This might be a really stupid question...

[Synreith]

Specifically, I was reading the lowest level build to solo tomb of horrors thread, (which is fantastic by the by, go read it) and I thought of something. Would it be possible to find a way to cast true resurrection on Mr Bossy Face? What about turning him into a living construct? Cheese may or may not be encouraged, as may be the sacrifice of your ability to taste bacon. So please, use discretion.

[noob]

True ressurection can be cast on destroyed undeads and it make them stop being dead(but never make it stop being undead nor remove its templates because it does not says it do: you will have a living creature with the undead type instead of having an undead creature with the undead type) but you can not cast in on an undead which have not been destroyed.
However you can cast it on an undead creature that have been destroyed then repaired even through it is not destroyed at the time where you cast the spell it has been destroyed once and so counts as a valid target for resurrection.

[Synreith]

Fair enough, what about making him a living construct?

[noob]

It is really hard to make of a creature a living construct.
Basically you will need a wish with one of the options given into a guide about monster players.(something like savage species)
But you can turn a construct in an humanoid or giant(and nerf it down hard unless it did not had an int score before) with the spell incarnate construct it needs to beat a will save and sr but since it makes the creature friendly with you it is really cool.

[KillianHawkeye]

However you can cast it on an undead creature that have been destroyed then repaired even through it is not destroyed at the time where you cast the spell it has been destroyed once and so counts as a valid target for resurrection.

The spell is certainly referring to an undead that is currently destroyed (since most undead besides liches do not come back after being destroyed), even if the text doesn't literally say it.

[noob]

He is supposed to use the lowest level build to solo the tomb of horrors so it probably is an elven generalist domain wizard(or other build powered by direct interpretation of raw) who got access to level 9 spells at level 1(and a domain so he can probably pick up the domain with true resurrection even if it is weird for soloing).(unless he manage to have a character of level 0 or less)
Also he was speaking about using true resurrection which is further indication that he probably have access to level 9 spells at low level.
So we can not even know how physics works in his universe.

[KillianHawkeye]

He is supposed to use the lowest level build to solo the tomb of horrors so it probably is an elven generalist domain wizard(or other build powered by direct interpretation of raw) who got access to level 9 spells at level 1(and a domain so he can probably pick up the domain with true resurrection even if it is weird for soloing).(unless he manage to have a character of level 0 or less)
Also he was speaking about using true resurrection which is further indication that he probably have access to level 9 spells at low level.
So we can not even know how physics works in his universe.

I think you're jumping to conclusions here. He said he was reading a thread about low level soloing the Tomb of Horrors and it made him think of some interesting questions. There's nothing saying that he is trying to get high level spells on a low level character himself.

Anyway, even if somebody is doing some crazy TO shenanigans, that's no reason to start willfully misinterpreting how resurrection spells interact with undead creatures.

[TheCountAlucard]

Also even if resurrection-type spells worked on undestroyed undead, they don't work on an unwilling target, so all the boss has to do is not want to be affected.

[Synreith]

Alright, so I've read through what ye all said, and now I'm gonna reword my question. Would it be possible to turn the boss into a living creature feasibly, so that you may use a "slay" type spell/ability/etc. to finish him off? Preferably without resorting to something along the lines of saying, "Because my God says so." I'm primarily looking for cost efficiency here.

[TheCountAlucard]

Again, resurrecting a target requires them to be willing. All they have to do is not want to return to life.

[noob]

Why would they not want to be living?
They keep all the undead traits and undead powers but are living and so will go to an afterlife when dying instead of just being destroyed.
However that would not make them vulnerable to most of the slay living stuff because undead have immunity to stuff with a fort save that do not targets objects so it would be a bad idea to cast this on an undead if your objective is to kill it.

[TheCountAlucard]

He just said it was so you could hit 'em with a "Slay" effect!

Would it be possible to turn the boss into a living creature feasibly, so that you may use a "slay" type spell/ability/etc. to finish him off?

I'm primarily looking for cost efficiency here.

Look, man, if I've become undead, it was probably for a reason. If you come 'round offering to make me alive again, I'll probably turn you down, because with life comes vulnerability to cancer and diabetes and heart disease and "Slay Living" spells, and that's before I start wondering what you're getting out of all this.

And if you just fling a resurrection spell at me out of nowhere, I'm definitely assuming you're trying something, so expect it to not only not work, but for "Disintegrate" spells to follow.

[noob]

According to dnd rules becoming living again for an undead would let it keep all its undead properties including but not limited to immortality, all the undead immunities, being an undead(you keep the undead type it is just that you are living), all the powers you gained by becoming undead and the powers you gained while being undead and all the powers steaming from being undead.
It also happens that there is no effect that kills living creatures who can effect living undead due to the undead immunities who by luck prevents all those living killing effects from working on them(undead have immunity to death effects and all the kill living stuff are death effects).
Undead are immune to death effects and that is not due to the fact they are dead it is due to their type that they do not lose when resurrected.
You are interpreting the rules in a non raw way.
By raw undead lose nothing at all from being resurrected and by raw they even gain the ability to go to an afterlife if killed(which they did not had before) instead of being just destroyed.

