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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Proficiency in every skill

    Long stories short:
    8th level proficiency master

    Half elf Bard (Lore) 4/ Rogue1/ Warlock2/ Cleric (Knowledge) 1

    2 skills from the race
    2 from the background
    3 from the Bard + 3 from the college = 6
    3 because of Skilled feat
    1 because of Rogue multiclass
    2 from the Knowledge Domain
    2 from the warlock's Beguiling Influence invocation

    For a total of 18 (all) skills in which you add your proficiency bonus, you also double the bonus on 4 skills of your choice because of various experteses and on the four knowledge skills: Arcana, Nature, Religion, History.

    At level 20 you can reach 10th level in Bard for another expertise and 6th level in Rogue (possibly Arcane Trickster for spell slots progression) for yet more expertise, so that you'll end with adding double your proficiency bonus in 12 skills.

    This character has only 3 ASIs and one of them is spent on the Skilled feat, but has medium armor and shields proficiency so maybe with tough and war caster he could stand a chance even in the frontline.

    Just some useless thoughts that I wanted to share, do you have more efficient ways to achieve such a skilled character? And how would you (if you would) play it? Personally I see the 8th level proficiency master as primarly a support caster which basically handles all the social encounters by himself.
    Last edited by Lombra; 2017-04-11 at 07:53 AM.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    V Human (skilled) Rogue 1/Bard (Lore) 3/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Warlock 2 (beguiling influence) does it at 7...

    if we add UA material we can do it at 6th I think (V Human (skilled) Rogue (scout) 3/Mystic (nomad) 1/Cleric (knowledge) 1/Ranger (revised) 1) with all skills and a beefy 'wilderness warrior' chassis

    In practice though, jack of all trades as a bard covers a lot of ground with medicine, animal handling, etc... a half-Elf Lore Bard with one level of Knowlege Cleric really does everything a 'skill master' needs to do for me in play
    Last edited by Naanomi; 2017-04-11 at 07:56 AM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Naanomi View Post
    V Human (skilled) Rogue 1/Bard (Lore) 3/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Warlock 2 (beguiling influence) does it at 7... if we add UA material we can do it at 6th I think
    Oh right the Variant Human, nice catch. I didn't read extensively through the UAs so I stuck with the core rulebook.
    Edit: I think the Variant Human falls short of one skill if I'm not mistaken.
    Last edited by Lombra; 2017-04-11 at 07:54 AM.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    With eldritch blast as your at-will damage he'll stay perfectly competitive with most other PCs throughout his career.

    Buffing and controlling as a bard fits well too for using the slots. I wouldn't put him on the front line though.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lombra View Post
    Oh right the Variant Human, nice catch. I didn't read extensively through the UAs so I stuck with the core rulebook.
    Edit: I think the Variant Human falls short of one skill if I'm not mistaken.
    V Human - 1
    Skilled - 3
    Background - 2
    Rogue - 4
    Knowlege domain - 2
    Beguiling influence - 2
    Bard multiclass - 1
    Lore Bard subclass - 3

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Naanomi View Post
    V Human - 1
    Skilled - 3
    Background - 2
    Rogue - 4
    Knowlege domain - 2
    Beguiling influence - 2
    Bard multiclass - 1
    Lore Bard subclass - 3
    I totally missed the Rogue as the starting class, giod job! It's already 10 skill proficiencies at 1st level xD

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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    If UA is allowed...

    Rogue (Scout) 6/Bard (Lore) 3/Wizard (Lore) 2/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Psion (v2) 1
    TOTAL = 13th level

    Half-Elf: 2 skills
    Background: 2 skills
    (Base) Rogue: 4 skills
    (M/C) Bard: 1 skill
    (Lore) Bard: 3 skills
    (Know.) Cleric: 2 skills
    Psion: 2 skills
    Skilled Feat: 3 skills
    =18 skills

