I am Warlock, Hear me Invoke

[GryffonDurime]

I am about to make a claim. It may be agreed with, it may be disagreed with, but on the whole I think it to be fairly accurate:

The Warlock is the Dungeons and Dragons equivalent of a superhero. Think about it: what other character class flys around, tossing energy blasts and things of that ilk all through the day and night? The Wizard conserves his energies for only tasks that require or benefit from the application thereof. Even the Sorcerer has a limit that makes him think twice about injudicious application of magic. Only the Warlock eats, sleeps, and breathes arcane energy.

In addition, I'd like to claim that the Warlock is by far one of the most delightfully splashy classes for characters who want to be able to do some absolutely amazing things simply out of sheer awsomeness, in the style of Wuxia or Welsh heroes. Additionally, with nothing more than a change of flavor, almost any kind of empowered character can be created within a reasonable level of stretching. Par example:

Spiderman - The Webslinger himself could be reasonably modeled on a high-Strength Warlock. Between eternal Spiderclimb (for obvious reasons), Dark One's Own Luck to Reflex Saves and Entropic Warding (to simulate spider-senses), you've got most of the basics already.

Gandalf - Quoi? Gandalf Grayhame, a Maia, cast as a lowly Warlock? Between a simple change from Eldritch Blast to "Ray of Light", a few choice invocations from Complete Mage (Hammer Blast and Call of the Beast among them), and Hideous Blow (to make the old man a slightly more fearsome swordsman), you can create a fairly effective Gandalf. Fellow Fellowship member Legolas might also have a level, if only to pick up the CMage invocation Witchwood Steps.

Random Jedi #32 - If you want to manipulate the Force, you might be a Warlock. While a bit higher level than some others to effectively demonstrate, Repulsive Blast is Force Push incarnate, especially combined with an appropriate shape essence. Beguiling Influence and Charm make an effective Jedi Mind Trick. And did someone say Leaps and Bounds for springing into battle? Throw in an Eldritch Glaive for good measure, and you have a passable Jedi.

Now, I know that Dungeons and Dragons isn't really meant to play host to the first or third example, but even still, the shear scope of the potential inherent to the Warlock's modular, customizable design displays how you can create a mechanically established character with a deep number of possible choices even when dealing with only a single class.

So, for those of you out there who love the warlock, let's see what you can come up with. Superman is obviously waiting there, looking for someone to give him DR45/Kryptonite. Sabriel the Abhorsen is entirely possible, save perhaps for Astarael--unless you count an Utterdark Doom. Warlocks can even pretend to be a little Japanese school girl who fights for love and justice, if only you change the words Eldritch Blast to a season-appropriate attack.

I think that is by far what makes the Warlock fun--barring a small change in flavor that only the most inflexible DM would refuse, a Warlock can be almost anything.

[Maltrich]

Random Jedi #32 - If you want to manipulate the Force, you might be a Warlock. While a bit higher level than some others to effectively demonstrate, Repulsive Blast is Force Push incarnate, especially combined with an appropriate shape essence. Beguiling Influence and Charm make an effective Jedi Mind Trick. And did someone say Leaps and Bounds for springing into battle? Throw in an Eldritch Glaive for good measure, and you have a passable Jedi.

Three words: brilliant energy longsword.

[de-trick]

Three words: brilliant energy longsword.

No bastard sword because can use 2 handed or 1 handed

[Morty]

Gandalf - Quoi? Gandalf Grayhame, a Maia, cast as a lowly Warlock? Between a simple change from Eldritch Blast to "Ray of Light", a few choice invocations from Complete Mage (Hammer Blast and Call of the Beast among them), and Hideous Blow (to make the old man a slightly more fearsome swordsman), you can create a fairly effective Gandalf. Fellow Fellowship member Legolas might also have a level, if only to pick up the CMage invocation Witchwood Steps.

That doesn't fit Gandalf any more than Wizard. In D&D, power of arcane spellcaster or semi-spellcaster is measured by the amount of people he can kill during the day. In LoTR, it's far more subtle.

No bastard sword because can use 2 handed or 1 handed

You can use longsword two handed.

[de-trick]

learn something new everyday

[Matthew]

All One Handed Weapons (as opposed to Light Weapons) can be used Two Handed. It is part of what makes such things as Dwarven War Axes and Bastard Swords utterly pointless outside of very specific scenarios (Such as: Racial Familiarity, Exotic Weapon Master and so on)

[GryffonDurime]

Fascinating as this conversation is, and with no intended rudeness or intention to insult...

...so incredibly not the point of the thread.

...So how 'bout 'them Warlocks? Ain't they a kick?

