A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default The Elven Lords (epic template)

    The Elven Lord

    Creating an elven lord.
    "Elven Lord" is an inherited template that can be added to any creature with the elf subtype.

    Size and Type
    The creature’s type and size do not change.

    Armor Class
    The Lord gains a +12 sacred bonus to AC.

    Special Attacks
    An elven lord retains all the special attacks of the base creature and gains those described below.

    Spell like abilities: At will: Detect magic, greater dispel magic, detect undead, speak with plants, speak with animals 3/day: Heal, Greater restoration CL 30th

    Special Qualities
    An elven lord retains all the special qualities of the base creature and gains those described below.

    Weapon Experience: All elven lords have much experience with many things, especially weapons. They are considered proficient with any weapon they wield.

    Grace: An elven lord adds their charisma to all saves and as a deflection bonus to AC.

    Animal Empathy: As the druid ability, with a +8 racial bonus.

    Blessings of Corellon Larethian: The elven god has granted these lords immortality, and he protects them from taint and vile damage.

    Abilities
    Change from the base creature as follows: +6 Dex, +2 Con, +12 Cha, +8 Wis, +8 Int

    Feats: Weapon Finesse, Quick Draw, Iron Will

    Masteries
    All elven lords master a particular trade, granting them more abilities in their chose discipline.
    Disciplines:
    • Religion: Elven lords who chose to master in religion have abilities that make even the most devote cleric bow his head before him. The lord can turn undead as a cleric equal to his hit die, he casts spells as a cleric of their HD and gains the following domains in addition to any he gains from Corellian: Magic, Knowledge, Elf. He gains a +12 racial bonus on knowledge (religion) and spellcraft checks along with extend spell. They are also among the wisest of the elves gaining a +4 to Wisdom.
    • Magic: The lord who devotes himself to magic has learned spell lore that most mages never even hear of. He casts spells as a wizard of their level (or sorcerer if preferred). And gains the following feats: still spell, silent spell, quicken spell, and two other feats a wizard could take as a bonus feat. In addition he can more easily adapt the costs of metamagic, reducing it by 1. The continuous study has given them a +12 racial bonus on knowledge (arcana) and spellcraft checks. Those who cast as wizards are some of the smartest elves, gaining a +4 to Intelligence, while those who cast as a sorcerer instead gain a +4 to charisma.
    • Master Scout: The lords of the hunt, these scouts have abilities to help them hunt down the enemies of the elves. They gain skirmish as a scout of their HD and favored enemies as a ranger of thier HD. In addition they gain favored enemy (orcs) as a bonus feat. Against favored enemies they may still use skirmish even if the target would normally be immune. They gain point blank shot, precise shot, manyshot, track, keen eared scout1, and improved precise shot. The time spent in the wild has given them a +12 racial bonus on Spot, survival, and listen skill checks. New spell like abilities: Find the path, veil, detect snares and pits, detect animals or plants. This time has made them wiser, and more agile giving a +2 to dexterity and wisdom.
    • Shadows: The lord of the shadows has mastered the art of the rogue, and he takes out any infiltration missions that the elves may need, and so often is battling the Drow instead of hordes of orcs. They gain sneak attack as a rogue of their HD, hide in plain sight, (any environment), and immunity to poisons. The training they have undergone gives them a +12 racial bonus on: sleight of hand, disguise, forgery, bluff, hide, and move silently checks. They also get any 2 ambush feats, sneak attack of opportunity. New Spell like abilities: At Will: superior invisibility and trueseeing at will. This training and time has given them a +4 to Dexterity.
    • Lorekeeper: The lorekeeper maintains the libraries of the elves, frequently knowing many secrets that have been forgotten in the stream of time. They gain a special lore ability (as the bardic knowledge ability) equal to hit die with a +12 racial bonus. They gain a +12 bonus on the following skill checks: appraise, craft (any), decipher script, disable device, forgery, knowledge (all), open lock, sense motive, and use magic device. They gain any four feats they qualify for, and can use forgery checks without a sample of writing and no increase to the DC. New spell like abilities: break enchantment, detect scrying, find the path, foresight, analyze dweomer, true seeing. These are some of the smartest and wisest of the elves, gaining a +4 to Wisdom and Intelligence.