    Bard 3: 2 expertise
    Rogue 1: 2 expertise
    (Scout) Rogue 3: 2 expertise
    Rogue 6: 2 expertise
    (Know.) Cleric 1: 2 expertise
    Psion 1: 2 expertise
    Wizard 2: 4 expertise
    =16 expertise

    tl;dr by 13th level, you have proficiency in all skills and expertise in 16/18 of them
    Last edited by Pichu; 2017-04-11 at 08:15 AM.
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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    I really don't see the need for all of the multiclassing.
    If you want to be a skill monkey, and still be able to contribute, Warlock 2 / Lore Bard X is your best bet.
    Jack of All Trades covers any skills you aren't proficient with.
    Warlock 2 gets you reliable at-will damage.
    Primarility Bard levels means you aren't hurting much on your casting, like all that multiclassing will do.
    All of that multiclassing is just wasted, IMNSHO. It's a gimmick.
    Last edited by DivisibleByZero; 2017-04-11 at 08:34 AM.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Pichu View Post
    If UA is allowed...

    Rogue (Scout) 6/Bard (Lore) 3/Wizard (Lore) 2/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Psion (v2) 1
    TOTAL = 13th level

    Half-Elf: 2 skills
    Background: 2 skills
    (Base) Rogue: 4 skills
    (M/C) Bard: 1 skill
    (Lore) Bard: 3 skills
    (Know.) Cleric: 2 skills
    Psion: 2 skills
    Skilled Feat: 3 skills
    =18 skills

    Bard 3: 2 expertise
    Rogue 1: 2 expertise
    (Scout) Rogue 3: 2 expertise
    Rogue 6: 2 expertise
    (Know.) Cleric 1: 2 expertise
    Psion 1: 2 expertise
    Wizard 2: 4 expertise
    =16 expertise

    tl;dr by 13th level, you have proficiency in all skills and expertise in 16/18 of them
    Now that's dedication, it's a shame that we're just two away from the skill god of expertise in everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by DivisibleByZero View Post
    I really don't see the need for all of the multiclassing.
    If you want to be a skill monkey, and still be able to contribute, Warlock 2 / Lore Bard X is your best bet.
    Jack of All Trades covers any skills you aren't proficient with.
    Warlock 2 gets you reliable at-will damage.
    Primarility Bard levels means you aren't hurting much on your casting, like all that multiclassing will do.
    All of that multiclassing is just wasted, IMNSHO. It's a gimmick.
    It's not a matter of efficiency, just an exercise to acheve something, you know, for fun.
    Last edited by Lombra; 2017-04-11 at 08:39 AM.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lombra View Post
    It's not a matter of efficiency, just an exercise to acheve something, you know, for fun.
    It's an excercise in efficiency that's been done, you know, just for fun, like 50 times. A new thread about it pops up every month or so.
    If you quote me and ask me questions,
    and I continue to not respond,
    it's probably because I have
    you on my Ignore list.
    Congratulations.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by DivisibleByZero View Post
    It's an excercise in efficiency that's been done, you know, just for fun, like 50 times. A new thread about it pops up every month or so.
    I can't remember a thread like that in the whole time I've been here, and the point is not to make an efficient character, but to find the most efficient way to get as much skills as high as possible. I think you might have read it the wrong way.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lombra View Post
    I can't remember a thread like that in the whole time I've been here, and the point is not to make an efficient character, but to find the most efficient way to get as much skills as high as possible. I think you might have read it the wrong way.
    It's been done as its own thread a few times; that's how I knew the 'best' answer immediately

    Not as often as top run speed threads though

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    Beholder

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    So in my campaign, I've banned vhumans but fixed the standard human with "one simple trick:" players can swap out any (or none...or all) of their +1 ability bumps for proficiency in any skill of their choice. They can therefore start with no ability +1s, but 6 skill proficiencies, before even getting to backgrounds and classes. Therefore, a player in my campaign could max out all proficiencies by level 5 as a human:
    Six from racial
    Two from background
    Four from rogue
    Two from knowledge cleric
    One from bard...then three more upon joining the college of lore

    Optimal build for combat would be a lightning arrow master. Comes fully online at CL 17: AT 6/Lore bard 10/knowledge cleric 1.