If you plan to kill the undead boss making it become alive will only be negative because by raw it not only give it no additional vulnerabilities but it also allows it to go to the afterlife when killed thus allowing to come back as a demon or angel to kill you(and possibly have T1 casting) because making an undead alive do not make it less an undead.

If you want it not to be alive but instead to lose his undead coolness you should not resurrect him and instead use spark of life http://dnd.arkalseif.info/spells/spe...of-life--4198/

[The_Jette]

According to dnd rules becoming living again for an undead would let it keep all its undead properties including but not limited to immortality, all the undead immunities, being an undead(you keep the undead type it is just that you are living), all the powers you gained by becoming undead and the powers you gained while being undead and all the powers steaming from being undead.
it also happens that there is no effect that kills living creatures who can effect living undead due to the undead immunities who by luck prevents all those living killing effects from working on them.
Undead are immune to death effects and that is not due to the fact they are dead it is due to their type that they do not lose when resurrected.
You are interpreting the rules in a non raw way.
By raw undead lose nothing at all from being resurrected and by raw they even gain the ability to go to an afterlife if killed(which they did not had before) instead of being just destroyed.

Per the entry for Undead types in 3.5, any undead creature that is affected by Resurrection or True Resurrection are returned to life as the creature type and subtype they were before they were turned into an undead. Per the spells, the undead have to have been destroyed before they can be targeted, both in the listing under target (indicating a dead creature, not undead), and in the spell text itself. Therefore, an undead creature can be destroyed, then returned to life by Resurrection or True Resurrection. Your interpretation of RAW is completely ignoring flat out written rules, and as such is incorrect.

[noob]

I forgot to read the undead type sorry.
(at the same time why is all those rules concerning players are in the monster manual is weird)
onto the spell not working on undead who have been destroyed once on its life it is not clear.
I think there is no reason for which an undead who have been destroyed once then came back to undeath could not be resurrected since it says
"who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed." which does not needs the undead to be currently in a destroyed state it only needs to have been destroyed once after becoming an undead.

[The_Jette]

I forgot to read the undead type sorry.
(at the same time why is all those rules concerning players are in the monster manual is weird)
onto the spell not working on undead who have been destroyed once on its life it is not clear.
I think there is no reason for which an undead who have been destroyed once then came back to undeath could not be resurrected since it says
"who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed." which does not needs the undead to be currently in a destroyed state it only needs to have been destroyed once after becoming an undead.

That's an interesting concept, but misses one other thing. The target of Resurrection or True Resurrection has to be a "dead creature," not undead. A creature that is undead is not dead. It would take an extreme interpretation of the rules to allow it to work on an undead creature and turn it into a "living undead".

[Synreith]

So I could Spark of Life it, then slay the cheeky bastard, interesting...

Thank ye gentlemen, I do believe I has found my answer. No, wait, doesn't he automatically succeed on a saving against anything that allows spell resist?

[The_Jette]

So I could Spark of Life it, then slay the cheeky bastard, interesting...

Thank ye gentlemen, I do believe I has found my answer. No, wait, doesn't he automatically succeed on a saving against anything that allows spell resist?

I've looked up Strahd's stats, and don't see anything about automatically succeeding at any saving throw against spells that allow spell resistance. Spark of Life and Slay Living are both Cleric spells, but Slay Living being a 5th level spell. If you could find a scroll of both, you could cast them by being a 1st level Cleric and making a caster level check. I doubt you'd be able to survive the round between casting Spark of Life and getting off Slay Living, though. So, you may wanna avoid that. Then again, by level 11 you'll have 6th level spells. You could get Quicken Spell as a feat, memorize Spark of Life as a Quickened Spell, then follow it up with Slay Living if he fails his save. He does have a +16 to Will saves, though. So, chances are, he's going to make his saving throw unless you have some way of drastically boosting up your DC's.

[ExLibrisMortis]

There is only one way I know of to turn a creature into a living construct, short of DM fiat (including wish): take ten levels of Renegade Mastermaker. One of the entry requirements is the Humanoid type, though, which may require further magic to obtain.

The funny thing about RM 10 is that you get the living construct type, which is a subtype, so you could feasibly be an Undead (living construct), which is one of the weirdest and most awesome types possible (do you have a con score? I don't know).

[noob]

Well renegade mastermaker have a huge trouble: how do you convince an undead to take it while it lose so much caster level(you get an better unarmed strike but that is not what an undead monstrosity seeks(since they probably use natural attacks) the only thing interesting is that you can cheese the warforged integrated components to gain one thousand hp for 12500 gp of integrated level 0 scrolls).
You will probably need to control the undead creature for that.