[InaVegt]

I like the warlock as a tool of war, that first level warlock is a more effective archer than that first level ranger, let me compare:

Touch attack vs 1 point of bab
Free shots vs max range (no army has unlimited arrows, as such even rangers can't shoot whenever they think they see an enemy)

So, let's say we have as an opponent a 1st level warrior orc, the ranger has a longbow and fav'd enemy (orc), the orc has dex 12 and is wearing chainmail, he stands 220 feet away.

Let's assume both our characters have dex 14.

The warlock uses eldritch spear and as such has enough range, he has to hit an AC of 11, meaning he needs a 9 or better to hit (60% change) meanwhile he deals an average of 3.5 damage per non critical hit. (0.6×3.5=2.1 damage average)

The ranger shoots with his longbow, suffering a -3 penalty for range, meanwhile he has to hit an AC of 15. This makes the total needed to hit 15 or better (30% chance) meanwhile he deals an average damage of 5.5 per non critical hit (0.3×5.5=1.65 damage average)

[lord_khaine]

the problem with statistics are that people can just about use them to prove anything they want.

in this case you have just proven that at that range and with those chars the warlock is more effective, but really, that ranger isnt focused on archery with a lowly dex of 14, and could benefit from both rapid shot and a mightby bow.

[Starsinger]

Three words: brilliant energy longsword.

B.E. Weapons can't affect constructs, Jedi are notorious for whoopin droid face with their lightsabers, other than that...

As for the OP, Bravo! I like it when people use D&D creatively... also the Warlock as Magical Girl inspires me.. my next character is so a magical girl, just gotta reflavor.. Eldritch Blast is gonna be something sickeningly sweet like, "Pink Sugar Heart Ache"... why does that sound so familiar?

[InaVegt]

the problem with statistics are that people can just about use them to prove anything they want.

in this case you have just proven that at that range and with those chars the warlock is more effective, but really, that ranger isnt focused on archery with a lowly dex of 14, and could benefit from both rapid shot and a mightby bow.

If we wanted to focus that ranger on archery, the warlock must the same.

So, with 18 dex we have the following: a +0.1×damage average (that is, 2.45 for the warlock, 2.2 for the range), now the ranger is closer but still less effective. It becomes mighty expensive for en army to issue composite longbows to every archer in the army (while the warlock doesn't even need a bow), not to mention stats above 15 are rare (10 out of 36 people have one, that's 27.8%, and that's in a random stat, so 10 out of 216 would have a dex of 16 or above, that's 4.6%, all assuming 3d6 down the line, as people are made (you just select the better ones for your PCs))

Taking rapid shot is quite a waste if you're planning on progressing above first level (and can only be done by humans at that level)

[AslanCross]

I do think the comparison to a superhero is quite accurate--you have a narrow selection of powers that you can use ad nauseum. Of course you wouldn't be insanely tough like most superheroes are, but it's still a good comparison.

Also, magical girl ftw.

[Tengu]

It becomes mighty expensive for en army to issue composite longbows to every archer in the army (while the warlock doesn't even need a bow), not to mention stats above 15 are rare

1. Archers in an army would probably be warriors or fighters, not rangers.
2. Somehow, the idea of how is it possible to create an army of warlocks eludes me. Unless in a very unusual setting.

[Fax Celestis]

1. Archers in an army would probably be warriors or fighters, not rangers.
2. Somehow, the idea of how is it possible to create an army of warlocks eludes me. Unless in a very unusual setting.

Why shouldn't there be? Nations train rangers, scouts, and fighters in their armies; why not warlocks?

[Citizen Joe]

2. Somehow, the idea of how is it possible to create an army of warlocks eludes me. Unless in a very unusual setting.

Bronze Citadel run by an Efreeti Lord. All his troops sign a pact with him and thus become warlocks. Wish 3/day kinda assures loyalty.

[Tengu]

Why shouldn't there be? Nations train rangers, scouts, and fighters in their armies; why not warlocks?

Because martial training takes usually much less time and resources than a magical one? I could see members of spellcasting classes as valuable assets on the battlefield, but they'd be rather rare - certainly not regular troopers.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a warlock need to have some sort of a pact with an evil or chaotic outsider in order to use his/her power? That does not speak exactly "soldier" to me.

Bronze Citadel run by an Efreeti Lord. All his troops sign a pact with him and thus become warlocks. Wish 3/day kinda assures loyalty.

That's what I call "unusual". Makes sense though.

[PaladinFreak]

You're right. Warlocks just plain rock. I'm not saying they are overpowered, as their abilities are weak enough on their own that you generally wouldn't want them if you had limited spells per day, but, with the infinite spells per day, I think they are worth it.

Plus they are really cool.

[Khantalas]

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a warlock need to have some sort of a pact with an evil or chaotic outsider in order to use his/her power? That does not speak exactly "soldier" to me.

Or a fey. Or a celestial. Or a slaad. Wait, slaadi are already chaotic outsiders. But you get the idea.