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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by MrFahrenheit View Post
    Comes fully online at CL 17.
    Do people actually play games like this?
    "Hey guys, I have an awesome idea for a character. We might never get to a level where it will work, and I'll be pretty useless for most of (if not all of) the game, but on paper it's awesome!"
    Last edited by DivisibleByZero; 2017-04-11 at 09:06 AM.
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by DivisibleByZero View Post
    Do people actually play games like this?
    "Hey guys, I have an awesome idea for a character. We might never get to a level where it will work, and I'll be pretty useless for most of (if not all of) the game, but on paper it's awesome!"
    It's more of a thought experiment for most people, but not every game starts at level 1. Some DMs might occasionally want to run a high level campaign, and it's nice to have cool builds ready for if they do that.

    Or, if you're a DM, they can be cool NPCs that exist in your world, that form the stuff of legends that your players might hear about, or even someday meet, whether as friends or foes.
    Last edited by erok0809; 2017-04-11 at 09:30 AM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Wow, Zero. Why are you shooting down a thread you're clearly not interested in participating in? Is it fun to show disdain? They do it for fun, and apparently they haven't gotten their fills after doing it for the last 50 times. Just like you pretend to be a vengeful half-elf rogue that kills goblins (I don't actually know the characters you play, but D&D as a game asks for child-like fantasy), so do they make their own characters.

    As for my contribution to the thread:

    Half-Elf -> 2 Skills
    Guild Artisan -> +2 Skills, +1 Tool Proficiency
    Artificer (Gunsmith) 2 -> +3 Skills, +4 Tool Proficiencies with Expertise
    Cleric (Knowledge) 1 -> +2 Skills with Expertise
    Rogue (Scout) 6 -> +3 Skills, +4 Expertise, +1 Tool Proficiency
    Bard (Lore) 10 -> +4 Skills, +4 Expertise, +1 Tool Proficiency
    Skilled Feat: +2 Skills, +1 Tool

    For a total of: 18 proficient skills (8 with Expertise), and 8 Tools (4 with Expertise)
    Last edited by LeonBH; 2017-04-11 at 12:03 PM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Beholder

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by DivisibleByZero View Post
    Do people actually play games like this?
    "Hey guys, I have an awesome idea for a character. We might never get to a level where it will work, and I'll be pretty useless for most of (if not all of) the game, but on paper it's awesome!"
    Never mind the fact that I've been running a campaign for the last two years, which started at 1, and now sees the PCs at the threshold of level 19. So yeah, games like this happen.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Naanomi View Post
    V Human (skilled) Rogue 1/Bard (Lore) 3/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Warlock 2 (beguiling influence) does it at 7...
    Yes, this guy is a true Jack of All Trades. Ironically, he has a class feature named Jack of All Trades, which is completely useless, as he has no non-proficient skills ...

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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by MrFahrenheit View Post
    Never mind the fact that I've been running a campaign for the last two years, which started at 1, and now sees the PCs at the threshold of level 19. So yeah, games like this happen.
    I wasn't referring to games never getting to that level.
    I was referring to the build, that comes on-line at level 17, and the fact that most games never get to that level.
    Do people actually play characters, at a real table, when that character isn't going to come "on-line" until level 17?
    If you quote me and ask me questions,
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    you on my Ignore list.
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    Kobold

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruslan View Post
    Yes, this guy is a true Jack of All Trades. Ironically, he has a class feature named Jack of All Trades, which is completely useless, as he has no non-proficient skills ...
    Not completely useless remember that Jack of all trades apllies to all ability checks and not just skills. This means it applies to generic checks (like initiative) and tools (which this character is not fully proficient in unless he spends a LOT of money and time to pick them all up).

    One less intensive method but yields almost as good results in skill use is rogue11/bard2. You get half prof bonus to all ability checks and treat the minimum roll (yes this checks out by strict RAW and per Sage clarification believe it or not).