      The Dark: “You’re not scared of the dark, are you?” While an Elven lord that specializes in sjadows calls the dark an ally, this elven lord is the dark. Few see him, and those that do? Well, they won’t be telling anyone anytime soon. The Dark Lord (hehehe) gains a frightful presence out to 60’. Unlike most a succesful save only keeps others safe from him for 2d4 rounds. The DC is 10+½ HD+Charisma modifier. In addition the lord can see in any type of illumination (Even magical darkness) as if it was normla daylight. Within the range of his frightening presence the area has shadowy illumination. A light spell equal to ¼ the Dark Lord’s HD negates this for the duration of the spell, minimum 1 round. If the Dark Lord can cast spells they may cast one additional spell of each level that has the darkness tag. New Spell like abilitiies: Greater Darkness (heigtened to a 9th level spell), any one other spell with the darkness tag. They gain a +4 to charisma and dexterity representing the fluid grace of shadow.
    • Nature’s Guardian: These Lords carry the power of nature, and those who would defile it soon face their wrath. They are able to wildshape at will, and the forms available to them are those that would be available to a druid/master of many forms equal to HD, with them gaining abilities to a druid first until 20th and then applies to master of many forms. They gain a +12 racial bonus on survival, knowledge (nature), listen and spot checks. They have been imbued with nature’s wisdom, gaining a +4 to wisdom

    Environment: As Base creature

    Challenge Rating: Same as the base creature +3, and additional adjustment based off of mastery: Religion (ECl 1-8 +12, 9-15 +8, 16-20 +4), Magic (ECl 1-8 +12, 9-15 +8, 16-20 +4), Master scout (ECl 1-8 +6, 9-15 +4, 16-20 +2), Shadows (ECl 1-8 +6, 9-15 +4, 16-20 +2), lorekeeper (ECl 1-8 +4, 9-15 +2, 16-20 +0), Nature's guardian (ECl 1-8 +11, 9-15 +7, 16-20 +3)

    Alignment: Usually Chaotic Good

    Advancement: By character class, or if the Dungeon Master wants you could possibly give them another mastery…


    PEACH, more masteries to come, taking suggestions atm but have a druid type coming so any others I will take
    Last edited by Westhart; 2017-05-06 at 04:58 PM.
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    The masteries vary wildly in power (especially comparing the ones that grant spellcasting to those that don't). However it's absolutely bursting with flavour, very Tolkienesque!

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Thank you

    yeah they did vary... Thinking different CR adjustments for them?
    Homebrew: If it is mine feel free to PEACH and/or use it.

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    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    Thank you

    yeah they did vary... Thinking different CR adjustments for them?
    Yes, definitely. Maybe work out a base CR adjustment for the template, then an additional CR adjustment for each mastery. The religion mastery for example could effectively turn a 1st-level commoner elf into a 30th level cleric, whereas the lorekeeper mastery is practically a flavour thing in comparison.

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Yes, definitely. Maybe work out a base CR adjustment for the template, then an additional CR adjustment for each mastery. The religion mastery for example could effectively turn a 1st-level commoner elf into a 30th level cleric, whereas the lorekeeper mastery is practically a flavour thing in comparison.
    Well, for base perhaps a +3-4, not sure on the masteries though...
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    Well, for base perhaps a +3-4, not sure on the masteries though...
    It might be easier to scale back the benefits - eg. instead of granting 30 levels worth of casting they could grant a few more thematic spell-like abilities. However that might mess up the flavour and purpose you intended for them.

    EDIT: What about instead of granting spellcasting for the religion mastery (for example), they instead have to already have that amount of spellcasting? For example Elfie the religion master Elven Lord is already a 30th level cleric, and the template gives him an extra wisdom boost or somesuch?
    Last edited by rferries; 2017-04-20 at 08:26 AM.

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    It might be easier to scale back the benefits - eg. instead of granting 30 levels worth of casting they could grant a few more thematic spell-like abilities. However that might mess up the flavour and purpose you intended for them.

    EDIT: What about instead of granting spellcasting for the religion mastery (for example), they instead have to already have that amount of spellcasting? For example Elfie the religion master Elven Lord is already a 30th level cleric, and the template gives him an extra wisdom boost or somesuch?

    Hmm, think I am going to go with a small combination of those, probably do it tomorrow...
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Sorry for the double post but had an idea for the fix, wanted to see what people thought

    BUMP
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    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Looking at what's here, I'd just set it at CR+20 minimum, since you seem disinclined to reduce the drastic power offered by the template. As Ferries mentioned above, no matter what you apply this template to, they effectively become an epic character. Even if it's a 1st level commoner, I wouldn't throw something that potentially has spellcasting as a 30th level Wizard at any party below 20th level. Even if they're something much less threatening, like the Lorekeeper, it's not much of a stretch to imagine the kind of influence the greatest Bard of Elvenkind has- he can be a pushover in combat, but when his allies are ALSO up in the reaches of epic, you're never going to get close to him.