Then again, I am having a hard time picturing a benevolent fey screaming "alright, you maggots!" like R. Lee Ermey, but it would be fun watching a training regiment overseen by a sylph.

[Citizen Joe]

The chaotic end of warlocks don't really lend themselves to an organized force. So you're looking at a mostly lawful evil/neutral evil group. Its really just a matter of putting an outsider in the upper echelon of the particular country. I don't think Eldritch Blast has range bands though... just goes out so far and stops. That means archers have better range.

[Starsinger]

Elves are by their nature Chaotic unless otherwise noted, yet Elves have armies... why can't fey/fiends?

[Citizen Joe]

I said organized force. Chaos can have armies, they just aren't organized.

[Tokiko Mima]

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a warlock need to have some sort of a pact with an evil or chaotic outsider in order to use his/her power? That does not speak exactly "soldier" to me.

A Warlock is no more beholden to the fiends/outsiders that gave his ancestors power than a sorcerer is beholden to their dragon blood. A long time ago fiends would make Warlocks, but by far more Warlocks are simply born with their power, rather than being given it.

I think the issue with creating an army of Warlocks is the same as creating an army of sorcerers: Most people just don't have the potential to become either class. It's assumed that most adventurers have the potential if they say they do, it's as easy as picking up another class level, but for normal people it might be imposssible.

Certainly, you could do as the Jedi apparently do: Look for and train the fraction of people with the Warlock potential as elite warriors, but you're still going to need footsoldiers/Storm/Clonetroopers as well.

[Citizen Joe]

A Warlock is no more beholden to the fiends/outsiders that gave his ancestors power than a sorcerer is beholden to their dragon blood. A long time ago fiends would make Warlocks, but by far more Warlocks are simply born with their power, rather than being given it.

I could be wrong, since I don't have (or want) that specific book, but I thought the specific warlock had to sign a pact with said outsider/fey/whatever.

[Inyssius Tor]

No, they do not.

[Tokiko Mima]

I don't think Eldritch Blast has range bands though... just goes out so far and stops. That means archers have better range.

Initially, Eldritch Blast is limited to a range of 60'. This is respectable for most ranged weapons but not fantastic.

1st level Warlocks can pick up the Eldritch Spear Invocation, however, which increases their range to a very respectable 250'. To hit at that range an archer would have to be hitting their second or worse range band, and applying a -4 or greater penalty to attack. In addition, the target of an archers attack has to penetrate the full AC with armor and dodge bonuses. Whereas a Warlock's Eldritch Blast is generally a ranged touch attack, and completely bypasses armor, shields, and natural armor.

So yes, while ranged attacks have a chance of striking it's not nearly as good of a chance, and it's difficult to maintain Line of Sight at those higher ranges anyway. It's a trade off.

The real penalty Warlock experience is not gaining iterative attacks. Since Eldritch Blast is a standard action they don't get the benefit that others do when their BAB reaches 6 or higher. On the other hand, it keeps them highly mobile, as you can expect a warlock to have a free move action in any given round.

[slexlollar89]

check this out... i made a warforged warlock that had his left arm turned into a wand receptacle (the wands could be used up and a new one could be put in) and called him Mega Man... the only downside was he only had one hand!

[Morty]

The problem with creating an army, or part of the army, from warlocks is that you aren't trained as warlock like you'd be trained as fighter, ranger or wizard, you simply are warlock and then you decide if you embrace your heritage -by taking levels in the class- or screw this and do something else -by not taking any levels. The fact that Warlocks need to be chaotic don't help much either. Not to mention that enlisting people with fiendish or otherwise alien heritage into army wouldn't be good for sovereign's PR.

[The Demented One]

As for the OP, Bravo! I like it when people use D&D creatively... also the Warlock as Magical Girl inspires me.. my next character is so a magical girl, just gotta reflavor.. Eldritch Blast is gonna be something sickeningly sweet like, "Pink Sugar Heart Ache"... why does that sound so familiar?

I think that was one of Sailor Minimoon's attacks.

Wait! Manliness...fading away...NOOO!

[ForzaFiori]

The problem with creating an army, or part of the army, from warlocks is that you aren't trained as warlock like you'd be trained as fighter, ranger or wizard, you simply are warlock and then you decide if you embrace your heritage -by taking levels in the class- or screw this and do something else -by not taking any levels. The fact that Warlocks need to be chaotic don't help much either. Not to mention that enlisting people with fiendish or otherwise alien heritage into army wouldn't be good for sovereign's PR.

Chaotic OR EVIL.

u could have an army of Lawful Evil warlocks.

[Morty]

Chaotic OR EVIL.

u could have an army of Lawful Evil warlocks.

The point remains. People who have to be either chaotic -and therefore likely to have troubles with obeying orders- or evil -therefore likely to cause other troubles- aren't good material for army.