dip to get cha to longsword atk and dmg, as well as hexblade's curse?

    We did a roll 4d6 drop the lowest and here are the stats I got. 17,17,16, 12, 11, 8.

    So far I assigned them as such:
    16 str
    12 dex
    17 con
    8 int
    12 wis(racial +1)
    19 cha(racial +2)

    Another thing is since I'm starting at 4th lvl should I just go straight Paladin 4 for my Warcaster feat? Or would it be wise to Paladin 3/Sorc 1 or even Paladin 2/Sorc 1/ lock 1?

    Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks!
    Your stat array is fine, the idea is good. The only thing I'd advise for you is to ask the DM if he intends on going up to level 20.

    Most campaigns never actually get that far. If the DM doesn't intend on having you play at level 20, worrying about what the character will look like at that level is pointless.

  23. - Top - End - #323
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    DruidGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    You're right I actually usually aim not to worry so much about my late game (as in 15+) although I do still give small thought. I'll ask him and come back with a definite answer on that.

    I'm more concerned with my early game than anything. I'm struggling to figure out how to assign my levels for like the first 6 levels.
    Ways I've come up with:
    Start off as just Paladin 4 - this gets me my Warcaster feat. So I can Sword and Board right off the bat no problem. On level up take Sorc or Lock 1 then the other on next level.
    Paladin 3 / Sorc 1 - No Warcaster feat, but some versatility in spells. I still get an oath (thinking Crown for this guy). On level up take Paladin 4 for Warcaster, then Lock 1, then Paladin to 6. This means I'll probably be one
    Paladin 2 / Sorc 1 / Lock 1 - No Warcaster feat, but versatility in spells, Cha to longsword, Hexblade Curse, No oath options yet. Take Paladin to 4 on level ups.

    I guess what I'm asking is what is the smoothest leveling path to take? Or is it even worth it to take that Lock 1 ever? I mean in a sense I usually aim realistically for reaching 12-15th lvls max.
    And at this point, if I do start with Sorc in my levels would it be better to start Sorc and get Con proficiency? Or Heavy armor?

    Thanks for advice again!

  24. - Top - End - #324
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Paladin 6 is so good. If you plan on getting 6 levels, get them before anything else.

  25. - Top - End - #325
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2017

    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hello Great guide! Gladiadores to see its still functional. I wanted to ask for help. I am starting a Long campaign ( From lvl 1 to 20). I am unsure as to wether i should play the sorcadin here or a pallock which i have heard is very powerful. What are the differences? Which is stronger? I was thinking about fiend chain warlock as its very interesting and has options outside of combat particularly with the imp. Is it viable or do i lose too much power? Its an epic challenge where every table is gonna be playing in the same island so a lot of PvP is expected among all parties. Only Core book and SCAG allowed. What is your advise? Thank you!

  26. - Top - End - #326
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Dieo View Post
    Hello Great guide! Gladiadores to see its still functional. I wanted to ask for help. I am starting a Long campaign ( From lvl 1 to 20). I am unsure as to wether i should play the sorcadin here or a pallock which i have heard is very powerful. What are the differences? Which is stronger? I was thinking about fiend chain warlock as its very interesting and has options outside of combat particularly with the imp. Is it viable or do i lose too much power? Its an epic challenge where every table is gonna be playing in the same island so a lot of PvP is expected among all parties. Only Core book and SCAG allowed. What is your advise? Thank you!
    My advice would be to start a new thread. This one only touches on the benefits of warlock, and really concentrated on sorcerer.

    You'll get more, and better advice that way.

  27. - Top - End - #327
    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    I may have missed it being alluded to by anyone other than Daion515, but considering the unearthed arcana books that have come out and the ease of replacing shillelagh with a one level dip in warlock, why not Warlock Hexblade 1/Stone Sorcerer 1/Any Paladin 2/Stone Sorcerer 16? There has been some dance on sorc/hexblade or hexblade/paladin, but taking all three with a bit of moderation nets you the best of all possible outcomes. You get level 9 spells still (albeit quite late), you only miss out on one ASI, and the only big sorc thing you miss out on is a group capstone shot instead of a single bodyguard effort.

    On the flip side, you officially become a slow moving DAD (Con becomes your hp AND ac bonus, while Cha becomes your attack, casting, and face stat), and thematically everything you get is more or less from a blessing from an extra-planar source. You may be clumsy, but with only a single dump stat and 13 strength, you run 15 mains out of the gate and can still reach both caps if you're dying to hit that milestone... and get a feat in there with variant human if that is your shtick. Right from the word go, you can fill the role of semi-tanky striker, and by level 4 you're fairly "online" with your first dabbling of smite, a combat style, a means of being durable and tanky while attacking like the best of sword-and-boarders. As time goes on, however, you get to make that eldritch knight fidget uncomfortably as you enjoy doubled cantrip strikes and almost normal full casting progression. By a level after they get their first taste of multi-attack, you're already capable of launching a quickened double booming blade with smite frosting.

    Hexblade curse isn't amazing, but against the BBEG it is certainly not without use, and being able to ditch strength AND dex means amazing things for your tanking. You never have to worry about armour (except maybe a shield), you nova with smite like any other pally, and you go boom like any sorc, only your attribute dependency is lessened and you have the greatness that is hex and eldritch blast. Heck, if you still want more devilry in your life, you can even take level 20 into warlock one last time, and capstone with a couple invocations instead of that likely unnecessary final metamagic option. Short rests also net you an extra warlock spell slot and spell known, one more bump on hp, and one less casting of a level 5 spell... If you hit level 20 to begin with, you don't have many problems left anyways but I'd personally rather end a career with diversity.

  28. - Top - End - #328
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    SamuraiGuy

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    Post Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Hey, great guide!


    Quick question; unless I'm completely missing something, isn't a Longsword only versatile? (Not Finesse) As such wouldn't you use a Rapier for a dex-based sword&board build?

    Quick Edit: WotC also released an UA last month completely changing the Favored Soul (And as such is actually quite lackluster and also doesn't gain the Extra Attack feature)
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___________
    As far as my build goes: I was planning to run 7/13 using Oathbreaker and Shadow (Swapping Swadow for Wild if DM doesn't allow UA)

    My stats are (we rolled using the 4d6 drop low system) 18/8/14/8/10/16 in that order (This because I'm planning Half-Orc, bumping it to 20/8/15/8/10/16).

    Now what would optimize my playstyle damage-wise (full on shred through stuff, ignoring things that don't bother me/get them out of my way with dominate spells), S&B or 2handed? And in that respect (if 2-handed) Gsword or Glaive/Halberd?

    I was /thinking/ a Glaive with PAM and the Tunnel Fighting Style. This leave me with 3 ASI options along the line, getting GWM, ASI for Charisma and possibly Resillient(CON).
    Last edited by Willywilliamrtx; 2017-03-13 at 12:17 AM. Reason: Added build feedback

  29. - Top - End - #329
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Are Volo's races gonna get into this guide?

  30. - Top - End - #330
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Unlimited Blade Works: The Guide to the Ultimate Paladin/Sorcerer Multiclass

    Quote Originally Posted by Willywilliamrtx View Post
    Quick Edit: WotC also released an UA last month completely changing the Favored Soul (And as such is actually quite lackluster and also doesn't gain the Extra Attack feature)
    Definitely less enticing, though cleric spell list access means it's not entirely without merit. Oathbreaker 7 / Favored Soul 5+ picks up animate dead, for instance. A little late at level 12, but still.

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