    Yes the max check will not be quite as high but it will be better in many ways and you will be a very solid character in general.
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    DruidGirl

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    This is pretty cool. Still room in the OP's build (and most of the suggested builds) to then take Rogue to 11 for Reliable Talent. Which means not only are you proficient in every skill, half-proficient in every ability check (including initiative) and tool check, expertised in a good percentage, and can guidance for small additional boost on top of that; but you also can't roll below a 10 in any of them.

    I'm actually playing a variant on this right now. Inspired by TYP's focus on dungeon-crawling: Character concept is a dungeoneer trap specialist and artifact hunter, indiana jones-ish, who's been training his whole life, perfecting his dungeoneering skills. I wanted him to have proficiency and/or expertise in history + arcana (because he's been studying lost treasures and ancient relics), thieves' tools (of course), stealth, perception and investigation (to find those traps). Probably navigator's tools as well, and maybe religion. If he really wanted to be the best in the biz, he'd also need guidance, a way to gain advantage on skill checks (I settled on Enhance Ability), and the ability to disarm traps from a distance (mage hand legerdemain). As I started thinking about how to accomplish this, I realized he'd need to follow a bit of a skill monkey build. Right now he's Rogue 1 / Knowledge Cleric 1 / Bard 1, and he's a blast to play. The plan is to take him to Bard 3 (for expertise and Enhance Ability), then Arcane Trickster 3 (for remote trap disarming). After that I'm not sure, but will probably continue in Rogue to 11 for Reliable Talent, then Knowledge Cleric 2, then finishing up (if he makes it that high) in Bard. Picking up the Lucky and Dungeon Delver feats ASAP.

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    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    AHA! I HAVE RETURNED! I bring with me two builds: One for 18 expertise and one for 4 tool expertise. Both give you all 18 skill proficiencies.

    WARNING! 2 HIGH LEVEL BUILDS AHEAD! PROCEED WITH CAUTION!

    #1: All 18 expertises @ 20
    Bard (Lore) 10/Rogue (Scout) 6/Wizard (Lore) 2/ Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Psion v2 1
    -Same build as this except you go Bard 10 for an additional 2 expertises, two feats (Alchemist, Burglar, Gourmand, and Master of Disguise) for 2 tool expertise, and choose Charlatan for 2 tool proficiencies.

    TOTAL: 18 skill proficiencies, 18 skill expertises, 3 tool proficiency, and 2 tool expertise

    #2: Tool expertises @ 20
    Rogue (Scout) 6/Bard (Lore) 4/Artificer (Gunsmith) 2 or 4/Warlock (GOO) 2 or 4/Wizard (Lore) 2 or 4/Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Psion v2 1
    -Half-elf, Charlatan, and skilled feat (Rogue 6) give 7 skill proficiencies & 2 tool proficiencies
    -Start Artificer: 4 tool proficiencies & expertise in them
    -Rogue: 6 expertise
    -Bard: 4 skills (one from M/C) and 2 expertise
    -Warlock: You get 4 proficiencies (Beguiling Influence & Caiphon's Beacon)
    -Wizard: 4 expertise
    -Cleric: 2 skills and 2 expertise
    -Psion: 2 skills and 2 expertise
    -Level 4 in Bard and Wizard, Artificer, or Warlock: 2 feats from Alchemist, Burglar, Gourmand, and Master of Disguise

    TOTAL: 18 (19, but one goes to tools) skill proficiencies, 16 skill expertises, 7 tool proficiencies, and 6 tool expertises (2 from feats)

    NOTE: (Somewhere) its says that if you have the same proficiency twice, you can choose another iirc

    Disclaimer: I may have messed up the additions there
    Last edited by Pichu; 2017-04-11 at 01:36 PM.
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    Lonely Tylenol's Avatar

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    I'm actually playing the Rogue 3 (Scout)/Cleric 1 (Knowledge)/Bard 3 (Lore) build and just hit level 7 with it. Every skill proficiency, eight Expertise (Survival, Nature, two other knowledge skills, four free, which I think are in Stealth, Insight, and two social skills), and three tool proficiencies (thieves' tools, plus disguise kit and forgery kit from Charlatan), plus Guidance from the Cleric to add 1d4 whenever humanly possible.