    Take a look at he Scaling CR value of the Paragon template from Epic Level Handbook- I'd start with a VERY high CR adjustment, which drops slowly the higher the CR of the Base Creature.
    If the Base creature is already a 30th level caster, for example, expanding their spell list doesn't do too much, but give a 6th level character access to 6th through 9th level spells on the spot, and he's only going to be 6th level for about a day and a half as he works his way across the countryside, slaughtering everything in his way.

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by MalikLucius View Post
    Looking at what's here, I'd just set it at CR+20 minimum, since you seem disinclined to reduce the drastic power offered by the template. As Ferries mentioned above, no matter what you apply this template to, they effectively become an epic character. Even if it's a 1st level commoner, I wouldn't throw something that potentially has spellcasting as a 30th level Wizard at any party below 20th level. Even if they're something much less threatening, like the Lorekeeper, it's not much of a stretch to imagine the kind of influence the greatest Bard of Elvenkind has- he can be a pushover in combat, but when his allies are ALSO up in the reaches of epic, you're never going to get close to him.

    Take a look at he Scaling CR value of the Paragon template from Epic Level Handbook- I'd start with a VERY high CR adjustment, which drops slowly the higher the CR of the Base Creature.
    If the Base creature is already a 30th level caster, for example, expanding their spell list doesn't do too much, but give a 6th level character access to 6th through 9th level spells on the spot, and he's only going to be 6th level for about a day and a half as he works his way across the countryside, slaughtering everything in his way.
    Well, the first level commoner would have spellcasting equal to its HD. Since elves do not have racial HD it is a 1st level wizard. The 6th would have access to the same spells as a 6th level wizard. Also if you are putting this on a creature before epic when it is an epic template [shrug], not to mention that you would not put it on a commoner anyhow Unless commoners are now lords that is.
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    Well, the first level commoner would have spellcasting equal to its HD. Since elves do not have racial HD it is a 1st level wizard. The 6th would have access to the same spells as a 6th level wizard. Also if you are putting this on a creature before epic when it is an epic template [shrug], not to mention that you would not put it on a commoner anyhow Unless commoners are now lords that is.
    I like your edits, spellcasting = to HD feels much more streamlined. The suggestion above about using a scaling CR adjustment would be helpful, I think. As you say though, at epic levels CR becomes less useful - everything is so powerful already! :D

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    I like your edits, spellcasting = to HD feels much more streamlined. The suggestion above about using a scaling CR adjustment would be helpful, I think. As you say though, at epic levels CR becomes less useful - everything is so powerful already! :D
    Yes, after a bit of thought I can see the point... Will se what happens when I start going back over it
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    Yes, after a bit of thought I can see the point... Will se what happens when I start going back over it
    It was a great idea to begin with and it's only improving with time! :)

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    It was a great idea to begin with and it's only improving with time! :)
    Thanks, well once I finish a few other things this will be back on teh writing board to see what I can squeeze out
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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    There, tried the CR and made everything equal to HD instead of 30th level.
    Not sure on CR, as that is the part I always sucked at and why I kinda free form the monsters and experience with my players XP.
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    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    There, tried the CR and made everything equal to HD instead of 30th level.
    Not sure on CR, as that is the part I always sucked at and why I kinda free form the monsters and experience with my players XP.
    Looking good! Very detailed breakdown on the CR adjustment, too (I'm terrible about the finer points of CR too so can't help you there :D).

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Looking good! Very detailed breakdown on the CR adjustment, too (I'm terrible about the finer points of CR too so can't help you there :D).
    Yay! I'm not the only one

    Also when are you going to make animal companion feats? You have done familiar and paladin ones
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    Yay! I'm not the only one

    Also when are you going to make animal companion feats? You have done familiar and paladin ones
    Ha! I've debated doing it, the trouble is animal companions are already pretty powerful (the old joke about druids having a class feature more powerful than an entire fighter :D). Never say never, though.

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    Default Re: The Elven Lords (epic template)

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Ha! I've debated doing it, the trouble is animal companions are already pretty powerful (the old joke about druids having a class feature more powerful than an entire fighter :D). Never say never, though.
    Hmm, we were looking for something weaker then a fighter?
    ...
    ...
    ...
    I FOUND IT!!!
    ...
    ...
    ...
    Never mind
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    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

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