    I made the conscious choice to avoid Warlock early, because it was really out of character for... Well... My character, to pursue those avenues. Ironically, as of the very last session we had, that is no longer the case, so I might look at Warlock to round out the build soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pichu View Post
    AHA! I HAVE RETURNED! I bring with me two builds: One for 18 expertise and one for 4 tool expertise. Both give you all 18 skill proficiencies.

    #1: All 18 expertises
    Bard (Lore) 10/Rogue (Scout) 6/Wizard (Lore) 2/ Cleric (Knowledge) 1/Psion v2 1
    -Same build as this except you go Bard 10 for an additional 2 expertises.
    Lore Wizard overlaps with Knowledge Cleric and Scout Rogue, with no provision that you can change the subject of your expertise. This build caps at 15 Expertise unless the DM specifically allows you to shift Expertise around (resulting in either the Lore Wizard or the Knowledge Cleric to give you expertise in something like Athletics or Sleight of Hand).

    I know the rule which lets you select an open proficiency if you are already proficient in something a class ability gives you, but I don't believe this extends to expertise.
    Last edited by Lonely Tylenol; 2017-04-11 at 01:40 PM.
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    ClericGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonely Tylenol View Post
    I know the rule which lets you select an open proficiency if you are already proficient in something a class ability gives you, but I don't believe this extends to expertise.
    Ehhh, I just assumed it was the same. 'Cause I'm lazy

    I did ask this question on r/dndnext just recently though...
    Last edited by Pichu; 2017-04-11 at 01:49 PM.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    A mystic with nomadic mind seems to cover this slightly faster. Sure they aren't proficient all at once, but they can be as an action.

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    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    The earliest I can get all 18 skills is level 6 with this:

    V. Human: 1 Skill
    Skilled Feat: 3 Skills
    Background: 2 Skills

    1 Rogue: 4 Skills
    3 Lore Bard: 4 Skills
    1 Knowledge Cleric: 2 Skills
    1 Nomad Mystic: 2 Skills

    1+3+2+4+4+2+2= 18 skills

    6 of the skills are with Expertise. Also with the Charlatan background we would have proficiency in Thieves Tools, Disguise Kit, Forgery Kit, a musical instrument, light and medium armor, and shields. Are stats aren't great at 8/14/14/13/13/14 after racial bonuses, but that's the price you pay.

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    Planetar

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    I mean with enough cash and a permissive DM you can do it at level 1, any class.

    You can use downtime to train skills, after all, and that's DMG (or players handbook, I can't remember) material, no UA required.
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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by MrFahrenheit View Post
    So in my campaign, I've banned vhumans
    That makes little sense to me, since vhuman overcomes the inherent advantage at low levels that all other races get with their special features. (As in 2/3 of them get dark vision ...)

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    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by KorvinStarmast View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrF
    So in my campaign, I've banned vhumans
    That makes little sense to me, since vhuman overcomes the inherent advantage at low levels that all other races get with their special features. (As in 2/3 of them get dark vision ...)
    I combined the two, and only have one version of humans.
    +2 to one stat of your choice
    +1 to three different stats of your choice
    any one (half) feat which offers a +1 to a stat, but does not gain that +1
    one skill of your choice

    Limiting the feats to half-feats only alleviates the strain of a 1st level character obtaining one of the best feats, which are always a huge pain to balance at low levels.
    Last edited by DivisibleByZero; 2017-04-12 at 07:43 AM.
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    MonkGirl

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    Default Re: Proficiency in every skill

    Quote Originally Posted by Fayd View Post
    I mean with enough cash and a permissive DM you can do it at level 1, any class.

    You can use downtime to train skills, after all, and that's DMG (or players handbook, I can't remember) material, no UA required.
    Only tools and languages. No 'real' proficiencies

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